[click for full size.]

Hi all, have not been in this forum for a while. I have been upgrading Poser last few years and thought I'd see how the SSS shaders fair.

Here are a few renders with danae's shader for Dublin. I did not change anything in the IBL lights or the shader nodes. Should be noted, however, that I did morph her head into a somewhat different femme than the Dublin default.

I like it!

another...

...another....

....last one...

Thanks for posting these. I have her on my wish list and was wondering how well she looked by other users.

If you really want to take full control of SSS and other render options for skin, try Snarleygribbley's EZSkin script. It gives you a very user friendly control panel that addresses just about every major option. Oh yeah. It's free!

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2841322

Hey there, Operaguy.  Long time, no see.  How do you like the new version of Poser so far?

J

I think this figure actually came with SSS in the shader (from what I read in the ad). I'm curious to see the shader, but not $14.50-curious.

And no, don't post screen-shots - Danae might not like that... :lol:

Not that you would, of course... heheheh

 A pretty texture!

 I'm guessing it uses the scatter node- with a scale of 1 or less. Just my guess!

Quote - And no, don't post screen-shots - Danae might not like that... :lol:

Not that you would, of course... heheheh

1 or less it's just the correct value for the wax museum !

Quote - 1 or less it's just the correct value for the wax museum !

You mean, like this one? I was so rapt with it, though... wow, we're as good as CGSociety, now! :lol:

Ok, now read ;)

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2839884&page=2

Anthanasius, it's nice to point out such a valuable technical resource, however there are some of us that do not read French.  Would it be possible to kindly provide a translation?

Basically Anthanasius said that the lower the scale, the more translucent is the material.

Note that I compensated for this in my first postings on scatter by mixing with diffuse. Later I simplified by increasing the scale.

Ah, thanks for the abridged edition, BB.

that dublin texture/shader does look great.. almost had me willing to dump just a little more money into v4.. still might it is a different texture than anything else I have for her, and the SSS shader seems to render very well, I'd like to get a look under the hood.. very tempting

If there is an implication here that the renders I posted seem "too much," I can also see that. If I push further with Poser for stills (I am starting up with Messiah for animation now), I'd go for some tempering of the SSS. But right out of the box it is just fun to wallow and indulge in the glow. It is delicious.

Thanks for the link to EZSkin! I have not tried it yet but looks good.

Agree it would not be right to show a screen shot of Danae's shader nodes. I will say that it is not just the SSS nodes, but also some strong specular and bump mapping. She did a good job. I hope she revives Rio and Manhattan with an SSS pose and also provides non-makeup textures for them both.

@jartz: So far so good with PoserPro 2012. I have not yet installed SR1. Renders faster, in my opinion.

::::: Opera :::::

Dublin needs some displacement for her brows.

The skin could do with some bump/displacement also.

Color and light look good, just less wax and more bump/displacement.

That was then. This is now. And thanks for the link - j'ai tout compris. Merci bien.

[click for full]

i made a bump map for the brows and increased the intensity of the existing face and lips bump maps.

that by itself pulled down the so-called "wax effect" in my opinion.

::::: Opera :::::

Scatter scale on that shader is at 0.85. What Anthanasius suggests is closer to 1.75. The skin is really nice nonetheless and looks even better with less glow.

I think RobynsVeil has it close on her Antonia shader.

Hello,

how are the texture maps? I have danae's Rio, those textures have some burned-in speculars, but I could get rid of them using bagginsbill's shader technique, and apart from that, the textures are nice.

I'm also tempted to get Dublin, but would be interested to learn about the speculars before. 

Best regards,

   Michael

with SSS on, do we still use specular and specular maps?  is it better to set specular to 0.0 ?

But I have been playing with the new SSS thingy too, and taking out P2012 for a sin.

The Wacro SSS doesn't do much for me honestly but the shader nodes that come with some new characters are very nice.

I think they work for me best with a specular light in the scene. Here is K4 with GND Anastasia's nodes. I'll try them out on V4 and M4 next. Click to enlarge image.

Quote - but the shader nodes that come with some new characters are very nice.

Which look a lot like the ones I posted at RDNA. You don't need to buy characters to get a good SSS setup. I posted 4.

In the image you show above, it looks like the skin bump is done with turbulence - a tactic I showed was better than almost all the bump maps ever made. It does look nice, eh?

Quote - with SSS on, do we still use specular and specular maps?  is it better to set specular to 0.0 ?

I'm going to take a guess and say no (assuming you are using blinn as your specular part).  SSS is how light reacts under the skin, specular is how shiny the skin is.  Just because you have stuff going on underneath doesn't mean you can't have some shininess on the outside.  In fact I just held my hand up to an indoor light and with the light coming in from the window, I could see both SSS and shininess. 

I'm curious to know how this shader is done ... and how it interact when changing light !

The problem I find with doing IDL renders, is that while the lighting is great, it kills all skin specularity. The only way I can overcome this is not through skin nodes, but with a specular light in the scene. Otherwise skin looks flat and lifeless.

It's ironic that SSS has re-introduced the old devil of nostril glow. Not really glow but SSS translucency makes nostrils too well lit. And AO nodes can't fix that, for reasons that bagginsbill would understand much better than me.

Michael, the texture maps for Dublin have no significant highlights. There is a little at at the corner of the eyes and tip of the nose. The painted-on hair is free of specular.

:::::: Opera :::::

I was very impressed with the Dublin promos and with operaguy's renders, and with a gift certificate burning its way to expiration, I bought Dublin.

Very nice texture set.

