So, you want my money (Tips and hints from a buyer who spends $100 a month) Now this is not intended to bash or promote any one, or group of vendors. Or to bash or promote any one or group of artists. I am well aware that money is tight (even thought I spend a great deal on poser items) I know that vendors are always looking for a new ways to get just one more sale. So for those who wonder late at night who buys poser stuff and why, and how can I can some of that. This is for you. First, a little about me, and my addiction. Im a divorced 39-year-old male, with a lot of free time and no life. I have a pretty well paying job in the computer field, and the types of poser work I do is stills and stills for stories that I write. This means that the images I do will have a lot of stuff in them and there will be a lot of them. The most stuff I have used in a poser image was 37 figures, 20 static props, and a few high res textures. I have an 80GB HDD with one thing on it, POSER. My runtime folder is 32.2 GB in size, about a third of that is compressed with the power of ProPack. As I said at the beginning I spend on average $100 a month between the major locations. Though most is bought right here at renderosity. Though sometimes I can buy up to 200 a month. I have spent, just here, this year from 01/01/03 to now, $1236. This would list me as nearly completely insane. But its my money and I could/can afford it. So, how do you get some of that? Heres what I look for and make my decisions on. Free Stuff- Do I have free stuff of yours? Is your free stuff easy to get to, how does it install, and how does it work. I look at free stuff as your portfolio, how do you do what you do, what is your style, can I use it for commercial renders (Im a published artist and one day I may luck out and sell more work and if I cannot use your free items then why should I download them). Are your free items only for what you sell? (This eludes that your support is not good since I have to rely on seeing it available instead of getting an IM or mail after the sale so I can get them.) Summary- Free stuff lets me have a taste of what you can do. If the free stuff is good, what you sell SHOULD BE a better quality and/or have more tricks it can do. (Example, BAT, who hasnt used or downloaded his stuff. So when he started selling what he sold supported all Vickies and has more morph targets.) If there is no free stuff from you the other factors below become a lot bigger. But free stuff is my biggie. Forums- Are people talking about what you sell? Are they having problems or are things great? How quickly do you respond in those forums if at all? Are you fixing the things people are having problems with? Galleries- Do you use what you sell as you advertise it, can you use it as you intend it to be used? Do you actually do work with it other than to sell it? If not then why would I? (Example- Ecstasy, TT, Daio, Syyd, all do real work with what they sell, if they believe in their work to use it why would I not?) Store- (Your golden opportunity.) Thumbnail- Does it show me what you sell, or are you doing art? If you want my money, show me what it is. Cropping a gallery image you posted shows me art, not item. Price-If I know your quality from free stuff, Ill consider paying more. But if I am seeing you for the first time in the store then I am less likely to pay a lot. Details- What can this thing of yours do, what can I use it for. Does it have moving parts, does it have morph targets built in. How many things am I getting by buying your thing? If Im getting more than one thing does that match what you are asking. (Example- 1 thing for 30 dollars versus 15 things for 30 dollars. If you think the one thing got bought, try again. However, if again, I know you from free stuff and that was cool, then maybe.) Product renders- Do they show what you sell in good detail, or in action. Again are you selling or impressing me with the artist that you are. If you are impressing me, then do that in the galleries not on the sales floor. Feed back- Who bought this and what did they think. Did they find it easy to use, are they a power user, meaning do they do complex renders with multiple figures and props. (Caution- I dont put a lot of weight here, except if I personally know the person leaving the feedback. Since I know that an item can be sold and images of it dont get posted in places I look. But I will read feedback mostly to see if it seems sincere. Purchases- Have I bought from you before, if I have and if I liked, then Im likely to buy again. Especially if I have left feedback or I use your thing right away. OR you have done a complete set of something, meaning for Vicky,Mike,Posette,Dork, (Like uniforms, or space suits, or armor.) Sorry for the monster long post and blather, but again, If you are wondering who is looking at buying poser stuff then this is something to think about. Im sure that there are people you spend more than I do. And possibly follow a similar trac, and likely there are a good number of people who spend far less and use the same guidelines. There are many reasons people buy poser stuff, many are impulse, and others are pros and semi-pros, and collectors. And for each type they have their way of buying. Im just illuminating one reason, mine. Thanks for the time and good luck! lalverson, member since 1999

