I just wanted to say something, I will continue to support Apollo Maximus where ever he goes because he is an excellent alternative to a lot of the other male figures out there.  I am saddened by this whole turn of events and I hope that new Apollo characters and clothing will continue to be developed and that he simply doesn't fade out of existance. 

I deeply regret joing Content Paradise.  I am not interested in the new line of Asian figures, while well crafted I don't usually use Asian characters in my renders.  Nothing against them personally, just a matter of taste.  The other CP only content is of little interest to me currently, I perfer Daz products to those native items though I do support and buy from merchants here and on Runtime DNA and Renderotica. 

I will have to check Anton's website for future developments.  If Anton reads this good luck with whatever you do.  You've always been kind to me on the forums in the past.

Does anybody know what happened to cause Anton to leave?  Or is it all behind the scenes stuff?

Ironically I'm on the other side of the coin with regards to Daz/CP.  I find the new figures at CP much easier and more rewarding to use, but each to their own.

I never got Apollo, not something that appealed, but it looked like a great model nonetheless.

Anton explained the situation a day or two ago, here in this forum. If you search for "Anton" you'll probably be able to find it. He isn't discontinuing Apollo, just moving. Details were in his  recent post

maybe, in addition to his own sites, anton could sell him at 'rotica I recall they used him in alotta renders there. I dunno how diane or IB or legume feel about it, admittedly.

Quote - He isn't discontinuing Apollo, just moving.

Moving where?  Seems like all of his bridges are burned.

He and Daz are on the outs.

Poser Pros is Daz.

Not sure what happened with RDNA.

He blew off Content Paradise.

Not sure what happened with Renderosity.

No where else really to go in the Poser community that has much traffic.

Sometimes in life we learn that it's  necessary  to make concessions in order to get the best possible position for ourselves.  I fear with Anton though,  that it's his way all the way or the highway and no meeting in the middle.  Which is unfortunate and is the reason that Apollo is now homeless.  You can't go around burning your bridges because eventually you get stranded and have no where to go :(

First of all I want to say: Apollo is a GREAT character. I really like him. He's innovative in so many ways!

but...

well...

I'll probably buy stuff for Apollo that other people have made, as it's not their fault/problem how Anton behaves.

I will, however, not buy anything from the creator before he has at LEAST acknowledged that he was in the wrong. It would suit him to actually apologise but that's just not likely to happen as he's 110% convinced that he as right and the rest of us are blind, drug-addicted trolls that just won't admit it.

Boycotts actually work. They worked on Shell, McD, France, SouthAfrica...you name it...

I really have been meaning to get apollo,  and will once he is here ( anton says that he has been talking to clint but the file size is an issue that has to be worked out or something very similar).

About Clark,  he is a pale comarison to even teh p4 dork,  and I do not think that i would use him even if he was free.  I truly like James though, and use the RR versions of Daz's characters just cause they are easier but Yuki is still my favorite character :)

I have a strong belief in the concepts and functionality of Apollo. I don't think we've seen a fraction of the full potential of this model, or what could be achieved in a female version with those ideas.

As with any figure that is released, further development expands its usability and creates ever more versatility - Capsces Cole morphs represents one of the stronger products that did appear quite early on for him, and there have been great textures and poses - I only wish there was more of such quality.

I too think the events of the past week have played out very badly for Apollo and Anton. In my laymans observations of anything that has a public face, there is always a lot more that goes on behind the scenes that ultimately influences the turn of events - business and personal relationships, personalities and histories and all that stuff.

In the end, as more of a consumer of 3d content than anything else up to now, my main concern is doing the projects for which I got into Poser in the first place. I identified Apollo as having all the potential elements I was looking for in a male figure (incidentally the same ideals that e-frontier used to use to market the default P6 Jessie and James -  that with them you could make just about any human character you could imagine - They don't use that ideal any more).

