Let's not get too carried away with V5 just yet.  She might just be a twinkle at the moment and we haven't had an official release of Stephanie and the kids.

There seems to be a great emphasis on what Daz should/could/would do. If individuals can produce what some consider to be models superior to Daz products then surely SM has the resources to do so. They don't need to provide them with Poser - people would and did pay for quality figures like Miki and TY. If Daz were to pull the plug on Poser compatibility wholesale, then what? Being largely dependent on even a friendly competitor for your content seems like a risky long term strategy. SM needs to develop their own Uberwench.

Quote - There seems to be a great emphasis on what Daz should/could/would do. If individuals can produce what some consider to be models superior to Daz products then surely SM has the resources to do so. They don't need to provide them with Poser - people would and did pay for quality figures like Miki and TY. If Daz were to pull the plug on Poser compatibility wholesale, then what? Being largely dependent on even a friendly competitor for your content seems like a risky long term strategy. SM needs to develop their own Uberwench.

I would buy a figure called Uberwench for the name alone hahaha

Quote - > Quote - I doubt gen 5 figures will work very well with Poser unless SM changes some things to read the same as DS.

Nope I would not hold my breath for DAZ figures anymore. Start looking for alternatives that are compatible with Poser or switch to DS.

What gives you this idea? 

You'll see.

maybe V5 will come with a temple smart-propped to the feet, and sword to the hand...;) (oh come on, I'm sure someone's thought it...;)

DAZ will NOT abandon Poser compatibility. It's doesn't make business sense. Even though they are now selling a version of Studio, there are FAR too many Poser users to sacrifice.

'Nuff said.

What ever you say. Just don't bet your life on it.

Quote - ...SM needs to develop their own Uberwench.

The G2 figures are pretty good, but their morphs were seperate products and expensive in comparison with DAZ-if they had been included with the figures they might have been more widely accepted.  Unfortunately that particular time window seems to have now passed.

I like V3, and I think that she could be improved upon with some JCMs.    You would need to add them to clothing, tho'. ..

FWIW:

M4, IMHO, is pretty decent. Not quite as much a resource hog as M3, but still way too polygon heavy for my tastes. The DAZ figures have always been heavy, making them tough to animate unless you're using pre-built animation paks, which I hate to do.

But V4 and A4 were a real step backwards facially. A4 in particular just underscores the weird "maybe she's anime, maybe it's maybelline" feeling I get from their female line. I was never a big fan of V3, but she really does look good by comparison, and A3 is light years beyond this hapless mess we have now.

So if we're going to see a V5 (which is inevitable), a few suggestions, in case anyone's (1) reading and (2) gives a damn what I think:

1. Run this monster through something to reduce the poly count. It's absurdly high.

2. As noted above, let's see some real morphing packages, not these lame attempts to date. I find it odd that you can find far more flexibility in M4 and not the Showgirl. I find it even odder that the Gen2 characters have far more flexibility, despite their lower poly count, than the Gen4 ones.

3. Get out of your office/cubicle and go see what a real, honest-to-god women looks like. Yes, supermodels are acceptable, but see them without makeup. Play with the proportions, if you must (and you will), but can we please start putting a bit more reality into this? You can always provide a "drop dead gorgeous" morph, you know.

4. V4's breasts, even with the Elite morphs, still move like boulders. Again, go reference some real world breasts (Think of the fun you'll have!) and study how real ones move.

5. Can we please fix that damn underarm issue?

6. Can we please separate the hip/buttock region from the upper thigh so she moves a bit more naturally? Study the work theyve been doing on Antonia for a clue here, okay?

Just my 0.02. YRMV

if they make a V5 they need to look on the body topology.

and why does M4 have veins on the base mesh? we dont need that kind of details.

Quote - > Quote - ...SM needs to develop their own Uberwench.

The G2 figures are pretty good, but their morphs were seperate products and expensive in comparison with DAZ-if they had been included with the figures they might have been more widely accepted.  Unfortunately that particular time window seems to have now passed.

You know, V4 And M4 are base figures. The morphs are seperate products as well, although DAZ does sell bundles. The problem with SM was that they decided to let third parties create the morphs instead of doing it themselves.

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - ...SM needs to develop their own Uberwench.

The G2 figures are pretty good, but their morphs were seperate products and expensive in comparison with DAZ-if they had been included with the figures they might have been more widely accepted.  Unfortunately that particular time window seems to have now passed.

You know, V4 And M4 are base figures. The morphs are seperate products as well, although DAZ does sell bundles. The problem with SM was that they decided to let third parties create the morphs instead of doing it themselves.

I believe that's the same at DAZ. They're called "DAZ originals", but they're just bought whole cloth from an outside source. I could be wrong about the morphs, but I know a lot of the so-called "originals" have been acquired from outside.

Quote - if they make a V5 they need to look on the body topology.

and why does M4 have veins on the base mesh? we dont need that kind of details.

Veins? I don't see veins on the base.

I was under the impression that E-Frontier had their figures done by an outside party...

Quote - I could be wrong about the morphs, but I know a lot of the so-called "originals" have been acquired from outside.

Most of the morphs are in house.

My understanding of the DAZ process is that the main development of their figures is coordinated with the company itself.  Brokered artists/contractors under NDA do the beta testing to provide further input for development as well as content for release.  Some products developed by outside developers are bought outright - whether those items were originally contracted for development or not is something I'm not familiar with.

My understanding of how the EF/SM figures were developed is that they were created by an artist in Japan.  Then the figures were re-rigged for the American version of the software.

The problems with the EF figures were stylised figures which made them harder to morph and the rigging was atrocious. Which they kept and still do blame it on user error. The rigging has never been fixed.