A very good post Lee :) I can think of several other things to add to that. Rsr's....they are a necessity for a P4 user and if your product says that it's P4 4.03 compatible and you don't have rsr's in your file list then it's not compatible. I shouldn't have to do anything to your product to get it to work before I install it. Little shrugging guys in my libraries don't make me want to purchase from you again. Same goes with version errors in your products. No excuse for them. None, zero, zip, nada....if your testers are telling you things are ready and you have those version errors when someone uses your package for the first time, you either better make sure that someone is testing in Poser 4.03 and if they are; then different beta testers are in order. Easy fix yes...but if I spend money on an item, then I shouldn't even have to worry about it. Expect an IM from me if I purchase your product and find them there. I shouldn't have to fix them, you should :) You don't and I won't buy from you again, because that tells me that you really don't want my money :) Those are two pet peeves of mine :) I'm a merchant also, just starting out, so I know that those things I speak of are very little and easy things to do for the customer. :) but MAJOR PITA's for the customer to have to do them themselves and they shouldn't have too, they paid you/us/them for the product to be 100% right. I like Lee, spend a lot of money every month on Poser. Sometimes more then what he spends. I'm scared to add it up, because I figure I'll go screaming into the night if I do....everything he said in his post is pretty much spot on, the only thing I don't agree with is the rendering. Not everyone has time to render with what they sell, I sure haven't lately anyway LOL!!! But that doesn't mean I don't believe in my product. If I didn't believe in it, I wouldn't sell it :) People are talking about things being tight, prices are too low, it is kinda scary that's for sure, I'm just starting out and I can see it too...but maybe the good that will come from this is that quality will increase in order to stay ahead of the competition. :) Not saying that quality isn't already there, but we can all always improve right? I for one am going to print Lee's list out and put it on my bulletin board and do my best to follow what he has laid out. Sounds like he has a pretty good blueprint :) Thanks Lee :) Pendy

Some really good points raised there. I would like to raise a few (sort-of) counterpoints though. Certainly in regards to the Forums and Galleries points, a lot of the Merchants here do this as a hobby, part time, while doing a 9-5 job on the days. With the sheer volume of stuff that gets posted, it can be difficult to find the time to answer forum questions. A more effective way of communicating with a Merchant would be IM or e-mail.....its more direct, and that way the Merchant can't miss it. If they then fail to respond, well, its probably time to shop with some-one else. Price is always a thorny issue.....but, to be honest, if we at 3dmodelz didnt need to survive and feed our families, we'd give it ALL away for free, for the simple reason we just making stuff in 3d. And for me personally, i can create much more with 3d modelling than i can with my meagre artistic talents. We just enjoy 3d..... Details are good! product renders, we're doing 2 of the 3 showing just the model/prop/skin/etc....so no extras, just showing what it looks like, and the third image we're doing non-postworked scenes, with extra props and stuff, to show a complete straight poser render. rsr's....see image. We've also started including png's as well. All our stuff is finished in Poser 4.0.....so we're then sure if it works in that, it'll be fine in 4.03 and PPP, and (usually) P5. Also eliminates version errors :-) Useability should also be a factor. Are you going to be able to put it to lots of uses, or is it too specific? Can it be used for more than it was intended? Are there things that can be used with a wide range of other stuff to create complete and well rounded renders? We, certainly, are always striving to increase that aspect of products too. Thank-you Lee, some really good points there :-) Andi, 3dmodelz

oops, forgot the image :-)

Great points and great thread - I'm always interested in suggestions for improving my products and bussiness. As a customer myself, I have similar views (I want to see enough detail about a package to make an informed decision). I left more detailed tips in another thread (in the merchant's forum), so I'll just go find me a corner to sit quietly in and listen. ** pulls out tape recorder **

Thanks guys.. this is a great thread.. Lee, very good points! I think we follow pretty much all of them. One thing.. Customer support!!! Until the customer is happy, the job isn't over.. this just makes sense.. a buyer that is happy, is a repeat buyer!! Happy Rendering! Noel

I posted and it got deleted. So i'm not rewriting what i said. i will post part of it over at RDNA store forum. never had that happen before :(

As a consumer and not a seller, I'd like to highlight one of Andix's points - When I buy a product, my first thought is "can I use it more then once?" There are some wonderful items out there, but if i'm going to spend x amount of money, seeing as how my budget is extremely tight, I want to spend it on something that I'm going to be able to use more then once. Also, it makes a huge difference to see as much as I can of the product in the renders - like Lalverson says, I'm not interested in art when I visit the market place, just functionality. My imagination usually fills in the blanks. : ) my half cent, Rob

Fabulous and great points folks and I always try to get this things done by myslef. Customer support is very importend and if the happy with your products that keeps you going :) Thanks to all :) Jurgen

