Hey guys,

I was just wondering why my sales of the latest two character products, Tina Perez by me & Temptest3d http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/tina-perez-for-v4-s4/109408/ and Reese Sisters by me & P3Design http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/reese-sisters/103863/ are suddenly down.  I partnered with a couple top vendors to try to get some more exposure & more sales, but it seems to revert my expectations.

Today I looked around characters that were released during and after the release of Tina Perez, and see lots of gallery credits (10+) of them, yet Tina has no credit, & of course my assumptions same comparison of sales.

What gives?  What's making people not buy my products & not want to render them?

I try to make them uniquely different from all my other characters and all other characters, try my best to make them high quality, even my renders are high quality with a realistic lighting (no shadowless or ultra bright lights), tattoos "burned" into the skin rather then "painted" or "copy/pasted" for the more real look, and the skins react naturally to lights (no glow).

All this work costs a lot of time, even if this was a full time job for me (I have a real life job), I couldn't release a character once a month cause of the time involved, so I try to make the prices as reasonable as possible to reflect the uniqueness.

So why am I not selling them?  Is it that my characters don't look like fairies?  Is it the prices?  Is it the quality?  Is it the promos?  Is it my reputation as a vendor?  I can't figure this out.

Can I get anyone's honest feedback?  Maybe an honest feedback from a vendor?  I really need to boost sales but I'm doing something deathly wrong.  Don't worry, I won't be offended on any critics, critics are for people to learn and I've learned a whole lot of things from them.

...wolfie

I'm not a vendor, but if you want honest criticism, it's probably down to market oversaturation.
You're effectively just another vendor putting out the same things as others are.

You have a lot of competition.

You don't have to be a vendor, I'm asking the general public, but a vendor is welcomed to chime in.  And if anyone feels they want to site mail me instead of posting in public, they're welcome to.

Could be "effectively just another vendor putting out the same things as others are", and market over-saturation of characters, but the thing is, other vendors are in the same boat as to that respective, but they're selling more and their characters are rendered more.

I accept your criticism, thank you very much, but honestly that one wasn't an effective point.

...wolfie

Wow, considering what has gone on here in other threads you are brave indeed to actually ask for criticism.

Personally I think pumeco has the biggest part of the answer.  V4 has been going for ten years now and I must have 30 to 40 different character sets and I doubt I am exceptional for anyone who uses V4 regularly.  Anyone who is a Prime member has loads of V4 characters available to them for the massive sum of $3.50 and I counted over a dozen in the first 5 pages alone.  Many of these are not only for V4 but Genesis too which increases the use for anyone that uses both figures.  Any character needs to stand out and offer something different.

On a positive note the sisters are something different but how many of the gallery credits that you noticed were 'pin up' type renders?  While the sisters are a little different not many of the pin up artists are likely to buy and for V4 that is a sizable market.  In addition, and maybe unfortunately unfortunately, just because you spend a long time on something does not mean it is going to sell well. 

Just my view mind, but I don't see anything wrong with your figures, (if I did have a negative comment I cannot see a great deal of skin detail from the promos even if the the promos make an item of it) but neither do they have me reaching for my credit card.

I love your characters, wolfie. You're one of the very few Poser artists trying to create realistic/natural looking teens and kids.

I think the problem is simply that they are V4 based, which is pretty much at the end of her lifecycle.

Transfer the morphs (Or perhaps better even just the heads while utilizing G2's improved teen/kid body shapes) over to Genesis 2 and I'm sure your sales will improve.

The one thing that grabs my attention when I'm skimming through the marketplace is skin texture. I don't often shop specifically for new characters. I usually just let my eyes wonder. If a character's skin texture grabs my attention, then I'll go look a bit closer. The skin texture has to really pop. Realism is a big plus. Even fantasy textures.

Even though I do like the character morphs you create, the skin textures just don't grab my attention. The renders for this particular product, to my eye, are flat and uninspiring. They definitely do not show off the skin textures to good effect.

Just looked at the Sisters set (I missed that one first time). Same criticism. The morphs look very nice, unique. The skin textures are the problem (for me). If there are any little touches for reality (skin pores, SSS, etc) the renders don't really show them off.

In general, the renders don't do your characters justice at all.

