This problem is in Bryce 4. I don't have exactly the same problem in Bryce 3, but it is basically the same. I have been trying to move the water texture of an object around approximately 360 degrees to create a cycling animation, but this hasn't been working out. I tried revolving it just 180 degrees, and even less than that, but the same thing always occurs: I move the slider in the Materials lab to the frame I want it to be at, set the keyframe and rotate the material, then when I move the slider again, the values I just entered disappear, falling back down to the original value! Is there any advice that you guys have for me? Thanks in advance, Akril

consider yourself at 0 degrees you can move to -180 or to +180 no further. still confused? check april archives for this forum. you'll find the answer. check under "simple 360 degree rotation kmatrix 4/8/2002"

Sometimes, it's the simple things that we overlook, so I have to ask: Did you put a keyframe at the very first frame in the scrub thingy?

reverse order. Move the material then set the key frame.

Instead of doing keyframes at 0,180, and 360, try placing them at 0, 120, 240 and 360. Steve S.

Bikermouse: I looked under the topic you said to, and followed the steps. I tried rotating it in thirds, but the same thing happened. when I set the second keyframe to 120, the X and Z axes jumped to -180 and the Y axis jumped to 80, and both keyframes were that way. No change. johnpenn: Yes, I did set the first keyframe. Sometimes I clicked multiple times just to be sure. EricofSD: I've been doing that, I guess I didn't make that clear in my post. I've been asking it so many times. sanvito: I tried what you suggested, and it didn't work. I'm really starting to lose hope here. I appreciate you helping me, but I'm afraid I need even more help. I'm afraid I may have run into a bug or something. Akril

Hmmm... I just re read your first post. I see you are trying to change the material over time. I just tried it, and I can't do it either. I tried it in world space first, and it didn't work, so I tried it in Object space, and then parametric. No dice. I've never tried animating a mat before, I would assume it's possible, but maybe there is, as you say, a bug in the works.

Oh yes!! You need to use object space. Hey I've done it in the past. If your xyz's are jumping on you you need to start over and try again(remove the extra frames.) keyframe in first then change the settings. check your settings before you render.

I looked over your reply: I didnt say use 120. What you need to do is figure out how much each frame should move - take that value and subtract it from 180. use the result for the keyframe at the halfway point. you only need 3 keyframes. 0 at 0 180 - result at halfway and -result at end.

oh yes I forgot. in the edit texture dialog - you are using offset(the third one down) aren't you?

Not sure what the problem is. I just rotated a water texture around the Y-axis(in object space) on a cylinder for 360 degres over 4 seconds (90 degrees per second) and it works fine. 1. At 0 seconds 0 degrees set a keyframe. 2. Moved scrubber to 1 second, entered 90 in the y axis rotation in the edit texture and added keyframe. 3. repeat step 2 until you reach 4 seconds entering 180, 270, 360 respectively. If you want I can send you the file.

my apologies : I finally found the old file and I did rotate the wheel itself - not the material(mine worked along the z axis because of the orientation). I did use object space flat shaded and additive. try it first with less that full 360 degree rotation. say 90 degrees. that way you can see if you're on the right track.

I am using the materials lab, and I've tried everything that's been suggested. I've checked "Object Space" instead of "World Space", I have all the things checked under the triangle icon that you have, I've tried using just three keyframes after deleting all my previous attempts, after I check the second one, the X and Z axes jump to -180 and the Y jumps to 0, and I don't really know what "offset" is. I've STILL got the same problem. Does the fact that this material is a water plane have something to do with it? Akril

Yes X and Z will change while Y goes to 0. This is because in the material editor Y only has a range of -90 to 90. Try what I suggested and ignore the values. When you input each value zero out X and Z and input 90, 180, 270 360 in the Y. The values for X and Z will change but the whole thing will work. As I said I can send you the file I have if you want to see the settings.

I tried doing what you said, I ignored the jumping numbers, and when I finally had them all entered in, I looked at all the keyframes, and they had all jumped to -0 on the Y axis. I'm afraid it didn't work. Also, this texture that looks fine in world space but terrible in world space, so I really don't know what to do. Akril

Ok let me work on it and get back to you. I'll see if I can get it to work. From your pic it looks like you are just trying to get the water to flow down the stream. Instead of getting it to rotate wouldn't it be better to just go in a straight line down the stream?

