DAZ could, if they wanted to, write a full bore content converter instead of a half born extremely memory hungry crack like DSON. And that are my last words on the subject.

wolf359 posted at 11:24AM Fri, 27 April 2018 - #4329034

Ah! Finally the other member of the Troll duo has arrived! I'm amused.

Though I won't reply to any of your ramblings MISTER @MaleMedia.. You're only here to stir up shit in company with your pal @woof359", and I won't support yous in your'se "mission"

Now please SOAD.

Karina

tonyvilters posted at 1:19PM Fri, 27 April 2018 - #4329042

DAZ could, if they wanted to, write a full bore content converter instead of a half born extremely memory hungry crack like DSON. And that are my last words on the subject.

Again, years later the conversation isn't about DAZ3D writing converters, the subject is about V4 which happens to be one of their products. You know it's the Poser forum, right? You probably should vent some of that frustration towards Smith Micro, since they've been AWOL from most users since November and DAZ doesn't need to do things that SM should have done years ago. You should probably get back to topic ;)

KarinaKiev posted at 1:24PM Fri, 27 April 2018 - #4329046

wolf359 posted at 11:24AM Fri, 27 April 2018 - #4329034

Ah! Finally the other member of the Troll duo has arrived! I'm amused.

Though I won't reply to any of your ramblings MISTER @MaleMedia.. You're only here to stir up shit in company with your pal @woof359", and I won't support yous in your'se "mission"

Now please SOAD.

Karina

Someone's taking this really personal. But the ignore button is always good so that the conversation of who still uses V4 isn't derailed. But you know personal attacks aren't allowed here.

You all would have more fun fighting hear https://www.callofduty.com/

WAR

Because I have tons for her, I refuse to work in DAZ Studio, and everything above V4 crashes my Poser, that's why.

Because I can't do this with any other figure that I have...

The real cr*p happening in Poser forums is, they act like in a cult. Don't post your opinion, that does not go with the crowd and you are accused to be a troll as part of the evil DAZ conspiracy. That is just crazy. Actually I think, the decay of Poser came with those V4 only users. They brought Poser down. They don't care about how well their figure is, they don't see, that V4 bends like a piece of dry wood and is therefore only useful in portraits. The V4 users mantra is: "I bought so much stuff, I won't switch." Then why should SM invest in really improving Poser? Why would they release cool figures, when that crowd is still using V4 only? SM can lean back and sell the same stuff over and over again including some free modules every new version as a tease. For the majority of the V4 people Poser 7 mostley would be enough. @ Karina: your Sasha 16 is amazing and awsome - small problem still, she is about 10 years late. A product like this released in 2008, I might have become a V4 user too. last but not least, I just can't stand all those V4s in the galleries anymore. yawn Beside some small amount of real good examples, the majority is ... well... below "expected skill level". Use more than those unbalance pregiven one shin up poses. Stop those "one eye blink tongue out" expressions. No more fairies on a mushroom, please. Light set up are a cool thing that People urgently shoul think about. Seriousley, it's a PITA to watch the e.g. DeviantArt galleries using V4. Go drop V4, it won't hurt. There are two new kids on the block to play with. Bella and Project Evolution. You can even convert your V4 stuff to PE now. Now with my comment, twolf359 and Male_M3dia don't look as much like Trolls anymore, isn't it? so yeah, I'm glad I could help.

tonyvilters posted at 9:54AM Sat, 28 April 2018 - #4328999

One must be a retarded clown to use their DSON crack to get any of the new stuff partly working in Poser.

Tja, DAZ is the only company that hacked into its own code, to come up with a crack, to get something going in a competing software. LOL. They should sue themselves. LOL.

Not really. Decision makes perfect sense for their business since the company makes money by selling content. A wider scope of users for them means more sales = more money. To expect (or not) whether the extra sales will make up for the investment of making and supporting these bridges is business decision.

But this goes off topic.

Ach, they just release the best content. Completely agree. The best figures, the best vendors, the best marketing system.

They don't want to create a full bore converter to Poser because they want to get you all into DS.

Once that's Poser is dead and forgotten, they can start to sell DS again.

Full circle business strategy.

Unfortunately for them, this generation of Poser users has all the content they need for V4/M4.

