Hey,are there any game creators in here. I have a nephew(15years old) who is interested in creating video games but isn't into computer graphics yet. What programs should I suggest to him. I mentioned Gmax , but not being familiar with any of the game creation engines/software I thought I would ask. Gmax may be overkill for starting out but it is the standard I think so why not learn that first. Is there a good all in one program that allows you to create games/medel etc. thats good for beginners and hopefully free as well. Thanks for any input. The games forum wasn't very active so that's why I am posting here. Mike

If your talking game programing, I played around with DarkBasic a while ago. Did some OK stuff in it... It is pretty bloody simple, and does most the hard work for you. They have a "pro" version that I have never used, but that looks like its good. http://www.darkbasic.com/ Blender (which I belive is a freeware 3d modeling / rendering / game creation program) does some game stuff (though I've never used the program, and don't know just what type of stuff it does). http://www.blender3d.org/

Several flavors of BASIC out there...EMC mentioned DarkBASIC already, I've messed around in TnT BASIC and found it quite comfortable. There's a few freeware/shareware things out there, mostly open-source (like the Marathon open source) -- which means a lot of struggling through patches and patchy documentation, which ain't fun for anyone. And then there's something called the Coldstone Game Engine, from Ambrosia, which was designed to let a beginner create a simple RPG. It has the benefit of simplicity -- with the inevitable downside of lack of flexibility. I messed around with that for a while, too -- it uses pre-rendered sprites, and it turned out Poser and Bryce made them easy to create.

Thanks for the info . Regards Mike

3DGS is a very good introduction as well - Introductory level only $49, very active forums, upgrade in steps to Commercial and Pro level. The ability to make click together games is a great morale-booster at the start, for anyone not used to 3d creation, and scripts. http://www.conitec.net/a4info.htm

i know this is a 3d forum in general..but dont forget about Flash and Director are also good for making games..just depends on what kinds of games hes wanting to make...

Hrm. Game making is a big topic. Director/flash or whatever from Macromedia are simple for small projects but a real nightmare (from experience with Director 7) for larger projects. I hope I'm wrong with their later offerings but from what I know, I dread the day I have to work with their products again. I have never played with Dark Basic or any other basic languages. For starters they may be ok. Basic, Python and Java are good languages for most games. I wouldn't try to code a Quake clone in one though. Not impossible but I wouldn't expect the performance from it. Side scrollers and simpler puzzle games are simple enough for these languages. If he wants even more down to the metal then pick up a good compiler, I'd suggest MSVC++ (standard edition .net is fine and cheap, it just doesn't come with optimizing compiler.) as most free libs out there target this compiler first for the windows platform. There are free C/C++ compilers but you'll be in for some headaches working with them if you are just starting out. You'll be in for some headaches and frustrations anyway because programming is generally a frustrating past time. I hope your nephew is patient. ;) For simple library for graphics I would start with libSDL (www.libsdl.org). It's simpler to figure out initially than DirectX and OpenGL setup is trivial. It limits to only one window in a windowing environment but most games don't need more. Lots of support libs as well. OpenGL and SDL are levels simpler to set up and get going than DirectX. There are other libs but for starters that will keep him busy for a few years. :) Poor guy.

Thanks again ,My nephew is pretty smart and he picks up new things quickly , but patience I don't think is one of his strong qualities. Mike

Attached Link: GameDev

Doh. I was going to put in some links but forgot.

gamedev is a good place to start.

<www.flipcode.com>, also has some decent articles and tips and tricks.

<www.makegames.com>, although slightly self promotional for 'fastgraph' graphics library which on it's own is also a good graphics library albeit only for windows but the information there is generic enough for starters.

<www.gameprogrammer.com>, is mainly a mailing list for game programming. Not too shabby but hasn't been completely useful yet for me. Another resource couldn't help.

And don't forget Garagegames, idevgames (for mac), and gamasutra. http://www.idevgames.com/ http://www.garagegames.com/ http://www.gamasutra.com/ And these are the urls I've kept around for game engines; http://www.tntbasic.com/ http://www.rapideuphoria.com/hotnew.htm http://www.iit.edu/~sarimar/GDS/metal.html But really, the best place to start messing with games is with custom levels and assets for an existing game. Many of the well-known games have level editors and other ways (and communities dedicated to) expanding and changing the game play and graphics.

Mike - don't know whether you were planning on buying him a present for Christmas of a games-making program :o) but if not.........I have 3DGameSTudio Commercial, but changed to Atmosphere some time ago. I know it's possible to transfer licenses, I've seen people talking about it on the 3DGS forum - it's just a question of informing Conitech. I've lost my broadband connection for the next week or so, but I'd happily forward 3DGS for him, and transfer the license, if you think he'd use it. It's just been wasted for the last year, so I'd rather give it to someone who'd get some getting some enjoyment from it - it's a fun program.

pogmahone -- Out of curiosity, do you mean Adobe's Atmosphere? Would you be willing to share your opinions on it? Thanks!

Pogmahone, I gave my nephew some information to look at , I will see how interested he is in the links that you guys provided ,which I sent to him. If he seems really interested I may take you up on your very generous offer. Regards Mike

Hi Thalaxis I belong to a kind of cooperative of writers/concept artists/3d modellers, and our original intention was to make online games. We experimented with 3DGS, considering doing screenshot walk-thrus a bit like the original Myst. Then we looked at Wild Tangent, but at the time it was hard to figure out what it would cost, and it seemed complicated. We finally settled on Atmosphere. It's been beta up until now, version 1 has just been released. I think it's going to be a great program, if people bear 56k users in mind - if you're used to broadband it's hard to remember that not everyone can download 6MB just for curiosity. But it's possible to make any kind of game for online playing with it (I think). It will probably take a bit of time for it to settle completely, but it's got Adobe behind it. We feel it's going to be the one that becomes the standard, for all sorts of reasons - though Strata3d looks very good as well. Also I've seen nice stuff done in Director, but who can afford that :( Also, the movement was a bit sea-sickish in both Strata and Director compared to Atmosphere. Atmosphere is hooked up in some way with Viewpoint, which is a great technology, usually you have to pay a license, but not for use in ATmosphere. Whew!

Thanks for the response, it was very informative. I've been doing some research on game development tools lately, because a friend of mine indicated that he might be working on a game and might be able to use my help (I am a software engineer by trade). So I will put Atmosphere on my list of tools to check into. :)

Only useful for online games and VR worlds though, I think.

I got that impression, also. That's the main reason that I had not given it much thought until you mentioned it.

Mike - maybe it was mentioned already in this thread............gmax is free, you can use it for making characters and doing some animating. A lot of people start in 3d by messing round with extras for existing games, customising existing models etc. Here's one link to the download - http://games.softpedia.com/public/cat/4/4-1.shtml but if that's not working a search on google for gmax free brings up loads of alternatives.

Pogmahone, I did give him the link for gmax since I thought this was the industry standard for creating games but I thought it could be overkill for someone just learning. Mike

True. The beauty of 3DGS is that you suddenly find you've made a world with characters that walk round and make noises etc. Things start clicking into place mentally once you've had encouraging results!