I've noticed a big increase lately for characters for the G2 and G3 figures. I have used V4 since the beginning and am disappointed there are very few characters or clothing for her lately. I don't like nor use the Genesis figures and have no desire to, therefore my purchases have come to a screeching halt. I know I'm not the only one that feels this way so just putting it out there. Thank you for your time.

As much as I totally agree with your sentiment ... there has been a demand from the community as a whole for vendor support of the Genesis figures. The vendors need to create for the customers and they are asking for Genesis a lot now. I personally would prefer that they include V4 in their workflow so that we all can have access to these wonderful creations. That way everyone will be served. I'm not saying to not make for Genesis, but I often see V4/Genesis2/Genesis3 in the description. This would be a great benefit to the community as a whole. Vendors ... let's not forget the new kids on the block ... Pauline and Paul and their teen counterparts! These are fantastic figures as well.

I agree, it would be beneficial if the vendors would include V4 in the Genesis zips. Sadly I do not see that often.

Judy

As a vendor I can let you know I am still on gen 4. I cannot afford the genesis figures, their clothing etc. My creations will be gen 4 for the foreseeable future.

The decision whether to support V4 or genesis (or both) is entirely up to the vendor. Fortunately there is still enough support for the V4 and family that she's a long way from being obsolete. I sometimes use the Genesis 1 figures because I got V5 and M5 free with Carrara, and I got V6 free from Daz a while back, but I still prefer V4 and M4.

Good to know SpookieLilOne that you will continue with V4 items. Honestly I don't find the characters as pretty with the Genesis figures. I have seen some pretty V7 but yet again, they are far and few between. I'd rather keep adding to my V4 collection. Good to hear you saying wheatpenny that V4 is far from being obsolete. I will keep looking. Thank you all for your feedback.

I am in a similar position in that I do not want to jump through hoops to get a figure to work in Poser or try and re-invent the wheel by swapping programs. Having said that my spending on V4 was dropping anyway as I have a vast wardrobe of items for V4. More recently I have used Dawn a lot more, particularly after the release of Dawn SE, and that has resulted in me using dynamic clothing far more and there was never much for V4 as far as dynamics is concerned.

I do still use V4 and occasionally buy items for her as they are easily converted to use with Dawn as well but I also accept the market for V4 (and Dawn) is a much smaller market than that for Genesis. You really can't blame the vendors for following the money, as they will when Genesis 4 and Genesis 5 hits the market, it is just I am not playing that game. I am happy with what I have and the occasional new products and opportunities that open up. For example I never dreamed I would do so many renders using horses but that all changed when, instead of buying yet another V4 outfit I purchased the Hivewire horse instead.

I'm still making stuff for V4. If you are into Superheroes, scifi and comics (and geeky stuff in general), then you might find something interesting at my DeviantArt homepage. (just google Terrymcg and DeviantArt). That's where I am selling my costumes.

It's all a matter of market saturation. V4 has been around for so long, and so many thousands of characters and products for her have already been been released, that any new V4 product released has to compete with all of that previously released product. By comparison, the number of products that are out there for G3F/V7 is relatively small, so any new product is going to have a lot less competition. As for creating a product that works on both V4 and V7... we've really hit the point where backwards compatibility is getting very difficult to maintain, so not only does it add a huge amount of work to the cost of the product to make two versions, but converting the skins requires the use of third party products that the majority of customers won't own. And even if you do that, it's not like G2F, where it wasn't that hard to remap a V4 skin and clone a V4 morph. Remapping for G3F can be very hit or miss, and requires specialized software or custom geografts. It's kind of like trying to make parts for a Tesla work on your Mom's old VW... yes, it can technically be done, but from a vendor's perspective, will the handful of additional sales you might get really be worth all of the time and effort?

As a primarily Genesis 3 User I can tell you there is still a lot of V4 support here, I think the problem is still that Rendo does not have any easy way to narrow down what kinds of items you want to see. As much as you don't like looking at an item, wanting to buy it, and finding out it's for Genesis, that's how much I don't like doing the same thing and finding out it's for V4. There really isn't even a good way to separate out DAZ only items from Poser only items from items that will work with both.

If Rendo is interested in getting it's programmers to work on an update for this July that will actually increase sales, a good start would be to allow user to set software and Character generation settings in their profile, then classifying all new items when they come in by those preferences, and allow users to filter or not filter on the click of the button. And that includes paid advertising, you stand a much better chance of getting a sale from me with that if it is something I can actually use.

