Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=931999

Jeff, why are you moving this? I can only assume you have something to hide. Not an attack, just an observation.

Jeff asked this member to keep this here in this forum. This member did not listen.

Heh... Dammit sbertram, don't you know there are rules here? They are: 1. Your posts are subject to deletion or movement to another forum at the moderator's discretion. 2. The moderator knows all. 3. The moderator doesn't need to give you answers. 4. If you question the moderator's motives, he can give you a warning ( ESPECIALLY if there was an apology somewhere in the post - What were you thinking apologizing? Don't you know people have been banned for that before?! ) Please remember these unwritten rules when posting. And whatever you do, don't mail the following people: tammymc@renderosity.com timmc@renderosity.com audre@renderosity.com spike@renderosity.com Aww screw listing them all... Just pull the list off the "Team" page... And if you wish to not deal with having posts moved or deleted, just swing over to www.poserpros.com. Over there it's kinda like the wild west... everybody gets a gun, so be careful who you shoot at. :P Paul

"Jeff asked this member to keep this here in this forum. This member did not listen. " Is this an Arnold Schwartzenegger-esque way of saying "This member has been banned." ? Paul

Nope, I am telling you why this post was moved here.

No kidding Entropic. This is a rather childish display of power. Spike, well we've got you here. What exactly is moron factor. Was he banned?

No worries, Spike... maybe Jeff should get this one moved to: http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?ForumID=12356&Form.ShowMessage=931005&Reply=931045 It's bothering me because it's so unrelated to Poser... Spike, you realize this whole thing would have quietly resolved some time ago had he just left the post? Everyone had had their say, and it wasn't too much "clutter." No moreso than the "Victoria Daz" interview or the post to tell us who won the world series, neither of which assist me in any way to make better Poser imagery. I'm sure Jeff's taken off for a bit, though, so do please pass these thoughts on to whoever up there decides what gets cut and what stays. It's a bit ludicrous, and generally makes you guys look far worse than it makes the "offender." I may not be a PR champion, but I figure if you folks are going to be biased, you should at least practice for a while at some basic customer service first. Paul

yawn ~S

Lapis, I wouldn't wail to hard on Spike. He's only doing what he was requested to do, which implies that the decision was made, and Spike's got to enforce it, regardless of whether he likes it or not. He doesn't have any moderating powers in the Poser forum. That's not to say that Spike hasn't practiced his own charming brand of biased enforcement of the rules, only that this once, he's not to blame. Paul

This was wrong. Very wrong.

Who made the decision that spike had to carry out. Sorry, didn't know there was a mod hierarchy. I agree with your assessment of this kind of mamby pamby action which just makes mods look silly when they act this way. All it does is fan the flames higher.

Well thank's Paul, As a matter of fact, I do have full power in all the forums, All Admin do. If you look at the team contact page, note the names listed under admin, we all have the same power.

Cross post there Lapis, BTW, I didn't carry anything out

This whole deal kind of reminds me of Juliani's approach to dealing w/ the homeless. Out of sight, out of mind--right Spike?

And POWER is what this is all about huh!

Giuliani? Goolyannie? Rooty tooty Juliooti?

I have not been following this mess to well, Need time to look at all the facts. Lapis, Not sure where you are going with that remark, What are you saying here? I can't help get this resovled if everyone wants to through fire..

....poserpro's...??...blech!...speaketh for yourself... If your gonna advertise for them then I will speaketh thus... Don't bother hangin' there....maybe they don't move the posts or delete them or even ban ya...but they will subject you to an even worse belittling tar and feathering at the discretion of their forum all mighty queen bee herself. Everybody has a GUN allright...(unfortunatly the boss lady herself has the biggest and ain't afraid to use it first and ask questions later), and they 'will' shoot you so full of holes your inspiration will drain out in twofold and then they will squash what's left and deal it out as kindling wood and oatmeal sprinkling... Just don't ever get on their bad side and you'll be okay...if your not me...your more than half way safe...I was lucky and got away with my spleen intact... I think I'll just take my chances with JeffH, the many HairBall clones and all the other coolies here...and keep my spleen nice and safe...;-)

I have nothing personal against you spike. I am just wondering if you could explain why some posts find their way to the graveyard at God speed and other posts, which are even more off topic, remain for all to see for eternity. Also, I find it rather strange that a mod can get away with refering to patrons of this site as "moron factor", yet a person who made a public apology is now banned because he wanted to make sure that people actually saw the post. Not really very fair!

I'm working on losing my liver Pete.