Next generation of 3D artists will probably move over to DAZ/DS if SM does not come up with valuable alternates.

tonyvilters posted at 1:26PM Sat, 28 April 2018 - #4329085

Ach, they just release the best content. Completely agree. The best figures, the best vendors, the best marketing system.

They don't want to create a full bore converter to Poser because they want to get you all into DS.

Once that's Poser is dead and forgotten, they can start to sell DS again.

Full circle business strategy.

Unfortunately for them, this generation of Poser users has all the content they need for V4/M4.

Next generation of 3D artists will probably move over to DAZ/DS if SM does not come up with valuable alternates.

Years later and the misinformation still spreads.

There could never be any "full-fledged" converter because SM refused to put anything in their software to allow that to happen. Poser didn't get the full implementation of the pixar subdivision and other things that the DAZ figures needed until 2 versions later. The excuse many of the users that came to SM's defense was, "that's proprietary so SM doesn't want to implement it." So DAZ made genesis 3 with industry standard Dual Quaterion weightmapping that SM could implement for free and made it so you needed nothing of DAZ's to bring it into poser. Now is that in the software yet? Not at all, and as you can see from the marketplace here, you see that customers got tired of waiting for SM to do anything on meaningful on the figure development front, so there's no need for a converter now. SM can mark it up as opportunity lost.

That said, some people still make items for V4 just not in the quantities some want, while others are waiting for other figures to upgrade to that has the same appeal. Also on the comment of "this generation".. what about the next?

Anyway, let's not derail the topic with rehashes of things that don't matter years later.

Joepie, I won !

I new "you" were going to repond. => Off to collect my ptice money.

Thanks.

Now AFTER reading WHAT your wrote? Why on planet earth would SM put code in Poser to please DAZ in the first place?

If DAZ wants to sell content to us, they can provide the code and not a part-time crack; LOL.

So predictable.

Again, in this conversation people will hear what they want to hear meanwhile life goes on and other things get sold. So I'll press the ignore button because I don't have to argue about what everyone sees in terms of what's in the store. Arguing, name calling and fighting is not going to convince vendors to continue supporting a product if that's all they're being offered. They'll do exactly what they're doing now.

Yes, baby, yes. I also won the double or nothing.

I've never known rigs to be universal like.obj. Not that I haven't wanted universal rigs is Standard Dual Quaterion Weightmapping universal ? Will they work in C4D, Blender ect ect.

RorrKonn posted at 12:34AM Sun, 29 April 2018 - #4329122

I've never known rigs to be universal like.obj. Not that I haven't wanted universal rigs is Standard Dual Quaterion Weightmapping universal ? Will they work in C4D, Blender ect ect.

It's available in most programs such as C4D, blender, maya, etc...

It's really terrible for forum users like me who only irregularly contribute here and even less over at DS forum to read such personal attacks as those from 'tonyvilters' and 'KarinaKiev' targeted against all Poser users who use DSON ("retarded") and especially two other members of this forum who still react civil to these comments and stay on topic.

To the moderators here: before you close this thread consider just to block 'tonyvilters' and 'KarinaKiev' from this thread because it was interesting to read all the other comments on the subject. Thanks in advance! PS: Sorry I did not find the option to write a PM to the moderator about this.

Would be cool if we had like a 3D windows n just buyed parts from Poser,C4D,DAZ,Maya etc etc n they all worked together in the 3D windows.

Lost In Paradise

The question in the thread is "Why are you still using V4?" To answer this you must first BE USING V4. If not, your presence in this thread, at best, is pointless and at worst, unwarranted. Now, if you are using V4, the topic is "Why?" Answers not within this topic are unnecessary and downright rude. Why don't you just pick another topic to derail? Does V4 hit some kind of nerve? You can tell us what you like about V4 that makes you continue to use her, show us examples and give helpful tips. Tearing down other figures or whining about different software should be done elsewhere. Even my pumped-up-on-hormones, adolescent-filled classrooms have more decorum.

I still use her, because the times I'm using her, she fits the purpose I am using her for. If she doesn't I use a different figure that will.

That is the wonderfully amazing thing about "CHOICE".

I still use her because i like how she looks, she works great for me, have lots of cool stuff, genesis figures dont work well on my computer, they slow down my poser so much its annoying.