Apollo comes closest to those ideals anyway IMO, far more so than any of the Daz figures - different approach really I guess, but one that really makes sense to me.

I'm pretty sure there will be further products in the near future. I've been developing a lot of different character types for my own work using Cole, and I have been considering putting these up either as freebies (as I've done with a few ADS poses for default Apollo) or for sale - not quite sure which yet.

I truly hope we haven't seen the last of this great figure or it's creator. I'd lay money on the fact that if they both did suddenly fall off the scene, someone else would step in very quickly with a similar idea or approach. JMO

Apollo is the best male character I've seen to date and I hope he resurfaces and is supported.  Anton may or may not have been right about Clark, there certainly were large coincidences but the only person who knows for sure is the person who made him.  Everyone else is just guessing or expressing an opinion and that is all. 
Anton by going public the way he did definitely did not handle this the right way however but not being perfect myself and having handled certain things in the wrong way before myself, I'm certainly willing to cut the guy a break.

My opinion....fwiw
I don't own Apollo, but even if I did, I would not consider that Anton or anyone else owes me an apology. I don't get that point at all. He had a decision to make and he made it. It's not up to me to judge him for that decision, and that's especially true since I don't know all the details of what went down, nor, I hasten to add, should I.

I wish him great good fortune.

Q

Apollo will definitely never find a home in my runtime.

Not just because of the behaviour of his creator, but mainly because I find the concept of multiple bodyparts and simplistic geometry to be a great step backwards from the realism and useability what we already gained.

I sincerely hope that DAZ and E-Frontier will keep their philosophy of doing detailed meshes that are easy to work with and straightforward cr2´s without any posing gimmicks.

So sorry, but in my Runtime the rule is:

:biggrin: :biggrin:  :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin:

And just for the record, I REALLY don´t mind if someone thinks that a mesh that can stretch like Mr Fantastic is the next best thing to sliced bread,  but please, why can´t you just use and enjoy him silently, just like the majority of M2, M3, D3, Don and Dork users do ?

Stahlratte

Carodan, I don't know how quickly we're likely to see another product like Apollo Maximus.

Creating something like that requires both a great deal of artistic skill and a great deal of technical proficiency.  Not many people have both of these qualities, in even moderate amounts.

Plus, as we have seen, even if you sweat and labor to produce a superior product in this market, there is no guarantee it will be snapped up or that your efforts will be rewarded. Quite the opposite. In fact, there are a couple of rules that seem to hold true in the tech industry generally:

• Marketing muscle trumps product quality nearly every time.
• The best prisons are not built with iron bars and stone walls, but with backwards compatibility.

If I had the skill and technical chops to duplicate the kind of work Anton did, I wouldn't do it, seeing the problems he's had. I'd feel that way even if there was no threat of skullduggery by existing vendors!

Maybe you're right Jimdoria. Maybe Apollo is just too sophisticated to be recreated too soon.

I might tend to agree that some of Apollo's mesh is light in places. There are advantages and disadvantages to this depending on your project requirements.

Quote - because I find the concept of multiple bodyparts and simplistic geometry to be a great step backwards from the realism and useability what we already gained.

Stahlratte

Uber dense mesh doens't equal high quality, a useable mesh = high quality. Just cause some vendors think that a 3 time subdivide is better then say a 2 times subdivide is bettter doesn't make it so.  From what I have seen ( and again I state that I DO NOT HAVE apollo) from apollo renders and the absolute sheer differences that the character can achive is mind boggling, I would like to see you make m3 into a baby and animate him straight to an old man, seriously, if you do and can then come back and show us all.  Till then I will continue to count my pennies for apollo.  That is the mark of a top quality figure.

I agree odeathoflife
Give me a responsive lower res mesh than a bloated hi-res mesh any day.

"It's not the "number" of polygons,but rather the "shape" that is important."
Anton told me that once and as I've tried to create my own characters,I can see he is right about that.

