Hello,

Here the first dress created with an integrated simulator. This product has been created for Genesis 8 Female. The future products will certainly be done for more characters. This dress is very simple but it is the first of a set of outfits I want to do using the same concept. The product contains a "Simulation" part which starts a limited VWD program. The principle is:

• to select the simulation method,
• to import the collision actors, and to press on the "Simulate" button in the interface. The dynamic product will be imported and the simulation will start automatically. There are some tutorials showing how to work with the product.

For the people who does not have the VWD program, it is important to install the VWD plugin in Daz Studio. If you have some issues, please tell me.

When I created this product, I tried to add a few simulation methods.this This list is enough for simple simulations but I ask you to tell what would be the kinds of simulation to add in this simulation list. For example, tell me if you think it would be useful to add a simulation with a wind force.

All your feedbacks will be very helpful for the future products. Thank you if you accept to particapate to the project. I think the future of VWD is in part in it.

Here is the link to the product :

I don't know why the link has not be copied in the post. Here is the link: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1oCEUpR3vDo1dPfYfTDONeHUooRea14tV/view?usp=sharing

Hello,

just a precision, My aim is to create meshes with the same triangular structure. These triangles must be as close as possible to equilateral triangles and the size of these triangles must be the same for all the part of the outfit.

The method will allow to be sure to generate a very regular simulation. And it also allows to define precise behaviours for the clothes when the material is changed.

Hello,

I suppose some users downloaded the product.

This product is not here to be perfect, I want to validate the concept to sold a product with its simulator. I need your help to define the best way to reach this goal.

If you don't like the product, please tell me why. For me, it is very interesting too.

Thank you for your help.

  Gérald

Gérald, I downloaded and played a little with the Aline dress product (static sim only, so far) -- Here are my thoughts:

PROS:

• It feels like VWD (though, heavily crippled)
• Collision object import settings available
• Draping works fine (same as VWD complete product)
• Wind works fine (same as VWD complete)
• All the "live" sim settings work (Gravity, Inertia, etc. -- same as VWD complete)
• No issues with Start/Stop static sim for multiple re-sims per single session with Send To Host multiple times for morph target work (same as VWD complete)
• No issues with live deformation sim (though, only allowed on skirt)
• The view settings work with the cloth (color, wires, opacity -- same as VWD complete)
• Standard selections work (via shortcut keys only [shortcut key selection only NOT A PRO])
• Vertex locking/unlocking works (via shortcut keys only)

CONS:

• Auto-selection of cloth object (no user input)
• All import settings automatically set (no user input)
• Top half of cloth object locked to collision object with no way for user changes (no user input)
• No in-use parameter settings available (no user input/changes allowed)
• No view setting changes for collision object (color, wires, opacity)
• No select-by-material
• No custom selections
• No live deformation usage with top of cloth object (locked to collision object)
• No cloth shrink available for cloth object (collar strap/breast straps in desperate need of it)
• If not for already knowing the shortcuts -- No visual way to indicate to NEW users a way to lock/unlock vertices from simulation, nor how to engage selections

Now, these are more just based on personal taste of an experienced, advanced technical user, but I tried to put my mindset that of a newbie purchasing the product and having a play -- Just pushing buttons and see what happens (I know I cheated - I already knew the expected results).

I see what you are trying to do with this, but I think there are a few shortcomings for ease of use for newbies just purchasing for a quick sim with the cloth object.

• Pick collision object -- Check
• What to do next? -- Not sure (no indication cloth object is automatically selected/imported - just no more options) -- Press the Scene Viewer header to go to full screen of VWD -- No, just collision object in scene -- Press the Scene Viewer header again to go back to docked view.
• Eventually press the Simulate header -- Ahhh... that's it -- The cloth auto-imported and simulation auto-started.

I would put the cloth object auto-selected/imported and simulation auto-start in the PRO category, but it was too much of a guessing game just to get started, and I am a seasoned veteran -- Imagine a newbie purchasing not knowing what to do. You need to make the workflow very clear from the start.

Maybe, change it from having to press the Simulate header to an actual Cloth button like the Collision button (which auto-engages the Simulate header, go full-screen, and starts the sim as you have it)

Other than a not so clear start up, it is fine, but personally, I don't like it as a product. I believe the tool should not be included in the cloth product, and you should find another way to implement your auto-simple/non-pro quick sim clothing product to work with the already purchased tool.

Imagine you have 10 different cloth objects for sale and I purchase all 10 -- Now, I have 9 extra versions of the same crippled VWD to dispose of...

I like your idea for those who don't want/need full control, and just want a quick sim, but I think it should fall on the tool purchase side, and not the clothing side.

So, You already have the full VWD (let's call Pro), and a non-animation VWD version (let's call Standard). Maybe you should create a third VWD (this version in the cloth product), and call it something like Hobbyist or Quick Sim version. And, you can decide to make it free/available only for those who purchase a clothing product for it's use.

To switch gears here, Gérald, let's talk about the full VWD and the direction you are heading with it.

I have been sitting quietly on the sidelines just watching where you were taking it, and hoping you would implement things that would bring you a bigger audience (and more revenue).

You were very open in the beginning implementing some of my suggestions you thought were good, and rejecting others that did not fit your vision for VWD.

I had hope you would eventually work towards something that would yield more users/revenue, and it looks like your plan to open it up to more software might be the ticket.

