This just in from Daz, quoted from their latest November 28 (today) newsletter: "4 days and counting... DAZ|Studio is steadily approaching, Platinum Club members prepare! The day DAZ|Studio comes out, we'll be taking a quick tally of all active Platinum Club Accounts and placing a download link into all qualifying accounts. So, double check your account to make sure you have a valid credit card and billing address selected down at the bottom of the page in case your membership comes due for its monthly renewal. If you're an annual member whose membership is about to expire, hurry and renew now so you don't forget, your current expiration date will be automatically extended a full year from its current expiration date." Okay now, get in line....No pushing.... -jjsemp

Correction: the newsletter was dated November 28th but it just arrived today. -jjsemp

I just got it too! I was browsing the DAZ forum looking for info as tomorrow is the last day of November, and was shocked no one was asking about it. Then the latest newsletter popped in and answered the question. Looks like it got slightly delayed. Oh well, I really didn't have time to play with it anyway. -Tim

Tim, A lot of people seem to have missed this message which was posted in the Members Only forum by SKondris on the 25th of November: "Due to the shortened week and a couple of issues that we'd like to get fixed in DAZ|Studio before we release it to you all, we're going to need to hold off on the release until next week, I'm afraid. We are sorry that this means we'll not be able to hold true on delivering DAZ|Studio to the Platinum Club in November, as was stated earlier, however, it will be delivered to you prior to being released to the general public. This delay will allow us to offer you a better program and for DAZ to be around once you do receive it (we do not wish to release it right before the weekend either ). Though it will be just an alpha release next week, and is still very far from perfect or even ready for the general public, we feel that by next week you will be able to have an enjoyable experience with it as you help us test out DAZ|Studio further and push it into the realm of 'beta'."

Thanks for quoting it here! :) -Tim

I don't object to club members paying to alpha-test Daz Studio (even as Windows users had to pay to beta-test Poser 5), but I'm curious to see how the sales regimen works out for the Daz Studio beta modules. My guess is that they'll want to link them to the Platinum club via discounts for the modules, but the modules won't be exclusively Platinum.

No one has to alpha-test DAZ STUDIO if they don't want too. You can happily wait on the sidelines. I certainly don't expect it to do everything immediately. Most importantly, it just tells many of us what type of direction DAZ is going in with it (like runtimes, file formats, etc.) Personally, I'm still waiting for the Alpha-Beta tests of Poser 6 to finish (current test release is known under the CL software code name "Poser 5")

After all the hoopla, this thing had better not just perform but make damn good julienne fries as well.

"I don't object to club members paying to alpha-test Daz Studio (even as Windows users had to pay to beta-test Poser 5), Well, I agree with the second-half of that statement. :) Not sure what you mean in the first half though ... we don't have to pay (nor does anyone else for that matter) for the alpha, beta, or even the release candidate version of Studio. -Tim

I think we're all over rating this product. Hopefully it lives up to expectations and I'm sure, starting from ground up, they'll fix some inherent issues with Poser. But I think a lot of people are misguided as to what really can be done here. 1. 3D card accel won't do that much good for final renders. For a quick/preview render it will be fast but, if you want all the shader nodes and options supported, the final pic still needs to be software rendered. They can do some shortcuts like use the 3d card as a 2 poly renderer but that's about all. Not all open GL or DX options are supported on every card and there are some render options that DX won't even support. Its silly to think even the latest geforce card is going to support the multitude shading, lighting and other options. Certainly the renders on 3d cards won't be done in one pass. In Max, for example, the artist still has to do their final render as a software render. Don't count on super fast renders. They won't be beating Max or Maya times. Maybe Poser but I doubt by that much. 2. They are changing the file format from what I read. If so most of the side utilities that help people won't be that useful anymore. 3. The product is alpha and they even state that it won't be feature complete when shipped and would be waiting for plugins. Hopefully they'll support a robust plugin system that we 3rd party people can write for. If you thought Poser was buggy I hink you'll be in for a surprise with this product. We don't know their programming staff and we haven't dealt with any large product from them. Poser had its shake down of bugs and still has bugs. Do you really think DAZ is going to make a bug free app? Plus, I doubt DAZ is making so much money they can support a programming staff better than CL did. At some point they will release this product to get revenue rolling in just like CL did. 4. Irregardless of what system is run, the figues used are still super high poly count. A lot of programs choke on V3 and M3. The current wave of figures and clothes are just very poly intensive. If you're thinking your scene is going to render 2 to 3 times faster then I think you're dreaming. In all I think DAZ maybe more of a headache than a God send at first. Maybe in time they'll iron everything out but just remember how angry this community was when CL released a buggy P5? We'll see when people get their alphas but don't be surprised if the community realizes that making a product like this isn't all that easy and that DAZ studio suffers the same ailments as Poser 5.

