I believe, if one examines the facts of the past, and considers all of the censorship, site banning of moderators, admins, and even plain old users, of those whose views dissented, of those who did not understand the "rules" and were crucified for it, paranoia, hysteria and unethical treatment of past moderators if they differ from the opinions of Jack and Ed, yanking down of original posted work of those who offered it for free to free stuff if they differed from the political system, etc etc ad nauseum, it becomes clear that a change of management is a good thing. If I found out that Jack and company were secretly recoding a new database on their own, I might consider that they intended to flee into the night with intellectual property that is not their own. Working as a volunteer does not necessarily make them owners of all forum members names and addresses since they suddenly left Willow's defection high and dry and ran back here smelling a chance to make money either. Why don't Jack and Ed just get a job like the rest of us, and stop looking for easy money? Stop looking for folks to give them handouts, for folks to support them? For folks to sympathize and make things happen for them? Do you have an opinion? A mind of your own? Or are you brainwashed? I once thought they were special too. I once thought the sun rose and set on them too. I thought you should know. I support the real owners of this site and the ones whose largesse has benefitted us all. Edgenet.

F.Y.

`

Gee, if it was so easy, why did Ed and I turn down an offer that would have given us a PROMISED income?? And say HEY, LET'S OPEN A NEW FORUM, THIS TIME WITH NO FINACIAL SUPPORT, LET'S START BROKE AGAIN!!! If money was the root of what Ed and I stood for, this site would still be ran by me... So your views are once again wrong Bast. Sorry, but a noteable try. Jack

Flame me all you like. But there are too many witnesses to the past events who still remember. The facts are out there, the truth is out there. Use your minds. Listen, look, find it.

Not flaming you... just giving you the facts as they are. If you can't accept that because of bitterness you have towards Ed and I because we released you from admin status when you were creating a headache for the Community by creating rumors that were untrue. Please, don't do that again to the Community. Jack

If the shoe fits, wear it. I am referring to those above you, who felt the need to flame ;P

Ah... okay

If anyone was going to be banned for disagreeing with Jack or Ed, it would be me. I've spoken out publicly against Jack/Ed/Sprite/Stormrage several times in my rants. Hell, at one point if Jack and I had been in the same room, it may have came to blows! Yet, I remain. And, even, from time to time, I feel like they are glad to have me around, even if they don't care for me. So, Bast and all you other slanderers, FUCK OFF. Jack and/or Ed may have a talent for half-truths, stressing the MAY, but in the end they seem to be men of their words. Renderosity has been the best fun on the net since I've been here, and I know that has a great deal to do with Jack and Ed. So, Bast...if memory serves you're the schizophrenic trying to paint Jack as some crazed israeli cult leader, who's brainwashing who? The final proof is in "Tim's" response. Edgenet isn't interested in addressing the issues. And Boy, Howdy, if Willow and Grey are talking reconcilliation, then I think it's pretty clear who's the fucker and who's the fuckees around here. -Darth_Logice

Bast...don't know you. But your words smell like bitter and rancid flesh to me. Seems more of a "kick em when they're down" rant rather than an exersize in enlightenment as you bodly proclaim. I have had my differences also with Ed and Jack...never did they feel to need to ask the question you do. Why would they? All I ever heard from them was "freedom". I think perhaps you should be asking yourself what your motivation is. Smacks of toadying to the "New Boss"...definitely not the same as the old boss. (Though I regard Ed, Jack and much of the staff as people of honor rather than "owners") You're post keeps reminding me of a small child rubbing their hands with glee at the oppourtunity to get even. I'm not impressed...Getting a job with Edgenet? My inquiring mind wants to know.........

No dear. I do not live in Nashville, to get a job with Edgenet. I am already employed, probably would want more than Edgenet pays too ;p But as a past moderator/admin here, I learned a few things in my time... and little of it was nice. It all stank to high heavens.

I tend to think bast probably already is working here. Whether she's officially a member of the staff or not. Just remember, members and any admins who might be working here with bast and JeffH. These are the people who publicly posted private information in an effort to further their own ends, whatever they may be. Is that the kind of people you want to put your trust in? This is not a flame. Just the facts.

Yes Bast, I very much have a mind of my own and it will not be swayed by your half-truths and outright lies. I've been with Jack and Ed since day one and they've never dealt with me in anything other than an honourable manner. Sure Jack and I have had a our differences of opinion and, God knows, there have been times when we would have seriosuly injured each other if we had have been in the same room. But I don't think the sun shines out of any of Jack's orifices - I can only deal as I have been dealt - honourably.

sure you have one, bast?

Bast, I loved almost all of the graphic work you did during your first turn as a member here, but I have to disagree with most of your opinions. I was very dissapointed in BOTH sides when you were banned (I think they overreacted, and you and your friends retaliated in a childish manner, making both sides look as silly as some employers I've had). However, I think you are being an idiot here, accusing those of us who are willing to take the side of Jack and Ed over that of Edgenet. If Edgenet didn't have the spectre of "ogrishness" hovering over them from the mess with Willow & co. last year, then I'd be more open minded, but this is the SECOND time (in as many years) that they've come out as "closet villains;" it's difficult to see anyone supporting them as being more than a mindless sycophant under the circumstances. Perhaps there are more facts that need to be brought to light, but from what I've heard, Edgenet is totally in the wrong on this fiasco. I must admit that, given the events of the past, I'd be more prone to taking JeffH's words seriously than yours, and he hasn't really said much vitriolic, just that he's back, glad to be so, and looking forward to helping people puzzle out Poser. Not that we're being mindless drones to follow Jack and Ed. I'm not going to abandon the site, at least not for a while, because I did miss out on a lot when I left to follow Willow's group, but I suspect I'm more likely to stick with Jack and only come back here sporadically if he forms a new forum