A lot of people find Painter's interface clunky and bizarre compared to Photoshop or Paint Shop Pro. I am one of those people, but I was determined to use Painter to texture some clothes for P4W and P4M for some scenes I am working on (eventually to be released in free stuff). This texture isn't finished yet--it needs bump maps and detailing (stitches, some filigree on the padding, and some transmapping) but I was pretty excited about the results using the extra brushes and patterns that come on Painter's second CD.

Basically, the process involves using cloner brushes that duplicate a currently loaded pattern, which can be anything that tiles. For Shania's suit from PoserWorld, I wanted a "plain" texture. I am a huge fan of intricately detailed "royal" textures, but for my ranger image I wanted an outfit that looks like she runs around and kicks butt in the forest. No hanging out in delicate Marforno rooms wearing decorative armor for this character! ;)

Anyway, the point of all of this is that although I am still in the early learning process, I think Painter can create textures that are just as detailed and interesting as Deep Paint 3D with Texture Weapons, provided you don't mind working on a texture in non real-time. Heck, Painter even comes with a skin pattern (complete with pores and wrinkles) that made me realize that I could do body textures by making tiling patterns out of images of skin.

I was wondering if anyone else uses Painter to make textures. A lot of people use Photoshop, Deep Paint w/ Texture Weapons, Paint Shop Pro, and Corel's PhotoPaint, but I never see anyone mention Painter.

I can't even FIND painter anywhere. It's like the program doesn't exist. Where did you get it? Is there a website URL? Kate

Attached Link: http://www.procreate.com

Painter was part of MetaCreations and was sold to Procreate, a division of Corel. I don't have Painter 7 (their newest version)-- just Painter 6. With a *little* bit of work you can covert all PSP tubes to Painter Nozzles also.

This image is just a quick splash of a cloned Painter pattern and a quick demo of the liquid metal plugin floater, which allows you to paint with metal or water.

I should have mentioned.. Painter 7 has a new watercolor engine that looks interesting. You actually set drying time on brushes, which affects how the applied paint interacts with with other applied paint.

I did a search for Painter and found that Metacreations, Corel, and Procreat all make or made a Painter product. I don't know which one does what.

Attached Link: http://www.gimp.org

It's a program I'm use to in Linux, and it has a Windows version.... both are 100% free (link attached.) GIMP ("Gnu Image Manipulation Program") uses photoshop plugins well enough, and works (IMHO) better than P-shop in lots of instances. /P

Here's some fur, fiber, and oil cloning in action. The concept is very simple. You can "clone" any image, and clone brush you choose changes the output. Furry cloners pick up the colors of the original, oil does the same but adds depth, straight cloners *directly* copy the source pattern, and so on.

I messed around with fur and hair brushes in Photoshop a lot, but I think I am going to switch to Painter for all texturing since all of my PS plugins work in Painter (terazzo, KPT, and so on.)

VERY interesting. I've been wondering about Painter, - seen it on the Corel site, and wondered why on earth they have two products that seem to do pretty much the same... Photopaint and Painter. I wonder if the clone tool is similar to PhotoPaints image-spraying. My next question would be something along the lines.... when does Painter get to be incorporated in the Corel suit! ;) I mostly use Photoshop as well, - but sometimes I use PhotoPaint because it DOES have some features Photoshop doesn't. Hmm... wonder what it costs. lol I need to stop getting new software... but... but... Britt

Painter is really sort of unique. This crappy screenshot shows some of Painter's palettes. When I bought Painter 6 several years ago, I originally got it JUST to use the image hose and a couple other features. Painter is not like Photoshop, which is more of an image manipulation program that can be hacked to make textures for Poser, for example. Painter is a real-media feel Painting tool. You can paint with fur, fiber, metal, oils, camel hair brushes, watercolors, textures, lenses, glass, water, patterns, hoses, and anything else you can think of a brush for. If you're REALLY smart, you can script certain actions.

The problem with Painter is that I don't think Metacreations or Procreate are really fostering a community for Painter, or any of their products, really. How many tutorial sites are out there for Corel Photopaint? Not many. Most Painter tutorial sites are old (Painter 3 - 5) and Painter is NOT an out of the box immediate results sort of experience. The learning curve is steep. It took me awhile to figure out how to do clone painting on aything other than the original layer, in spite of a giant manual and several tutorial sites.

Painter is a wonderful and unique program. And the most user surly interface I have encountered until I met 3dStudioMax. sigh I used the first version (beta code even) a million years ago when it belonged to Fractal Design. Then that turned into Metacreations who flogged it off to Corel who bumped it down to their subdivision. Poor program :) The idea behind Painter is that it is a 'real media' simulator. Where photoshop starts from the viewpoint of a photographer and photograph editor, Painter starts from the viewpoint of a fine artist. Mind you, it does many things that can't be done in RL, but the language and tools are named for traditional artists tools. If you make original artwork digitally, or make textures you should consider learning Painter - but be warned its not for everyone and usually takes a long time to master. I've concentrated more on Pshop in the last few years, so I'm a little behind in Painter. Good luck :) BTW I used to sell software, and am now a graphics apps trainer - you can tell by the instant lectures - sorry :) Lyrra

I have painter, I bought it specifically for texturing - but so far I have had problems with it. Are you working on the 3-D model or flat? I tried to create textures with it, but I just can't seem to get the hang of it. I've read the manual but I'm still confused.... I have trouble doing the simplest things with it... makes me crazy, but every now and then I pull it out and dust it off (and re-install it) and spend days working at it..

btw: I like the texture for the shania suit alot!