I don't like the mouth on Tina Perez. Looks like she's either perpetually sad or she's trying to do that obnoxious duck lips thing that everyone thinks is so hot. It's not. It's almost as bad as the cyrus tongue. Just my opinion.

The skins look fine though, and there seems to be plenty of options. So I'm with the rest in that its market saturation. You're competing with 10 years worth of V4 skins. So maybe adapt them to G1 or G2 - or even both. Cause a lot of vendors just kind'a skipped over G1, yet there are still people that use it and you see them asking about skins for V5, M5, etc a lot. That or do something other than white girls. Or at least in addition to.

That's my .02

I know that the character here is created to seem more mature than the average V4 character but this is the sort of thing I look for as skin detail.

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/3da-agatha/103528/

Honestly like all the criticism here, and they make sense.  As for the too many V4 (only) characters, I was comparing mine with "v4 only" characters, for example, Godin's V4 only "Robin" and "Elle", Seven's "Rosie" and "Brindie", etc... released about the time Tina Perez was.  The thing is, a LOT of girls in the Marketplace look the same, although vendors are starting to shy away from that.

However, I really have been wanting to know how to transfer face morphs to G2, and to create them as a morphs.  I don't have Blender and the likes, just DS4.7 & Poser9,  I create the face morphs from Ultra face morphs MR from RuntimeDNA, and I go very random and detailed when I create them..  Anyone have a link?  Now that G2 has young teen morphs, I don't need to create custom bodies.

On the minus side of G2, however, is that there are SO MANY morphs that are already installed (as you unzip the packages), that I imagine G2 is now taking a lot of time to even load.  That right there kinda yields me from doing characters for her.

Tina's lips are the "pouty" looking lips, idea from my cousin (who's name is Tina) and the cute girl on "Karate Kid 1".  I know some don't like it, even one of my RL friend didn't lol.

I agree about the promos, I should've showed some very up close renders for more details, maybe use other lightings as well (but I hate shadowless lights),

Prime, you have to be a top vendor to upload anything as Prime, that's Renderosity's biggest weapon against anyone who doesn't sell much (pun intended).  I was gonna do it but I found out I'm not qualified.

Textures, guess I need to work on that.

Thanks everyone for the criticisms, I've taken them to heart, and thanks a lot for the compliments on the morphs :)

...wolfie

I am going to go with most of the above.

but I will add a couple of things

1st they look like old models poser 5sh

2nd they are young teens

if you look at what is posted in the gallery these days, it is not young teens 

Honestly like all the criticism here, and they make sense.  As for the too many V4 (only) characters, I was comparing mine with "v4 only" characters, for example, Godin's V4 only "Robin" and "Elle", Seven's "Rosie" and "Brindie", etc... released about the time Tina Perez was.  The thing is, a LOT of girls in the Marketplace look the same, although vendors are starting to shy away from that.

However, I really have been wanting to know how to transfer face morphs to G2, and to create them as a morphs.  I don't have Blender and the likes, just DS4.7 & Poser9,  I create the face morphs from Ultra face morphs MR from RuntimeDNA, and I go very random and detailed when I create them..  Anyone have a link?  Now that G2 has young teen morphs, I don't need to create custom bodies.

On the minus side of G2, however, is that there are SO MANY morphs that are already installed (as you unzip the packages), that I imagine G2 is now taking a lot of time to even load.  That right there kinda yields me from doing characters for her.

Tina's lips are the "pouty" looking lips, idea from my cousin (who's name is Tina) and the cute girl on "Karate Kid 1".  I know some don't like it, even one of my RL friend didn't lol.

I agree about the promos, I should've showed some very up close renders for more details, maybe use other lightings as well (but I hate shadowless lights),

Prime, you have to be a top vendor to upload anything as Prime, that's Renderosity's biggest weapon against anyone who doesn't sell much (pun intended).  I was gonna do it but I found out I'm not qualified.

Textures, guess I need to work on that.

Thanks everyone for the criticisms, I've taken them to heart, and thanks a lot for the compliments on the morphs :)

...wolfie

Sorry, I wasn't suggesting you should be selling in the prime market, only that your characters are in competition to a fair few that are less that a third of the sale price of your character. Looking at the characters you have compared with one thing does jump out to me as a buyer.  All of the others have lots of close ups, of the eyes, the lips the face along with full length nudes.  In short it is very easy to see what you are getting for you money.  In addition there is a description of exactly what you get as regards the files included, I had to look in the 'read me' to get the same information for your product.  I know you have added a lot of the information on the promo pictures themselves but that does not work for me and personally I don't like the font used for those descriptions.  I also feel the wording detracts from the figure itself.  I now other vendors use similar methods but usually for props where i do not feel it detracts as much.