Mason makes some very good points. However I would think that one thing that might make people less "hostile" towards DAZ studio (if it happens to be buggy) is the fact that they didn't have to shell out two hundred bucks for it. That said, it wouldn't surprise me all that much if people started complaining and forming lynch mobs because a free software application didn't live up to their expectations. For me, it's just another new toy to play with during the holiday season. :)

Most of the "hoopla" is created by ourselves so if we are disappointed we know who to blame. DAZ has actually been quite conservative regarding what this program will offer in its initial beta release. I anticipate a number of problems initially, both in program and design. But I will not be annoyed because they are not selling or promising anything more at this early stage. - Jack

3D card accel won't do that much good for final renders.

True. The renderer itself is software-driven and dependent on raw CPU power, much like Poser and most other 3D applications. The hardware support is there mainly to speed up the user interface and document windows. And to make the preview look nicer (antialiasing, less downsampling of textures, proper display of transparency, etc.).

At some point they will release this product to get revenue rolling in just like CL did.

Unlike CL (which is basically a one-product business despite other efforts like Avatar Lab), DAZ is already making money hand over fist through dozens of new products released each month. They don't need to release D|S early for revenue.

Unlike CL (which is basically a one-product business despite other efforts like Avatar Lab), DAZ is already making money hand over fist through dozens of new products released each month. They don't need to release D|S early for revenue. << Hmmm.. how do you know that? They sell product but that doesn't mean they are making the necessary ROI or money necessary to fund a large product like DAZ studio. I've made large software products. Studio is probably costing around 800k to 1.5 mil if they are paying normal salaries and have a sizable team. That's money not making money but money tied up in dev. Do you really think the entire poser community is buying enough product to create enough revenue that DAZ can spend a sizable chunk of change on making studio without it hurting them? If they have investors, at some point they are going to feel pressured to ship their product. Yes, unlike CL they have other things to bring in revenue and that helps but a failed DAZ studio can still sink them, especially if they spent investor capital on it.

You may well be right, Mason. I certainly hope not, however.

** they didn't have to shell out two hundred bucks for it.** Try 900 and you'll be closer to what I had to pay. And considering the price drop so fast after it came out I couldn't even make my money back when I sold my copy :/ So Daz|Studio is at least $900 worth of value compared to Poser 5. If D|S runs on my system, doesn't stall and shut down for no apparent reason and doesn't make my computer dialup the net then I'll be a happy camper - and even if it did, it STILL won't have cost me anything.

While the 3d support won't help renders, 95% of my time in poser is in setting scenes up. Moving items, scaling them, positioning them, ect. If I can get a smoother interface that reacts much faster, I can always use daz studio for setup, save a pz3, and then do the render in poser, if DS isn't up to snuff yet render wise. I look at daz Studio more as another tool or utility, rather then a replacement for poser...

here's what i see: d|s is about to come out. there are three groups of people, those who think it'll work wonders, those who think it's going to be a nice toy to play with, and finally, those who think it's just overrated and aren't putting any stock into it. however, curious labs is being even more quiet than normal, and i think they're holding their breath to see what d|s will be capable of. for better or worse, daz studio is going to change the face of ready-made 3d humans, for one main reason: poser will finally have some competition. how far this goes, we'll have to wait and see. when your first neighbor moves in, no matter what they're like, it's gonna be hard to walk around naked anymore. never in the history of capitalism has some friendly competition been a bad thing. even if daz studio turns out to be nothing more than a goofy toy, it should stir some growth among the market.

... and a fourth category of people- those who view at as a preliminary overture of things to come. Other than what appears to be rather good rendering abilties I really don't know what to expect from Studio at this stage. However, given my past experiences with DAZ energy and committment and the certainty that it can only benefit them to have more control over their own destiny I expect great things from its future development. Here's wishing DAZ Studio the best of luck and a glorious future. ...daz studio is going to change the face of ready-made 3d humans... DAZ/Zygote has already done that without Studio. Would Poser really have been as popular if DAZ/Zygote had never entered the market? But Studio might ultimately make a real difference to us real-world characters- could put a smile on our faces LOL! - Jack

right! but if studio proves successful and well built, then daz can get it's stuff to the masses without having to depend on curious labs. i sure hope it works out. think of the changes that might come!