A4 is so cute...

Another Brick In The Wall (Part 2)

To update my post from 2 years ago.....

V4/M4 still has more content (Characters, Clothing, and Hair) by several orders of magnitude. Now that content is even easier to move to whatever figure I wish to use than it was two years ago.

V4/M4 still has a wider variety of content (Characters, Clothing, and Hair) by several orders of magnitude. This allows me to have a wider variety of scenes than any other figure. And it is easier to move to other figures than it was 2 years ago.

V4/M4 uses less system resources than newer DAZ figures. 1/2Gb figures is the height of stupidity when nothing else is made to the same level of detail.

V4/M4 is less expensive than newer DAZ figures. Other Poser native figures are still price competitive with M4/V4, but the G figures are steadily going up in price.

V4/M4 is easy to upgrade (i.e. add weightmapping, subdivision, etc) to have all of the features of a modern figure.

V4/M4 is an easier figure to use than the G figures, based on how they were initially designed way back when.

At the end of the day, the DAZ Gen 4 figures are the most cost-effective figures available. That being said, they aren't my go-to figures. I use V4/M4 to fill gaps that aren't addressed in enough depth for other figures. Then again, I have never understood the desire to limit oneself to a single mesh. More figures equal more variety.

And yeah, DSON is still a poorly designed, poorly implemented piece of software. If one wants to use G figures - it is easiest just to export the figures out of DS and convert them to Poser native. My DAZ G2 figures are about the same size as my SM G2 figures (about 100Mb each).

Oh, and we can also depend on DAZ to do 70 - 85% off sales (like right now) - which doesn't happen with other figures.

The main reason I am using her now with all native Poser figures available is because I was able to pick up 100% of what I have for her FREE. All the morphs, some clothing, a couple hair props... all free, And I can make anything I don't have.

It's been a while and I really can't be bothered to wade through all this thread to see what's been said but...

I may be repeating myself here, so forgiveness is asked for in advance. I never took to V4 but, sometimes the figure gets the job done. There's a ton of stuff available, the newish WM versions plus the stuff by Karina makes it a lot more useful overall. Added to which, figures don't go mouldy/moldy, nor do their clothes/hair/accessories. Decent shaders, subdivision and so forth make all figures (ok, most figures) useful now and again. Hey, I still like V2 and 3 at times.

Big, big fan of Project E, it has to be said, although I haven't done much with the figure yet. I don't have much time to work on my own projects, let alone render stuff for fun and I've just joined a new band so time is even more limited now.

Right, that's me for now. Oh, and please, guys, try to keep a sense of proportion here. It's stuff for making pictures, nothing to start fighting about.

SamTherapy posted at 12:55AM Mon, 07 May 2018 - #4329563

It's been a while and I really can't be bothered to wade through all this thread to see what's been said but...

I may be repeating myself here, so forgiveness is asked for in advance. I never took to V4 but, sometimes the figure gets the job done. There's a ton of stuff available, the newish WM versions plus the stuff by Karina makes it a lot more useful overall. Added to which, figures don't go mouldy/moldy, nor do their clothes/hair/accessories. Decent shaders, subdivision and so forth make all figures (ok, most figures) useful now and again. Hey, I still like V2 and 3 at times.

Big, big fan of Project E, it has to be said, although I haven't done much with the figure yet. I don't have much time to work on my own projects, let alone render stuff for fun and I've just joined a new band so time is even more limited now.

Right, that's me for now. Oh, and please, guys, try to keep a sense of proportion here. It's stuff for making pictures, nothing to start fighting about.

Expiration date ... Never.

Got a youtube page ,for ya Music ?

RorrKonn posted at 1:10PM Mon, 07 May 2018 - #4329567

SamTherapy posted at 12:55AM Mon, 07 May 2018 - #4329563

It's been a while and I really can't be bothered to wade through all this thread to see what's been said but...

I may be repeating myself here, so forgiveness is asked for in advance. I never took to V4 but, sometimes the figure gets the job done. There's a ton of stuff available, the newish WM versions plus the stuff by Karina makes it a lot more useful overall. Added to which, figures don't go mouldy/moldy, nor do their clothes/hair/accessories. Decent shaders, subdivision and so forth make all figures (ok, most figures) useful now and again. Hey, I still like V2 and 3 at times.