I stress these are all my personal views as someone who buys a lot of content, if no one else feel the same you can ignore me but if others do feel the same perhaps it is worth thinking about.  I would make the same comments no matter which figure was involved.  I am not a vendor in any way and the only reason I am being this critical is because you asked.

Thanks SoulTaker, not really sure what you mean in "old models Poser 5ish", but I do see what you mean in young teens.

In earlier years, people have been wanting more natural looking kids, as apposed to bloated K4 and no "teen4" morphs, and I've been studying in making V4 into V4 teens.  When Stephanie 4 came out, that really gave me the lift in creating them (my second character here, Sabrina Blinker age progress, petite adult).  Sales really boosted since, and she's still the most sold.  When I was doing forums, chatting all the time, I was known as the "child king", yes, I've been called that quite a few times, and I and I think two other vendors are the only ones creating kids.

I've been shying away from kid/teen morphs a bit though, and Lucy Zepp (adult) was the first "adult only" character released by me, though I loaded an add-on for her as young-teens.  What I'm thinking of doing from now on is to create only adults, so that people aren't forced to buy kids when they buy my products.  Then "young-teens" as an add on.

Thank for your criticism, friend!

EDIT:  @hornet3d, I just saw your comment as I submitted my post...I do see what you mean, and yes I do ask for any and all critics, we all learn from them.  If we don't have people that welcome critics without being offended, no one would learn.  People who do the best in everything are people who receive critics to heart.  We have to be out in the world and take honest comments gladly, instead of hiding in the closet thinking you're creating what people want.

...wolfie

Wolfie, I'm far from knowledgeable with Studio, but I know that Studio, unlike Poser, loads morphs "on demand".

So you can install basically thousands of morphs for Genesis 1 & 2, but none of them will load until you actually spin that morph's dial.

So no worries about G2 loading times.

As for transferring morphs from V4 over to G2, that's dead easy as there are V4 "clones" available for G2.

They will reshape G2 into a V4 lookalike and then you can simply transfer your custom head morphs over with a single mouseclick.

You can even still use your textures as there are V4 UVs available for G2.

They will reshape G2 into a V4 lookalike and then you can simply transfer your custom head morphs over with a single mouseclick.

How?  In Poser? I do know about the UV's, so not worried about "G2 textures".  Didn't know about the dials not being "loaded" till you dial them lol, and thanks friend!

...wolfie

No, in Daz. There a product called GenX that allows you to transfer morphs and characters from older generations to Genesis 1 or 2. Or you can do it manually which is also fairly easy, but it requires you to understand how clones work.

Hmm, just looked at my sales report,

Lucy Zepp (teen, first release) surpassed Sabrina Blinker, and more than tripled her adult version, didn't realize that lol.

...wolfie

No, in Daz. There a product called GenX that allows you to transfer morphs and characters from older generations to Genesis 1 or 2. Or you can do it manually which is also fairly easy, but it requires you to understand how clones work.

Ok, I have GenX, and even released a freebie G1 version for those who bought Sabrina Blinker.  I was thinking of doing that as a product for other characters, but then buyers are required to have GenX.  Firstly I don't like requiring customers to have "add ons" for G1 or G2, secondly (and I don't know how many people bought GenX) that would limit possible customers, cause people without GenX and don't want to buy it wouldn't buy the product. I want to learn how others are releasing G2 characters with their morphs in G2 itself not via GenX.

GenX is awesome, it really is and I bought it instantly, but don't know if most others share the same opinion.  Thanks for your advice, friend!

...wolfie

Buyers are not required to have GenX. You transfer your stuff then re-save them on the new figure. It is just a tool that does the transfer. Once saved, it is independent from GenX. In other words, nobody is required to have it for a product that was converted via using it. Hense why you see some people release dual versions of a character, one for V4 and Genesis12, because they either did a manual transfer or just used GenX:)

Buyers are not required to have GenX. You transfer your stuff then re-save them on the new figure.