Tom

Today Renderosity recinded all recent and previous offers for me to have a store here. Apollo will be retired and I am leaving the community. New info is at my site.

I leave angered and resentfrul at merchants like ernyoka, members like Acadia, and store people like JenyK

To railroad and troll and to ignore it and pretend it isn't happening is despicable. So the combined Poser stores, witho their secrets and intigues have managed to squeeze me out. COngratulations but at least they had to band together, if even in secret and over years to do it.

"TOS" means "To obey silently"

I leave with my honesty, my convinctions and zero respect for a level of commnity wide corruption I happily leave behind.

To my supports I thank them and wish you well in life. To those that sat silent over years and sites, I abhore you. To the mentally ill that now run our forums, well you wou;dn't understand anyway.

Goodbye,

Anton

PS: DOn't bother sending me IM's and email now with silent support. I am sorry but the anger I have over such lack of honesty is not capable of ebing expressed.

Well wish you well, and I wish that I got Apollo before.

 SHIT.

oh. more drama.
yawn

Well, that's truely ashame Anton.  I will miss Apollo, and you... for a couple hours anyway then I'll move on.  You've taken a really good thing and needlessly killed it for no real valid reason at all.

And by quitting like this all you've done is hurt yourself, no one else.  May I suggest you get some councelling and maybe some anger management therapy, then once you've cooled off try rethinking your decision.  Life's simply too short for this crap to destroy your work over.

Very sad news indeed.

I wish you all the best for the future, Anton. 

I've found you to be incredibly helpful and supportive in the short time that I've known you. Only sorry that it was toward the end of your Poser career.

Apollo still rocks as far as I'm concerned.

Quote - Today Renderosity recinded all recent and previous offers for me to have a store here. Apollo will be retired and I am leaving the community. New info is at my site.

I leave angered and resentfrul at merchants like ernyoka, members like Acadia, and store people like JenyK

To railroad and troll and to ignore it and pretend it isn't happening is despicable. So the combined Poser stores, witho their secrets and intigues have managed to squeeze me out. COngratulations but at least they had to band together, if even in secret and over years to do it.

"TOS" means "To obey silently"

I leave with my honesty, my convinctions and zero respect for a level of commnity wide corruption I happily leave behind.

To my supports I thank them and wish you well in life. To those that sat silent over years and sites, I abhore you. To the mentally ill that now run our forums, well you wou;dn't understand anyway.

Goodbye,

Anton

PS: DOn't bother sending me IM's and email now with silent support. I am sorry but the anger I have over such lack of honesty is not capable of ebing expressed.

So not getting into the mudslinging fest of THAT thread or any other thread deserves nothing but being loathed and stomped on? Nice way of treating supporters :crying: kitty5

Be happy. Mediocrity will soon prevail. Just a few more sharp edges to dull down.

:sad:

Well put.

Quote - I will, however, not buy anything from the creator before he has at LEAST acknowledged that he was in the wrong. It would suit him to actually apologise but that's just not likely to happen as he's 110% convinced that he as right and the rest of us are blind, drug-addicted trolls that just won't admit it.

Boycotts actually work. They worked on Shell, McD, France, SouthAfrica...you name it...

Why should he apologise or acknowledge he was wrong when he thinks he is right? I said it elsewhere and repeat over here, I do not think he is going to make up something just for fun. I would not apologise either if I made a statement that I believe is right only because other people think I'm wrong.

Well this stinks because I just got Apollo as a gift and bought stuff for him. Why yank a good product because you are angry at another merchant??? This doesn't make any sense. And why did renderosity rescind their offer for Apollo? It's not like all the merchants work in a big office together and there might be a fist fight...

Quote - PS: DOn't bother sending me IM's and email now with silent support. I am sorry but the anger I have over such lack of honesty is not capable of ebing expressed.

