Well ... sometimes you're happy - sometimes you're sad ... I was planing to write a bigger tutorial about posing but I just found out noone really wants to have it. I don't want to write something - noone wants - quiete easy. How I come to this solution ?? Well, simple. A few days ago I asked here if someone wants to make some real images (due to copyright reasons) for me where I can built this tutorial on (full explanation - see here: http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=1299559). I just got two replies - one was a bit confusing, the other was worth a try - but it is simply not makeable this way. So - if noone wants to have a look in his/her photoalbum for finding just a simple sitting or standing pose he/she simply does not want to have a tutorial - what else should I think ?? Well - OK - then not (shrug) Thx Schlabber

As being new to Poser I would love to have some tut's on "posing"....how sad....sounded like this could have been a great time saver.....:(

I don't think it's a lack of interest in the tutorial itself. But you were pretty specific: "I'll mainly use Michael and Victoria for that tutorial so you have to look a bit like them." Some people who might have been willing to help probably felt you wouldn't want their photographs since they don't look like Michael/Victoria or Ken/Barbie. Maybe if you had considered real looking people, there might have been a better response. Sorry we lost a tutorial as a result. I think most people here have nothing but respect for your exception posing skills.

Re post your request I for one did not see it. if I can help you out, I would be glad to. Just put up the post soon as I am going out of town for the weekend, leaving on friday early. tony

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=1299559

I don't understand why you need someone(other peoples) help on this. It sounds more like a self-destructive justification for not wanting to do it in the first place. your grasping for the 'cool' factor without any meat. It seems to me you just posted it so you could entice others to do it. Prove what you want to do by doing it yourself. people will help you beta it im sure. if there is merit to what your doing. and not only that, but others might understand those specific details that are otherwise pretty lame. a pic of a pose of a guy that resembles mike? sigh why should other people put time into looking/making something when you cant/wont. You obviously didn't hold your breath, that's why your reposting. Sorry Shlabber, i dont know you so dont take this personally. maybe you write great tutorials, what do it know except what ive read.

I didn't see the original post, either. I don't know why, as I check the Poser forum almost every day. Schlabber, I KNOW that your tutorial would be appreciated. I'm not sure I fully understand why you're asking for photos of people who look like Mike and Vicky, though. It seems to me that you already have your techniques down. I must be misunderstanding something, here. I'm sure that there is no lack of interest in learning from you. Perhaps the original message generated some confusion? Unfortunately this posting came across as an undeserved reprimand. I hope you know how appreciated you truly are.

Didn't see the post at all but I could maybe help if you still want a shot or two. Don't look like Mike though ;)

3ncryptabl3_lick Sorry Shlabber, i dont know you so dont take this personally Sure - this is obvious !! Let's say I've done around 4000 poses for free so far (Could also be 5000 or more - I never counted them). I've written tutorials about posing at my site (www.schlabber.org) - I've done the Judy-poses for Poser 5, I can't remember HOW many people I helped when they called (via phone) or mailed - Maybe you know a bit about me now ... And, well - it's Schlabber (with Sch) - and don't take this personally This wasn't meant as a joke - sorry

Sorry - I had to cut this answer from the other ... dialyn: Yes, maybe it was a bit to specific - but I first wanted to know if there is/was a chance to get something I have in my mind before trying to find a workaround - It's easier to explain something that everyone can see then like 'if the person on the image would have shrinked his arms I would do the pose like ...'. And it's easier for everyone to find something similar between an image and the pose - that's why I was asking for Mike/Vicky-like-people. I think it's absolutely clear not everyone look like them. But I can't understand why almost noone even asked :-( xoconostle: I can't say how appreciated such a tutorial would be - but I think you want to be a bit sure if you're willing to write about 60-70 magazine-sides. See, I'm giving away a lot of know-how - and I want to give it away for free - if noone wants to read it I spent around one month of my spare-time for almost nothing - I simply want to avoid that - that's all. Well - let's see what else comes ...

no, i dont know anything about you except what i read above and the cross post, hence my statement. i dont take anything personally from anyone who doesnt know me so... i get it now though, you feel after all the work you have selflessly done that you expect people will just come jumping up to you to do your bidding? it all makes sence now... you wana keep going or are you gona push me somemore? i can leave the joking aside too and continue for ever buddy

Schlabber, both you and I know how valued you are by the community...

