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Poser - OFFICIAL F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2024 Nov 21 6:06 am)
Subject: Ok, it's gotta be asked: What's your version?(and yeah no gripin)
Content Advisory! This message contains nudity, violence
90
40
46
0
35
48
16 P5 Only
ProPack
P4/Artist
P3 & Earlier
P4 & P5
PP & P5
P5 No Use
173 P5 Owners 157 Active P5 Users 88 PP Users 81 P4 users 259 Total Respondents Unadjusted Curve Adjusted
Effective Users % P5 Users 61% 51% 33,914 % PP Users 34% 54% 36,164 % P4 Users 31% 51% 34,354 % P4 & P5 14% 29% 19,104 % PP & P5 19% 34% 22,467 % P5 Owners 67% 72% 48,103 258.69 Effective Sample Representation*
+/- 16% Accuracy
*Based on an estimated user base of 67,000 users.
(flags enabled for naked statistics and what will likely happen to me now...) Message edited on: 06/28/2004 23:38
thou and I, my friend, can, in the most flunkey world, make, each of us, one non-flunkey, one hero, if we like: that will be two heroes to begin with. (Carlyle)
Personally, the only problem with things like this is how you arrive at your figures. I'll give you the 175 owners and 157 active users of P5. When you have polled and gotten answers from all 67,000, then I will concur with your findings. I've never understood these things to my satisfaction. If you poll 100 people, how can you be sure that the next 100 won't give you opposing answers? These things are just too fallible IMO. However, as a broker, now that I have P5 for Mac OSX and cannot use PP or P4, I will provide P5 Mats, but find myself in the maddening position of having to reverse engineer to accomodate those still using PP and P4. People using three different (really, two) versions puts it on the broker's shoulders to try to accomodate the differences. I find it difficult and time-consuming, with no real compensation for the effort possibly. My newest forthcoming product will have P5 specific material settings. I wait to see if it really makes a difference for the time investment. Cris
Out of statistical context, you are absolutely correct, Quoll -- no argument there. I would hope it wouldn't be taken out of statistical context. Then again, I am posting it in the poser community, aren't I? lol As to the specific use of the terms "Effective Sample Representation" and "Effective Users" -- the terms simply mean nothing more than that's the end sum as it's expressed out. Based on the statistical probability of like answers, those are the "effective sum totals". That's all. Nothing funky about them. In fact, until I read your comment, Quoll, I hadn't thought about the wording -- it's a standard term. In further breakdowns as this continues I will seek to use "estimated" if all think that would work better. Statistically speaking, 259 respondents from the base 67,000 (which was a number I pulled from a two year old press release from the former CL owners online -- questionable, but it's the only one I could find. I would really, really, really love to have a better number) is valid as a sample group. This is what's known as a trend analysis, and there is a reason that anal is the first part of analysis. Since the repondents are not required to divulge additional information which enables you to break it down more effectively, the data itself is technically incomplete. A more sweeping survey would need to be done to determine a greater number of socioeconomic factors for a more accurate curve. However, I think more to your point is that this isn't really something you can use to make serious business decisions on -- I don't recommend it beyond possibly considering support such has Cris has done, but, to be frank, I'm not certain it will make much difference in the short term. Cris, the reason statistics work for large groups of people is because, as "groups" folks tend to behave in similar patterns expressed as commonalities. in other words, people who have similar situations, when acting as groups, tend to do the same thing, even though as indiviudals they may be utterly different. Folks don't particularly like that thought, but there's a pretty sizeable and incredibly effective marketing machine out there based on it. Not to mention insurance. Note, I am absolutely not trying to "prove" anything here. I just think it's cool. I didn't do this for market research puproses -- I did it because 1- I'm crazy and love doing this stuff for fun, and 2- I'm a total fangirl who just loves this stuff. Poser, DAZ, rosity -- the works. This stuff is just plain cool to me. I might bitch about one and whine about the other, but, in the end, I love it all. To get a good ratio that becomes a valid sample, you have to achieve a sort of pairity to where the number of people polled more or less is equivalent to the number of people they represent. In this case, that number worked out to be around 259. My initial guess was actually around 300 -- as I'd posted already. Note that there are some pretty startling differences between the Unadjusted and the Curve percentages. The curve percentage reflects as best as one can that "non-aggressive" user base. The typical curve for software tends to favor the immediate version prior more heavily than the current version, decreased according to the length of time between versions. I dropped a couple of curve tests for software in there. The one I ended up using was derived from some old photoshop data. There was one derived from OS data that might also have been applicable, but I thought the curve was more bellshaped -- the OS one added about a 15% deduction across the board and assigned it all to the P3 and earlier versions. And, lastly, it is important when looking at ANY list of statistics, to keep the error percentage in mind. The one noted here is pretty darn big. The analysis of the results, well -- that's for ya'll to argue about and throw eggs at me for :) hey -- I did flag it for violence...
thou and I, my friend, can, in the most flunkey world, make, each of us, one non-flunkey, one hero, if we like: that will be two heroes to begin with. (Carlyle)
LOL...ok, well, as long as you flagged it for violence.
I don't like statistics based on polls because I have been the victim of results of polls companies have done. I am of Latin American heritage and yet I fly in the face of most things companies claim I'm supposed to like or not like. And I don't feel I'm all that unique.
