I'm starting to get the idea that "Genesis" was a basline lump of polygons Daz has already been working with since the creation of the Gen 4 figures.  I find it interesting that all of the classic Gen4 figures are being released, even the very specific Reby Sky character.

Is Genesis just a repackaging of the starting point for all the figures we've come to love over the years? 

Seems to me in Daz Studio I could already mix and match any gen 4 figure while retaining the rigging..so the only real use of Genesis is weight-mapping, which is more a function of the program itself rather than the figure...yes?

Am I way off-base here?

Dunno.  Maybe someone should post up a few wires for comparison.

The base mesh is a bit different but pretty similar.  It's provided in low-poly only, and is dynamically subdivided within D|S.  That's another problem with DAZ providing a Poser-ized version, because Poser doesn't currently have that feature.  Some of the differences are e.g. the fingernails and toenails are welded onto the base mesh, whereas with V4 they were separate geometry.

The UV map is almost exactly the same, so you can share textures between the two.  That's a pretty good thing, imo.

There are some interesting features to Genesis besides just the rigging, but they're specific to DAZ|Studio and not so much the figure, e.g. "Smart Content" (no more "Update V4/M4", no more morph channel micromanagement) and ability to give you an alternate UV map if desired.

Deciding to redo and release the old V4 morphs was probably a combination between it being a pretty easy conversion (I'm almost certain the conversions were done by automation, something like what Morphing Clothes does) and to reassure buyers that they'd be able to obtain familiar looks that they liked with V4.

Hmmm.

Call me a traditionalist, but I was looking forward to a fresh take on the male and female stock form. 

Perhaps they are still working on a V5 for poser X?  Why burn that bridge, right?

From what I understand from reading the DAZ forums, the plan is that V5/M5 will be morph packages for Genesis.  Probably also alternate geometry for the M4 weenie.

Pfffft.

To be frank, if you're not regularly looking at wireframes anyway, what difference does it make to you?

"Deciding to redo and release the old V4 morphs was probably a combination between it being a pretty easy conversion (I'm almost certain the conversions were done by automation, something like what Morphing Clothes does) and to reassure buyers that they'd be able to obtain familiar looks that they liked with V4."

Well, if people buy V4/M4/A4/H4/etc. morphs for Genesis, it won't hurt DAZ's profit margin, either. Plus it puts some veritility on the table.

lmk

The problem with V4/M4/A4/H4/etc. morphs for Genesis is all the clothes, shoes, boots, etc will fit...the girls closets are jammed packed and the demand for more isn't as high with a mature character. Whereas if there is a new V5/M5/A5/H5 then everybody has to clean out their closets and restock them. Daz was in the business of giving away characters so you damaged your bank account buying content for the newest characters to ther benefit.

Today Daz is in the busines of????..... in regards to current and new characters?????

It will be interesting where we are in 3 to 6 months for now on this whole mess. :lol:

I must wonder if DAZ is rushing out what they can in advance of Poser hitting the market. After all, much of the old material will start to get weight mapped because Poser Pro 2012 is much cheaper on upgrade than either of the Advanced D/S applications (yet to be released) plus their content creation tools.

I have no idea how easy the DAZ tools will be to use, but the Poser tools are as easy to use as the Poser morph brush. Of course, as soon as some brilliant programmer makes a translation tool to move D/S Genesis and company to the Poser format, the DAZ content may (will probably) get a needed boost in sales.

lmk

Quote - To be frank, if you're not regularly looking at wireframes anyway, what difference does it make to you?

Well I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't appreciate paying twice or more for the same product. Call me silly, but I have to live within my budget. This is why you won't see me buying any of these morph packages to make Genesis look like the Mil4 figures when I'll be able to just weightmap them myself when I get Pro 2012. 

Quote - I'm starting to get the idea that "Genesis" was a basline lump of polygons Daz has already been working with since the creation of the Gen 4 figures.  I find it interesting that all of the classic Gen4 figures are being released, even the very specific Reby Sky character.

Is Genesis just a repackaging of the starting point for all the figures we've come to love over the years? 

Seems to me in Daz Studio I could already mix and match any gen 4 figure while retaining the rigging..so the only real use of Genesis is weight-mapping, which is more a function of the program itself rather than the figure...yes?

Am I way off-base here?

Genesis is a completely new mesh. The classic Gen4 figures are being released so that if you have V4-M4 characters you want to re-create with Genesis it makes it much easier to do. You can also mix them with other shapes.

Yes you could mix and match gen 4 figures with a little work, but you couldn't mix them with say, the DAZ Troll. With Genesis you can. If you want you could mix the M4 shape with the DAZ Troll, Anubis, RawArt's Drakon, and The Girl or any other Genesis shape and turn it into a child with a few dial spins and the rigging will adapt automatically. Also any Genesis clothing will automatically fit any shape you can create. Plus you can use any M4, V4 and K4 texures on Genesis.

V5 is scheduled for this Fall with M4 following a couple of months later.

I don't know if you have seen this video, but it may explain things better than I can.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTBBnc2SJ90&feature=uploademail

Coldrake

Well, seeing S4/Genesis out there for nearly fifty bucks tells me the days of the free character meshes is over.

As for the rest, meh. I'm sure it's useful, but not for me. AutoFit is a variartion on Wardrobe Wizard. P9 has weight mapping. I dont use the Gen4 characters anyway, so it seems kinda pointless.