I think, personally, most people would love your tutorial and many would be glad to help you. I don't know why it's particularly important that people look like the fantasy folks...afterall, it's not the looks but the poses that are important, and most humans bend the same way (unless they work for the Cirque Du Soleil), but it's important to you and my opinion doesn't matter. I can't help you out. I'm too short, too fat, and I have more moving parts than Victoria has. But I'm sure there are thin, tall types to excess out there. I hope some come forward. The tutorial would be invaluable to some of us who find posing a challenge.

schlabber well I for one would love to see a tutorial by you ... I've just spent a few hours getting vicki to lie down on a sofa sigh as for photos ... have you asked over in the Photography forum? they might be able to let you use a few shots Lyrra

Who wouldn't want to see tutorials from the Master of the Poser pose? I didn't catch the original thread, but I'm willing to help. I have a camera, just need a victim. Mark

Well my offer for a few dorky posed shots of me and a sword still holds :) I spend hours trying to do one pose a lot of times too and it is confounding a lot of times to me. Would love a tutorial ... And I second what illusions said .. well not the part about the movable parts ;)

Oh Illusions the thread HERO! Thank you so much for explaining all that to me! it was as if a great weight of misunderstanding has been lifted from my shoulders...!!! I get it... You get over it... Anyone else want to jump all over me? You get a big red cape and a pair of flatering tights to leap about in!

why couldn't you use the Standard Poser figures? If you want, there's a part of the site that has artist's pictures..been there once, but I'm sure it's still around. Heck, I'm out of the running; I look like a cross between Gollum and Col. Sanders..;)
I'd be very appreciative of a tutorial on posing; I'm still at the 'grab 'em by the ass, and grab 'em by the ankles' posing stage, so any help would be appreciated..and the Poser models get tired of being 'pretzel people' too..;)

i think you should do the tut only if you feel its worth doing.. i think it would be wonderful.. there are people that dont care and there are people that do, i think when people take the time to do tuts (and they are alot of work ) im sure that is a very kind considerate thing to do considering they are most of the time free and that to me shows the person gives a shit about others. as for photos i dont have a camera unfortunately or id most definately donate some

now now people ... behave hands on hips don't make me turn this thread aorund! Lyrra (moderator)

I remember the first time I tried to pose Michael. I sent his arm through his body. I thought I'd killed him. His head spun around as if from the Exorcist. I'm surprised I ever touched Poser again. If no one here suits schlabber's fancy, I think Lyrra's suggestion is very good (though it seems to me there are some likely offers now available). I always had a weakness for Col. Saunders..he helped put me in the shape I am in today. :) Fried chicken, anyone?

illusions: it's not worth it. 3ncryptabl3 lick, flattering has two letter "t"s. Just trying to be helpful there big guy.

skids to a stop in her flattering tighted feet and her red cape swirls tanglingly around her Someone called??

SChlabber has made this type of request before for pictures of people in certain pose situations as a basis for creating poses for Poser. Alas, it was posted in the middle of a five day stint I had away from the computer and trying to catch up one five days worth of messages at Renderosity amounts to reading a novel....and I can't bring my computer into the bathroom with me (where everyone does ALL their good reading, right?) so I didn't see it either. Sorry, sweets (Schlabber) :(

Anyhoo - most everyone here knows that Schlabber is from Germany - sometimes his words don't come across fully understandable to all ppl. What I took it to mean is that all he wanted was some average proportioned people in a variety of poses. Only because when a Poser figure has proportions beyond 'average', what is a normal pose for a standard figure needs to be optimized for that particular one. Hence the average base to start from - simple enough to understand I think for us all, right? :)

I think his frustration is understandable - I can't believe how much time he spends just posing and posing and posing the Poser folk and animals. He gives away a buttload of them for free and even the packaged ones he sells has a horde of them - very inexpensively priced to boot! He just seems unable to stop himself from posing and he's got a lot of enthusiasm for it - I think he felt let down when there was no reponse to his post.

Anyhoo - back to my wild kingdom - these tights are heading to the cleaners 'cause they're beginning to chaffe..... G ;P

lol - so much for today - I need some sleep ... :o) Lyrra - Don't worry about me - I don't want a personal fight in any way and btw. no, I didn't forgot you - I know I said last weekend - but - ya know - lots of poses to do - I hope to be finished 'till Friday and if you don't mind - a set for everyone, OK ?? illusions - Thank you for explaining this legal thing about the images - it might really was not totally clear. dialyn - fried chicken ?? now ?? - it's after midnight (well, here - lol) pakled - Don't worry, if I write the tut (it really depends on the photos) I'll cover Dork, Posette, Judy, Don as well - also some animals - but I don't need any images from animals for this. Hey - just got a few mails - I think somehow I'll find help :o)

Schlabber, I'd be more than happy to let someone have as many pics of me as you need; if you don't mind 'Mike with a beer-gut' ;p However I do not have current access to a camera and live alone (except for Godzilla, a 20lb Cuban iguana)....but if anyone in the L.A, CA area wants to get together and help Schlabber out (help the community out actually!!) I'm game!!!