The more space on page 1 you devote to items that don't work with the software we are using, the less sales you are going to get. This has nothing to do with vendor preferences as to what software they design for.

diogenese19348 posted at 9:26AM Mon, 09 May 2016 - #4268389

As a primarily Genesis 3 User I can tell you there is still a lot of V4 support here, I think the problem is still that Rendo does not have any easy way to narrow down what kinds of items you want to see. As much as you don't like looking at an item, wanting to buy it, and finding out it's for Genesis, that's how much I don't like doing the same thing and finding out it's for V4. There really isn't even a good way to separate out DAZ only items from Poser only items from items that will work with both.

Yes!!!

Please Rendo We need a Daz Only & Poser Only Button!!

Any chance that will be implemented?

@Biscuits this request has been added to the list and they will see what they can do in regards to fine tuning the search. I think we had a thread going on the subject a few weeks back.

A few weeks ago 3D-age was vendor of the month. I've enjoyed his products for years, but I'm curious: does he have any plans to make his V4 clothing items compatible with G3?

cellec posted at 11:31AM Sat, 21 May 2016 - #4269364

A few weeks ago 3D-age was vendor of the month. I've enjoyed his products for years, but I'm curious: does he have any plans to make his V4 clothing items compatible with G3?

You probably ought to ask him that directly, my bet would be if he was going to, he would have started doing that a while back. Actually a lot of his stuff does autofit, you just have to be careful about anything that's a skirt or dress because you get that danged "V" indentation with those. Most of the tops translate pretty well.

as a character maker, i can honestly say that creating products for V4 is just not worth my time anymore. sadly the sales figures no longer make V4 a viable figure to support. don't get me wrong, i love V4 and have spent an awful amount of money on V4 products. as my income from sales is what feeds me and helps pay bills, i have to create products that will give me a good return on my time invested, which means i have to create for G3F/G3M fulltime( i do manage to make a few lil props here and there when i have spare time)

sadly, the SM figures would have even less sales than V4, so they are figures that most PA's do not even consider worth touching.

tbh, in general , only PA's that make products as a hobby can think of continuing to support non-DAZ3D figures. the PA's that actually earn their living from product creation can only support figures that continue to be well supported by customers. in conversations with other PA's ( some used to create products solely for V4) the market for Poser products and V4 has shrunk to the state that they just are not worth spending the time creating products for anymore. i think it is a shame, as i love using both programs, and still use V4 a lot in my personal artwork. i prefer Firefly to 3Delight myself, but i really love Iray( just need to save up for a better graphics card to get most benefit from it! lol! )

Face it, V4 is old tech, Genesis 3 is new tech, this is a hobby that relies on new tech in order to grow forward, not stagnate in the past. V4's joints and figure are as realistic as posette compared with genesis 3, so the development of new figures and technologies should not rely on old tech.

Yes, there are third party products still being made in an attempt to give V4 a more realistic joint bend, but genesis 3 already has that built into the figure itself without the need for an extra purchase, along with being able to fit any clothing item/hair/morphs from generations 3-7! V3>V4>V5>V6>V7

I also agree that it was a crappy move for both DAZ and Poser to make Daz 5-7 generation characters mostly incompatible with Poser, and vice versa as this is the very reason why most V4 supporters hold Gen 5 characters in open contempt, which in turn has, to a large extent divided the community!

If V5/7 was as poser friendly as V4, we wouldn't have this issue, indeed, I would say that V4 would have gone the same route as Posette!

While DAZ started out as a company making figures for Poser, that's not what they are now, and they really have no reason to make sure the figures work in Poser at this point. DAZ Studio and Poser are competing programs. The question is why Smith Micro can't seem to make current figures for their own software. Actually the question can be stretched to why Smith Micro has never come up with a line of figures that caught on.

If SM wanted to use Daz 5-7 figures they could have written the support into Poser, it clearly wasn't a priority for them.

As far as the V4 vs Gen 5 characters, I can tell you that at the time, as a DAZ user, using V4 vs Gen 5 (the first genesis generation) was a toss up - Genesis 1 is not all that realistic particularly in Facial Expressions, and didn't bend all that well. Frankly it was great for any character what wasn't human, and I still use it for that.. Genesis 2 however is far superior to V4.