I use P6 and like it for textures. You can do most anything with the layers. I have not figured out clone yet. The cloner in Picture Publisher 8 is so easy to use, I just switch to it. PP8 also has a smear and distort function that I cannot find on P6. P6 is is not as easy to do minor smudging with. So PP8 is easier for me to do touch ups of renders, but the layers on PP8 - not vary strong. I can do minor nudging in PP8 and the brushes with names that I think should do the same thing, go wild instead. kieraw - is there a quick and dirty description of how to convert PS tubes to P6 nozzels? (without you should have PS.)

LadySilverMage (and anyone else interested, of course):

Thanks for the compliment on the suit. =)

Here are some tips for working with Painter. First, with regular Painter (NOT Painter 3D, which comes with Poser and is horrible), you paint on a texture map. I have JUST the item I am texturing open in Poser and Painter open with the template. I save interim images as JPGs and hit render in Poser to see how my changes look. Anyway, on to the tips:

1. Absolutely exlore some of the alternative materials, brushes, nozzles, and other things available on the second CD, PARTICULARLY in the WEB directory. There is a nice colletion of burlaps and cottons and such in the WEB/patterns library on that second CD. I used these materials for the Shania suit.

2. Understand the difference between CLONER brushes and regular brushes. Cloners are the most useful for texturing, and here is how to use them:

a: Open your template.
b: Select the white area OUTSIDE the mesh template using the magic wand.
c: Invert the selection and hide the marquee so it doesn't get in your way.
d: Make a new layer.
e: In the BRUSHES palette, change to the CLONER brushes and start with the "straight cloner" to see how it works.
f: In the PATTERNS palette, load a pattern from the CD (try the fabrics patterns in the WEB section, they are fantastic).
g: Begin painting. Voila, you are painting with a tiling texture.

Now, the great thing is that if you paint each clothing part on a separate layer, you can change the colors easily by adjusting hue or using tinting (either in painter or photoshop, whichever is easier for you.) So even if your pattern is purple, it doesn't matter because you can change that pattern to any other color later. It's really the TEXTURE that you care about, not necessarily the colors. I just happened to find colors I liked already in the patterns libraries on the second CD for this particular suit.

It is important to note that ANY brush can be made into a cloner if you change the Brush "Method" to clone. You can clone anything, even stuff that ISN'T in your pattern library, by using tracing papers and other features of Painter, but I am not an expert at using these techniques yet.

You can find some decent Painter resources at this URL: http://www.portrayals.com/resources.html and I also joined the Painter mailing list in order to read some of the archives to figure out what the heck I am doing.

Painter is frustrating, but as I discovered recently, extremely powerful.

Attached Link: http://www.gardenhose.com/nozmaker.htm

See this URL for the quick and dirty on nozzle/tube conversion.

Geesh, I can't even figure out the layering of it... Is this the same Painter? Painter 3D previously owned by metacreations? ~sigh~ LSM adrift in a boat without oars lately...

Nope, Painter 3D is DIFFERENT from Painter. Painter 3D is a garbage throwaway product, imho. Metacreations made like one version of it, tossed it for free into Poser 4, and that was about it. It barely works. This is Painter, the 2D painting tool.

Ah.... see my panel looks just like the one up there, when I bought it it was brand new at ebay still sealed in the box and I thought it was the other one, I have used the nozzles and that is it. No wonder I can't get the damnable layers to work.

kieraw, thanks for the link. I am still using PSP v4 and only for conversion of .jpg or .tif to .pic for conversion to .rsr. I don't think it recognizes PS nozzels format. About using magic wand and invert for defining where a texture goes? At least as far as Victoria is concerned, the mesh seems to map a bit outside the lines. If you cut it too close, you get a white line - maybe only on screen, but I color about half a facet outside the lines to avoid this. Painter 3D is very handy for matching front and back seams on split mesh. It is also useful for identifying which facet maps where. You have to be into self torture to use it to actually make textures.

This is what caught my eye.... g: Begin painting. Voila, you are painting with a tiling texture. Now, - wouldn't THAT be nice! :) I made SURE John read your post! lol ...droling and panting... I think I NEED this.... ;) Britt

I got to play a little with Painter 6 a while ago, and was positively horrified by the awful interface. I absolutely loved the idea behind the program, but the program itself seemed pretty much unusable.

Just recently, someone dropped Painter 7 in my lap, and I though what the heck, it's not like I've got anything better to do... With a little experimentation, I have come to love "Color Variability" -- I do not have a tablet (yet), only a mouse, but CV is a great help for getting a more natural look. So far I'm thinking it must be a great tool for painting a base when making skin textures.

I don't think I will ever stop hating the interface, though.

somehwat OTish As far as painting with tiling textures (and bumpmaps), I've found that the venerable (and free) paintshop works beuatifully. You can load the tiling bump (cloth? stucco? whatever?) in and paint with whatever color makes you happy. teribbly useful. Haven't found that with any other proggy - though I haven't fully explored/understood painter. Lyrra

Painter does the same thing. ;)