Oh??  ok, that's new, how do you re-save them on the new figure?  Pretty curious and now gonna load DS, gotta install GenX on G2 though, or do I need GenX update, or 2 (I know there's a new one)?

Well here is the thing. Get to know the basics of the program before you do this. You need to know how to save a character and auto rig bones (fairly easy). Get familiar with the app first before jumping into doing conversions (specially if it's a selling item). Because if you mess something up, it's handy to know why it is messed up and you will be able to identify the cause.

Actually I've used DS for a few years before jumping in Poser6, started when DS 1.3 was released.  Although now I use Poser9 a lot more than DS 3 & 4.7 (especially DS3) cause of the more natural renders that Poser offers via lights/surfaces, I do know a lot in the program itself.  Admittedly though, I've never converted things.

Is there a video available?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYCapNih-A4

That should get you started since you have GenX.

Forgot to mention, if you make a V4 morph for Genesis 1 or 2, people will however require the V4 clones. But don't worry, nearly everybody has it lol.

Talking about Victoria 4 for Genesis 2 Female http://www.daz3d.com/victoria-4-for-genesis-2-female? Did a search for V4 clone and that's what I got.

Watching the video, thanks friend!

Yes that will be the requirement.

Thanks, one more question, is GenX2 required, or is GenX good to use for G2?

Well it's been a while since I actually used GenX, I do transfers manually. I think Gen X2 is required and is the updated version that does both G1 and G2 transfers. I don't see a regular Gen X listed anymore.

Ok, thanks for all your help, friend, guess I'll have to buy that to work.  And yes, they deleted GenX long time ago.

...wolfie

Oh and with regards to the promos of your sets, use a more professional looking font and effect:) A good promo can look "cheapened" all because the wrong type of font was used. EG - I cringe at promos using comic sans lol (not that you used it). Typography and imagry go hand in hand:)

This is going to hurt .but I'm not doing this to be mean I wish you very much success .make a million :)

at times I think sells are just dumb luck .

the technical part : bad renders. the adults are not all out sexy. there kinda ugly .they all kinda look a like to me. the hair looks bloody terrible.
I swear i'm looking at a bad cartoon. I'm not buying that wink look either. I'm not saying ya done a half ass job I know ya worked for this but
It projects a half ass job and if you didn't car enough ,neither will they. 

The emotional part  "THE MOST IMPORTANT PART" : This is the part most never get.
Art is 100% EMOTION. POLYGONES N PIXELS HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH IT !!!
if you look at your render and don't feel over whelmed or excited or aroused or angry or any strong emotion
Well then ... all you have are some colored pixels on a canvases that no one will ever care about.

originality: is it original ?

who ya selling to ? are the ones with money still using V4 ?

I apologize if I hurt ya felling in any way ,was not my intentions.

Good Luck 

I still use V4, don't ever use Genesis or G2. I have Lucy and Sabrina, not interested in the offerings mentioned. Reasons are basically a mashup of what has already been posted, but to add my 'votes'

I don't like their mouths. Unique, yes, and decidedly away from 'stock' V4 which is great. That AUTOMATICALLY puts the character into aesthetic preference areas. I don't use Dawn either. I don't give a rats about the rigging and topology, I think she's ugly.

Their expressions in the promo renders make them look like spoilt brats, NOT someone I'd want to know. If I wanted them as for a specific character I'd definitely buy them, but as a general character for my runtime, no.

The hair sucks. Just an opinion, but lets down the quality of the skin. Lighting looks flat to me too...

I think you do good work. I don't think V4 is dead at all. Normal looking characters for any base are hard to find. Please don't give up!

No hurt here, all critics taken at heart, and even if I disagree, don't worry friends, everyone does have different opinions, and again everyone learns from others :)

Hmm... hair... can you guys be specific as to which character and which hair, and which promo image?  Not really sure, though I do know I didn't do all that great of job on it... I only try to use "every day", natural looking hair, not these funny looking high buns and pig tail "teen wannabee" hairs, just what everyday women look like.  Even put the Glyn hair on Tina Perez through Clothe room in Poser for it to weigh down as she tips her head (changed to dynamic hair).

