Thanks ;).

Laurie

Laurie "Clueless"

I guess I should mention that I'm using one infinite light with the Envirosphere.

I'm guessing, however, that's not the answer you want?

Tell me more. Is this for personal use? For a product? For a freebie?

Freebie, but it's helpful for me to create one just in case I do need one for a commercial project.

The only thing I can assume is that I'm gonna need two speculars again. Where? Ya got me.

While I appreciate your talents and your satin looks great, I'm not about to buy every single kind of shader I'll ever need. Not when I should be able to make one.

sigh Nevermind.

Laurie

Hang on I didn't say I wouldn't help - just wanted to know the target. You OK using P9/PP2012 features?

You remember the basic setup I gave you a couple weeks ago, the Fresnel_Blend'ing a diffuse, a blinn, and a reflect?

Use the Fresnel_Blend at IOR 16.

Set the Reflect softness to 3.

Use the color you want (your diffuse color) also where the reflect+blinn is going. If it's a dark color, try desaturating and lightening it first.

I use Bias(HSV(yourColor, 1, 0, 1), 1.2) * yourColor for the specular+reflection color.

Well, there were two examples. The fresnel blend was coming out of the alt diffuse and then the reflect and blinn were attached to that and then there was one where reflect was connected to reflect, blinn to alt specular and then a diffuse color in the main poser node. So I'm sort of confuzzled ;)

Laurie

The Poser surface is a giant Color_Math:Add node with some other nodes built-in, like Diffuse and Specular.

Whether you use the built-in surface adder and built-in Diffuse or you use an explicitly created external Diffuse, and whether you use multiple Alternate_... inputs or you manually Color_Math:Add them does not change the equation.

But - I understand you don't want to know how shaders are built.

I'll assemble a simple satin and screen shot it.

Just a sec.

No, I DO want to understand. I just don't understand currently, that's all ;)

I'm actually getting somewhere with this shader tho ;).

Laurie

Oh - I just noticed you mentioned Poser 8 versus PP2012, the shader produces a very different outcome. Are you now rendering with linear workflow (render GC) ?

This is a shader that is strongly affected by linear versus non-linear color space. The parameters end up having a very different influence bewteen the two. It's one of the reasons my shaders are 80 nodes instead of 8 - having to build into it the ability to detect linear workflow, and if it's not active, to do linear itself.

Are you looking for a single shader that produces the same outcome in both, as my shaders do?

Yeah, I'm using GC. I've been using it since I've had Poser Pro 2012. And yes, I'd like the shader to look good in both. Does look great in GC now at least since I've used ur advice and set it up like you suggested.

GC totally sucked the colors out of my Poser 8 shader I guess ;).

Laurie

Laurie

Yes that's about right.

You can do this without reflection as well, but then people have to use lights.

I insist on as much realism as possible, so for me the most important thing is the blurred reflection, not the blinn.

Good :). I'll run with this then....lol. Thanks for the help BB. Always. I just don't have the head for math and all that like you do. I struggle.

Thanks again!!

Laurie

It has many disadvantages. It won't look at all the same with/without GC. To change color you have to edit the two colors in the Blender. The first is the diffuse color, the second is the reflection color. The second color needs to be related to the first in a specific way, but since I'm going for fewest nodes, we leave that to the "artist", instead of math. Users also need to know how to adjust the quality to get more/less of the grainy effect.

The reason I did not use the Fresnel_Blend alone, but rather used a Fresnel_Blend running into an ordinary Blender, is because the Fresnel_Blend has no reflection value (brightness) control. The .6 in the Blending value is the maximum reflectivity in this shader. You can raise or lower that for more/less shine.

My full shader has built-in auto GC (incoming and outgoing), a single color control, a single blur control, and a single shine control away from the node spaghetti.

That looks like pretty nice silky tho ;). Maybe like a polished challis/rayon if one added a bit more noise.

Laurie

Quote - ... I insist on as much realism as possible, so for me the most important thing is the blurred reflection, not the blinn.

See, I'm the opposite ;). I'm not concerned so much with the physical accuracy as I am with how close it looks to the real thing to my eye...lol. Sometimes they amount to the same thing, but sometimes they don't. Poser has its idiosyncrasies. What can I say ;). Thanks again!!

Laurie

What I meant was more than half the lighting/shine should be coming from the environment, and without the reflect node, that will entirely be missing.

Interpret any way you want (as an artist) but if you're outside, I better see sky in that satin.

Was just gonna turn the sphere back on and rerender...lol

Laurie

By the way, it's important that you understand something here.

I DO NOT KNOW THE MATH OF SATIN

I'm doing this using my "artistic eye" - same as you.

What my eye tells me, whether or not my math-brain has anything to say about it, is that reflections matter a lot here.

The more something behaves like a metal, the more important are the reflections.

I don't know the physics of satin - I don't know why it behaves like a metal - but it does.

Well, the satin I made, it relects the color of the sky somewhat (not vividly) but not clouds or other objects really. Too far away I guess. It does reflect things up close, such as the underside of the ruffle. Satin does act like that. It's not a true metallic. (grandmother was a seamstress and I've been around a lot of satin in my life). If anything, it's more like a pearl than a metallic. Just has a similar "sheen" if you like. More like the sheen of velvet than the sheen of something like a brushed metal.