Seeing that there are add-ons that can convert V4's entire morphs and clothing across the entire generation 5-7 character lineup means that she won't leave completely as there is an interest still there, but at some point people will move on as DAZ has clearly moved on from making V4 content, it is up to V4 PAs to carry on, and if not, you can always have V4's morphs and clothing live on through genesis 1-2.

I still work with, and create for, the Generation 4's, as I use them in conjunction WITH my Genesis 1.

I don't hardly even touch the Genesis 2's or Genesis 3's. Yes, I'm a DS creator and artist, but I also provide Poser support if it's at all possible for me to do. If you don't believe that, just check HW's forums, and look at Nataani's development thread.

I never was overly fond of the Generation 4's, to be honest, but I do still use them - and support them - today. I also still use my old Generation 3's and sometimes even the Generation 2's. Heck, there's times where I dig out my old P4 male and female to use! Old and obsolete does not mean utterly useless.

That said, however - if the Daz Genesis figure products were not selling, IMO vendors would not continue to be making products for them.

Give the un-solvable divide at the moment in terms of the Gen5+ not functioning in Poser, and the DS artists wanting to use them while the Poser folks still want to make use of the Gen4's... IMO, the best thing we can do right now is to just aim for more of an even keel of support for both figures.

Any product or freebie I make for Genesis 1, if I can make it compatible somehow with the Gen4's, I do. And that's the best that any vendor or freebie maker can do with this situation.

The choice to support, or not support, any figure is up to the individual creator. I personally greatly enjoy working with Genesis 1. I despise the G2's and the G3's. I like Dawn and Dusk and Luna. I support the figures that I enjoy working with. I have gotten used to M4 and V4, but I really don't like either of them. However, they are definitely better figures than M3 and V3 ever were, and yes, I do support them when it is possible for me to do.

We have two programs on the market. Daz Studio, and Poser. DS can make use of almost any Poser content that is produced. The same can NOT be said for Poser. This makes supporting both programs rather difficult at times for creators. And for those of us who only have the standard version of Poser, and cannot throw down two hundred or more dollars to move to a Pro version, having basically none of the content creation tools available (when they are free in Studio), further discourages additional support of Poser on the part of some creators. I came very close myself to completely dropping Poser support. An item that takes me maybe two weeks to put together and release for DS, takes me three to four MONTHS to get right in Poser. That's an insanely high production timeline. It's nuts.

I think at some point in the future, the two programs are going to end up completely splitting away from each other. I think it's only going to continue to get harder and harder to support both software, and at some point the products for one will not work in the other and vice versa. The introduction of the Genesis line was the beginning of that. Am I happy about that? No. No, I'm not. If I was, I would have already fully dropped all Poser support.

I'll continue to support the Gen4's as long as there's an interest in them, and I'll continue to do Poser support for my items (free or otherwise) as much as I possibly can. But if I can't produce a functional, good quality item for Poser, then I can't produce it, and it's just going to have to be DS-only. I won't put out anything that's half-schlocked just to claim it supports both programs. I don't care if the item is a freebie or a commercial product. If the quality can't be achieved, I don't put it out.

So long as I'm able to support both figure lines, and both softwares, I will. But I have to tell you, to be blunt, dealing with Poser is absolutely infuriating for me, and I can't stand the software. So anything I make that comes with Poser support, you can pretty much guarantee it's run me several months of fighting and pulling my hair out in order to make it work in that software for you. Poser is NOT intuitive for me anymore (and I did use it faithfully from versions 4 through 7, and then again on 10). It makes my brain hurt, and it drives me up a wall. I do it because I don't like to leave anyone out. But it's very HARD for me to work with, and does not exactly endear itself to consistent content production for me. Even when I was selling on Content Paradise, my DS content sold much, much better than my Poser content. And that's SM's home marketplace.

Those are just my own thoughts, as a long-time freebie maker, and small-time vendor.

I agree! I continue to use V4 and M4 and like the results I get. I have a small fortune invested in them and have no plans on moving on. I used to buy something every week, but now it's hard to find anything for them. Kinda sad. Too bad the vendors don't make V4 items in addition to Genesis things. I think people would still buy them.

For those using D/S, I trust everybody is aware that one can use Genesis and the legacy shapes to get a head start for modeling clothing for the legacy items. Few pros and cons for the end result. Pro, stays in one piece :-) Con, no inj/rem morphs unless something has been developed I'm not aware of. [I still use D/S3 to make those]