Lights... I do know it's a bit bright, my LCD monitor went down on my main computer, so I'm using my 18 yr old CRT Gateway monitor, which isn't very bright, should've looked at everything on my laptop before uploading but I was wanting to release Tina quickly as I needed to make some money.  And again, I really don't know why it looks "flat", I used a light set (included in Tina Perez package) that consists of a main, soft, back, and IBL light, all the lights except IBL with shadows at 100% applied (I hate, hate, hate shadowless lights and you can never find them in the real world so I never use them).  Can you point me to a light set you believe is isn't "flat"?  Not really sure what you mean by flat anyways.

Expression, the only extreme expression I used on Tina was the makeup promos, and that was just to show that you can use expressions on her without her looking all ugly or unrealistically "3D" ugly.  The others were simply a small smile.  Can you point me to what you're talking about as in "brat" expression?  And again most of her promos show her not expressing at all so you'll know what she looks like when you load her.

In my opinion, promos that show no expression at all..... just dead look on with not so much as to care what they're looking at... is plainly dead and I see a lot of them.  In fact, 99% of promos don't tell me whether this character can handle V4 expression at all, cause they're not using them.  A lot of characters I bought can't either, they get really ugly or unrecognizable, that's why I show that my characters can, so that people will know if they want to render my character smiling, they can.

I did look at the finished promos, and I was very proud.  When I did all the update promos on Tina (had to change them for the testing team, no nudity cause they said she looked too young), Temptest3d was all excited and she was very happy with them.  What's wrong with them?  Scratching my head here, I worked very hard on them, though some may think they're "half ass" jobs.  Really got me curious, but don't worry, I'm not hurt in any way, like I said, everyone has different opinions.

Thank you all so very much for sharing your thoughts and being helpful.  Like I said, critics are for learning, if there wasn't any honest criticism, there would be no learning.

...wolfie

Characters do not sell themselves. Even if something is well made, you still have to catch the customers eye. So apart from making a good character, a product maker has to also become their own marketing person, and ensure that they have the tools to properly market the figure.

The main thing is to make promo pictures that capture both the eye and the imagination of the customer. Simply showing details is not enough. Show the "character", give the figure life and personality. Place them in interesting shots that can inspire the customer. You have to "Sell" the character with everything you have in your promos, because if the customer looks in the store and sees the same old shots over and over again, then they wont bother to take the time to look......you have to draw them in, and make it interesting enough for them to want to click.

Rawn

I like what you said, Rawnrr, and it's very true.  This is one reason why my promos are different from the rest, to make it interesting for customers to want to browse through.  Or at least try to, but apparently it's not working.  I see so many promos and they're all the same, with no "life" or expressions at all, yet they're top sellers.  I show expressions all the time and try to give my character life as in posing them to look interesting, but it's not working.  So this really has me curious.

Maybe I'm over doing them?  Maybe it's time I pay someone else to make the promos?  I don't know, I'm in the shadow of question marks here.

...wolfie

No offense meant, but to me your promos look like most every other ones in the rosity library.

Girls standing in a boring pose looking at a camera. (with alot of text and boring background)

Compare that to a few of these at daz (just did a quick glance through he store..so they are not necessarily even the best examples)

http://www.daz3d.com/monique-6-pro-bundle

http://www.daz3d.com/urban-survivors-hd-for-genesis-2-female-s-and-male-s

http://www.daz3d.com/fwsi-marie-hd-for-monique-6

http://www.daz3d.com/lyric-for-genesis-2-female-s

They all have a readily identifiable character, but in an interesting shot that catches your eye and imagination. Through costume, and background scenery, through creative lighting and adding expressions tot he character that give them life and personality. These are the things that sell a a character more than a screen full of text on the image.

Rawn

No offense taken friend!  Funny you showed me these promos, recently I was thinking about starting promos in a scenery instead of just fancy backgrounds, and looking at other promos I don't see a bunch of writings.  As for writings, just wanted to explain things cause I know most people don't bother looking in the Description or Editorial tabs for the info, they just look at pretty pictures to see if they like the products.

Clothings... sexy clothings always sell the characters if you do this right, but for some reason, even though my characters don't have kiddy faces like most, and even though Lucy Zepp & Tina Perez have normal size breasts and physically shaped bodies, the testing team ALWAYS tell me my characters look too young, no matter how big or fat or whatever.  So I don't do nudity or "too sexy for the young" clothing.  I see lots of kiddy faced small breasted characters in nude promos, they tell me it's nothing against me, they just feel she's too young but I don't one bit believe them.