I don't understand this. You sent two e-mails to me. I wrote back expressing some personal (and sincere) words of support after reading about your decision to leave the community in those e-mails. I had no idea that you had asked people NOT to send supportive messages because I hadn't seen this posting yet. I don't understand why you would reject what support you still have at this point. There was certainly no dishonesty in what I expressed to you. I chose not to dive into the Renderosity threads on Clark and Apollo, because as an enthusiastic owner of both meshes, I wanted to see how things played out, and did not want to get into the ugliness. I won't accept that there was anything dishonest about my message or how I chose to convey it. If you send an e-mail to someone's private e-mail address, a private reply is normal, not cowardly or dishonest. Perhaps I've misunderstood your words as quoted, but ... I just don't get it.

i don't think he should apologise for what he thought happened re the clark model...not in public anyway, but he did accuse a lot of people of some not so nice things. all because they didn't agree with him. i think maybe an apologee or two in that respect would be in order. sometimes even if i don;t think people are right i offer an apologee. it a way of showing no malice was meant. i think those in the cat forum can atest to what i say lmao. whatever. it seems everyone loved apollo no matter their opinions about what went on here. that something anton will always have.

i will say that i can't understand why people who commit or attempt suicide leave notes.

billy

I've stated elsewhere that I don't think it's likely Anton will apologize for thinking Clark is a copy, because he DOES believe in it, and believes he's right.

But his conduct in the thread, not especially against me but towards some other people... well... That's what has made me not want to deal with it anymore.

I'm sorry Anton feels resentful against me, that just shows how he's hearing what he wants to hear and not what people are actually telling him...

Anton is not my enemy. I have always and will always admire him as a great modeler, and I truly love Apollo and I'm saddened to see him yanked for no valid reason.

When someone takes his toys and leaves the other kids.. who is it hurting the most?

But his conduct in the thread, not especially against me but towards some other people...

His conduct towards others may not have been exemplary in that thread, but the conduct of some others towards him hasn't been all that nice  and exemplary either.  One of the first comments was that he had made this up to destroy a competitor's reputation, it wasn't considered that maybe he was convinced that he was right and was just trying to warn others.  Because it was Anton it had to be some evil scheme of his...

Apollo's retirement is a loss to everyone in the Poser community because there are very few alternatives out there.  I agree that computer hogging unimesh figures aren't the answer to everyone's needs.  Were Poser actually able to handle the memory demands of modern systems it would be okay, but in it's current code it doesn't.  The texture maps are what really imbues a figure with life.  If you look at any of the figures without their skin you will see a mere charicature of a human being that no one could possibly find "real" looking.  I'm all about diversity and the more artists produce viable Poser figures the more options 3D artists will have for their pictures, morphs have certain limits that can't address this alone.

All I can say is two words for the public announcement: Drama Queen.

And here I almost bought the upgrade at CP when it was $20. Had more pressing matters at the time that I had to deal with. Guess I'm SOL now.

David

QUOTE: "I'm all about diversity and the more artists produce viable Poser figures the more options 3D artists will have for their pictures, morphs have certain limits that can't address this alone."

A mesh is a mesh is a mesh....

...and you can give it any shape you want, not just the few that DAZ puts into their morph sets.

Look at As Shanims KIELO and ernyoka1´s GEEZER to see that we haven´t even scratched the surface of the Unimesh´ abilities yet.

http://market.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=42866

http://market.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/index.php?ViewProduct=35684

Stahlratte

Well, I too am sorry to see Apollo consigned to a premature burial... um, "retired". I was glad to see an alternative to the DAZ way be put forth, and when he was released I'd hoped it was the beginning of a good trend. It seems like a very technically sound product. Pity I'll never get to try it now.

And the next time I see some economist claiming that buyers and sellers in the market always act based on rational self-interest, I'm sending them a link to this forum!