Laurie

Here I've included a pic. I wanted to find one where the satin was truly outside rather than a professional image that has most likely just an outdoor background. Here, the satin skirt is barely reflecting the man's suit...more like it's just refecting the light being blocked rather than the color or the object (not sure how to explain it). It will however reflect the color of an object, but only if it's very, very close. The sky just gives a whitish reflection. But, being raised by my grandmother who was a seamstress and being around satin all my life, and even tho it LOOKS rather metallic, there's more specular going on than reflections if that makes any sense. ;).

I realize the sunlight is very diffuse in this image rather than bright and hot, but that just makes the specular from the sky even more white than it is here. Of course, I know nothing about the math of all that ;).

Laurie

Here, even tho the blue cloth is very close to the green, the green satin is only reflecting the shadow with very little color. It is absorbing a bit of blue from the sky at the bottom but very little (it's subtle). My point is you had it pretty darn close with what you told me to do the first time :). A lot of it depends on the color of the shader too - for instance, even tho it's got the same settings, the lighter pink satin is reflecting a lot more of the sky color than the red.

Laurie

Ok, done now...lol. Appreciate the help! :)

Laurie

There ya go. That looks good to me.

Nice

Those shoes are looking great Laurie.

Same goes for the bed BB.

:biggrin:

LaurieA,

May I use your Poser 8 satin shader?

Sure. I'm gonna throw some of those shaders in with the shoes freebie anyway ;).

Laurie

i luv your tag line Laurie    "Never go to bed angry - stay awake and plot your revenge." 

Quote - Sure. I'm gonna throw some of those shaders in with the shoes freebie anyway ;).

Laurie

Cool. I've been using your gem shaders quite a lot. Used the gold shader from that pack for Ninja Doris' earrings... and another one for the frame of her glasses, in fact. Just realised I ommitted the credit too! I'll get right on it

Quote - > Quote - Sure. I'm gonna throw some of those shaders in with the shoes freebie anyway ;).

Laurie

Cool. I've been using your gem shaders quite a lot. Used the gold shader from that pack for Ninja Doris' earrings... and another one for the frame of her glasses, in fact. Just realised I ommitted the credit too! I'll get right on it

I never cared about that stuff. The only reason I would want any credit at all would be that it makes it easier to find images done with stuff I made, which can be fun ;). But really tho, I never require that. Use as ya please. ;)

Laurie

Ah well, nonetheless, I've added a mention now

I like to try and remember and give credit where it's due... and I appreciate it when others do it because it helps me find cool stuff they've used apart from anything else... and I guess its the whole implicitly collaborative nature of this CG thing that, in part, I like so much too

I know what ya mean. I give credit myself in an image, for the same reasons ;).

Laurie

Quote - You remember the basic setup I gave you a couple weeks ago, the Fresnel_Blend'ing a diffuse, a blinn, and a reflect?

Could you please point me to that discussion? Even if the setup is the same or similar then what's already in this thread I'd like to learn from the correspondig discussion if possible...

Quote - > Quote - You remember the basic setup I gave you a couple weeks ago, the Fresnel_Blend'ing a diffuse, a blinn, and a reflect?

Could you please point me to that discussion? Even if the setup is the same or similar then what's already in this thread I'd like to learn from the correspondig discussion if possible...

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?message_id=3956203&ebot_calc_page#message_3956203

Thanks!

The Bedroom set is killer looking BB. Perfect to add to all the furniture you and DLM have released. If it's not to late add a dynamic set of bed clothes.

After standing all day in a classic T-Pose the characters I use like to have a little fun after hours under the sheets so to speak :blink:

Quote - The Bedroom set is killer looking BB. Perfect to add to all the furniture you and DLM have released. If it's not to late add a dynamic set of bed clothes.

After standing all day in a classic T-Pose the characters I use like to have a little fun after hours under the sheets so to speak :blink:

Dynamic sheet, comforter, and pillows already included. It comes with several already in various arrangements, or you hide them and sim your own with people under/over etc.

Quote - > Quote - The Bedroom set is killer looking BB. Perfect to add to all the furniture you and DLM have released. If it's not to late add a dynamic set of bed clothes.

After standing all day in a classic T-Pose the characters I use like to have a little fun after hours under the sheets so to speak :blink:

Dynamic sheet, comforter, and pillows already included. It comes with several already in various arrangements, or you hide them and sim your own with people under/over etc.

thanks a ton. Going to be a killer set. My debt card is sitting waiting and ready to go.:scared:

Beautiful bed, dynamic sheets, gorgeous satin...yep, that's a keeper! :D Will other fabrics be included as well?

A couple.

Everything on this car, except glass, is done with it.

This render was done with no lights, just EnvSphere, and took 26 minutes.

I've been refining these for weeks. The tiniest details have consumed a ton of time.

Looking splendid. Can't wait BB :thumbupboth:

Waitin' for those shoes too Laurie, by the way I have plans for them already... he he.

I'm packing em up today. LOL. Took longer than I thought :P

Laurie

Amazing, BB!

For those of us coming in late to the game..

PLEASE. "that other thread about satin?" Where? And GEM SHADERS? Just last night I spend an ungodly amount of time on a pair of earrings where I REALLY needed some gem shaders.. But.. Where?

(oh and a bonus question: Who's this Angela you've made all those freebies for, LaurieA?)