Anyways, gonna try to be creative here and put future characters in interesting scenes, hopefully from now on I can make my them stand out.

...wolfie

If I purchase a character I tend to be attracted to products that have something different of unique about them, either morphs or textures.

I did look at Tina Perez and, IMO she looked very similar to Lucy Zepp, who I already own and like using very much.

I'll credit a recent Lucy Zepp gallery upload to her....sorry I did not get around to it on uploading :(  

I did look at Tina Perez and, IMO she looked very similar to Lucy Zepp, who I already own and like using very much.

I'll credit a recent Lucy Zepp gallery upload to her....sorry I did not get around to it on uploading :(  

Hey thanks longprong!  Looking forward to see your image :) Yes, I agree there are some similarity with Lucy Zepp and Tina Perez, Tina was actually created to be Lucy's cousin, just didn't bother stating that in promos, nothing anyone would think important.  I'm gonna do a render of the two side by side and load it here :)

Ah, OK... if the expressions aren't changing in the promos then it comes back to the shape of the mouth. That combines 2 of my gripes into 1! The mouth shape is definitely realistic, but not one I find particularly attractive, so back to my comment on buyer's aesthetic preferences.

The hair is probably down to just the scene and lighting and was just an opinion. I don't pay a lot of attention to hair in promos because the hair isn't part of what's being sold (usually). BTW, I do read the editorials, the promo blurb at the bottom, and all the promo images when buying. I think the more info available the better. I resist buying on single promo images because 'just occasionally' I don't get the product I was expecting.

By 'flat' lighting I mean lacks contrast. I'm not a fan of IBL and 'light sets', I just use IDL. Again, my own preference. Nothing at all to do with the characters, so ignore me on that one... I can't put my finger on what it is... maybe the textures and lighting made them look 'cartoony'? Hmmm... maybe if I add something as a point of comparison and let others rip into my image there may be some more specific feedback...

This is a test render of a Laura 3 character after applying a new skin texture and Snarly's EZSkin. Not at all meant as a promo, but lit and rendered to show her in as natural a lighting as possible. The hair is also just as old a mesh, but I used the new subdivision function to increase the poly count and remove the obvious jaggies for this close up. Just me, but I appreciate shots like this in promos...

For a bit of comparison (and to demonstrate what I mean by 'flat') here's 2 quick renders of Lucy.

First is using IDL and an HDRI background...

This one is also HDRI, but included an infinite light to get her to stand out from the background and to cast some shadow over her face...

Offered only as points of comparison... not saying they are better than yours, just a bit different.

Ok, here we have a comparison, full body and head only.

First, @ piersyf, unfortunately during the creation of Tina Perez, my last laptop crashed (literally on the floor) so I had to save up to get another one, I haven't installed Poser on this one yet.  On my main computer, I can't render IDL lights scenes, and if I attempt to do partial renders, each partial renders will be slightly lighter/darker, if I'm thinking correctly, it's because of the location of the "lights".  My old CRT monitor on my computer is a little darker then the laptop monitor (which is LCD of course) so I should've loaded the images and check them out on the laptop before uploading the promos.  Seriously thinking of redoing the promos.  For now until I install Poser on my laptop, I'm just doing my best using IBL lights, using AO for the more natural, less flat shadows.  I realize my shadows were too dark, highlights too light so I played more with my lights and did these renders below.

@longprong... admittedly there's more similarity than I wished for, as I made these two girls (Lucy Zepp age 20, Tina Perez age 21) as cousins, but there are differences.  First, the skins come from two different merchant resource textures.

You can see some difference, their height, weight, hip, breast size,  jaws, chin, eyes and even slightly on their noses.

...wolfie

Oh, I forgot to add, the more differences in the packages are the makeups & tattoos, and Tina has tan lines (still waiting for bagginsbill for an updated surface settings for the tan lines since you can't see them with gamma correction on right now).  Tina also will be updated with genital hairs, the last ones got rejected so I skipped that option for now and made new ones after she was in the market when I had some time.

...wolfie

Ah, OK... if the expressions aren't changing in the promos then it comes back to the shape of the mouth. That combines 2 of my gripes into 1! The mouth shape is definitely realistic, but not one I find particularly attractive, so back to my comment on buyer's aesthetic preferences.

