Ok as I am tweeking around in both pp2012 and sculptris I am getting frustrated. Is there anyway to create Dynamic skin?

As in, anyway to make "rolls of folds" of flesh actually fall and lay as if they are..well...fluid, soft and moldable?

I am not just talking about breasts...I am talking about things like the lil bits that come just under a womans shoulder blades that have a soft "lay" to them when she gets older, the upper arm flesh of (vulgarly known as) "bingo wings", the soft lushness of thighs when parted how the flesh softly falls to the side...

Sounds like soft body dynamics/deformation, available in other apps - possible Blender? IIRC, some folks may have experimented with 'clothifying' in that regard but I'm not sure. It's really more dynamic tissue than skin I'd think.

Quote - Sounds like soft body dynamics/deformation, available in other apps - possible Blender? IIRC, some folks may have experimented with 'clothifying' in that regard but I'm not sure. It's really more dynamic tissue than skin I'd think.

o.0

ok, does poser to blender work?

I've tried clothifying in Poser 8, and it works to a very small degree. Of course, the more frames you run the sim in, the worse it looks, and it's very difficult to simulate real flesh effects.

I think you can import the model into Blender, but not the rigging. Blender has material nodes too, so you may be able to import those. I haven't tried it because I am still trying to figure out how to delete the default cube (kidding, I can do that, just not much more). But I've watched a ton of tutorials on Blender cookie and Blender guru, and I've seen almost every aspect of Blender's capabilities. Now if I could do everything I've seen, I'd be dangerous.

Quote - I've tried clothifying in Poser 8, and it works to a very small degree. Of course, the more frames you run the sim in, the worse it looks, and it's very difficult to simulate real flesh effects.

I think you can import the model into Blender, but not the rigging. Blender has material nodes too, so you may be able to import those. I haven't tried it because I am still trying to figure out how to delete the default cube (kidding, I can do that, just not much more). But I've watched a ton of tutorials on Blender cookie and Blender guru, and I've seen almost every aspect of Blender's capabilities. Now if I could do everything I've seen, I'd be dangerous.

me too >.<

I actually have blender but..blender and I do not get along.

BUT I am more then prepared to try and make friends with it again if I can get that lovely softness to the skin.

Quote - > Quote - I've tried clothifying in Poser 8, and it works to a very small degree. Of course, the more frames you run the sim in, the worse it looks, and it's very difficult to simulate real flesh effects.

I think you can import the model into Blender, but not the rigging. Blender has material nodes too, so you may be able to import those. I haven't tried it because I am still trying to figure out how to delete the default cube (kidding, I can do that, just not much more). But I've watched a ton of tutorials on Blender cookie and Blender guru, and I've seen almost every aspect of Blender's capabilities. Now if I could do everything I've seen, I'd be dangerous.

me too >.<

I actually have blender but..blender and I do not get along.

BUT I am more then prepared to try and make friends with it again if I can get that lovely softness to the skin.

I hear ya. I have had Blender since version 2.4 or so, and I have used it only a few times. I did figure out how to use the shrinkwrap modifier, though. I used that quite a bit.

"Wibble wobble wibble wobble, jelly on a plate"

Yeah, Poser's cloth room won't really do very well for this... which is fair enough. It's kind of a volumetric simulation, I would think, as opposed to just folds and collisions of a near flat plane?

Face_off may have been looking into this off the back of Poser Physics, if I recall rightly? Or maybe SM have something being fleshed out on this front, to be revealed when they get round to rolling up their sleeves on Poser 2014? :)

Yours, the eternal optimist, Monsieur Monkey McCloud ;)

Well, I'm de4finitely not the person for Blender info. Laurie's a Blenderista - no idea if she's messed with soft bodies (no pun intended) but she or one of the other devotes can say how hard/easy the Poser to Blender road is. I did confirm that it does do SBD here is some info (appeards to be an older version but there's an interesting video). Probably much the same as running a cloth simulation in Poser. I imagine that YMMV depending on how small scale the effects you want are, density of the mesh etc. Maybe easier to do Helen Mirren than your avg. 60ish female (or  male) :-)

This would be something I would sculpt, using Blender's sculpting tools, since I don't have Zbrush. I would set up the scene first, then export it for sculpting refinement. I am not that skilled with Poser's morph brush, but if I were I might consider using that.

This is the sort of thing which is a lot easier to do manually using a sculpting tool then any automated system you could use. The reason is that human skin doesn't behave in a nice homogenous 'dynamic' fashion as it gets pushed around by cloth, bones, tendons, fat and skin-skin/skin-object collisions. Just compare how the webbing between your fingers moves with finger movement to say rolls of fat on a belly to the 'crushing' behavior of something like an ear etc. Then add to this the fact that as skin ages, its behavior also changes, becoming looser, more prone to wrinkles, less defined ... and you can how much of a nightmare this sort of thing is to automate. Even in big budget, high end production, it's done case by case with customized rigs for each character.

Much easier to just pose your character, get a reference photo of the pose (or the closest you can google) and add the various skin deforms using ZBrush or even something like the morph brush IMVHO.