Big, big fan of Project E, it has to be said, although I haven't done much with the figure yet. I don't have much time to work on my own projects, let alone render stuff for fun and I've just joined a new band so time is even more limited now.

Right, that's me for now. Oh, and please, guys, try to keep a sense of proportion here. It's stuff for making pictures, nothing to start fighting about.

Expiration date ... Never.

Got a youtube page ,for ya Music ?

Nope, sorry. There is an old video from an open air thing we did years ago, somewhere out there. I'll try to dig it up.

I still use Victoria 4 because I helped create her. ;)

HakDragon posted at 8:27PM Wed, 09 May 2018 - #4329714

I still use Victoria 4 because I helped create her. ;)

Can you tell us more about it, please?

-Timberwolf- posted at 12:29PM Wed, 09 May 2018 - #4329715

HakDragon posted at 8:27PM Wed, 09 May 2018 - #4329714

I still use Victoria 4 because I helped create her. ;)

Can you tell us more about it, please?

No problem, I was the QA Manager for DAZ during the V4.2, A4, M4, and so on all the way through Genesis 1. Our team did all the QA, I worked on software compatibility, and I even worked with Smith Micro during the Freak 4 roll-out to get the Poser scaling issues worked out. All the Gen 4 figures are my team's hard work and some of that same QA team still does a great job there today.

I did not work on original V4 or V4.1, I came on with Aiko 4 and the V4.2 rollout, but I still consider that version (which has stood the test of time) to be an amazing piece of work given what we started with and where this figure will be 10, 20 or even 50 years from now. With all the community fixes and reworks she is still looking and working beautifully for me (especially in Poser).

-Hak aka DAZ_HakDragon

HakDragon posted at 5:51AM Tue, 15 May 2018 - #4329717

-Timberwolf- posted at 12:29PM Wed, 09 May 2018 - #4329715

HakDragon posted at 8:27PM Wed, 09 May 2018 - #4329714

I still use Victoria 4 because I helped create her. ;)

Can you tell us more about it, please?

No problem, I was the QA Manager for DAZ during the V4.2, A4, M4, and so on all the way through Genesis 1. Our team did all the QA, I worked on software compatibility, and I even worked with Smith Micro during the Freak 4 roll-out to get the Poser scaling issues worked out. All the Gen 4 figures are my team's hard work and some of that same QA team still does a great job there today.

I did not work on original V4 or V4.1, I came on with Aiko 4 and the V4.2 rollout, but I still consider that version (which has stood the test of time) to be an amazing piece of work given what we started with and where this figure will be 10, 20 or even 50 years from now. With all the community fixes and reworks she is still looking and working beautifully for me (especially in Poser).

-Hak aka DAZ_HakDragon

Nice! Thanks to you and the devs/artists, we've had years to make images (aka: "art") using the most successful commercial CGI figure, by far. Ever.

V4 still rocks!

Simplest of setups: Poser Pro 11, a classic v4wm (based on 4.2, of course), curtain backdrop, 3 lights, reality 4. exported to luxrender for about an hour on a c2012 rMBP, all materials exported with no tweaking (except making floor more reflective). About 5 minutes to setup; most of that hunting through the massive library that's accreted over the years. Can't stress enough how easy this workflow is.

Seriously, why would I need to even look at another girl?

I have so much for V4 cloths, material and so on I don't like DAZ . would be great if bought V4 out right from and carried on the V4

Altec? I think you're missing some qualifying nouns in that second sentence.

Sincerely,

Bill

Yes I did Redfern What I meant to say was it would great if Smith Micro bought V4 outright from Daz and kept on improving her

Yeah, I think you'd have a better chance of having Prince perform at your next birthday party before that happens.

it would great if Smith Micro bought V4 outright from Daz and kept on improving her

V4 can only be "improved " by completely re-creating her with more modern technology that is tied to a native application that has matching core technolog to implement the advanced features of the figure,

Honestly, if a company is the making that kind of investment why not Make their own?? instead of continuously renovating some patched up, 12 year of rig from Daz??