The hair is probably down to just the scene and lighting and was just an opinion. I don't pay a lot of attention to hair in promos because the hair isn't part of what's being sold (usually). BTW, I do read the editorials, the promo blurb at the bottom, and all the promo images when buying. I think the more info available the better. I resist buying on single promo images because 'just occasionally' I don't get the product I was expecting.

By 'flat' lighting I mean lacks contrast. I'm not a fan of IBL and 'light sets', I just use IDL. Again, my own preference. Nothing at all to do with the characters, so ignore me on that one... I can't put my finger on what it is... maybe the textures and lighting made them look 'cartoony'? Hmmm... maybe if I add something as a point of comparison and let others rip into my image there may be some more specific feedback...

This is a test render of a Laura 3 character after applying a new skin texture and Snarly's EZSkin. Not at all meant as a promo, but lit and rendered to show her in as natural a lighting as possible. The hair is also just as old a mesh, but I used the new subdivision function to increase the poly count and remove the obvious jaggies for this close up. Just me, but I appreciate shots like this in promos...

Now that is what I find appealing, nice example. While I do not feel the Tina promos were too cartoon like, your render does display a great deal more reality which I like a lot. For the record you are not alone in reading the description and looking at all the promos before buying, I do that all the time and on occasions I also look at the readme file if I still have questions.  Due to this I am not a fan of words added to promos, although I have seen it used to good effect in promos for some props.  Props are very different though and often the wording describes prop options or where they fit in with other props in the same series.  Figures are different, if there are options or different textures I want to see the differences, the same with morphs.  The description might tell me there are a dozen morphs but I want to see what those morphs do.

You do your work on a laptop, Wolfie? I take my hat off to you! It occurred to me that what I had been trying to say in my own clumsy fashion is that you spend ages making the character, don't skimp on the promo renders. Spend days on them showing as much as you can... I was looking at promos yesterday that had renders in Poser and in an 'external renderer' (unbiased). Really really got a good idea of the potential of the mesh and textures, regardless of whether I have that renderer. Maybe see if you can collaborate on promo renders?

As to the character, looking at the images you posted... it's the mouth. Accurate and realistic lines for sure, I just don't like them. Aesthetic preference.

Honest opinion here.. only opinion - and its cause you asked for honest criticism.  I may come off as harsh and I really dont intend to - I just dont voice myself via type all that well, Im really just trying to help.

When I first opened that page, the first thing I noticed was the terribly flat lighting and some kind of terrible funkiness in the hair and  the shadowing of  the hair on her face.  Her skin lacks any kind of detail ( sorry not trying to be mean here).  To clarify: There seems like there is no actual texture to the map.. and a lack of bump/ spec maps possibly?  Also, the view of her standing there.. her lips are super shiny and give that wax lips appearance.. never a good look.  Her makeups look very blah and uninspired.  Her expressions in the promos - Im not sure if this is the actual morph or an added expression.. but its kinda weird. She definitely has some strangeness at the interior corners of her eyes and the nose bridge area. Im going to assume that it is because she has no defined upper eyelids which adds to her awkwardness a bit.   Maybe larger more prominent lashes may have helped with her overall look.

The Reese sisters - The textures look much better, and the lighting has greatly improved.  However, in my honest opinion the morphs just dont work for them.  Also, the eye blinking to show makeups are not particularly working in your favor either. ( maybe just a fully closed eyelid displaying it would have worked better)  I think this set would actually sell well with improved morphs and promos.

My best advice is to look at some top selling character vendors here - and at daz.  

Madde in particular ( god I love her girls) and there is a reason why;  The promos/renders are top notch - 

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/mdd-rashi-for-v4-2/108283/

The skin is beautiful, and well textured.  You can see  that her eyebrows fit the scale of her morph- the makeup has texture to it.  The character itself is very unique and creative - Indian characters have been done before but the beautifully detailed ornamentation sets this apart.

The lighting- It is well lit, and displays the skin very well... but it has some mood to - there are shadows but in the right spots ) not in or on her face.

The clothing is well thought out and beautifully detailed - and matches the theme she was going with. I cant find a single thing really wrong with this set or anything I would do differently- and its why I want it soo bad. I dont need it but I have to eventually possess it.

Im happy to see you are trying to set yourself apart  - But going too far out there also narrows your market.  The narrower the market the less profit you can make.

