I bet the eco system is very much a part of V5I... I did go back to e-on and study carfully the products and pricing... it looks like it's vue 5 pro that is modular, but of course with no eco-system... the problem too, is my own feeling that buying the full program means it may all work more smoothly than adding things onto an "older" version... I have no idea.... but in looking at the features list, it looks like I am STUCK with paying $600 or not, period.

I just wish I, as a vue 4 user, had some sort of price break... even just $100 off to upgrade to vue 5I, would help!!

I will NOT pre order, I will sit back now and wait to see how it all falls out, how folks like it, if e-on will consider a side grade from vue 4, etc... I will go post as much on the e-on site too, to make sure my "vote" is heard.

Message edited on: 02/01/2005 14:49

Lyne - "Vue 5 Pro studio" is just a name for a bundle made of Vue 5 and all the modules. You can get each module separately and add them to Vue 5.

but vue 5 pro will not have the eco-system... there is the way that e-on will get vue 5I purchases.. I did go post at e-on, where others are asking the same things... so hopefully..! I also posted over there, that it LOOKS like vue 5 I will import pz3's - so I don't need mover.... Ah well... I am going to go do some renders and relax.. :)

I think $150 for upgrade from Vue 4 Pro to Vue 5 Infinite is not a bad deal. If you compare it other packages, it is a lot more expensive. I recently did $500 for Lightwave 8.0 upgrade and $300 for Mojoworld Pro Upgrade - so $150 for V5I is a great deal. I think the features in V5I sound very high end - like some of features in Lightwave 8. I do like the fact that Newtek did give out a Lightwave 8.2 upgrade for free. One thing I really hope works, is the extra tree collections that I purchase. I purchase them and they will not load on Vue 4 Pro - I desire them to work with V5I - hoepfully even the new EcoSystem.

Lyne someone posted a question in the Vue forum at e-on site about a break for Vue 4 users and sbell told them to contact sells and they should be able to work something out. I feel like you may get a break if you will do that. :) If you have Vue 4 registered you can access the vue forum at e-ons site for more info.

I think $150 for upgrade from Vue 4 Pro to Vue 5 Infinite is not a bad deal. It's a fantastic deal. I am looking forward to spending the money. It'll be a worthwhile investment.

So what can we look forward to with V5I? A gallery full of treecovered panoramic landscapes...? Yawn. I'm very curious, meanwhile, about the memory issue - if no fix is yet available for OOM errors in V5E even in scenes under 1 mln polygons, how are they going to handle billions? No info on system requirements as yet...

So what can we look forward to with V5I? A gallery full of treecovered panoramic landscapes...? Yawn.

I'd say that things tend to be full of.....what they are filled with.

Whatever that might happen to be.........

BTW - I love endless 3D landscapes.....they tend to be filled up with trees. And little else.

I'd much rather drive thru the mountains & see endless miles of beautiful foliage than "drive" thru endless pics of NVIATWS. Of course, this is IMHO :)

"So what can we look forward to with V5I? A gallery full of treecovered panoramic landscapes...? Yawn" I would expect some of that, but the thing I've found to be the most interesting feature of Vue is how we find ways of doing things with it's features that they initially weren't intended for. I for one already envision a lot of other possibilities for this technology, and also look forward to propogating my landscapes with thousounds of trees, I think there's room for both. Happy Rendering!

The possibilites are endless. Action scenes - war/dance/ sporting. Neighborhoods with cities intertwined. Herds of animals. Fields of flowers. Car/boat/motorcyle races. The list is endless. This new technology sets up scenes in my mind, that I NEVER would have been to accomplish otherwise without mounds of postwork.

Of course, what you don't know is what sort of performance hit some of these new features will make. It's one thing to have a million trees in your scene, but another if it takes until doomsday to render the result. Just being cautious ...

Ecosystems allow much more than panoaramic landscapes covered with trees.

Think 'heaps', 'groups', 'columns', 'queues'...

• ant colonies
• asteroid fields
• cemetaries
• vehicles, traffic jams
• stampedes
• car races
• beaches full of people
• toy soldiers
• cities
• dumpsters

:)

Message edited on: 02/01/2005 17:08

Phantast, What I find encouraging..regarding sys specs. etc....is the animation over at E-ON was done with 512k of RAM. That alone has me hopefully :)

What exactly do they mean by "animated mesh"??? I use Cinema 4D - Which it will export to but not import from :-( -- So if I animate in C4D can I use the animation in Vue? What format?? Jim

I just gotta add my WHOOOOOOOOOOOOOAaaaa to this thread. When I read the feature list, I got goosebumbs. Still have em. The EcoSystem thing alone is more than I could've wished for. The illumination baking sounds very promising, too... especially if it can be done on a per object basis. Dang, sure hope my keyboard doesn't get shorted out from me droolin on it for the next 6 weeks. Way ta go, E-on!!!