Remember, Studio is NOT going to be a Poser killer anytime soon and it is NOT going to do everything Poser does now 'right out of the box' and there WILL be bugs in it and some may be hostile but that's why DAZ is only letting the Platinum Club have the current version right because they need a wider test base than they have now with a much wider collection of computer setups than the have in their internal test group. The Pclub will be helping stomp them bugs so Studio can be released to public beta sometime in December.

...without having to depend on curious labs. Precisely what I meant when I said "more control over their own destiny". As a businessman I would be extremely uncomfortable knowing my existence was dependant upon a single product over which I had no control. - Jack

...that's why DAZ is only letting the Platinum Club have the current version right because they need a wider test base... Mmmm... the PC people will only have Studio for a few days before the rest. As such, only the most egregious bugs will likely be found. I suspect that letting PC members have it first is just a feel-good marketing ploy. (Mind you, as a PC member myself I am not complaining!) I agree that those who expect Studio to be the next best thing to sex are likely to be extremely disappointed- serves them right. Sex is a tough act to follow... This long term public beta approach has been done before. Not only does it appear to offer superior testing feedback (for the reasons you mentioned and more) but it also tends to build a receptive market base. All in all I'd say it's a good thing that benefits most of us. In the long term it will probably even benefit CL. - Jack

Three key things that could make DAZ STUDIO an immediate success (once it gets through some December beta-testing) Lets say its January 2004 and its working fairly well and you have--- 1. An "advanced Asset Manager" (which has already been listed)- this could be a HUGE HELP to most people (including myself). This ALONE could make DAZ STUDIO a "Killer App". 2. Compressed Native File Format - something like LWO or 3DS (with approx. 2/3 more compression than OBJ) but allowing either attachment of texture files, or a more reliable way of linking to them with getting "lost". 3. 3rd Party Plug-ins - Other Rendering Engines, Special Effect Modules, HAIR, etc. - stuff that you would buy from someone ELSE, that did the specific cool things you need, while DAZ maintained the BASE app and plug-in links.

i agree, the benefits will be exceptional. and for those people who want this to be a curious labs killer, shame. if curious labs dies, then it's going to go back to a one-product market, and then there's no competition, and finally the product stagnates. imagine what would have happened if there was only one 3d app on the market? let's say lightwave was the only one, no competition. that means that it would have to come up with all the innovations on its own, and since there's no company to compete with, why rush development? i feel like that is exactly what happened to the poser market. maybe one day you'll be able to select a character and select the options "walk", "up", and "stairs" and watch v5 walk up the stairs in front of her, or choose "slap" "m5" "right hand" "50% power" and watch the program calculate the whole scene. that sounds crazy, but it could happen! but not with only one app cornering the market. daz studio, even if it blows ass right from the start, means competition, and that can only be a good thing for the market.

Just as I did with Poser 5, when Daz Studio comes out, I'll take what I get and use it for what it's worth, and I'm NOT going to complain one way or another. All of these programs are inexpensive (for most buyers) by comparison with others in their category. At these prices, it's kind of a miracle that they work at all. -jjsemp

...that sounds crazy, but it could happen! I got started with micros about 25-30 years ago. The boxes were rather primitive back then but still I raved about the future potential they held. People used to laugh and call me a dreamer. But comparing my yesterday dreams to today's reality I can say that, if anything, my dreams were far too conservative. - Jack

"I agree that those who expect Studio to be the next best thing to sex are likely to be extremely disappointed" Unless they're used to REALLY bad sex (or no sex at all, I suppose). ;-P bonni (just injecting some humor, don't mind me)

"the PC people will only have Studio for a few days before the rest." No, the rest of Steve Kondris' message said they were going to wait on feedback from the PC alpha testers before releasing a general beta, and though they hoped the gap would be short they seem to have dropped the original December timeframe.

Serves me right for being vague. SKondris suggested that Studio woould be released to the general public just a few weeks after the PC group got it. I thought of that as "days" as opposed to the more usual months and months. Of course we can't ignore Mr. Burns' comments regarding mice and men so who knows what will happen? Whatever... should be interesting though. - Jack

i wonder if daz studio will get its own forum or if this will be renamed the poser/daz|studio forum? after all, lightwave and maya don't share, even though they have many many similar functions. :)

Well, it's getting its own set of forums at DAZ ... R'osity might want to wait to spin off a new forum until D|S proves successful and acquires a sizable user base.

It would have to do something horrific, like format all my hard drives after stealing my banking information.

Oh, you played the original release of Pool of Radiance: Ruins of Myth Drannor, also?