"You say "no recoding = no innovation" - since when?"

new functionality doesn't "magically appear" either it's already there (and thus not new) or you code it.

You call it invention, I call it re-invention of what peeps like Ornlu but also me myself have already been doing for quite a while.

Controlling the strenght of the TA effect for each object sepeartely is nothing new, it's done by adjusting the ambient channels intensity.
The skin shader is nothing new, it's done by combining transparent color, blurry reflections and blurry transmissions.
The whole entire TA thing is nothing new! It's a button in the render options for christs sake!

Fact is, I see a render here, which ornlu could've made too...

No-one who claims to be inventive should ever have the arrogance to claim he/she does not need to look into other peoples work. Just remember that. Message edited on: 01/21/2005 05:43

Aye, something else we really need to discuss, Pumeco. This isn't your first image. In fact, thus far, you have ZERO images. And while other people like my friend Jocko are nearly as arrogant as me, at least they have A image to refer to. What's going on here is that you are just building off of other people's work. Note the model you are using? You didn't even make it. There is nothing innovative about this at all. There are a lot of things going on in this thread, but RayRaz is the only one who's fully called you out. Once again, I'm gonna have to agree with Drac on this topic : pro render sucks ass.

"You're probably expecting me to "pull-a-fit" and leave again aren't you - but no, I'm gonna have to dissapoint some of you because I'm not going to do that." I don't bother to make personal points... If you want to stay? then sure, go ahead and stay. We're not telling you to leave. I'm simply not taking pro-render, your definition of being inventive or your "marketing" seriously.

Gawd I hope we're not going to start into all this again. If it's not the Hot 20, then it's pro render :^( Being (lots) older than lsd and rr, I've seen plenty of people achieve pretty amazing things that I wouldn't have been capable of, and that I was sure they wouldn't be able to pull off. I've also known people who were foolishly self-confident, and got their ass in a sling. So at this stage of my life I'm quite prepared to believe that people can do what they say they can, until it's been proved otherwise. pumeco can either do what he says, or he can't. Bad-mouthing him isn't going to make the slightest difference to the outcome, and is pretty tiresome for everyone else.

@Rayraz

(POST 52)
lol, no, really "LOL"! - you really haven't grasped this yet, have you.

(POST 54)
"I'm simply not taking pro-render, your definition of being inventive or your "marketing" seriously."

-'raz, you already have.

@lordstormdragon

I'm not going to argue those Ornlu and "doing it already" type comments, because what you've been hinting at is egotistical. A simple suggestion might be to go and download the Ornlu equivalent - period (oops! where do I download that then?)

Stop dissing others that are "doing something about it", because I GUARANTEE, you'll fail miserably (I made my previous post in good faith, don't knock it).

As for the crab comment - I intend to IM Phil, and sort that type of comment. He deserves better than to be dragged through this in public, so it ain't gonna happen.

@pogmahone

I use Cinema for modelling mainly, but I like the Wings workflow better in a lot of respects. I suppose I could have both programs running simultaneously, and do a quick import/export (bring it into Cinema, delete a face, then bring it back into Wings).

I have to agree with Kemal, You and Ang25 would make for an interesting modelling thread thingy. But that sort of thing would probably do better in a thread at DAZ, because the thread always goes back to the front whenever it get's updated (nothing goes to waste).

(POST 52) lol, no, really "LOL"! - you really haven't grasped this yet, have you. There is a difference between a "creative solution" and "innovation.... (POST 54) "I'm simply not taking pro-render, your definition of being inventive or your "marketing" seriously." -'raz, you already have. If you find not being prepared to see pro-render as having anything new, not being prepared to see your pro-render renders as anything more special then the average TA experiment and not being prepared to pay a single penny for pro-render if (I'm not even willing to take the risk of using the word "when") it will ever come out to be "taking you seriously". Then, yes, I already have. And yes, in the beginning, I did. But the more I have to wait to see something truely new and the more I hear your thoughts about the whole thing, the more I feel you're either living in a self-sustaining illusion or you're a hoax. Either way, I do not find this to be any development worth getting my hopes up for. -- Ray (happy to wipe my ass with the PRO-RENDER Manual)

Yeah, that's really not a good idea dude - the manual's digital :-)

...interactive as well!!!

Ohhhhhhhhh - let's make this thread a nice round "60"!

I can still print the manual :P

Oh so you DO have a sense of humour then ;-) BTW we'll be accepting many payment types; -Cash -Cheque -Credit Card -Wire -In Kind (females only)!

why wouldn't I? ;-) so, if I waxed my legs, put on a bra stuffed with prints of the pro-render manual and wear a short skirt would I be allowed to pay in kind? :P

No,'fraid not dude, I might be twisted but I ain't dangerous :-P PS; Just got the IM, I'll send you the link as soon as PRO-RENDER'S ready to render :-) Patience my friend ;-)

Yup, self-sustaining illusions have PM capabilities too these days. Todays science sure amazes me sometimes

Oh that's ok. Dr.Rayraz sez I suffer from it as well :-) Len (still hoping to see that drac render).

dream on dude.. I'm so not a potential customer. Which drac render are you waiting for btw?

How do I buy Pro-Render? I didn't realize it was past the "beta" stage? I'd gladly pay a few dollars to see what it is you're doing differently. Hell, my work just bought Maya, not just for me to play with, but it's wonderful. I'm not certain they can afford your more advanced, more powerful rendering utility, but I'll run it by them, see what they say?

go lsd! lol

@Rayraz

Here ya go;

http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?ForumID=107&Form.ShowMessage=2083242

@lordstormdragon

That's real witty man, but you know not everyone can afford "Maya". That's one of the reasons why people ought to be pleased that PRO-RENDER is on the horizon. It can't do Bryce any harm, it can only be a good thing ;-)

So I can't buy it yet? Then this is all just promotional work? What else have you done with your new materials?

"So I can't buy it yet?" -Nope. "Then this is all just promotional work? What else have you done with your new materials?" -Actually no, believe it or not, this thread isn't promotional, it's a genuine WIP... ...or rather that's what it started out as - take a look, I never even mentioned "PRO-RENDER", I suppose my baby's just popular :-)

"take a look, I never even mentioned "PRO-RENDER", I suppose my baby's just popular :-)" post 3: once post 31: 5 times post 36: twice post 46: twice post 56: once post 64: once post 70: once post 72: once total: 14 times :)

Looks like it's my fault then. I just asked if it was pro-render. I'm not gonna keep track of this thread anymore, so let me know if anything interesting pops up.

@Rayraz I never mentioned "PRO-RENDER" in my original post, that's what I meant :-) @drawbridge Whether you get to read this or not, it's nobodys fault. And I'm MORE than gratefull you made your posts, and noted problems. As I've said before - I intend to IM you ;-)

Let's end the thread here, please :-)

since we're probably not gunna agree, I think that'd probably be best yea. I would still advice you to take a look at other peeps' experiences with this quest on getting professional render techniques, simulated or non-simulated, working inside bryce. Even if only for a wider perspective and inspiration.

Aye, I'll take the last laugh this time. (cackles!)

cool. :^P