Phantast: I definately hear you on being cautious, that (along with finances) is why I won't be ordering it until I hear for sure that this whole ecosystem is all that it touts itself to be in the system resource category. Dlk said it way back at the beginning of this post that Vue 5 Esprit right now has enough problems trying to do scenes that are in the tens of millions of polygons, and e-on is talking about 72 BILLION polygons for one of these ecosystem things, I will definately hold until I know for sure that it really does work on a 512mb system (and by work I don't mean "well, it doesn't crash, and you CAN render it, but it takes 4 months and you better not touch it while it does it's thing", I mean you can actually move things around in it without waiting five minutes for it to regenerate the whole scene for every millimeter you move the object :) But yes, very excited and hopeful and jittery (and yes, I think I felt goosebumps and hairchills somewhere along the line) at the thought of the new ecosystem feature :)

mm veritas, animated waves got my juices flowing to :) nah theres just so many improvements in infinite that its a borderline dream, hopefully this dream wont get riddled with bugs :)

Had to throw in my 2 cents worth of excitement - actually it's a lot more than that!! Infinite sounds incredible and I can't wait! I do wonder about system resources, but I'm building a new machine and can't wait to test drive the new software on the new hardware.

I am curious about hardware for usage with Vue. I currently have 1 Meg of memory on my machines. Is there any value to going to 2 meg on memory for Vue. FYI: Machine runing Vue 4 has the following.. I think currently hardware has stalled so I waiting for Dual cores. 3.2Ghz P4 HT - 1 Gig DDR400 GeForce 6800GT 320G harddisk plus 300G USB I been debating about getting a Dual CPU Xeon system ( hopefull with dual core - but that maybe not here this year ). I know Lightwave 3d will take advantage of more than 2 cpus, can Vue take advantage of more than 2 cpus - IE 4 cpus - a dual xeon system with HT, will have 4 logical cpus.

Holey Moley!another Captain Marvel fan. Fantastic news, Looking forward to seeing the first renderes with it.

The new eco-system functionality is awesome. Instant forests, crowds, herds, citys and suburbs... all in the same image... all interlaced. It's a huge breakthrough. Billion polygon renders that are memory friendly and fast to render. Yes, uses multi-processors (more than 2).

All I can say is "WOW!!" Ok, I can say a lil' more ... I read every single feature and am very impressed. Some of the stuff I have to say "It's about friggin' time!!", but it all makes me very happy. (I'm sure you're all sooo relieved! LOL!)

The new keyframing and rendering options finally put Vue into the Pro status in my book. I'll have to see how they are really implemented to say for sure, but it sounds like everything I, and other animators, have been asking for ... just crossing fingers and hoping it's more stable than previous releases. Sounds like they took steps in that arena as well.

Can't wait...

Well... I was one of "those" who said they would be waiting until Vue 5 Infinite shipped and was tested "by the masses." I would not be buying it until the initial bugs were worked out - if ever. Well... I'm eating my words. Looking at the images, animations and feature list... I already pre-prdered. Can't believe it but I did. Of course the $149 upgrade pricing kinda helped too! :) March 14th can't get here soon enough! Megalodon

I should be paying around $20 for mine thanks to some contest vouchers, so it's a no-brainer. But even without them, it's still pretty much a no brainer if you're upgrading.

Amazing # of polygons in very realistic image. At what resolution is this image and how long did it take to render?

Wow, very photorealistic ;) So that took what?...a few million years of creation and render time ;) On a more serious note, It'll be interesting to see if Vue's memory management / ecosystem technology will work with xfrog trees, so we really CAN recreate that scene!

There will always be limits and trade-offs with what you can do depending on your memory, CPU and the size/type of objects in your scene. An ecosystem with 1000 Vue trees will be a lot more diverse and light on your system than the same scene with 1000 xfrog trees.

fantastic work rodluc, as mentioned a rendertime of a few million years is alittle to much for most people and computers :).

