So here's the second part of turning Genesis into a fully useable Poser figure.

In the first part I turned Vicky 5 into a "standalone" Poser cr2 with only the Vicky 5 shape loaded and the V5 UV-set permanently assigned. She also loads with Poser's native SubD by deafault, so she's as fast in preview as any other "normal" Poser figure.

Cloth auto-fit still works the same as it does with default Genesis, as does everything else.

Now...

,,,having V5 is all nice and well, but her exaggerated default proportions don't really fit with my custom figures that are all based on real people, hence have "normal" proportions.

Scaling is a big part of making a Poser figure more realistic, but sadly Genesis still has some problems with Poser's native scaling. I tried fixing the scaling zones manually, but the results were still hit and miss.

So...

...instead of using actual scaling, I'll use the animateable joint centers instead to compensate for the changed proportions. That means, instead of scaling a limb shorter, I simply morph it shorter and then adjust the joint centers with the offset dials.

1. I started with an "lean" copy of Genesis that only had the base morphs loaded. Switched to "Unimesh Skinning" and saved it to the Poser library as a cr2.

2. I loaded that Genesis copy, set it to "Basic Female" and also loaded my "Aneta" custom figure. Then I started transfering Aneta's custom shape over to Genesis using the Morph Brush.

The proportions were pretty similar, so I only had to scale (!) Genesis legs a little shorter along the y-axis. (That "scaling" would later be a morph once exported)

1. I zeroed Genesis and exported the morphbrushed "Aneta" body as an object file.

2. Loaded a new copy of my Genesis cr2, set the "Base Female" to "1" again and added the Aneta shape as a full body morph.

3. I then adjusted the joint centers for the knees, feet and toes with the offset dials until they matched with the shorter legs.

Genesis also has notoriously narrow shoulders, so I adjusted the shoulder joints a bit, too.

Finally made some JCM's for more realistic armpits, and added V5's facemorph.

Everything works like normal Genesis, but she's still as easy to use as any regular Poser mesh. No DSON loading, no slow OpenGL preview caused by permanent SubD. (And no "ghost halo", either)

And what about clothing ?

Can she still do the click-click autofit thing ?

Yes, she can ! (Much to my surprise, actually)

You simply transfer the new "Aneta" morph over to the clothing with "Copy morphs from..." and enable "Include morphs when conforming", so the whole autofit process takes maybe 10 seconds longer.

Except for the low res mesh, thats what I envision the "ideal" Poser figure.

Loads quick, is fast in OpenGL and cloth fitting is practically instantaneously. No lenghty conversions tying up Poser or "Cloth Room" fiddling. Maybe a wee bit of MorphBrush fixing for extreme morphs.

Now that I found an easy way to change proportions in Poser, I think I'll do a few more "realistic" Genesis characters so I can use them alongside my custom figures.

Don't you love TECH-NO-LO-GY ?

:-)

That looks great, JP.  

I don't know why people are are reluctant to use an exported version of Genesis.  DAZ morphs currently can't be directly added to it, but one can load them in Studio and crank out a new cr2...

This is allmost too easy ^^ ;)

Thanks !  :-)

I actually haven't even Studio installed on my system to show that all the tech needed for Genesis (Or a Genesis-like figure) is built right into PP-2014.

So there's no excuse for not having all these latest features in a Poser figure.

I know that figure morphing is even easier in Studio itself, as you can simply morph a figure including proportional changes and the rigging will "auto-snap" right back into place. But I wanted to see what is possible without the "dreaded" Studio installation.

(To be honest, I don't really like how invasive Studio has become with stuff running in Windows even if it is closed)

Anyway, I added an alternate "Aneta-morph" to this figure that includes a "mono-boob" shape for more realistic cloth conversion.

Think I should smooth over the belly-button, too.

:-)

Forgive my bewilderment, but could you walk me through getting Genesis into Poser in the first place without having to have Studio installed? Pretty please with sugar and a cherry on top, Joe? 