I especially love that I might be able to use a future version with Blender -- It is part of my wishlist in fulfilling my Marvelous Designer clone with Blender and using VWD as my simulation engine.

So, this brings me to what I want to talk to you about possibly implementing in VWD (Pro, Standard), which is in line with your clothing product in this thread -- Working on implementing a cloth auto-retopo based on the Gmesh Advancing Front Isotropic Equilateral-Dominant Triangulation you use for your meshes which works best with your simulation engine. Correct me if I am wrong -- I am going off our previous mesh topology conversations, your inclusion of Gmesh retopo for volumetric closed manifold simulation (have not used yet, but have set my path to Gmesh), and your general affinity for Gmesh itself.

As you said, this control of the meshes will help in creating simulation standards based on mimicking cloth properties (cotton, wool, leather, etc.) which could help bring in more people as I believe this is something high on everyones wishlist.

I believe it could be done, but I am just going off my own workflow I use for dynamic remeshing in Blender which is comprised of multiple working parts.

I believe you could employ a similar workflow based from UV islands, separation, flattening, remesh-call (Gmesh), reconstitute flat patterns, vertex welds.

This is just speculation, and I can see it in my head, but outside of Blender, I don't know if you could employ all the working parts.

Without using Gmesh, the closest I can get to the Aline dress mesh is via Isotropic remesh in OpenFlipper. I haven't worked with Gmesh enough yet to know if this will work as I envision.

Thoughts?

Hello DaremoK3,

Yes, of course, I remember our dialogs by email. Thanks a lot for this long and precise message in the forum.

Yes, the VWD version distributed with Aline Dress is very limited because it is free (offered with the asset). The concept is this one and this is perhaps a good way to promote the program.

The dress is not good because I want the user concentrate on the concept, not on the dress. The version distributed with the outfit or the hair is not a full version, it just allows to simulate the outfit or the dress in the same package. The asset takes place on the disk and the specific version of VWD does not increase a lot this size. If you buy 10 VWD products, you will have 10 new versions of VWD. These versions will allow you to simulate the asset included in the same package without the need to buy a full version. If you have the full version of VWD, you could use the VWD program in the package or youe full VWD program. If the default simulations included with the asset are enough for you, you can use one of them. If you prefer to use the full version, you can place the asset on your favorite character and start the full VWD version as you made before. It is for this reason, I want to distribute a limited version of VWD with the asset.

About the interface of the limited version, you idea is very interesting but some methods like the "Nails to collision" function needs to have to collision actor already loaded. It is for this reason the program starts without any importation. Perhaps a precise message like "Select all the collision actors useful for the simulation and press on the Simulate tab". You are right, a button could be easier to understand.

Please, tell me if mes explanations allow to understand better my aim.

Thank you for your help K..

Hello DaremoK3,

I want to reply to your second message separately.

The next version of the program will include new functions which will allow to create clothes.

When I want to create clothes, I start from a pattern made with Rhino3D. This surface can be meshed with GMSH. Once this mesh created, all the actions needed to create the final cloth including placing on the body, UVMap meshing, UVMap grouping, welding are now usable in the program. I will do a video showing how to create a clothe.

I could try to write the functions allowing to generate a surface and learn how to export it in a format understandable by GMSH (.STP for example). This will ask me a lot of time and I am not sure to manage correctly this task. And I am not sure this work will generate some revenues because Marvelous Designer exists and it is a very good program.

I agree with you concerning the ability to open VWD to other software by using the .ABC format. This file format can be imported/exported in many software. This would allow to make VWD independent of any other program. I want to find time to see how this can be done.

You are right, it is very important to find a meshing structure and size which will allow to have a precise and predictable behaviour of the clothe. Currently, the mesh is made of equilateral triangles using a size of one centimeter. For me, there is a more interesting work to do. Find the best meshing structure and size to generate hair having a realistic behaviour with reasonnable simulation time. Currently, this mesh is made of strands composed of sequence of triangles using a size of 0.5 centimeter separated by 1.5 centimeter. These sizes allow to define stiff or soft behaviours for each strand. You can see the latest video I made using this method in my youtube channel named "Bettany hair".

About a program which would be able to remesh an existing clothe, I am not sure it would be bought by a lot of users. A defined behaviour (Cotton, leather, silk) has a sense if you do animated simulation. Currently DForce works fine for pose simulation even though it is not perfect. VWD works better for animations but I am not sure this area interests a lot of people. Perhaps I am wrong...... I hope.

I you want to remesh an existing outfit, the next version will be able to do 90% of the job. It's just missing the surface generation.

Please, feel free to give me all your wishes for VWD, I will be happy to find a solution to implement it in the program.

I gave the dress a quick test now. The simulated animation in motion is really nice but I noticed 2 issues:

->Without movement or with just very minor the cloth has still some uncontrolled movement. This doesn't seem to be the case when I switch to CPU with this specific mesh, which is quite nice. I think you said in the past that it isn't really fixable with GPU, right?

->Bigger animations (I tested it with a 15 seconds/30frames one) fails to import

Hello Surody,

Thank you for these tests. Currently, I am trying to find the best meshing size. I will do more tests without animation to see if I can resolve this issue with the GPU computing.

About the importation of large animations, I will do some tests to find if this issue comes from the specific version of the program.

Please, can you tell me if the different simulation methods are well defined and if it would be useful to add other simulations methods?

I use this post to say it is very useful to look at the readme file which contains the addresses of tutorials helping to start with this version.