OOp, crossed posted with Schlabber: I also have a large iguana if someone has the camera! Noggin's lizards could use some of Schlabber's magic too!!

Attached Link: http://web.infinito.it/utenti/m/maclean/

Schlabber, I figured you'd give them out for everyone ... no big deal :) Besides ..juggling and tightrope walking are two things I've yet to see posed. And at any rate its my job to make sure that all remains nice and polite here. Lyrra

Lyrra - I figured you'd give them out for everyone ... no big deal :) Besides ..juggling and tightrope walking are two things I've yet to see posed. Well I (!) can't do that - maybe Vicky can ;o) - OK - I'll do 10 juggling - 10 tight rope walking and 10 combining both :--) but then until Saturday or Sunday - you'll be noticed when they're done.

I'm still thinking about that iguana that outweighs my Lhasa Apso. Wow. I have a camera but I live too far south of L.A. to be any help. Lyrra...I thought this was nice and polite for us. :)

maclean - thaaaaaaanx - will have a closer look at it tomorrow - to late here :o) igohigh - sorry x-post: I'm a bit unsure if even Vicky can walk on a tightrope, juggle with 5 balls and then also fighting with a sword against a dragon or so - maybe even naked in a temple ?? - uh-oh ...

/me envisions a naked Vicky walking tightrope in a temple high over the head of a dragon whilst juggling swords...... Got that Egon?? L

I can certainly understand why you'd want to make sure that the effort would be worth it. I've recently tried to do some things that I thought would help people, but very few people bothered to respond. Even if this tutorial never gets written, just remember, you have one of the most respected names in the Poser universe, and for good reason. Posing is indeed an art unto itself, and you, sir, are an artist.

Lucy Fur: hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm ... I need a real-life-photo from that :---)

Hey! You didn't say I'd have to juggle one-handed so I could take a picture with the other hand! ;P

Lucy Fur: When you arranged all of that just call !! I'll take the next flight in the US just to take a shoot from that xoconostle thx - but I'm more like a worker ;-)

You should have caught me 10 years ago..I would have sent a pic...but now that 40 has arrived....various parts have shifted somewhat ;).....I still would love the pose tutorial!!!! I spend hours...just like all the above..doing the pretzel thing..twisting the head almost completely off....that's why I search & buy all of mine...& when the money recovers from recent spending spree here I will be buying you CD :). I actually have a speadsheet in Xcel with my "wish" purchases(all catagrozed of course)& check them off as I go. Talk about anal & organized LMAO!!!! Please write it!!!!! Oh, by the way, my husband is from Euskirchen,Germany(not that you care). Debby

lol I'd have helped if you asked me 5 years ago. Fairly tall, 5'9, and was built quite well, but alas, childbirth added a few more pounds than dear Vick carries. lol And I am a bit, um, bustier than she. I'd offer my husband or son, but hubby is broad shouldered, but much thinner waist and legs than Mike, and my toddler is a bit to tall for the kids, so I don't think I could be any help. :( I'll check to see if I have any of my old modeling pics around that might be of some use, though. Unfortunately, I never learned to juggle or tightrope walk. :D But I might have a couple of pics with a sword. (Don't ask, :D I did theatre.) If they are at the house, and not in storage with the rest of my earlier stuff still in NYC, I'll let ya know.

I know I might get in trouble for this suggestion, but I know someone here who could do it (gulp)... Rio. runs quickly from thread

Schlabber, many of us see you as the King of Poses. I am rubbish at posing characters and often use your poses as the basis of my own. I also did not see the original post and do not look like Victoria - well, I might with a few serious morphs on her! Tell us what sort of poses you want though and I will be happy to help in anyway I could - I am sure that most of us would! Don't let this put you off - we love you!