Figure& animation Companies Like Reallusion have began to understand what the rest of the CG world Already knew.....

You Dont Need to keep paying homage to one"special" group of people in Draper Utah ,to have good looking young white girls in your Character program . Thus Reallusion Will be shortly releasing their own stand alone high quality Figure creation&morphing program with NVDIA IRay for use in the Powerful Iclone animation pipeline as well as for exporting to other pro Applications that import FBX(including poser11)

https://www.reallusion.com/character-creator/production.html?utm_source=rc_1805&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=newsletter&utm_term=cc_main_know_more

There are a lot of high quality V4 renders in the galleries, which are mostley portrays. V4's face is its strengh. It is highley morphable. But it is a PITA, to see all these V4 renders with their unbalanced all the same pre set poses and those licking lips and laugh "s.e.x.y" expressions. V4 smiles are butt ugly, because she suffers from the DAZ-smile desease. Her upperlips don't strech when she smiles. We have the same V4 renders over and over in all galleries for 12 !!! years now. Move on, please.! Here I recreated a V4 gallery nightmare: [ugly Render.png]

I agree that they should make a new character a bit more advance than V4 rather than remaking her. Not saying that she have run her cause, because that is simply not true, but as I have said before it depends what you need from a character.

And I don't really follow your point:

V4 smiles are butt ugly, because she suffers from the DAZ-smile desease. Her upperlips don't strech when she smiles. We have the same V4 renders over and over in all galleries for 12 !!! years now. Move on, please.! Here I recreated a V4 gallery nightmare: [ugly Render.png]

Nothing prevent you from creating a morph to deal with that, if you think its a problem, in fact as seen from the demonstration of that comic book, cant remember what its called now, you can completely change her to whatever you need. And what you are using as an example can be said with any character doesn't matter if its V4 or someone else. You will always be able to find things about them that might not be good or what you are after for a given character.

That people render her in such images that you use as an example, have nothing to do with her as a character. I think its a sort of narrow minded view, because what makes a good image or not, is not only the character, but composition, light & shadow, expression, mood etc. So even if you used a genesis character it would make no difference to whether an image is appealing to you or not. Now I would agree that if you take a character of very low quality it might ruin the image, if it doesn't match the rest of quality because it stands out to much. But V4 is no where near that in my opinion.

What it comes down to as I see it is actually a discussion of what is interesting art and what is not. Which is a personal taste, to me it comes down to primarily two things, technical and creativity. By technical I mean someone trying to do something for a given reason which is not especially to be creative or make something that have to mean a lot, but purely to test or show off technique. And then you have the creative part where you attempt to make your media be interesting and meaningful in whatever way. Which is what people that are referred to as artists do. Which could be modern art, people doing all thoughts of crazy things and call them art.

And to me an image like you posted above is not very interesting, but might be more of an technical thing for a person at given point. Like for instant in your image it might be that you were trying to match the background image with the character or something and it were your first attempt. Personally I would upload such image, because I think its to little if that were a technical test and I wouldn't upload it as "art" either, because I wouldn't know what the image were suppose to express. So I can see what you mean with your example. But again I think you are wrong blaming it on V4 or any other character, rather than your view on what you think people should upload as interesting art.

I'll take the ten penny box of nails please.

Nothing prevent you from creating a morph to deal with that, if you think its a problem,

Someone released a set of V4 multiple smile morphs years ago that are truly remarkable...Beautiful!!. I used the GENX 2 Plugin for DS to move them up to my Genesis females Along with all of my favorite V4 morphs including some ones I had "Dialed in" for V4 years ago and saved.

My point is this: Daz was able ease the transition from Millenuim 4 to genesis because they own the Millenium 4 IP and users of Genesis ONE/TWO never had to abandon thier Massive hoardes of V4 content & Skin Maps until enough new G1/G2 stuff flooded the market to replace it.

We all know the history.

The Poser community will never have the option of moving forward to new figure tech while keep compatibilty with their Millenuim 4 Content collections...sorry, but that is the reality of it.

Obviously No one seems interested in any tedious Manual conversion of V4 clothings to a new girl or Project E would have been the saviour many were expecting.

Any new figure that automatically uses V4 clothing violate DAZ's IP. and Daz will never sell that IP to Anyone as Eclarke Pointed out.