"Cris, the reason statistics work for large groups of people is because, as "groups" folks tend to behave in similar patterns expressed as commonalities. in other words, people who have similar situations, when acting as groups, tend to do the same thing, even though as indiviudals they may be utterly different. Folks don't particularly like that thought, but there's a pretty sizeable and incredibly effective marketing machine out there based on it. Not to mention insurance."
Sometimes, I think, this notion is more promotion than fact. Yes, people do things and behave in certain ways in large groups, but here, in the purchase and use of software, you really don't have group mentality because people don't purchase as a group. Martketing and forum opinion may sway some and not others. Most people don't even come to the forums or come only when they have a specific problem. But...we certainly see group mentality under certain situations in the forums, that is true. (BTW, the fact that the marketing machine is large and effective doesn't mean it right or good for us. W Just means the spin is working IMO.)
But, statistics, aside, it is interesting to see what people are using, of those responding.
Cris
Message edited on: 06/29/2004 03:34
My in-laws are all named Valdez, so I know the point you speak to. One of the things I dislike about broad statistical analysis based on ethnocentric elements is that it segments a group based on an assumption that the sub-culture dominates the metaculture -- that's bad sociology. It's also why I'm not teaching it somewhere -- seems bad sociology pays better most of the time. Fundamental tenet: sociology cannot predict what an individual will do. Nor are statistics a good way to live your life. And, most important of all, you said it wonderfully: ..."the fact that the marketing machine is large and effective doesn't mean it right or good for us...". and for which we can all be very thankful :) Thanks again for responding. :)
thou and I, my friend, can, in the most flunkey world, make, each of us, one non-flunkey, one hero, if we like: that will be two heroes to begin with. (Carlyle)
ynsaen.... It might be worth asking the Bryce and Vue communities as well. I know that there are a fair number of them that use Poser.
Message edited on: 06/29/2004 11:00
There are 10 kinds of people: Those who know binary, and those who don't.ย
Aย whiner is about as useful as a one-legged man at an arse kicking contest.
Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/homepage.ez?Who=ynsaen
thou and I, my friend, can, in the most flunkey world, make, each of us, one non-flunkey, one hero, if we like: that will be two heroes to begin with. (Carlyle)
Did you account for multiple entries, since this has been posted at several different sites, and people do not always use the same nick. yea know, CL has this information. Why are you collecting this data? You also realize that your numbers are completely off just for the fact that not everyone who uses poser uses the poser forums, schools, people who bought Metatools, metacreations, and never upgraded to P5 etc. I was told by my stat's freind if a poll is more than 4% plus or minus, the data is pretty much off (thats why on the news you rarely see greater than 4% in their polls). I don't mean to sound harsh, but you mention that it's not for marketting purposes in your post, yet you also have asked who would be interested in a poser 5 book, and this would fall within reason this poll, as well as the post in almost every poser site. what's goin on?
nothing's "going on", lol -- I just want to know :) I've already addressed the effective accuracy and covering unlisted users. News orgnaizations reduce that margin of error by using known curves and collecting ancillary data as well -- socioeconomic stuff like your location, gender, ethnicity, etc. I could ask those questions -- if it was that important and it was being used for demographic purposes. It's not. It's being used to get a decent sample of the basic poser user base and what versions they use. What's done with that is up to the parties involved :) yes, CL has this info. Care to ask them to share it? ;) This isn't for CL. This is for me -- and you, and anyone who happens to be interested. Since the book I'm writing deals with the features of Poser Artist and Poser 5 specifically, and that's a known element, the book doesn't even factor in, lol. The reason it's on the major sites is that I want to get as many folks as possible answering this. I mean, come on! lol Don't you wanna know? I'm a fangirl. I'm a sociologist. I happen to love this stuff becuase to me it's fun to sit here and look at them. yes, it's stupid. But hey -- I am ynsaen, ya'know :D
thou and I, my friend, can, in the most flunkey world, make, each of us, one non-flunkey, one hero, if we like: that will be two heroes to begin with. (Carlyle)
You know as well as I do that while many claim them as poser consperacys often they turn out to be somewhat true in the end. Just wanted clarification. "Don't you wanna know?" Actually, not really, I'm more interested in other poser related questions (I won't ask those here, would be OT and inappropriate to your thread). I am sure that in the end when you have talleyed your results there will be a lot of discussion especially about Poser 5 and the results). Thanks for the clarification :)
MachineClaw if it keeps ynsaen happy and out of trouble I don't see any problem in gathering this info, and ynsaen is such a good girl too. 8P grin I should have also told you ynsaen that I've still got P2 that I got from a cover disk years ago, although I've hardly used it 'cos I swore that with the trouble it gave me when trying to use it I'd never use Poser again, HA! how wrong I was. lol 8) Cris_Palomino I for one would be very pleased if you added P5 mats in future versions of your products, but in saying that I think you'll make me poor again. lol 8) And on another note I use P5 with Bryce, mainly doing my renders in Bryce, which is why I think the Turbo plug-in from DAZ is a wiz idea. 8) Catlin
noted! ;) Keep 'em coming folks -- Next stats update will be shortly after the weekend. I'm hoping to provide more breakdowns on the numbers for folks. And if anyone has a specific breakdown request, please post it as well.
thou and I, my friend, can, in the most flunkey world, make, each of us, one non-flunkey, one hero, if we like: that will be two heroes to begin with. (Carlyle)
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