Attached Link: http://market.renderosity.com/softgood.ez?Who=Spanki

I thought I'd re-post a few (edited) snipits from the merchant forum thread... When I browse the marketplace, here's the order of events that might cause me to purchase a product (pre-assuming that I have some need/use for it, but related to my impulse buying): - Thumbnail First impressions can mean life and death. Poorly lit/composed or uninteresting thumbnails rarely get me to 'look inside' to see what the product is. - Price ok, so the thumbnail looks interesting enough, but I see by the thumbnail and package title that it's an overpriced [insert common packaging ideas here]... pass. - Product promo images Yep, the first thing I do is skip ALL the ad blurb text and view the images. If the first image falls flat for some reason, I don't always make it to the second and/or third. Each image should make me want to see the next. If it's a modeled product, consider showing wireframes, consider showing material zones, consider showng uv maps - all of these help me get a feel for what I'm buying. - Ad blurb / text Ok, so the images didn't scare me away and the price is either reasonable or can be better answered/quantified by reading the ad text. That text needs to now make me a believer. If it's just a file list, that's useful, but I can see that in your readme. Tell me what the special features are - better yet, list them (where appropriate) on your images so I don't miss them on the step above. - Readme file I often get a feel (rightly or wrongly) of the effort/thought put into a package by the readme file (and I don't buy anything without seeing that first). A readme file with nothing but a list of files in it doesn't inspire me to buy the product anymore than it (apparently) did you to create it. There are exeptions to this of course (depending on the complexity of the product), but seeing detailed installation instructions, usage tips, texturing tips, special considerations, etc. in there tell me you put some effort into the product. You also get extra credit in my book for being up-front about possible limitations of your product, along with any work-arounds or solutions. - Product Feedback This is not necessary for me to make a decision, but it can help persuede me if I'm on the fence. I might also go look at your other products - either to purchase something else - again, the little thumbnail(s) might be the only reason or (more often than I care to) to try to 'divine' some information about the current product I'm interested in (hint: don't make me go looking for details of your product in forums and your gallery renders - don't assume that I've been following it's development elsewhere. If it's a relevent feature or detail about your product, I need to see it somewhere in your ad). - Name Recognition I listed this last because of the particular way that *I* shop. I try to be objective and give new/unknown merchants the benifit of the doubt. I try to ignore who made it until I've decided whether I'd like to have it or not. If it seems pricey, or borderline for some other reason (not enough detailed info), "who made it" starts weighing in more heavily... Billy-T kicks me over the fence, Joe-Smoe might pull me back it (appologies if there's a Joe-Smoe vender out there ;). ...now, since this IS the Product Showcase forum, I don't feel bad about posting a link to my store ;). So the question is, do my own products meet my own standards? Ultimately, you'll decide with your purchasing dollars, but my answer is: I think I'm getting better about it and threads like this will help me do just that. Thanks, - Keith

Attached Link: The Largest Merchant Store in Renderosity........

Good point keith, this IS the Product Showcase forum, so store links are the order....heheh Didnt mention customer support, because I had assumed that every Merchant realised that customer service is the Prime Essential aspect of being a merchant. Customers are your raison d'etre as a merchant. Without them, you are not a merchant....! As an addendum to customer service we also do things like supply new versions of products to previous customers for free. So anyone that bought version 1 of WorldZ, got version 2 free, despite the fact that to all intents and purposes it was a new product, since we re-built it completely.....but nonetheless, we still gave it to buyers of version 1 for free....then we made version 1 available as a freebie.....see [Our free section at 3dmodelz](http://www.3dmodelz.com/Free/downloads/downloads.php) under Poser > Extras for version1 of worldz, and addons for version 2.....then browse the 400 or so free items we have there....**grin**.....and when we make a version 3 of WorldZ, we'll do the same.....

;-) Excellent points being brought up. Just bookmarking so I can keep an eye on this thread. :-)

Andix, as one of your customers, I LOVE the way you give the newest versions of your product to your customers that have already bought. That is one of the reasons I know I'm in good hands whenever I purchase something from you :) Just wanted ya to know that!! Pendy

One thing that is extremely important for me is that the name of the product AND the name of the store/merchant is on ALL the promo images. I may not have the dough this month, and my wishlist is so long that things get buried. I save promo images to disk in a special folder. I more often than not forget to rename the images so it's important that the info is on them.

lee, i'm at least as crazy as you, i think.... but you've made some great points - and very important ones, as always. for myself, everything is in detail and quality. i'm not a professional artist and use poser as a hobbyist. but i've always looked for craftsmenship - the "artistry" of the work itself - in most everything i've acquired: cars, furniture, books, etc.... i find myself tending towards that with 3d models, too. (of course, most everything i have is old except for the 3d models.) quality first. everything else comes of its own accord. the better the product is, the less complaints.... as for the quality of customer service, it's relative to the problems one might encounter witb a product, non? my imperfect heuristic remains: "you get what you paid for." if, on the off-chance, it exceeds your wildest expectations, all the better. but if it disappoints, i won't be back.

Oh, you're in good hands with us Pendy....**Wicked Grin**...j/k..lol on the subject of upgrades, we will be updating a lot of our older props packs during the rest of this year, because as we improve our skills, these don't look as good as they did when we first created them. And, theres a free add-on available for the Ultimate Urban series, which can be obtained by filling in the soon-to-arrive Renderosity surveys. Fill in either the Marketplace or Community survey, and you'll get Ultimate Urban #0 free.