Quote - I leave angered and resentfrul at merchants like ernyoka, members like Acadia, and store people like JenyK

Ummm? Thanks for singling me out there Anton!  In case you hadn't noticed I've been one of your supporters ever since I came to this community. I even over looked the slam you and Machine made against me not so long ago.  Perhaps you've also forgotten how many times I've sent you PM's offering you my support and encouragment and telling you to ignore the trolls on the boards who were trying to get under your skin, the very latest of which was the day before yesterday.

Quote - To railroad and troll and to ignore it and pretend it isn't happening is despicable. So the combined Poser stores, witho their secrets and intigues have managed to squeeze me out. COngratulations but at least they had to band together, if even in secret and over years to do it.

I know this might be hard for you to see and accept, but the only person responsible for squeezing you out of the main stores, is you.  I only know you from our few talks in PM and from how I see you conduct yourself on the boards.  I like you Anton, and I respect you as a person and deeply admire your talent.  However, I spend enough time on these boards and others to know that you aren't  exactly the easiest person to deal with when it comes to business.

My post above was not a slam against you. It was an observation and restatement of facts that are widely known.  You haven't exactly been secretive about what's been going on with your store ventures or misadventures; quite vocal really.  There has been an "incident" with every store you have been associated with that has resulted in you leaving, and slamming the door behind you in the process.

You have amazing talent in your craft. Absolutely amazing. I was so surprised to find that so many of the items that I see around the poser community, and that I have in my own library were created by you.  However, modelling talent aside, you lack in the ability to market your wares without offending for some reason. 

EF gave you an amazing opportunity to get Apollo out there and into so many hands, but instead of trying to work through the initial bumps, you break your agreement with them and leave after a few weeks. Now Apollo is homeless, retired and seemingly so are you.

Quote - I leave with my honesty, my convinctions and zero respect for a level of commnity wide corruption I happily leave behind.

Despite your misdirected hatred and animosity I still call you "friend". > Quote - To the mentally ill that now run our forums, well you wou;dn't understand anyway.

I thought you of all people who hated being slammed or picked on, would know better than to say something like that.  Some people here have been your friend and alia and you repay them by calling them mentally ill?  Nice :(

Quote - PS: DOn't bother sending me IM's and email now with silent support.

I wouldn't dream of it.  I had offered you my shoulder and my support and encouragment many times over the months. It seems to me that you are the one being dishonst here. I now find out that you consider me your enemy?

Quote - I am sorry but the anger I have over such lack of honesty is not capable of ebing expressed.

I have been nothing but honest. It's you who have been otherwise.

Ok, here I am.

Beat the hell outta me.

As you do, some comments:

1 - I did consider that Anton believed what he claimed. In point of fact, when I looked at the meshes, I went above and beyond what he provided, and I looked hard.  Becuase it was anton, and while I might not be the greatest fan of his historic behavior, I am a huge fan of his work. The two concepts are disassociated, however, for me. I believed there were going to be issues. I expected them.  I hunted for them. Hard.  And I did not find them.

2 - Anton did more deleting of posts in that hell thread than the mods here did.

3 - Anton's historic behavior, if you are not familiar with it, is the reason these suppostions were made.  The same way that people will, forever, assume that I exist solely to torment others in times of pain. I don't make them lightly, nor without consideration and examination of details from many sources.

4 - I am not the reason Apollo is not available anymore.  I do not have any influence over the conduct or decisions of the administration of this site. My editorializing of the situation was only as influential as it was taken by those that read it. I think apollo is a great figure, and said so several times. And I believe support for him should continue, regardless of availability.

5 - Note carefully that Anton did not apparently single me out in his message. Also, note that the message as posted above was not the original one posted on his site:

"Today Renderosity recinded all recent and previous offers for me to have a store here. Apollo will be retired and I am leaving the community. New info is at my site. I leave angered and resentfrul at merchants like ernyoka, members like Acadia, and store people like JenyK To railroad and troll and to ignore it and pretend it isn't happening is despicable. So the combined Poser stores, witho their secrets and intigues have managed to squeeze me out. COngratulations but at least they had to band together, if even in secret and over years to do it. "TOS" means "To obey silently" I leave with my honesty, my convinctions and zero respect for a level of commnity wide corruption I happily leave behind. To my supports I thank them and wish you well in life. To those that sat silent over years and sites, I abhore you. To the mentally ill that now run our forums, well you wou;dn't understand anyway. Goodbye, Anton PS: DOn't bother sending me IM's and email now with silent support. I am sorry but the anger I have over such lack of honesty is not capable of ebing expressed."