Thus poser users, who will never leave poser for DS or Iclone Pro, can continue as they have been with the Hivewire figures, or PE or cling to V4.

No problem.

Any new figure that automatically uses V4 clothing violate DAZ's IP. and Daz will never sell that IP to Anyone as Eclarke Pointed out.

Are you sure that is correct, possible or even legal? Because the cloth that is made is not owned by Daz but by the creator. In theory I could create a dress for Character X that I made, which happens to also fit on V4, it sounds weird if they would or even could sue me for having made Character X, without clearly being able to proof that my mesh were made on V4 or copied from her and even then Im not sure they could do it. Daz own the right for V4, but you can't claim a mesh only the design? Because what would prevent me for doing the same on a specific size box and say that no one else can use my box "character" called Boxer and if any cloth fits him it would violate my IP, it sounds a bit dodgy to me, if that is true. :D

Also you have to remember that V4 comes with a lot of morphs, so if the cloth fits any of these is it then the same?

Mobster that sounds very logical but I guess DAZ (like many US-companys e.g. IBM, Oracle, ...) rely more on these two historical statements:

1. britain rules the waves but america waives the rules (from america cup historie)
2. pacta sund servanda (latin from very long ago)

Second one is unknow e.g. to Donald Trump. I guess he had not have latin in school ...

Both together means US is a land of lawyer and even if something sounds logical it needs not to be successful in law suits ... I would not try to discuss law things with companies able to pay dozends of lawyers even if I'm sure to be on the right side. Very very sad but true ... so no actualized V4 although the girl is it worth and the invests into all these content would be a very honest argument.

Mobster that sounds very logical but I guess DAZ (like many US-companys e.g. IBM, Oracle, ...) rely more on these two historical statements:

britain rules the waves but america waives the rules (from america cup historie) pacta sund servanda (latin from very long ago) Second one is unknow e.g. to Donald Trump. I guess he had not have latin in school ...

Both together means US is a land of lawyer and even if something sounds logical it needs not to be successful in law suits ... I would not try to discuss law things with companies able to pay dozends of lawyers even if I'm sure to be on the right side. Very very sad but true ... so no actualized V4 although the girl is it worth and the invests into all these content would be a very honest argument.

But there is a difference between what companies "feel" is right and what they can actually do. Because if you think about it, what Wolf359 is suggesting, if its true, and this is what they claim. Daz have claimed a specific human body shape as their IP, I mean we are not taking about V4 face or design as such, but if any character fits any cloth that would fit V4, then they would be able to claim that someone had violated their IP. US or not, I really have a hard time believing that such thing would be possible, because we will run out of human shapes very fast then. Because I guess this would be the same for any character, so any Genesis character, PE could do the same, SM with theirs etc. I think someone might have misunderstand what Daz is talking about legally here. Disney can and does protect Mickey mouse as a design for example, but they can not prevent anyone from ever creating a character which is a mouse at same basic shape, if it looks different. So as long as you don't directly rip off their design there would be no problem. V4 rig is not unique either, loads of characters use that or something similar, so it need to be in regards to her complete design if you ask me. Meaning that you copy/paste her looks and everything.

I think someone might have misunderstand what Daz >is talking about legally here.

No misunderstanding Daz considers the shape of thier figure as "Unique" and ANY mesh that uses the shape of a Daz figure as a guide becomes subject to the Daz EULA that YOU agreed to when YOU installed that figure on your system.

This includes something as small as wedding ring modeled to fit around the finger of the Mighty Genesis.

I know this because I tried to Share the original base mesh that I created in Silo 2.0 and use as the base for all of my original Genesis Clothing that I create for myself.

You see I dont support Daz financially at all as I am liberated from their content hamster wheel by my own modeling skills..

here is a tiny excerpt from the mutiple emails Daz sent threatening me with legal action over MY OWN Original Model:

DAZ: "We have had to remove your thread "POLL: any interest in a FREE open source Clothing base mesh for G2 thru G8??" as the shape of the base mesh is derived from the shape of the Daz figure it matches, and as a result you do not have the rights to make the mesh Open Source (or to loosen the Daz EULA in any way)."

