I was just wondering if anyone has ever produced a normal run/jog with the Walk Designer? I have yet to see anyone do it without the now-common RIGHT LEG JERK. In fact, just doing the default walk from the WD produces not-so-perfect results. I would love to know if ANYONE has every gotten the Walk Designer to work properly? I have talked to Curious Labs tech about this, and they do seem to be aware of the problem but could not offer a real solution. Does anyone out there have one (a soluton thatis)? Other than using canned BVH files, of course. I have talked about this with several people in the Renderosity community and they have the same problems. Has anyone experienced anything different/positive? -Tim

Yes, I have a solution. The first thing you do is close Walk Designer and never-ever use it again. Next open the Animation Controlls at the bottom of the screen and start animating!

I played around with Walk Designer way back when I first got Poser 3. I haven't touched it since. It will only help you to produce buggy, repetative walk/run/stagger motions...it will not help you to learn how to animate.

I know this wasn't the kind of answer you were looking for (and of course it's not the only answer) but I hope this helps.

JK: Well, at least you made me laugh after reading the first line. Yes, that's pretty much the conclusion I have come to. I have had a few people CLAIM to have successfully used the WD in the past, but either never produced any proof, or posted a really crummy animation. I know how to animate ... unfortunately, walking/running is just about the hardest thing you could possibly try to animate ... IMHO. Also, I'm in the process of making a full-length featurette (we're in pre-prod now with a few rough-cuts done, the script was a year and a half in the making) and so "hand-animating" every jog, run and walk is out of the question. I have LifeForms now, but getting a Poser compatible bone character out of it is almost as frustrating as WD. Thanks for your "support" ;-) -Tim

I have found I am able to animate walks, runs, jogs very convincingly "by hand." The best part about doing it that way, is your character is ready to respond to the environment around it and you are not "animating" (if you can call what you do in WD animating) in a vacume. If you pay attention to the way we move around in real life, we never just walk in a straight (or even Bezier curved) line with constant repedative movements at a constant rate. We are always slowing down, speeding up, turning corners, nodding to friends, opening doors, sidestepping on-comming traffic, etc. Whatever you get out of Walk Designer will either be of limited use or produce a very boring movie.

LifeForms, IMO, is an unneccessary and frustrating extra step. You can do everything you need to do right in Poser.

BTW, what is a full-length featurette? I think that's an oximoron.

Thanks for the pep-talk, and I would tend to agree with you. But there are times when you want JUST a standard jog or run. A five second sequence of a dude running is not going to be observed as being a repetative motion. But yes, canned walks or runs throughtout a movie WOULD be boring. Full-length featurette ... does sound like an oxymoron. But just saying featurett -- in the animation world -- implies a 5-10 minute (or less) sequence. This puppy is around 40 minutes (based on script length and compensating for cuts), so it not a full-length feature either. Maybe we need to come up with another name, eh? -Tim PS> A trailer should be playing at a "web site near you" by the end of the year or Q1 2002. We'll probably throw a rough-cut trailer out there sometime this summer ... I HOPE!

There are a few BVH's around if you look hard enough, or if you have Character Studio there's a bunch included with it that work in Poser. Daeve

Daeve: Thanks, but I have a boatload of BVHs. Although I forgot about the ones included in Character Studio ... thanks for the tip. -Tim

I tried the automatic animation ONCE, animating a rapid extension of the right arm (simple straight thrust). I never intend to use it again.

Not sure what you mean by the "automatic animation" ?? Are you talking about a BVH file, or a pose set, or what? -Tim

The animator doodad--where you can set up a few "critical" frames and have Poser do the betweening. YUCK!

That's not automatic animation, Dogface, that IS animation. Well, that's what computer animation is. For a quick thrust you may want to switch your keyframes from spline to linear. You can do that in the animation palet. That means your motion is going to travel in straight lines from your first keyframe A to B and then another straight line from B to C. Spline animation on the other hand, will give you a curved line that travels from A through B to C. A bezier curve basically. You use Spline for graceful, flowing movements and Linear for direct, definitive movements.

timoteo1, don't misread what I am telling you as "support" or "pep-talks," it's more "tough-love." In the time it takes to work out the kinks of these "short-cuts" you could have animated five good scenes. Get to work already!