6 - Anton does not need to apologize. It would be nice if he did, but that's not a need.

And, Lastly, if Anton really does believe all of this, he will do what he should have done in the first place: file claim. ANd I don't mean with Rosity, I mean in a court of law. It is not as expensive as some think, and those costs can be recouped from the loser. 

THese types of "events" should never be played out in the forums.  Ever. For any reason.  Complaints should be brought to the stores in private, should be investigated, the stores should be allowed to decide, and then, after all of that is done, a posting should be made stating facts as simply and as directly as the statement made in this case, and locked. People do deserve to know when there is an infringement. They do not need to have the opportunity to create a 750+ post thread about it.

beat away.

To bad that Apollo was removed from cp etc. I rather liked the character. I hope Anton puts up hi own store, and sell's his stuff there. That way he does not have to put up with all the stuff going on at various poser store sites.

Well... I sat back and watched.... man was it all crazy... but anyway.. I'm sure I'll continue to support Apollo with textures.. It's not a big $ making thing but hey... it doesn't hurt me to spend my free time in a postive way by learning the ins and outs of Photoshop and my ancient version of Deep Paint.  Actually I have something in the works, that is, if I can get my face model to ever show up! haha! 

Things come, things go, the same with people but you can't stop living your life because of it.   Yes Apollo may be gone but in the immortal words of Zulema from Project Runway "I don't care if you cry and cut, but you need to cry and cut. Don't stop and cry."  So keep on cutting ya'll.....

btw.. looking for an artzone invite.. !!  anyone? {{crickets}} hellooo? {{crickets}}

Interesting...

I got an invite!!! Thanks!

Attached Link: The offer is still good

Well shoot Usslopez, just ignore the PM I sent ya. If I'd scrolled down I'd have seen you got your invite. Just so everyone knows I wasn't hitting on you in PM, even if you are cute, I was saying I had 10 invites available for Artzone.

Thanks Mizrael..!  and for the complement too (insert "awe shucks" blushing smiley here)

I got an invite from xoconostle but I couldn't log in anyways ... maybe it'll work later..  it just takes me to the start page... 

Thanx xoco!

Brilliant, creative geniuses are usually temperamental. I think Anton's vast contributions to this community should have bought him lots of leeway when it comes to his behavior, which wasn't that bad at all, really.

So, we lose Appollo Maximus and we gain what in it's place?

Clark?

Am I missing something?

Isn't Clark sort of a waste of hard drive space?

Clark is less well-made than the P4 Dork or James, two underrated figures that are routinely dismissed as "useless" and "unpopular."

Clark is a cheap, crude, weird-looking figure with no textures or morphs.

And this is what people are getting excited about? Have we lost our collective minds?

I figure Anton will be back. Creative geniuses frequently throw "snits" and then calm down.

But let's not ever lose a real talent like Anton's in exchange for something so useless that it's borderline embarrassing.

If all this erupted over a really useful, well-made modification like Domus, maybe, I could understand. But for Clark?

Puh-leeze.

P.S. I think Anton's right. I think Clark is crudely "inspired" by Appollo Maximus. But I never would have gone public with such an accusation. Why bother? After the initial (and totally inexplicable) excitement over Clark dies down, the figure will suffer the same fate as Sarah, Alexa, The Girl and other peripheral figures that don't catch the public's fancy. Anybody remember ugly, old Dinah? Didn't think so. And she was a heck of a lot prettier than Clark.