The shader is almost exactly the Diffuse+Scatter blended shader I posted at RDNA. The scatter has been lowered, which is making it a bit more waxy, and the color map has been used for bump, which I frown upon, but otherwise it's the same as what I posted. The extra translucence in this shader is arguably a correct way to go given the character is a fair-skinned lass! To each his own - we can all adjust the scatter scale. That's the great thing about Poser products - they're not closed up.

I'm very excited to have a new set of textures to mess around with - this one is very unique.

I like this texture set.

I know this is going to sound petty, but why don't vendors give credit where credit is due?

I've seen variants of your shader in a number of figures now, BB... won't say who, but in none of them do they even mention where they got the idea from. It would be a nice gesture, anyway.

Antonia WM wears a variant of your shader - not one you particularly agree with, but the basic idea came from you. Credit was given.

'Course, I'm not selling anything. Maybe that's it.

<climbing off my soapbox to boos, jeers and hisses>

Do I see burned-in specular on the lips? I don't have time to investigate. If that is burned-in, I'm a little disappointed.

Oh, and I'll still buy this texture set... when it goes on special. Even if it for V4. :lol:

Yeah, Robyn, I noticed that. But - it's no big deal.

What I really want to put a stop to is people thinking they need to buy these textures just to get the shaders. I published the shaders for free, and people who use them are supposed to link to those in the readme, so that other users know where to get the shaders, and know they can use them in their own work.

OK - gotta go to my party. Happy New Year!

I won't say any more...seems to be a vendor mentality thing. Dunno. :glare:

Happy New Year to YOU, Bagginsbill!!! :woot:

I see a little on the nose tip, too.

Sigh.

Yep, and really hard to photoshop out: tried it and failed - really need to try your technique. So, the face texture gets displayed on a hi-res square, right? nodes applied and render saved to 3000 x 3000 image. Or whatever.

If you go into the material room and click the "idiot button" called "add SSS" it just throws in the SSS Skin node. That does not a full shader make. So, danae arrived at her complex of nodes in some way. I agree that if it arose out of a study of BB's explorations and free shaders, it would have been proper and fair for an acknowlegement.

Further, since tweaking is unavoidable, we have to learn what the various nodes and settings therin actually do. So, study of BB's work seems indicated regardless. So, I am echoing that it is not necessarily necessary [!] to purchase a package to obtain and learn to manipulate a full SSS shader. Thanks for your essay in the craft, BB.

I am not a blind champion of danae, having gone to extent of requesting a refund on RIO once it became clear there was no non-makeup texture. In our exchange, danae simply did not think this was an important issue.

And apparently BB is now saying the dreaded painted-in specular can be detected in Dublin. I'd say this is relative, as having gazed with horror at many atrocities in the past, this set looks quite matte and even to me. It is not impacting my renders.

All that having been said, whoever executed the photoshoot and workup of this skin from life did a great job. I am glad to have it. Thanks danae.

::::: Opera :::::

[click for full]

I decided she needed real hair.

::::: Opera :::::

People have a big problem to understand a real simply thing, with SSS we no longer need complex shader with 100 or 1000 nodes.

You can create a very realistic shader with less than 10 nodes.

If some people need to hard work with nodes, return under P8 or P7 ;)

Quote - Michael, the texture maps for Dublin have no significant highlights. There is a little at at the corner of the eyes and tip of the nose. The painted-on hair is free of specular.

 

:::::: Opera :::::

Thanks for the info!  I like the textures, so they're now on my wishlist. I can live with the smaller speculars bagginsbill mentions below.

Best regards,

    Michael

Such lovely texture!  The third from the top of operaguy's pictures is a look I have seen from my Mom. LOL

I also thought it was very nice of the artist to include her thanks to bagginsbill in the description. Probably more people will see it there since many do not read the read me.

I said (to myself) no more V4 textures since I do have many but this is just to beautiful to pass up.

Quote - Such lovely texture!  The third from the top of operaguy's pictures is a look I have seen from my Mom. LOL I also thought it was very nice of the artist to include her thanks to bagginsbill in the description. Probably more people will see it there since many do not read the read me.

I said (to myself) no more V4 textures since I do have many but this is just to beautiful to pass up.

I agree - that does Danae considerable credit... shows a lot of integrity.

Danae wrote me a lovely note a couple days ago. I haven't had time to answer her. Hope she's reading. Thanks for the note and the acknowledgement, D.

I'm overwhelmed with work myself today, otherwise I'd be playing more with the texture and showing you guys stuff.

OK so I was wrong it was 0.85! I was sure it was 1! :-) I've been using BB's shaders and some variants since he first started posting them. Nice to see the Dublin texture set. I'm confused- did Danae acknowledge BB or not?It's gorgeous btw.

I have seen baby skin look like a scale setting of 1 was used- so there are real world examples. Most don't have the dreaded arm pit glow-or burned in lip speculars. It looks like chapped lips more than a disease. I had a similar results by creating a skin texture from some web pics of Megan Fox- the chapped lips look.

As I've said on the RDNA forums- the single click skin shader is no way as good as the scatter+ Blinn or Scatter + FBR. The FBR version is used in a product by Sureality called "Tamesis." I first saw the FBR technique used by Carodan on RDNA.I think the scale setting is also less than one- although I've reset mine to over one. I don't think 1.75 should be etched in stone-some people have a little more translucence than others.Maybe an OFFICIAL range of 1.2 to 1.75? Just kidding-but

 My usual strategy is just to load a full body Material I've saved- with one of the SSS setups from the forums-then substitute the new texture maps. I agree that turbulence is the way to go for bump maps- I dont use any of the greyscale versions of the texture maps anymore.

Quote - ... I'm confused- did Danae acknowledge BB or not?...

...

She did acknowledge Bagginsbill's work. Very nice of her, too! I was wrong.