Quote - Forgive my bewilderment, but could you walk me through getting Genesis into Poser in the first place without having to have Studio installed? Pretty please with sugar and a cherry on top, Joe? 

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2874212

"Forgive my bewilderment, but could you walk me through getting Genesis into Poser in the first place without having to have Studio installed?"

That's easy.

You need of course a version of Poser that can do weightmapping. (Poser 9 or better)

Download the "Genesis Starter essentials" and the "DSON importer for Poser".

Extract the essentials to a new folder on your desktop. Copy everything INSIDE the "content" folder to a new folder. Call that folder "Genesis"

Add that "Genesis" folder as a new runtime to you Poser installation.

Finally install the DSON importer to your actual Poser runtime, so the importer script shows up in your script menu inside Poser.

Now you can simply load Genesis by clicking on it's icon in your new "Genesis" runtime.

But Genesis' own subdivision is a bit slow in Poser, so if you have PP-2014, you can simply load Genesis and:

1. Disable subdivision via the DSON support script. (Set subdivision OFF)

2. Change figure skinning to UNIMESH. (Figure->Skinning Method->Poser Unimesh)

3. Select the "Body" of your figure and set "Subdivision levels" to "1" for Render.

Genesis will now be unsubdivided (=fast) in preview but subdivided when rendered.

1. Save that copy of Genesis to your figure library, so next time you don't need the DSON importer anymore but load Genesis directly again from the cr2 you just saved.

2. Follow my "Genesis Hacking" No I tutorial for creating other standalone cr2's of Genesis that have only a single morph loaded like "Vicky 5, Mike 5, Teens, etc."

If Genesis loads with all morphs at once, it gets slower and slower over time the more morphs you add, but if you do it like this, Vicky 5 will be even faster than Vicky 4 on your machine.

No installation of Studio involved in all of this.

You need just the "DSON importer", which is nothing but a small python script to translate the Genesis files into something Poser can read, and the Genesis figure itself.

But this goes just into a separate runtime, like all the other Poser stuff.

This was originally in reply to Keith:

Okay, so...I still have to use DSON? is this with the loader scripty thing? That link doesn't tell me how I get Genesis into Poser. It just tells me how I get Genesis to stop lagging in poser. 

I do not have Studio installed, and I would really rather not have it installed. I am quite happy with my Poser interface and I don't want to have to learn another program. All my learning channels in my brain are currently being used with learning Japanese and how to work Blender, so I really don't have the time to spend on DAZ Studio. 

I wouldn't even care, except I couldn't resist the sweet deal on some Mass Effect-style morphs for Genesis that I would like to use someday. 

Joe is far smarter than I about all this, so I'm just...I just wanna make it work. How do I make it work? I need simple directions with as little screw-up room as possible, because if anything is vague, I can guarantee that I'm going to mess it up. 

Thank you, Joe! I will attempt this and come back to report success or failure, ehehe.

You only need the DSON script to initially load Genesis.

Once its loaded, you can safe it to your figure library and use that copy instead.

But DSON isn't DAZ Studio, it's just a translator script, so no need to install Studio at all.

Attached Link: http://docs.daz3d.com/doku.php/public/software/dson_importer/poser/userguide/dson_installation_requirements/tutorials/dson_installation/start

This is very interesting, and seemingly so simple, it's brilliant!  Or maybe so brilliant, it's simple!  Not sure which yet.

Anyway, great job here. 

I have successfully gotten Genesis to work in my PP2014! Thanks, guys! 

Joe, you are awesome. In you the venerable spirit of Poser from days of yore still shines brightly :-)

So I don't need to install Studio, but I still need to download it? Nah, I'm too petty at this point to even let them count that  as another person using DS. And frankly, after two years of not using Genesis, I just don't care anymore. But good job, Joe. I hope everyone appreciates what you've done for Genesis and Poser users.