ME :Hi these meshes were not "derived" from the base shape of any genesis mesh these meshes are a made with Silo 2.1 and exported to C4D( see attachments) the base shape is entirely different and pushed an pulled until theysurrounded the various genesis meshes for clothing development purposes

The topology is different the vertex count is different No Daz rigging or UV info is shared

Please explain, in exacting detail, how these are any different from ageneric 'Sci fi bodysuit" for G3 etc being Shared on Shared CG??

If you do not provide a proper legal explaination I will share thisfree community resource

DAZ :"The fact that you modelled the meshes to fit around the Daz figures means that they derive from the Daz figures, and so are subject to the Daz EULA."

Welcome to the Delusional world of Daz3D

3D-Mobster posted at 5:50PM Wed, 29 August 2018 - #4335434

---

Any new figure that automatically uses V4 clothing violate DAZ's IP. and Daz will never sell that IP to Anyone as Eclarke Pointed out.

---

Are you sure that is correct, possible or even legal? Because the cloth that is made is not owned by Daz but by the creator. In theory I could create a dress for Character X that I made, which happens to also fit on V4, it sounds weird if they would or even could sue me for having made Character X, without clearly being able to proof that my mesh were made on V4 or copied from her and even then Im not sure they could do it. Daz own the right for V4, but you can't claim a mesh only the design? Because what would prevent me for doing the same on a specific size box and say that no one else can use my box "character" called Boxer and if any cloth fits him it would violate my IP, it sounds a bit dodgy to me, if that is true. :D

Also you have to remember that V4 comes with a lot of morphs, so if the cloth fits any of these is it then the same?

The artist owns the mesh that makes the clothing, but in order for that clothing to function on V4, it requires V4's rigging (and shape), and DAZ owns V4's rigging (and shape). They allow that rigging to be used to make content for V4. They do not allow that rigging to be used to make a competing figure or content for any competing figure(s). If the artist wants to refit their own V4 clothing (meaning what they've modeled themselves) to another figure and use that other figure's rigging then that's out of DAZ's control, but they can legally (and have) stopped the production/sale of any figure that uses V4's rigging, because her rigging is their IP.

The artist owns the mesh that makes the clothing, but >in order for that clothing to function on V4, it requires >V4's rigging (and >shape), and DAZ owns V4's rigging (and shape)

Correct sir

I did not fight them in the matter I mentioned above, becaues I was only trying to help others get a head start on becoming clothing developers themselves instead of begging the PA's in the bi monthly "no content for men", threads over there.

Interestingly DAZ Did suggest that I submit my base dev mesh as a commercial product to apply to be a Daz PA ..but I Declined.

DAZ :"The fact that you modelled the meshes to fit around the Daz figures means that they derive from the Daz figures, and so are subject to the Daz EULA."

Welcome to the Delusional world of Daz3D ?

That's hilarious :D

I have to say that I doubt that such claim would hold up in court and sounds more like a scare tactic made by someone that think they have the right to do something that they ain't legally allow to do. I mean what would they do if someone accidentally figured out that one Dreamworks clothing items for a movie fitted V4, would they threaten them as well? I would like to see that :D

The artist owns the mesh that makes the clothing, but in order for that clothing to function on V4, it requires V4's rigging (and shape), and DAZ owns V4's rigging (and shape). They allow that rigging to be used to make content for V4

There might be is some legal rights if you copy/paste the rigging directly, and that i would say is a HUGE maybe only and would like to see or hear from a lawyer that actually know if that is true or not, because I find it hard to believe. I mean Daz don't have any legal right in calling their bones hip, chest etc. Every 3D human character is build on the principal that the rig is suppose to mirror that of a human being, animal or whatever. I can only imagine Disney and Dreamworks having to invent fictional bones because they are scared of Daz :D

And what about Dynamic cloth? it have no rigging, yet you can model it as a catsuit if you want, so I guess they can legally claim that as well them? And what if its a loose dress that fits V4 and some of the other characters around, then you are really in trouble. :D

To me it sounds insane, seriously deluded if they can get away with that or if people take it seriously. In regards to your mesh Wolf359 it could probably fit several characters with only minor changes.

I decided to send this as a question to a group of lawyers, which should reply within 12 hours whether its legal or not :D