Daz figures are the easiest to morph. The main morph packages are done in house. But these figures are getting harder to use in Poser. We do a lot of hacking and fixing now days.

If there was a company that started to make figures that matched DAZ figures but made for poser, I think that market is now open.

I know, some are thinking it's harder than you think. No, I know what it take to do it. I also know that most of the example that I have seen in the 10 years I've been around are by individuals or a couple of artists. It would be different if it was a real group/company that did it.

Quote - IMO, I didn't see anything wrong with V3. (I don't think she should have been dumped on the side of the road.)
"She's my main working figure" 

Same here. I really do not like V4 at all, even after all these years of trying to use her. There are enough morphs and fixes for V3 that IMHO, makes her more realistic looking and able to move and bend just as well as V4. I think it was a huge mistake to merge the V4 mesh with Aiko and the Girl...the end result is the supposed "realistic" woman just looks way too soft and 'toon like to me (and is it just me, or does it seems like 95% of the V4 characters for sale here seem to be some variation of the "racoon eyed lolita' doll...they don't look like a real woman at all).

For my work, V3 is still by far my #1 girl. I wished that there were more products still being made for her; when I see the odd V3 item here in the marketplace or at CP I snap it up. Just 'cause she's old doesn't mean she's used up!!

Quote - Same here. I really do not like V4 at all, even after all these years of trying to use her. There are enough morphs and fixes for V3 that IMHO, makes her more realistic looking and able to move and bend just as well as V4. I think it was a huge mistake to merge the V4 mesh with Aiko and the Girl...the end result is the supposed "realistic" woman just looks way too soft and 'toon like to me (and is it just me, or does it seems like 95% of the V4 characters for sale here seem to be some variation of the "racoon eyed lolita' doll...they don't look like a real woman at all).

I largely agree with your assessment of characters available, but it's not the fault of the mesh. I can easily get a more normal look even just using Morphs++, and moreso with Argile (which isn't even particularly robust as a sculpting act). If blame is to be laid, you can probably blame people for buying the same kinds of products over and over.

But personally, when I buy a character set, I very rarely use the morph. The primary thing I look for is a good quality texture.

And FWIW, the V4 mesh was not "merged" with Aiko and the Girl. Those products were added on as morphs to her mesh long after her creation, and the same could probably have been done with the Gen 3 figures if DAZ had really wanted to (not sure about rigging tho).

Quote - [But personally, when I buy a character set, I very rarely use the morph. The primary thing I look for is a good quality texture.

And FWIW, the V4 mesh was not "merged" with Aiko and the Girl. Those products were added on as morphs to her mesh long after her creation, and the same could probably have been done with the Gen 3 figures if DAZ had really wanted to (not sure about rigging tho).

I think a good majority of us buy for the texture more than the morph.

They could have done the same with Gen 3 figures. As long as it's the same mesh and the same grouping.

Quote - > Quote - [But personally, when I buy a character set, I very rarely use the morph. The primary thing I look for is a good quality texture.

And FWIW, the V4 mesh was not "merged" with Aiko and the Girl. Those products were added on as morphs to her mesh long after her creation, and the same could probably have been done with the Gen 3 figures if DAZ had really wanted to (not sure about rigging tho).

I think a good majority of us buy for the texture more than the morph.

They could have done the same with Gen 3 figures. As long as it's the same mesh and the same grouping.

What I meant by them "merging" V4 with Aiko is that it seems to me that V4  basically was shaped from the get-go to be more "cartoon" like then V3 or V2. To me, V4's default body and face looks a heck of a lot more like A3. Some may like that, I don't. She's way too skinny and rubbery looking and her face has this constant "thousand yard stare" look. Again, some may like this, I don't.

I  also mostly just use the texture sets and some head morphs from character sets. The other part of my annoyance with V4 is the fact that they basically grouped the morph dials by morph sets  (morph ++, elite, etc)  rather then by function or body part (I know you can probably re-arrange this somehow, but still). And those @@#$#! magnet sets to conform....GRRRRRRR....

She was designed to be more flexible/blank which meant she was sort of at the sum of averages.It makes it easier to morph but not as appealing from the start. I have a lot of issues with her but that was the intention. I think they realized it didn't work as well as hoped and they fixed it with M4.

One would think they could have learned from H3, which is my favourite realistic male mesh. It's a pain to load, because all the polys needed to handle the detailed morphs make it impossibly heavy. From what I can see, they tried to do the same thing with V4 and its various iterations, from G4 to A4.

I can see the usefulness of having everything spring from a single mesh, but when you're trying to draw out so many wild variations, it starts stretching the basic foundation just a tad too much.

 V4 is rubbery looking.   
Love esther

Actually, a V5 mapped similar to V3, without the lousy magnets of V4, a similar default shape to V3 but with better arms (in fact, the general bending capabilities of V4)and a decent set of morphs would be very welcome in my Runtime.

Try as I might, I cannot get myself to like V4 much.  I have a couple of good characters but most of 'em look too much like the default shape for my liking.  And since, IMO, the default shape is damn awful, that's the deal breaker.  Short of dropping the mesh into a modelling app and creating my own morphs (and I ain't about to do that any time soon) I don't see a way around it.  The leg shaping morphs are all but useless, too, IMO.

BTW, just so as not to disappoint David, Posette is weird looking too and bends like glass.  :)
 

If we are going to make V5 similar to V3, we should try to avoid the macaroni shoulders and drinking straw elbows.

Also, IMHO, one thing that V4 has over V3 is that she makes a much more convincing Asian character.

Well, I did say with better arms.  :)

Yes, I agree with V4 making better asian characters.