A 40-minute movie? Here in Hollywood we call those "short films."

Attached Link: http://www.poserstore.com

PD, I think you and I have been through this before. Yours are jogging in place. Jogging (walking, running, etc.) in place is useful for VERY few shots. Unless someone knows of a way to apply a pose set pr BVH to a walk path? IS there a way?? The P4 manual does not seem to indicate that there is. -Tim

Dogface: Ditto, that IS animation ... keyframe animation. We would be lost without it ... what could be easier? For a custom animation that is, of course. What gets complicated is tweaking it so that it looks realistic. For people just doing "casual animating," you can get a lot done just posing, move down the timeline, posing, and on and on. JK: Oh, I definetley got the tough love aspect of it. Yeah, I guess it is a bordeline film short. What happens if it comes in a 30 minutes instead 40 ... what is it considered then? -Tim

A short film is anything that is anywhere from 1 second to 80 minutes. It doesn't even have to be on film anymore.

If you have a running-in-place animation, all you have to do is move the BODY of the figure on each keyframe so that it moves at the same pace as it jogs/runs.

Gotcha. Or the hip, right? But with a BVH, and other canned motion that's a HECK of a lot of keyframes. Would this work: Select all the keyframes for the body and delete them, then add a key frame for body position at the start position, and then one at the end of the animation for end position? Naturlly you'd have to have enough "cycles" to make sure it didn't look like he was sliding. But would that not work? -Tim

I would not keyframe the hip for actual distance movement, because you don't want to get those type of keyframes mixed up with any bending, twisting, side-tot-side movement your hip is doing. Best to keep that seperate incase you have to go back and delete keyframes.

Tim, what you are saying will probably work just fine. Some run or jog animation have the character moving faster in the first part of the cycle than in the second part of the cycle and those type of animation will take more keyframing for the overall movement. But generally if you find the correct distance for your end point, your jog/run/walk will look fine.

If you are really in a rush, you can always shoot the jogger from below, at an angle where you can't see the ground, and you will never see any sliding (even if its there). :)

Hope this helps.

JK: Thanks for tips ... and ah, yes ... aren't camera angles a wonderful thing. In fact, I suppose I could use the WD and position the camera so you just don't see that blasted right leg. Unfortunately, as you know, I'm going to need some OTHER angles. Thanks again. -Tim

If the machine does the betweening, it's a form of automation. Hence, "automated animation". It's only not automated if the animator does every frame.

But I still don't have a clue as to why you hate key-frame animating then? If you take a figure's arm that is straight out from its body (perpendicular) at frame 001, and then jump to frame 030 (1 second) and position it so it is by his side (parellel), you're telling me you'd rather do each individual key frame (30 in all!) just to have his arm move to his side, when the computer could produce the exact same (if not better) results in about 1/100 of the time? I don't get it, why would you want to animate this way? Confused, Tim

Because key-framing with Poser can't do a proper lunge worth beans. Every frame has to be adjusted to avoid unnecessary and unwanted motion inserted by the computer and/or insert motions that the computer doesn't. Might as well just do it all myself. Tell you what, you buy me the $50,000 system and software and I'll sing the praises of keyframing to the stars. Anything that I can do better by hand is not as good as what I do by hand.

I'm NOT trying to be confrontational or rude, but it sounds to me like you're criticising a piece of software for which you have not fully mastered. The complaint you are making is a common one among novice Poser users who only use spline mode (instead of a combination of spline, linear, constant, break-splines.) Also most people don't even realize there is a POWERFUL Graph pallete part of the program. I own and use Character Studio for Max (and a few other figure animation tools) and believe me when I tell you, Poser is INFINTELY easier to use, and you can get similiar or superior results. Poser can't do everything, but it does what it was designed to do VERY well ... IF you take the time to learn how to use it properly. -Tim

BTW, what type of lunge are your trying to do? Are you talking about a fencing lunge, or just a guy lunging forward or what? I'm up to the challenge, as I'm sure JK is as well. Tell me what you're trying to do and I'll see if I can accomplish it with minimal TWEAKED keyframes. -Tim