After reading your posts and the rants going off in this one I do have a few questions. In your original post you said; "And here occurs a problem for me. I'll explain how it comes from a real picture to a Poser-pose. I can't use an image from a well-known person for this 'cause I simply don't have the rights to use those images. So - I'm searching for some real-image-poses: a standing - or in motion - one (you might know the Shania Twain one I'm using for my Website-tutorial something in that direction)" In brief you said you can not use someone famous and then 2 paragraphs later you state that you use Shania Twain? Is she not famous? If you are only using the "pose" what does it matter what they look like or if they are famous, how can you copyright the way someone poses (hey don't walk like that, that is my walk I swear I'll sue) I understand that you intend to use in a magazine, have you ever tried to contact the copyright holder for the image of the famous person(s) to see if you could use it? There are some royalty free images that you could probably use, you may have to pay for some though. Your poses BTW are excellent and I do know what it is like to get (or not) reference materials. I am not ranting at this post I am just pointing out were my confusion came from, from your original message. Please do not take this the wrong way and keep up the excellent work you do.

Sabretalon: I'm not taking that as a rant, no problem - it is not so easy to understand (and truely, I'm also don't understand most of this stuff at all - lol) this image-rights-thing. **************** In brief you said you can not use someone famous and then 2 paragraphs later you state that you use Shania Twain? Is she not famous? **************** Oh, yes - she is and it is NOT right what I did at my website-tutorial - but as this is only my problem - now if this tutorial comes out and someone wants to host it - it is also the problem of the one who is hosting (or printing) it - I don't want to have any legal rights problems with this tutorial - that's all. ***************** If you are only using the "pose" what does it matter what they look like or if they are famous, how can you copyright the way someone poses (hey don't walk like that, that is my walk I swear I'll sue) ***************** afaik this doesn't matter - If I don't have the right to use I am not allowed to use it ... but - anyone who knows exactly about it - please correct me if I'm wrong :-) ****************** I understand that you intend to use in a magazine, have you ever tried to contact the copyright holder for the image of the famous person(s) to see if you could use it? ****************** No, but this would include a lot of work - I thought making them new from scratch (the images) would be easier. ****************** There are some royalty free images that you could probably use, you may have to pay for some though. ****************** Do you know any source ?? If so, please fire me a link over ... ****************** Your poses BTW are excellent and I do know what it is like to get (or not) reference materials. ****************** Oh - thx :o) ****************** I am not ranting at this post I am just pointing out were my confusion came from, from your original message. Please do not take this the wrong way and keep up the excellent work you do. ****************** Oh - don't worry - that's why I try to explain this and that here. Hope it helped Schlabber

Well, I can't see that a lack of volunteers to provide photos means no-one wants to see the tutorial. I can imagine a lot of people read the original post, and thought, "That sounds cool - but there's no point in me sending MY crappy photos - someone elese will send something better". And of course, if everyone thinks that, you get the observed result. Actually, it might be quite difficult to find really good photos that would be useful for this purpose. The average person standing around looking goofy is not necessarily a good model. One can do a lot without such reference models, using imagination instead.

I put in a vote for some poses of people looking goofy. We've got a million of Vicky staring into Valhalla...how about Vicky losing her grip on her sword once in awhile? Or Mike tripping over his toga? Or either of them stopping for a cappucino and dealing with those plastic tops on the cups. Not so naked Vicky in the Temple of Starbucks.

Hi Schlabber, I think you're posing talent is legendary, around here anyway. I would appreciate a tutorial that helps with things that are probably second nature to you. Things like how much the diferent neck segments should turn when turning the head or how much the shoulder should raise when lifting arm, etc. I often spend time tweaking a pose, trying to figure out these nuances.(Sorry I'm useless with out a spell checker.)

Dosen't anyone in LA area have a camera?!? I promise my mug won't break the lens! I'll even put a bag over my head (they make me do that when I go into the grocery store anyway).....

I'm thinkin', igohigh, you could get one of those one time use, throwaway, ecologically disasterous cameras. Then find some tourists and let them know you'll take picture of them with their camera if they will return the favor for you. Problem solved. Or you could teach your iguana how to shoot the camera. It's never good when I start thinking.

Attached Link: http://www.fineart.sk/

Dialyn; tried that but remember I live in LA. I handed the little throwaway camera to a little tourist kid on the street, son-of-a-gun if he didn't not only run off with it but pulled a gun and demanded my wallet too! Poor little runt, when he saw my wallet was empty, he threw it back and hit me in the head with it sheeesh =8(

igohigh, when you have a bad day, you have a royally bad day. LA is a big place...maybe you need to hang out in a better part of town. :( Oh well, I'm out of ideas. Take care. And remember to duck!!