Quote - "Wibble wobble wibble wobble, jelly on a plate"

Yeah, Poser's cloth room won't really do very well for this... which is fair enough. It's kind of a volumetric simulation, I would think, as opposed to just folds and collisions of a near flat plane?

Face_off may have been looking into this off the back of Poser Physics, if I recall rightly? Or maybe SM have something being fleshed out on this front, to be revealed when they get round to rolling up their sleeves on Poser 2014? :)

Yours, the eternal optimist, Monsieur Monkey McCloud ;)

It must be jelly 'cause jam don't shake like dat!  

Quote - This would be something I would sculpt, using Blender's sculpting tools, since I don't have Zbrush. I would set up the scene first, then export it for sculpting refinement. I am not that skilled with Poser's morph brush, but if I were I might consider using that.

I do in scultpris. but it doesnt give the same effect of flesh to flesh. the actual dynamic of how it folds, mold and softly shapes.

Quote - Well, I'm de4finitely not the person for Blender info. Laurie's a Blenderista - no idea if she's messed with soft bodies (no pun intended) but she or one of the other devotes can say how hard/easy the Poser to Blender road is. I did confirm that it does do SBD here is some info (appeards to be an older version but there's an interesting video). Probably much the same as running a cloth simulation in Poser. I imagine that YMMV depending on how small scale the effects you want are, density of the mesh etc. Maybe easier to do Helen Mirren than your avg. 60ish female (or  male) :-)

oh that sounds promising. that really does. It looks as if I may have to make friends with blender after all narrows her eyes at the blender ICON on her desk top

Yeah, it is a very powerful and versatile program. I understand that the somewhat eccentric keyboard-centric interface was revamped some years ago. It may still be less intuitive for some people, or maybe just the hangover of its reputation. Something like this where in theory you  might only need to learn a little of Blender might be attractive -  Until you get to think about whether to render in Blender/Lux whatever or try to bake the mesh and get it back into Poser if possible etc. If someone could create an application to roundtrip a Poser mesh into Blender for SBD and get it back, maybe as morph, I think it might be hugely popular. Of course, I always thought they should have done SBD in Poser before some of the other things …

Quote - Yeah, it is a very powerful and versatile program. I understand that the somewhat eccentric keyboard-centric interface was revamped some years ago. It may still be less intuitive for some people, or maybe just the hangover of its reputation. Something like this where in theory you  might only need to learn a little of Blender might be attractive -  Until you get to think about whether to render in Blender/Lux whatever or try to bake the mesh and get it back into Poser if possible etc. If someone could create an application to roundtrip a Poser mesh into Blender for SBD and get it back, maybe as morph, I think it might be hugely popular. Of course, I always thought they should have done SBD in Poser before some of the other things …

wow that would be fantastic. if you could take a V(add what ever number) do the soft body calculations, then make it so you can use that as a morph back in poser...omg that would ROCK!

Quote - If someone could create an application to roundtrip a Poser mesh into Blender for SBD and get it back, maybe as morph, I think it might be hugely popular.

Someone has .. Colorcurvature's Pose Morph Loader, works well for exporting and bringing back in a modified mesh as a morph.  

"Someone has .. Colorcurvature's Pose Morph Loader, works well for exporting and bringing back in a modified mesh as a morph."

Cool! Now we just need to see the big lady sing - or maybe just a cube of 'jello' wiggle as a proof of concept :-)  

Carrara does soft body physics and Poser content works natively in Carrara (figures, cameras import, lights import, poses, .pz3, runtimes, props, etc.). Utilizes Bullet physics...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BR17ouNdXA0

There have been experiments with clothifying skin - see Poser Soft Bodies by RajDArge in the tutorials section for example (I can't work out how to link to it).

But the difference between cloth and skin is that skin doesn't have consistent characteristics across the surface of a body - how it reacts will depend on skeleton structure, muscle density and all sorts of factors that I, as a layman untrained in anatomy, can only guess at. To be realistic, all these factors would need to be programmed in to a simulate-able figure.

I look forward to having this feature, sure. To be able to bend an elbow or knee and have the flesh compress in a realistic way, or to have tight clothing behave in a proper two-way interaction with skin, would be great. It will happen eventually. I'm not holding my breath though. ;)  

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/tutorial/index.php?browse&section_id=32&page=7    :-)

This is very true. You're only going to get an approximation. It might be pretty accurate for a uniform mass like jello, but the human body, with bones, BMI, tone, who knows what all, would presumably be a lot more challenging. Time to renew my call for 'Smart Figures' that incorporate information about themselves, weight, BMI etc. to interact with software simulations. A 300 lb. person and an olympic sprinter climbing stairs course are going to behave differently. You could probably take into account factors like fatigue as well. If it happens, it will probably show up in games first strangely enough.

for just a still .jpg a body / head morph would work.
I've seen aginng morphs for sell before.

For animation of a flabby persons flab bouncing around.
Where talking very difficult.
I haven't even seen HollyWood try that.

How skin moves, folds, sags ect is not uniform.  Besides the underlying presence of the musculature and bones, you have to account for age, elsaticity, presence of fat and collagen, fibrosing and adhedsions, surface and deep tissue scarring and on and on.

If there is one thing you learn after several semester of A&P, the human body if far from symmetical or uniform.