Vue enables you to create landscapes that you'd never be able to photograph. Because those landscapes previously only existed in your mind. And you won't have to wait "several million years" for the result.

Maybe we could get a global rendering network to split it up, maybe get it down to a few thousand years instead? :) Agiel: Oh yeah, I know, there are always limits, and eon definately has my vote as far as memory management goes, I've tried out a few other programs and most can't even come close to handling the sheer number of polygons that Vue does. And you're definately right about a vue forest being more diverse, it would just be nice to have a decent pine tree that can be spread out like eon shows it's maples being spread out like. The environments I want to create are dominated mostly by conifers and frankly Vue's christmas tree style "fir tree" just doesn't cut it, even using the editor it's just not what I'm looking for.

I cannot afford $600.00 yet so I will upgrade my version 4 to version 5 and I hope I will upgrade to Infinite later because I WANT IT.

"Pre-animated meshes as a feature? It is listed further down the page as relates to Vue 5."

Oh yeah, don't know how I missed that, and you can use them in ecosystems. If there's some way to control their behaviour in an ecosystems, that's the most fantastic feature there.

"I mean you can actually move things around in it without waiting five minutes for it to regenerate the whole scene for every millimeter you move the object :)"

I very much doubt that you will be able to move any individual object within an ecosystem, just define a set of rules for distribution.

As far as memory use goes, e-on must (at last) have adopted the notion of instantiation for such huge arrays to work. Consider this; a Vue maple averages 44,000 polys, if we take it that those polys are triangular and defined by 3 x 3 x 32 bit numbers per poly that gives around 510k for the geometry, on top of that around 1k is probably needed for a descriptor containing: name, translations, material, visibility, etc. An instance of that tree (i.e. an exact copy), even translated rotated and scaled, can be repesented in 40 bytes. Take it further and a group of instances can be instanced for a similarly small overhead.

Of course it still has to get rendered though...

I'm still at Vue 4.2. I know Vue 5 will run on this old box of mine, but what kind of hardware do you need to run this latest version of Vue 5 Infinite? I can't afford to buy software and machines....so I'm actually thinking I might just wait for a about a year.....get a new computer and by then Vue 5 infinite might be more affordable :)

Pre-animated meshes I still don't understand this. What formats beyond Poser can be pre-animated? Jim

Apparently E-on is going to be providing pre-animated mesh objects through the Cornucopia-3D store they are working on. The show reel for Vue 5 had an example, in the very low res figure walking along the sidewalk. That wasn't a Poser figure, but something else native to Vue 5 & Vue Infinite. As it had a very unfinished look to it, I would guess that E-on provided it to Phoul expressly for the purpose of showing the basic functionality, with more to come.

Dale_B, don't you have the guy in question (Dave) in your Vue 5 object library? I do.

Dale B: Thanks I have Cinema 4d R9, Rhinoceros 3, and LightWave 8.2. Hopefully one of those will work! What is the Cornucopia Store???? Jim

The store won't be up for possibly a couple months.

That wasn't a Poser figure, but something else native to Vue 5 & Vue Infinite. Interesting.

Attached Link: Pre Animated Meshes

Hell, I'm impressed by those features in Vue Infinite... and I'm a hardened bryce user. That ecosystem thing looks soooooo very interesting (let alone texture baking) :)

welcome onboard flak :) and yep v5I sure is impressive looking nothing wrong with bryce, but if you have the money i think its time to move over :P

Hmph! So I do! I haven't gone poking about in the libraries all that much, being too busy hammering away at the PoserVue end of things. Looks like I should...

Thanks war2... I regularly cruise through this forum in stealth-lurk-mode as a few of the technique things can be used in both bryce and Vue with small adjustments, but when I hit this thread I left some drool. Just cleaning up now ;) edit - yeah 600$ is a pretty steep hit for a hobby, but it sure looks like it would be an interesting hit.

Message edited on: 02/03/2005 06:50

Attached Link: Complete List of features

With all the complex new features in Vue Infinite I am hoping e-on will give us a couple new pine trees that will work with the Ecosystem. The one lonely pine has been around for ever and I never did think it made for a good looking forest. :) I would like to hear some info on memory management also. :)

yeah 600$ is a pretty steep hit for a hobby I've know people to spend $50,000 to $75,000 on a bass boat. I've also known audiophiles to drop $35,000 on a high-end stereo system. And not bat an eye in the process.

I have a neighbor who spends more money on his car as a 'hobby' than he does on his house :)