But it does raise an interesting question: will proggies like WW still work with these new-technology clothes? I'm kinda betting probably not, and we're looking at a further split between DS and Poser.

Such interesting times.

I think that S4/Genesis price was a ploy to get people to buy the V4/M4 morphs because you would get S4 for free for a limited time if you did that. Then they announced S4 would be coming off the market shortly, probably again to get people to buy the morphs now.

Quote - Well I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't appreciate paying twice or more for the same product.

Texture compatibility with V4/M4 is actually a major selling point, so you don't immediately have to buy all new textures.

Quote - I think that S4/Genesis price was a ploy to get people to buy the V4/M4 morphs because you would get S4 for free for a limited time if you did that. Then they announced S4 would be coming off the market shortly, probably again to get people to buy the morphs now.

Yeah I agree with that 100%.

Quote - Genesis is a completely new mesh.

I took a closer look and you're right, the mesh is pretty different.

edit: the UVmap does look very much the same though (which is a good selling point)

Quote - I took a closer look and you're right, the mesh is pretty different.

edit: the UVmap does look very much the same though (which is a good selling point)

Genesis has UV sets for all 4th gen figures, V4's is the default.

So far was not impressed enough with genesis to keep the morphs, the hair follows the ear mesh, to me that says they released too early. I too will be updating my Poser to 9 and 2012. I may play with morphs on my own for genesis, but I can't afford to keep buying stuff when the whole idea...I thought...was you used one mesh for all characters. Love ya Daz but not that much.   8^)

Quote - > Quote - Well I don't know about the rest of you, but I don't appreciate paying twice or more for the same product.

Texture compatibility with V4/M4 is actually a major selling point, so you don't immediately have to buy all new textures.

Not to me it isn't. It's only a selling point to people who plan on using it and I don't. I see no reason for giving DAZ money to use a figure that doesn't work in my program of choice. I don't care how you DAZ Studio users want to spin it, it's not a selling point to everyone. I already have V4, S4, , G4, M4, H4 and F4. I don't NEED Genesis to use their textures. Period.

err... I'm actually a Poser user, I'm in the beta program, I'm just being fair - Texture compatibility really is a good selling point for a lot of people, even if you don't care about it.  Ease up with the hyper flaming reflex there.

Yeah, texture compatibility is a good thing.   Unfortunately you also can't bring in head morphs and I have no idea if there will be anything like Alice or GND morphs for gene.

Losing all of your custom characters is the outcome of any and all new figure releases, unfortunately.

Whatever. I maintain that it's only a selling point if you're already sold on the Genesis figure. I'm not. The fact that you have to fork over more cash to use the Mil4 morphs when I already own the figures is a HUGE NO SALE point for me.

Quote - Yeah, texture compatibility is a good thing.   Unfortunately you also can't bring in head morphs and I have no idea if there will be anything like Alice or GND morphs for gene.

You can still make a headmorph, you could make a bellybutton morph if you wanted.  If your tool of choice is zbrush all you have to do is hide click the head, hit mask all, and then make the head visible again.  That way you've limited yourself to sculpting just the noggin (You've also stopped yourself from mucking up the eyes and teeth).

There's certainly nothing to stop someone from making  full bodymorph like Alice for Genesis, and you'd have to guess that Daz invited Aery_Soul/Alpha_Seed to the party.

Quote - Well, seeing S4/Genesis out there for nearly fifty bucks tells me the days of the free character meshes is over.

As for the rest, meh. I'm sure it's useful, but not for me. AutoFit is a variartion on Wardrobe Wizard. P9 has weight mapping. I dont use the Gen4 characters anyway, so it seems kinda pointless.

But it does raise an interesting question: will proggies like WW still work with these new-technology clothes? I'm kinda betting probably not, and we're looking at a further split between DS and Poser.

 

Such interesting times.

Follow down to PhilC posts. Many other script writers are also working to update their products.

Well damn, look what Ralf did.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=88362

that'll be a lot of beer money I think.

Quote - Well damn, look what Ralf did.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=88362

that'll be a lot of beer money I think.

Now that is really clever but you still need to use DS4, fine if you are already using the program.  With limited time on my hands I will spend my time learning the new features of Pro 2012 and, in the mean time, read up on what the testers are doing with it so far.  

Making plans for September and, after placing pre-order, keeping credit card firmly in wallet.

You do, at least for now, but my point was that his $20 utility obsoletes the FBMs from DAZ that they're selling at a much higher price, and DAZ is only selling the main FBMs with none of the variants.  Probably someone at DAZ is having a V8 moment right now :)

Very smart of Ralf, I hope he makes a mint from it.

The utility won't give you the base shape, since that isn't a morph. It will work to give morphs that can be used with the base shape morph to reproduce the look of a V4 or M4 character, however.

Ah I didn't read all of the description text. 

Quote - The utility won't give you the base shape, since that isn't a morph. It will work to give morphs that can be used with the base shape morph to reproduce the look of a V4 or M4 character, however.

I'm not sure you're COMPLETELY correct here.

It definitely will NOT give you the V4 or M4 base shapes.

It might well give you the "Iconic" Girl 4, Freak 4, Aiko 4, and Hiro 4 shapes that they are currently selling to Platinum customers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Gen 4 versions of these are morphs of V4 and M4 respectively are they not?

That's right, yes - for fourth generation adult figures V4 and m4 are the two base items, with everything else a morph.