I'm torn on this one.  On one hand, I'd love for Genesis to be more responsive but on the other, the whole reason I got it was for the amazinging morphability. But it would be nice to have a fixed V5 and M5. It's still weighted-mapped and everything?

Many thanks for the kind words, everybody.

Glad you've got everything working properly, Hana-Hanabi.

I had no real use for Genesis in the past, either, but the most recent update finally fixed the joints so that it now bends as well in Poser as it does in Studio.

I made weightmapped versions of D3, V3, SP3, M3RR, V4LOD and M4LOD to easily re-use old clothing with a minimum of conversion needed, so making Genesis useable in Poser in order to use all it's new content was the next logical step.

Not to mention the convenience of clothes being converted to any character shape in just a few seconds.

The point is not to make more people use Genesis, but to demonstrate what Poser actually can do:

Every figure with a properly built mesh topology can be "a" Genesis, because "Genesis", to me, isn't about the actual mesh, but the "system" and technology that it was built with.

And it would be a shame not to use that technology, just because "they" had it first.

@ sandman_max :

Poser right now can't load morphs "on demand" like Studio can, so if you want the convenience of ultimate morph mixing, the Genesis cr2 will become quite heavy over time.

Switching from Genesis' native SubD to Poser's SubD will speed up Genesis quite a bit, but "hacking" into the Genesis cr2 to create standalones for the major characters will speed it up even more.

You can always create "pre-mix" standalones by leaving several character morphs in the cr2 before you save it to the Poser library.

Make a copy with all the realistic females, one with all males, one with all toons, one with all monsters, etc.

Or make a copy with the V4, V5, A4, Girl4, A5 and Girl5 morphs etc to mix and match.

I don't think you need ALL MORPHS ALL OF THE TIME, and if you do, you can still load the original copy of Genesis via DSON.

And yes, Genesis is of course still weightmapped.

DAZ won't create a fully Poser native Genesis because that would be a logistic nightmare. The technology will develop, both of DSON as well as of Poser, so I think we'll see even better compatibility over time.

But right now, this is all what can be done.

I don't want to persuade anyone to do it, but personally I don't mind a little morph shuffling and cr2 editing to be able to use all the new Genesis content without too much fuss.

Quote - Many thanks for the kind words, everybody.

Glad you've got everything working properly, Hana-Hanabi.

 

I had no real use for Genesis in the past, either, but the most recent update finally fixed the joints so that it now bends as well in Poser as it does in Studio.

I made weightmapped versions of D3, V3, SP3, M3RR, V4LOD and M4LOD to easily re-use old clothing with a minimum of conversion needed, so making Genesis useable in Poser in order to use all it's new content was the next logical step.

Not to mention the convenience of clothes being converted to any character shape in just a few seconds.

The point is not to make more people use Genesis, but to demonstrate what Poser actually can do:

Every figure with a properly built mesh topology can be "a" Genesis, because "Genesis", to me, isn't about the actual mesh, but the "system" and technology that it was built with.

And it would be a shame not to use that technology, just because "they" had it first.

I'm not THAT petty. Two years ago, Genesis was new and shiny, and I hadn't invested two years in making clothes for the native Poser figures. That was the time to hook me on Genesis and they didn't.

I'm also not saying that no one should use Genesis. Use whatever you like. Just be creative.

Quote - So I don't need to install Studio, but I still need to download it? Nah, I'm too petty at this point to even let them count that  as another person using DS...

You just need the Genesis Starter Essentials...

Here's a question I just thought of: can DSON-into-Poser be used for their altered geometry figures, such as the four-armed "This is totally not a Thark" Thark.

Right now, I simply don't know.

The "geo-grafting" part should work, as it already does with the Genesis genitalia for example.

If the additional arms are a separate figure that just is conformed to Genesis with only the collars "geografted" on, then Poser "should" be able to do that. As I said, the genitals are a conformed figure with the pelvis part "geografted" to Genesis' pelvis.

But if Studio actually "injects" new bodyparts to the original Genesis rigging, then I doubt that figure works via DSON.