Quote - I think Anton's vast contributions to this community should have bought him lots of leeway when it comes to his behavior

No, it didn't. 

Quote - But let's not ever lose a real talent like Anton's in exchange for something so useless that it's borderline embarrassing. If all this erupted over a really useful, well-made modification like Domus, maybe, I could understand. But for Clark?

The facts do not support Antons "roughly shaped" accusation.  What's left?  A popularity contest?  Not very mature.  No one made Anton leave in a hissy fit, he did that all on his own.  Shahara didn't force him out, Ynsaen didn't single-handedly deprive anyone of Apollo, Anton made that decision to run all on his own.

facts?

the main problem here was there simply are no real facts about Clark, just opinions.  It's almost impossible to prove one way or the other, there's only multiple "coincidences" and accusations.  Only one person truly knows for sure and that's Shahara.  This will never be settled to a certainty, it will simply be forgotten in time

Quote - Anybody remember ugly, old Dinah? Didn't think so. And she was a heck of a lot prettier than Clark.

First off it's Dina, and I remember her plenty well, just used her commercially not more than a month ago. Dina was a damn good model I dunno shit about Clark or Maximus,. But I do know that Anton is acting like a world class wanker.

Anton leaving is a loss.

You can reject it, downplay it, dramatize it, shake it, slam it, laugh at it or sweep it under the rug - it's a loss. He has and will continue to contribute to our 3D world long after he's moved on as we continue to use his products and share them in the gallery.

Oh, and Daz didn't invent the 3D world. They just enhance it. Nothing more.

I don't think anyone is exactely cheering at the fact that Anton left and took Apollo with him. I for one do not. I'm honestly saddened that the Poser world has been deprived of Apollo because that character seriously ROCKS!

But it is no one's decision but Anton's. No one pushed him out of the door here. And trying to turn the facts that way, and indeed singling out someone like Acadia who has been truly supportative to Anton all along is simply bad behaviour. Childish, even.

I'll miss Apollo. As for Anton, I hope he comes back later when everything has cooled off. It's not the first time he has left the community for ever...

Factoid 1: Within a day of his release, Clark had not 1 but Two complete professional photographically based skin texture sets for under $13.

Factoid 2: Within a week, Clark had one minor set of facial morphs and one complete set of facial morphs that got held up in their release by the debate for another week!

Factoid 3: Thanks to PhilC, Clark had Wardrobe Wizard Support for clothing within a week of his public release.

Factoid 4: I am a customer of both figures. I paid 10 times less for Clark and learned more about the workings and use of Poser, CR2 editing, Morphs, Dynamic clothing, texturing and Firefly render settings using his imperfect figure than I ever learned while using Apollo.

Factoid: 5: I still prefer James over any other Male figure.

Opinion: I'm keeping that to myself. Men of Good Character Keep Good Company.

Factoid X: Clark is no Apollo Maximus by any stretch. ;OP

Get over it.  I'm sorry, the "I can create a human figure in an hour" ploy is B.S. (talk to Penn & Teller).  Quality (static) human figures take weeks - talk to any PROFESSIONAL in the business.  Quality Poser human figures can take months - because they aren't static but are expected to be morphed and scaled and tugged and pulled in all sorts of directions.  Apollo Maximus is a quality Poser figure which stands up to most of that rigor.  Can you say "edge loops" or the preparatory work involved in planning for dozens of morphs and proper joint deformations?  I know from experience that the more flexible a figure, the more complex and the more time required to plan, design, and execute it (and I haven't even done a human figure!).

That said, I'm appalled at the bickering (from both sides, mind you) over this matter.  Now I remember why I don't get involved in these minute internal matters - too much personal vendetta and cronyism.

I hope that Anton can find his 'center' and drop all of the conflicts that have caused the disaster before us.  He should have sold AM to DAZ for a princely sum and been released from it.  At least we'd have Apollo the faerie and Apollo the alien hunter by now... ;)

'Nuf said