this post is also up in the poserpros site, im in a rotten mood, and i need to spead its infectous state. is it just me, or does V3 suck. the model its self, i love, i like the slender athletic feel to it, and the face is soft. but the morph injections are a hanous crime on the poser community i can not explain how long it takes me to put morph injections on her. one bye one, no problem, but as soon as you click on inj all features or head morphs or all of any anything, it takes like 40 minutes. I for one would love daz to go back to the simplicity of v2 and m2, add the damn dials back, I hate inj. Make all the new uni meshes you want, and I will buy them. But please leave the inj at the door. Am I the only one who feels this way?

I must say they certainly are a pain in my comps butt lol. You know what I did? I spent the forever adding them by full head and full body too!! Then I saved the pzr file as v3 all morphs, it takes way less time to load her this way with the inj already there no worries and far less hassle. Since it sounds like you deal with the exact same issues with her as I do, thought you might like to try this, it worked for me; she's still a slow loading pzr, but no where near the time or hassle of inj's!

im in the process of doing this, but i gotta tell you she's driving me kooko for cocopuffs.

I feel your pain, Core. I was at first very reluctant to use V3 because of the hassles. I did what foxseelady's done and injected all morphs to the face and body and "spinned the dials" till I was satified with the outcome. I've known to spend a whole week on just one scene. With a little bit of patience I think you'll come to like V3 as well. Since I bought V3, I've only gone back to V2 twice. To achieve the same results as V3, I think you need to use magnets, and you don't wanna know what a pain magnets are. JV

oh i know, but it seems to me some of the stuff could have been dials to begin with, then the extra stuff could have been inj files. i just feel errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, right now, but i'll get better,lol. damn i sound like a newbie. and i have had v3 since she came out.

I have not bought, and will not buy, M3 because of this. One of these inj horrors is enough.

Have you got the main !DAZ folder (which contains all the deltas) inside the MAIN poser runtime/libraries folder? I'm running P5, and at first I had the !DAZ folder installed in my secondary linked runtime. Take forever that way - P5 needs it to be in the main runtime. I can now load all head morphs in about 2 minutes (used to take forever, as you have found.)

I have a bad feeling that Stephanie 2 is also going to be of the injectable type. :( It's my own fault, I know, since I still use Poser 4, but the disaster my Pose directory has become is very disheartening. There's no room for anything other than the injections. (OK, that's an exaggeration, but you know what I mean.) I am hoping that DAZ Studio will have a method of controlling the carnage. Kimberly

Which version of Poser are you using? Also, did you installed all the Service release for V3? With all the SR Victoria 3 works much better and faster on Poser 4 and the morphs load really "fast" on my PC. I had problems in Poser 5 and it took ages (if it didn't lock up) to load all morphs. Then I was told to install V3 on the main Poser 5 runtime (or at least to put a copy of the !DAZ directory in thr Libraries folder of the main P5 runtime) and it started to load very quickly. Of course I also installed all the SR for Poser 5. In Poser 5 you can organize the pose folders too, making using V3 and M3 less painful. I hope this help, before they told me these tips I had to put Poser 5 on sabbatical because I really couldn't use V3 at all. Staby

I read on another forum that DAZ Studio will not use the injection system, but they didn't explain how. I think we'll find out soon, but I suppose that the program will access the deltas in the !DAZ folder directly. (?) Anyway you are right if you only have Poser 4 it painful to use the injection system. I had to create afake runtime to store all the stuff I didn't need at the moment so that I only had V3 folders in the pose directory... :( Poser 5 helped a lot, but I have to admit that I didn't have a lot of problems with it because I really use Poser 5 as if it were Poser 4 (no firefly renderer, no hair room end so on). But the folder management system is a must have...

im going to bed

As long as you have the service packs for V3, and in all cases for M3, you can remove or combine the !V3/!M3 folders in your Pose library - only the separate !DAZ folder is critical. It's probably a good idea to keep a backup of the original V3 Pose folders, for any character INJ poses that were set up pre-service packs and not updated since.

they did that so they could have creative control over the ugly bitch, and make the money they feel they deserve.......they just want the money Im glad god dosent charge us with a sin every time we create our own shade of blue ....... I agree with ya

They did it so it could be downloaded ... She is actually cheaper than V2 was ... The file with full injection would be so bloated and workable for most people (100 megs per file without clothes) and would be really bad to download. People were asking for upped resolution and they got it but it comes at a price larger file sizes.