Of course the object file could always be imported into Poser and then custom rigged, if you really, really need that figure in Poser.

Best to ask this over at the DAZ forums in the DSON thread.

Just checked and the "Four Arms" geografting figure comes with DSON companion files, so it should work in Poser.

The actual Bar Soomian morph strangely doesn't, so you either have to ask RawArt why there are none, or try to make the DSON companion files yourself.

But for that, you need Studio installed.

(Maybe D3D's free DSON importer might work, too, for the morph.)

Quote - The actual Bar Soomian morph strangely doesn't, so you either have to ask RawArt why there are none, or try to make the DSON companion files yourself.

But for that, you need Studio installed.

(Maybe D3D's free DSON importer might work, too, for the morph.)

Bar Soomian predates DSON, so the base files are not in the proper format for DSON companion files. Since the arms have been updated to DSON the product should work, however you would have to resave every part of the Bar Soomian product to DSON (morphs, materials, etc)

D3D's DSON Loader is supposed to load things without the need for Poser Companion files, if that means anything to ya. (This is where I just smile and nod, 'cause I have no clue what I'm talking about!)

Quote - D3D's DSON Loader is supposed to load things without the need for Poser Companion files, if that means anything to ya. (This is where I just smile and nod, 'cause I have no clue what I'm talking about!)

It should load things that are saved using the DSON specification, however that product is not, so it won't work.

interesting so you can shape the genisis figure in poser and attach genisis made cloths to it?.

Cheers Rowlando

"interesting so you can shape the genisis figure in poser and attach genisis made cloths to it?."

Provided you have PP-2014 with its "Copy morphs from..." functionality, yes.

(D3D's morph transfer script might work, too. WardrobeWizard can transfer morphs, too, but AFAIK Genesis is not supported)

Phil does have a WW plugin for Genesis, but I don't own it...

"Phil does have a WW plugin for Genesis..."

Thanks for the info. I hadn't seen it on his website but it's good to know it's available.

I was hoping to use facegen to create the morphs for a character face and load them in DS save the figure to use in poser but I have not yet tried to get it into poser pro 2014 I have not installed DSON but what your saying seems much better.

Thanks Rowlando

Attached Link: YouTube Exporting Genesis Using DAZ Studio

what is so different between the DS triax weightmapping and the Poser weightmapping?

AFAIK, the only difference is that actor scaling is weightmappable in Studio...

You know I only have one BIG reservation with Joe's method. It doesn't seem to be the official DAZ solution to the problem. So if a problem comes up, who do I contact for support at this point, Joe or DAZ. Does DAZ even know you can do any of this?

Quote - You know I only have one BIG reservation with Joe's method. It doesn't seem to be the official DAZ solution to the problem. So if a problem comes up, who do I contact for support at this point, Joe or DAZ. Does DAZ even know you can do any of this?

I'm pretty sure that DAZ's solution is to use DS.  I would go with Joe.  In my experience, he is much more responsive.

Of course I don't want to persuade anyone to do things he/she feels uncomfortable with.

But to me a mesh is a mesh and a cr2 is a cr2. Once Genesis 1 or 2 have loaded into Poser, they, for all intents and purposes, are native Poser figures.

So why shouldn't I do the same kind of stuff with them I do with my other figures ?

DSON is pretty much just a translator, like Poser has a built in translator that lets you load a compressed .crz without having to manually uncompress it first into a .cr2.

(Try opening a .crz in a word editor to see what I mean. It's just gibberish.)

There are some differences in Poser vs Studio rigging. I never bothered to find out what exactly is different. (TRI-Ax for example can have a different map per joint axis).

All I know (and care) is that the DSON importer makes a good enough translation job to let me use Genesis without any additional joint fixing necessary.

And that automatic cloth conversion still works. (Some extreme morphs use a bit of morphbrush work, but that is true of older figures, too.)