Spike-- Maybe he means that the way these posts keep jumping around seems like a fairly arbitrary and thoughtless way of trying to stifle what seems to be a legitimate discussion. Pete-- Dude--no shit. I posted something HERE that was critical of Poser Pros recent policy changes and the whole crew came over to R'osity and gang-tackled me. Yikes.

Maybe if you and Pete stuck to the truth once in a while and stopped sounding like broken records, members wouldn't complain about you all the time and Mehndi wouldn't have to step in? Sheesh. Why is every subject an excuse for your personal grievances that have nothing at all to do with the subject at hand???

Mosca you have paraphrased me correctly. You've been cheatin with them there Coles notes again, haven't ya. Liver still intact...so far.

YoUaLlAReStUpId

Dang, that didn't take long. They're everywhere! What did Mehndi step in, exactly? And I'm a little worried about the state of ScottA's liver right now, to tell you the truth... martinis, anyone?

ScOtTaIsNoTsTatElIvErIsNiCeWhEnSeRvEdWiThCrAcKeRs

I was thinking of a different organ actually. The one that rhymes with pain. As in pain in the*#!#.

"Well thank's Paul, As a matter of fact, I do have full power in all the forums, All Admin do. If you look at the team contact page, note the names listed under admin, we all have the same power." I was referring to the fact that you generally aren't going to override another admin's decision Spike. AFAIK, once Jeff decided the course of action on this, you're generally going to defer to his judgement. I know exactly what you have the ability to do, and not to do, Spike, and was trying to let Lapis know that if it was going to get resolved, you weren't one of the "bad guys." Coincidentally, I don't really care if this one post got moved to the FN&TC forum, but if you're going to pull the switcheroo with one off topic post, then you should damn well be doing it to all of them. There's a post in the Poser forum from a while back where Steve Cooper asked people to send his son stamps. That doesn't have shit to do with Poser, but it stayed. I'm not saying I dislike Steve ( or his son Cooper ), quite the opposite. I do dislike the bias involved in enforcement of the TOS, even though I feel I have, at times, benefitted from it. If Renderosity is a business, then its employees need to start being business-like, which implies unbiased unilateral enforcement of policy. Insofar as your special bias, Spike, I've seen you come down fairly more often than not, and I'm not going to dredge up months of forum history, as that wouldn't be terribly constructive. I will say that after one particular event, I will trust you to review this decision moreso than I would trust any other member of the administrative team. Paul

Well spoken Paul.

[Maybe if you and Pete stuck to the truth once in a while...].... Excuse me..??...You calling me a liar??...pretty nervy there eh... I would be very careful if I were you on that remark...I happen to be far too open and honest which IS what get's me in so much fuckin' trouble around the forums...time and time again... I didn't ask to get picked on by her majesty, she chose to use me as a pin cushion to make everyone see just how much power she can have over a male member she has personal issues with...of course, I can see how many fans she has all over so...Mosca, I really have to agree with you for once... Lapis...still holding onto my spleen... If anybody else wants to come play "pick on me" from the poserpro gang..."have at me then"...I really don't give a friggen shit...I already told them all to go BITE ME... As far as re'trailing a thread...like I am the "only" one that does that eh...besides, wasn't me that brought that up...was Paul...and really...it's all one in the same since we're talking about "forum ethics and morals" here...basically...mainly "staff" towards the "members"...and THAT poserpro incident is a GOOD example of how NOT to conduct oneself especially as an exalted leadership...but I won't hold my breath it won't happen again to some other unfortunate soul member...you can bet on it...

Perhaps there should be a new forum created, called "Shit". Then you could move all the on-topic posts there.

Pete, I don't know what happened with you, but I haven't had any problems over there for some time. And as for "picking on you" I sincerely pray for your immortal soul that you didn't just imply I'm part of a "PoserPros" gang... I think that with any amount of research whatsoever you'll find that on a given day I'm as likely to tear into Mehndi and Russ as I am to tear into DAZ, Rosity, or anyone else who mistreats their membership. Now, Pete, we've had discussions about you losing your temper, and they generally build until you blow, and then within a week you're apologizing. So, once again I'm asking you to go drink a beer, smoke some pot, whatever, so that you get your perspective back, man. There's no need for you to get yourself banned over someone making a snide remark, even if you do take it to heart. Beyond that, if you really want to fight this out, go over to PoserPros, you won't get banned there. :P (Just teasing, Pete... We can agree to disagree on this one) Paul

"Perhaps there should be a new forum created, called "Shit". Then you could move all the on-topic posts there. " Now you've done it Legume! You're going to get this thread moved to Community Ideas! :P

Uh, Paul, Thanks I think.. I will do my best to get to the bottom of this. On a side note, Thoese of you that are sending "Fuck you" e-mails to us, Please remember that this also breaks the TOS. :) I realy want to get to the bottom of this matter, Please give us the time to pick up all the crap... Thanks Spike

This is one of those moments where you think, hey, maybe there should be a forum just for this kind of stuff. And then you say, oh, right, C&D.