The trouble is, the stream's at an angle, and I've tried making it flow that way, but I can't get it to cycle. Making it go aorund the Y axis is the only way to make it look realistic. And I may be using this technique in some other images if I can ever get it to work.

Hmmmmm.......I'm not sure what to tell you. Using what I did above and your flattened cylinder with "nice water" apllied in world space it works. Are you using autokey or manual key? The only thing I can think of is that your keyframes aren't saving. Are you sure you are setting the keyframe after you move the scrubber and adjust the material? If anybody else can think of what going on. I'd send the file to you but you can't import the animation into your scene. I can send it anyway if you'd like to look at it.

Oops..just realized your using 4 and Bryce 5 won't let me save as a .br4 file...sorry.

I checked "Auto Key", and managed to get over one obstacle. When I played back the animation, the material rotated normally until 180 degrees. That's when X and Y jumped to -180. I tried re-entering the values, but then the numbers began going crazy and the water began going sideways instead of around, as far as I could see. This is the same in both object space and world space. Akril

Ok if you can get it to 180 try entering the opposite numbers of what I posted above in my picture example (since you want it to go clockwise). IOW where I have -90 for Y put 90 instead of -270. And for 360 just put it back to 0.

(autokey!!)ok. you're on the right track. now seperate out the sugguestions because as you can see everyone has a different way of doing this. second decide if you want to physically rotate the object or just rotate the material texture. you should now have enough information to be able to do this either way. start a new bryce file that concentrates on just the rotation problem. go back to the previos sugguestions remembering the autokey setting that you used and experiment.

cograats Alderon: tried your material editor method and it works ! but to avoid confusion you should have stated,(in red),0 time 1/4 time 1/2 time 3/4 time and end time in stead of degrees . also the method needs to compensate for the fact that you will be duplicating the first frame at the end. Thanks for the mat method of rotation. I'll try to remember it. I tried my obj method of rotation and found that I needed to go just past 1/2 way point and change the sign of the rotating value and key frame it in order to prevent it going backwards halfway through. Anyway I got both methods to work using obj space and auto key off remembering to keyframe everything in after changing values at the appropriate points.

I finally got it. Thanks a lot, everyone. My only problem now is the long, long time it takes to render the animation, since I want the stream to be flowing slllooowlllyyyy... Akril

My mistake... I thought my problem was solved, but after about a half a day of rendering, I saw that this method didn't work. I've changed the object to a square and I've changed the water so that it rotates around the X axis instead, it looks better that way, and it flows fine for the first few frames but them accelerates dramatically and practically goes haywire before slowing to a halt and preceding to flow in the opposite direction. Needless to say, it STILL isn't working. I really, really hope there's an answer to this problem. Thanks in advance, Akril

Yeah It would be really neat if you could just make a cube, offset x in material lab by a certain number of bryce units and have it repeat.(Render times will indeed be long.) In material lab editor, try using "object top" instead of "object space" and 90 bryce units +- 10 offset(just below rotate)). That seems to come close - I used "leo" for my experiment instead of a texture. Let us know what you come up with. Anyway the two methods you learned for rotation won't go to waste - except for the boolean part you can now create animated waterfalls. Either method of rotation will work for waterfalls.(and I am sure you will come up with other uses for the knowledge.)

Note: I was refering to "Offset X" not "Rotate X" in the materials editor in the first two statements of my last post in case it wasan't clear.

I thought I already posted this message. I'll try again. I tried doing what you said, I changed the material to "Object Top" (which really messed up the appearance of the water), moved the material along the X axis using three keyframes (-90 units, 0 units, 90 units), and when I rendered it, the water stood still for a moment, then moved erratically along an axis which was definately not the one I wanted it to move along. Needless to say, it STILL isn't working. I hope there's a way to solve this problem, because it doesn't look like there is. Akril

Keep at it. keep changing space options ,xyzs. You're at a point now where no one can solve your problem better than you. You can do it. When you get positive results we'd all like to hear about it.

I think I finally got it. It's still hard though. I had to go in and find which frame looked the most like the first one to create a believeable loop. But thanks to everyone for all the help. Akril