The only drawbacks are UV-mapping and OpenGL slowness, but these can be easily taken care of by assigning a "permanent" object to a "saved" cr2. (Or exporting a cr2 from Studio. Which "is" quite easy)

I rig from scratch and "poserize" game meshes, so compared to that, a Genesis conversion isn't really hard to do. Not really harder than "fixing" older figures IMO.

Some cr2 editing, yes, but it's just a search and replace.

I'm not "promoting" Genesis. If I were, I'd send DAZ an invoice.

I'm just trying to make the most out of the stuff currently available to me and wanting to share the results.

:-)

:-P

But if the clothes still need DSON importer, won't that slow poser up?

"But if the clothes still need DSON importer, won't that slow poser up?"

You can save them as a Poser cr2 and make them use Poser's native SubD just like you can do with Genesis.

It is extra work.

But more rewarding IMO than converting clothes to Roxy or to a weightmapped V4 or whatever other figure you prefer.

Look, there will be no "Poser native" Genesis as far as I can tell.

DAZ doesn't really need "our" money that badly anymore to mess with a separate product line and SM, well, I don't know what kind of miracle SM is hoping for.

Technically, Genesis 2 is the best figure out of the box and it's the one who's getting all the cool stuff now.

I try to make it work in Poser as good as I can. And then share the results just for the heck of it and because I think using better figures will result in better Poser art for everybody.

If tomorrow someone builds an even better figure, I'll try to make that figure work in Poser as good as I can.

Take it or leave it. The choice is yours.

But as long as Genesis 1 & 2 and the DSON importer and Studio are free, all what you can loose are a couple hours of your time.

:-)

It would be great if you could post some sort of "pose file" that automates your custom joint positions etc, if you were willing to share or sell.

"It would be great if you could post some sort of "pose file" that automates your custom joint positions etc, if you were willing to share or sell."

There is no automation going on as the custom morphs are one-offs.

But theoretically the "morphed" scaling could be erc-connected to the joint center trans dials. That's actually how Genesis works.

But that would only make sense if you had a complete set of "scaling morphs" for the limbs and I'll leave making that to the Poser merchants.

As with the Danielle/Dawn figure, I don't actually know how to extract joint center trans pre-sets as a "pose file". Wouldn't be surprised if it even needs some python scrypting to work.

Also making it a "product", either free or for sale, would mean I have to give support, and I really don't have the energy for that left.

Strenght comes and goes, good days, bad days, so the only thing I can do right now is share with others how it's done.

I understand. Maybe one day. 

Quote -  

Look, there will be no "Poser native" Genesis as far as I can tell.

DAZ doesn't really need "our" money that badly anymore to mess with a separate product line and SM, well, I don't know what kind of miracle SM is hoping for.

Technically, Genesis 2 is the best figure out of the box and it's the one who's getting all the cool stuff now.

I try to make it work in Poser as good as I can. And then share the results just for the heck of it and because I think using better figures will result in better Poser art for everybody.

If tomorrow someone builds an even better figure, I'll try to make that figure work in Poser as good as I can.

Take it or leave it. The choice is yours.

And that's the main reason I won't be using Genesis any time soon. Well, that and the fact that my computer won't run Studio.I asked why DAZ didn't just put out a CR2 version of Genesis for Poser when it first came out. Their response was the DSON Importer. They're so hung up on getting people to use Studio, even if it's just to use the DSON Importer to convert it for Poser.

Genesis is there for anyone who wants to use it. I'm just not one of them.

The DSON Importer is a Poser plug-in, not a DS a DS plug-in. You don't need DS installed to use it, though you do need DS to create Poser Companion Files for content that lacks them (or you can use dimension3D's script that feeds the DSON Importer a filename directly instead of through a companion file).

You need DS to get Genesis.

Quote - You need DS to get Genesis.

No, all three Genesis flavours come with the DSON importer...

Really? Cool! I never bothered with DSON since I couldn't run Studio. Still don't care for myself though.