Um, why not just inject all the morphs at once and then save the loaded figure to your library? Then she'll act just like V2 and you don't have to worry about it. Just treat the morph injection as though it were a method to break up the downloads and keep them to a managable size. Sometimes its easier to change yourself than to change the world.

RHaseltine, you always give the best advice :) This is not the first time you have helped me out. Thanks! Kimberly

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May sound like advertising - but if you use my body-morphs, you get an "unbelievable body" with a filesize less then 10 MB, without any DAZ-morphs.

The separate INJ was conceived for purchasers like myself who are on slow dial-up, and would take forever to dl a fully morphed character - just my two cents!

I hate injection morphing, more for the face than anything else. However, there are ways to get sround it. Adding all the morphs to V3 or M3 creates a very heavy figure in terms of file size. And if you're running a smaller system or P5, it can really impact rendering time and the number of figures you can put in. I've noticed though, that many of the morphs I just don't use. So I created a V3 that only has the morphs I usually use injected in it, save the.cr2 file, and go from there. If I need another morph, I add it to that set. I mean really, I don't use the umpteen breast size morphs. Just a couple usually will work for most figures. And do I really use all the face variations? Nope. They're nice to have when I need them, but why have the overhead when I'm not using one? Celtic, french, and japanese faces are very good options, when you need them. But most of the time they just add overhead. That's the whole idea behind injection morphing, to allow for the greatest variation for a high res figure, but let you pick and choose which ones to use at any given time. Most of us have gotten into the habit of loading the "All Injection Poses", and that's what kills us. The M3/V3 require a little more careful pick and choose. What I'd like to see in Daz Studio is a drag and drop (or quick apply) option with a list of possible morphs to choose from. Select the ones you want from the list (multiple select please), drag them to the figure, and only those are injected. It does take a little more time sometimes, but by starting with a simpler base and only using what I need to inject, I keep the file size down and the remaining injections go a lot quicker. If you're good at editing a pose file by hand, you can combine different injections from the Daz files and have one preset one that'll load your usual base set.

I personally LOVE the morph injection, then again, it doesn't take me nearly as long to inject all morphs as some are reporting.
I have found that P5 seems to forget what it is doing, a simple attempt to change the camera position gets the ball rollin' again.
I absolutely HATED V2's long list of dials, I seldom use her anymore because of this. Yes, you can remove the ones you don't use, and can even add them again, but that is such a pain.
I think the whole disappointment with the inj is more an issue of poorly performing computers and bugs within Poser itself.

No, you're not the only one. The inj system is the reason I unistalled V3 and all her gear. I've never been able to get all her face morphs loaded and haven't even tried the body morphs. My computer always freezes up to the point where I have to do a hard boot - not even ctrl-alt-del will work with the bitch. I hate V3 - she sucked all the fun out of poser.

I like the INJ system. Properly managed it results in characters under 20mb. If you do not want to take the time to learn to use it, then it will be something to cry and whine about. Used correctly, it is vastly superior to previous Mil figures.

IMO, the INJ system was a stroke of genius. It was the perfect answer to having advanced, improved characters for Poser without 100 meg file sizes. Also, imagine the miles of dials you'd have to wade through if all the morphs were permanent in the cr2, like they are with M2 & V2. With a program as old as Poser, I guess you can't have advancement without "workarounds."

I could use her on an old 400mhz machine. I just injected my favorite morphs, saved her, and went from there.

moprh injects don't work for me ither. I would love them if the fact that every time I try to use them I didn't get kicked out of poser with no warnings no error messages!

While I'm no fan of the INJ system, inlcuding the "Where did those dials come from???" extra surprise that you can "fix" with some extra software, I truly LOATHE the repeated position that INJ or seperate purchaseable products are the only solution to getting file sizes down. Because it's nonsense. It is NOT impossible to break a file down into several downloads without charging for each seperate unit as a sortof stand-alone-item. It IS possible to provide files which are downloaded in parts and only combine to install once you have all the parts in place.