Just my two cents  - dont be mad

Me :0)

@piersyf: No, I didn't make the promos on the laptop for Tina, though I did do the renders on the Reese sisters on the last laptop (which is why the lights were better), then worked through Photoshop & PSP on the promos on my computer.  Character morphs creation in DS surface settings in DS & Poser on computer, texture editing in PSP, sometimes in PS on my computer.  The laptop monitor is just too small, and I hate the uhh... stylus or whatever you call it (square "mouse" on bottom) so I use a mouse.

@chevybabe25... quite a critic, if I was any weaker I'd have given up, anything good on them at all?  LOL.  Thanks though, I'm working on the lightings (will install Poser on my new laptop), and will look closer & catch funky morphs.  The makeup... well, I'm just trying to go for the lighter makeups, I just like light makeups and don't like hard stuff though I did add some goth & dark eyeliners, as well as thick/long black eyelashes on Tina for customers who prefer them.

I'm not giving up though, sure that was pretty harsh but I did ask for them.  I'm strong enough to continue and try to do my best on better creations/promos.  And thanks! :)

...wolfie

Im really sorry wolfie.. I know I come off harsh.. I am a critic..but Im also trying to help. ( this is why I tend to avoid offering criticisms, especially in public forums ) Im not trying to hurt your feelings, or be an ass. 

Yes - there are positives in what you have submitted - and I dont want you to give up - The second set The Reese sisters look greatly improved.  The textures looked better, and lit much nicer. The morphs are more improved as well.. 

I make characters too and I know just how ridiculously difficult and time consuming they are; I dont doubt for one second you didnt work hard on these sets. Keep your chin up- and the next one focus more on the things I mentioned. I guarantee it will sell better.

It's all good, Chevybabe25, I've just been going through some failures in life, and trying to do what I do best (character creation), to make more money first my laptop breaks, then my 21in LCD monitor on my main computer gives up so I had to drag my 25yr old trusty 19in Gateway CRT monitor, just another annoyance in life that held me back.  It's good that I'm a tough person and just get up and try again after failures, I know it'll pay in the future.

I've learned a lot from these critics, but then when you get so many bad things said about your work, you wonder, "why do I even bother wasting my time doing this for little money anyways?".  It was hard (not only you, but a lot of people saying my work's bad), yes, but critics do help you learn and get better at what you're doing.  It would've been nice to get some encouragement though, encouragements give you the strength to continue.

I know Tina Perez is a good character, I just didn't display her well.  Gonna try to re-do the promos & hopefully sales would get better.

Thanks all of you for the critics, I'm not asking for any more, I believe I know what I need to do :)

...wolfie

I want to add my 2 cents.......just because you asked honestly.

I just don't buy anymore V4 stuff - characters, clothes, everything.  I think she's been done to death and I've spent all the money I'm going to spend on V4.  I rarely even load her in Poser anymore.

When I lost my hard drive a few months ago with the V4 runtime on it, I was very picky about what I even bothered to re-install for V4.  Mostly, just stuff I paid for that I might be able to convert to other figures.

I do wish you would focus your talents on some of the other figures like Dawn and Roxie and Miki4.  Those are the figures I use in Poser now.  Something like your characters for Dawn would be welcomed by the small but dedicated Dawn fan base and would be well received, I think.  I would grab up anything you did for Roxie, Miki and Dawn.

But, honestly, I'm done buying for V4.

You might want to look into color calibrating your monitor. That would give a more consistent look for your renders. Also, if you're not already, you should run at least your artistic renders through some sort of color correction process in postwork. You can do it by hand in Photoshop or any of the other image editors out there.

Your artistic renders could benefit from better lighting and some judicious postwork.

promo renders don't look good enough IMVHO.  try to set up scene, lite and matls so it renders beautiful.

use BB's anisotropic shaders for hair and eyes, snarly's EZskin (all posted here as freebies) if it's o.k. to use their freebies in commercial promos.

use SSS, BB's envsphere, HDRI, 1 inf lite w/ray-traced shadows, 4 RT bounces, IC=50, IDL=32, samples=6, SR=0.5, GC=2.2 et al.

do not use P4 render settings*.  do not render in empty scene* devoid of background, props et al.

you wouldn't get honest opinions, as rule here: if you can't say something nice, don't say anything. it's more supportive, but leaves users stuck in ruts*.