Are you telling me Steve Cooper's son is named Cooper Cooper? Is he any relation to Major Major Major?

Better yet, I told him to buy Copper a Copper so it would be Cooper Cooper's Cooper.

Yeah....I once saw your post over at poserpro's and how you once got into it with em....you got pretty damn huffy and puffy......okay...cool...so you all made up and kissed things better...I also DID apologize to her 'royal one' many times over both in private and openly....as well as to others I have had my own guilt over thinking I wasn't thinking clear at one time so I was being unfair and nasty...some people like Jack for example have come to be incredibly good friends again with me and are very understanding, and I really respect that and cherish it...we all have our problems... I do not, however, appreciate being "stabbed" in the back by others, one of whom I haven't even mentioned her name....for all you know I can be talking Candice Bergen or Whoopi Goldbeeg or anyone...I don't think any person needs to be pissed on for no good reason especially after they did attempt to apologize....something just not quite right there...not at all... As for my bad temper...you have yours too Paul...I have seen it...me...I actually have too long a fuse...I like to think I get extremely "frustrated" with the lunacy and idiocy and then, after a while...yeah...I get real pissy....I think I do have that right, others do so why not I too...hell, I say sorry enough...and I never, hardly ever see anyone ELSE say sorry after they lose it all over the place or act imbicelic...they just kinda sweep it under some rug...and then go back to whatever like nothing happened... I am not mad at you Paul....just replying to you.....

Btw, Spike, you mentioned in another thread that Admin are members, too. I don't really want to e-mail tammy about Jeff's personal attacks ( calling members morons ) because I think that would be just a shitty kinda thing to do to a guy I generally like well enough. But I would appreciate it if, in the few hours I do spend here in a week, I didn't have to deal with ANY personal attacks, whether they are being made by Joe Schmoe or the Pope. Ta-ta for tonite. Cheers! Paul

A rant thread--cool. I think we all need a little catharsis (which is kind of like a little pregnancy, if you think about it). Group hug, anyone?

[On a side note, those of you that are sending "Fuck you" e-mails to us, Please remember that this also breaks the TOS. :)].....wow....is this actually happening??....or am I just gullible enough to actually believe this...??? If it is....man...that really sucks...where did all the professionalism go huh??...that is just as bad if not worse than what all are trying to accuse Jeff or whomever of here....fer shame...two wrongs do NOT make a right at all....they just make more wrong and it gets nowhere... (I keep telling this to myself as well...sometimes I just don't listen well either...;-))

For the record, I've only apologized to Liz and Russ once, and it was over something that was basically out of my control ( someone made an editorial decision that affected many people I'd attempted to mention in an article ). Also for the record, I'm not sorry about my earlier bombardments of PoserPros, as they were completely right at that time. If PoserPros signed with DAZ today, I'd be right back in trenches with my flamethrower. But they haven't been making shitty site policy lately (or at least I haven't seen it if they have), so I go there when I want to speak my mind. I come here when I have specific reason. Paul

Posting it here does the same thing, Tammy will see it. Fact.. Have a good one.. See ya in the AM..

G'Nite!

One question: why would anyone aspire to be a Moderator?

It's gotta be the money. It's just gotta be.

Well....maybe to some...can't speak for everyone....for others...it can be the "power" thingy which I "think" is a part of what the accusation is here... ...but...it "should" be a community spirit thing...more...a need to help...share knowledge...be a more internal part of all the good things and reasons people keep on returning to a forum...to be able to nourish and fuel the membership and all else that makes a site such as this "work" for it's "best" intentions...to communicate, aid, make certain things work properly... ...oh frig, this is all just going to get me in trouble...time for me to go chill for a bit...

The mods only make pennies per day. If they ARE doing it for the money. Then I want to hire all of you right now! I've got a yard full of leaves. And a pocket full of change. That's DOUBLE what you'd make here in a day. :-) ScottA

Hey--isn't that animation a violation of the TOS? (running for cover---)

(running for cover---)......dang lil weasle....jus' wait...;-)

I'm always late to the party, pete have you been a moderator yourself? (not a personal attack, just a question) I did it for nearly a year on IRC & it drove me totally batshit, it was fun for about 5 mins then it became a real pain in the whatsits, so I can't see any reason for people to really want to do it for the perceived power they would have, still have to stick to the TOS even up near the top of the pile.