Another thing you can do is make body types. I do this all the time. 1. Basically load up the injections you want. Don't load facial expression injections. In fact leave the head alone for now. 2. create the body shape you want. For example say its super heroines so I make a generic super heroine shape that I like. 3. Go through each body part and make a new morph for that new shape. For example, go through each body part and make a new morph called SuperHeroine. Keep the name the same for all the body part MTs. 4. Create a full body MT that adjusts the new MT. So in this case make a super heroine body MT. 5. In morph manager, load up the figure and delete all the other MTs or use the remove injection poses. Either way completely empty the figure EXCEPT for the full body MT you just made. 6. Inject the head with the head shaping MTs and shape the head the way you want. Don't inject facial expressions. Make a single MT for that head shape and again delete all MTs from the head except the one you made. 7. Inject the facial expression MTs. I usually don't inject the head at all during the construction phase and instead make a head shape MT seperately. I have a lib of favorite head shapes that are much smaller than the multitude of injections. So when all is said and done what you have is a V3 with just one Full body MT for her shape, one MT for her head shape and then all the facial epxressions injected in. Voila, a small, compact vicky 3. Then just swap out head shapes as you see fit to get different looks. I think its silly when people want to have all the MTs loaded. If you don't need spandex cuffs then don't keep lugging them around. Why have the Troll head MT when its not needed. Same with fat MTs if you don't need a fat person. Just make up a set of stock figures like fat, muscular, lean etc and you're set to go. This also works way better for Tailor since Tailor only has to convert one FBM instead of 20.

Wow I dont think I have ever seen the forums here so informative before..........Awesome.

(blushing till remaining hair combusts)@Kimberly

Although I understand the reasons for inj on a hi-res mesh I have to admit I don't like them either. You never know what morphs will come in handly. It is nice not to have to load all those funky teeth morphs. Personally I only like the pretty morphs on a figure. I just keep a version of V3 with everything I like loaded saved in my library

I also have done what PheonixRising and a few others have done - but by the time I add other figures and props I have a jumbo pz3 file that my computer ( medium weight system) refuses to render unless I do it in passes. A big PITA ! I've gone back to V2 and won't get M3 . I'm doing a very particular figure thing these days anyway and just don't need the V3 range. I use lots of V3 clothes/figure props though. Mason's method sounds really interesting though. Thanks for that Mason.

I also have done what PheonixRising and a few others have done - but by the time I add other figures and props I have a jumbo pz3 file that my computer ( medium weight system) refuses to render unless I do it in passes. A big PITA ! I've gone back to V2 and won't get M3 . I'm doing a very particular figure thing these days anyway and just don't need the V3 range. I use lots of V3 clothes/figure props though. Mason's method sounds really interesting though. Thanks for that Mason.

The problem is that ya spend to much time picking and choosing the morphs- learning what each one does- acepting then rejecting- when most of us just want to play with the character- make pictures- not become sudo modelers I'm still a fan of v2-

I have to say I'm mixed. She was intimidating at first but now I do just what Mason in #28 does. What I really Don't like is how V3, M3, Freak, LaRoo is over running my Pose Library with all these INJ/REM folders. Even in P5 it is getting WAY out of hand! And just wait untill Stephanie3, and V4, and M4, and V5, and M5.... When is the MADNESS gonna end?!? If INJ/REM is gonna stay then it needs it's Own format and Library system!!

bought V3, liked V3, took too much power to use even doing what Mason suggests so I junked V3. Won't buy M3 or Steffy 2 until Microsoft Longhorn is released since that OS is going to require major processor and memory increases. Computers that powerful might make V3 and M3 actually useable.

"The problem is that ya spend to much time picking and choosing the morphs- learning what each one does- acepting then rejecting-" I occasionally mutter "wouldn't it be nice if vendors documented their products" before shuffling off under the glassy-eyed stare of a wall of irate vendors who'd rather we all reverse-engineered their work - far enough to use it, anyway.

lol, yup who3d :) imagine the pdf size if daz actually documented every single morph

lol, what a nice little subject i started,lol and thanks for the imput all

I can say with absolute certainty that I hate INJ's. They are a good idea for some cases, but utterly useless most of the time.

When creating a new character I usually load up all the morphs (I never know what I'll use) which does take some time, but my system is fairly fast (P4 3.4, 2Gb ram).

The only way to compress down the CR2 file size thereafter is spending hours removing all the morphs I haven't used. Using V3 ends up to be a far more time consuming process than using V2. In the end I think the entire point of using INJs is moot. Honestly, with a few expectations I believe V2 is a superior product and more user friendly that V3.

Oh, if you want to make a V3 or INJ based character for release in the Market Place it's a nightmare. Since we are not allowed to release the CR2 we are left to deal ReadScripts. I dont think DAZ3D was thinking about the community when this product was created.

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