surfing thru some dudes gallery , and found this comment-- "...and to think you're limiting yourself to Bryce to create these marvelous images. I wish you were able to upgrade to Lightwave or Maya...that would be amazing...! arrrr it makes me mad. even if i could afford those programs.....arr...i still would use bryce. oh well sorry i tired and angry

What he needs to say is, "and to think you're limiting yourself to Bryce to create these marvelous images. I wish you were able to upgrade to Lightwave or Maya...that would be amazing.......................................and you'd probably do the same quality of work in most aspects." I understand Bryce isn't the 'industry standard' with making movies and games, but it's an easy program to learn and use, especially for the weekend warrior that doesn't work in CG as a full-time job. Working with Bryce COULD someday lead to CG jobs where they use LW or Maya...but until then, if you use Bryce, roll with what you have. I love Bryce, it's taught me so much about the 3D world, to me that alone already says it has done it's job. Making cool images is all bonus! I've seen stuff done w/ Bryce that could only be matched in the other programs...Bryce IS capable, and people just won't give it the credit it deserves. MD

To equal what you can do in Bryce would take a lot of expensive plugins in those other programs (not to mention the expense of those programs, and the larger learning curve of those programs when compared to Bryce...I am going on my experience with the demos of those programs). Why spend so much money just to bring those other programs up to what you can accomplish with native Bryce? Chalk up those kind of snarky remarks to ignorance, Woodhurst.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=445676&Start=1&Artist=RobertJ&ByArtist=Yes

about the same amount of time. woodhurst, who's the guy who said that, i feel the need for some flaming :) drac

It's an old issue, Jordan... welcome! :) No problem, you have the skills to demonstrate that Bryce can do wonderful things. Just keep posting... and let them babble. The real skilled artist shows off in every gallery (I'm thinking of Moebius in the Lightwave, for example, or linkinpark & pupi in the C4D, just to name a few)... but, as someone said in this Forum not so much time ago, it's a fact that while in the high-end galleries most of the works are simple displaying of models, in the Bryce gallery you see more attention to the artistic composition and the "idea" behind the image. I think the main goal of everybody should be upgrading their (ours) skills, before upgrading the software... LOL :) S.

And if they say anything about the limitations of Bryce as a modeler, just thumb your nose at 'em and download yourself a copy of Wings3d (its free, and fairly easy once you figure it out.) Bryce imports common model formats just fine, provided that the built in booleans and primitives can't do what you need.

Ahhh the old adage...Mine is better then yours....The only reason why Bryce is not mentioned along the lines of Maya or Max is because we cant use Plugins or such and even not being able to import animations and being able to export models into a useable format in other programs about did Bryce's future in,I hope it isnt true I will always use Bryce just for fun but I also know that to get the high payin jobs in the gaming/movie industry you better learn the higher end programs....One thing is for sure...With me learning Truespace6 and being able to import my models into Bryce and use in my Art is awesome,I would love to be able to import Poser animations I want to so bad I can taste it,But since that doesnt seem to be going to happen I might have to venture towards Vue and mover4...DO NOT get me wrong I will still use Bryce....I also hear that folks are working on trying to figure out how to import your Bryce scenes into Vue4....

i've got strata 3D, C4D, and the demo of maya (which i can't use 'cos i need an NT based OS) but bryce is so much easier, simple, sexy? and under-rated. it does some funky stuff the others can't even attempt. which seem to have slipped my mind at the moment..... John

thanks guys--- i dont HATE lightwave or maya, or 3ds or anything, it just gets on my nerves when you see ppl who have spent alot of money and time to learn these programs, but produce things ive seen rudy, alvin, stefano, and countless others produce far better, THEN they go around shunning bryce simply cuz its bryce. its 3d racism i tell you! pS, i know this is an old issue, but its jst now REALLY getting to me. anywayz sorry jst woke up:)

The only complaint I have about bryce (ONLY) is the renderer... I wish that it could use render nodes & rendering agents like YAFRay or POVray or Renderman or FinalRender... Bryce would be so much less under-rated if only its rendering ability was better. If you then added a nurbs/patch/spline modeling tool... Bryce would be at the top. But, there are ways around the substandard rendering agent, unfortunately they require large render times that aren't suitable for animations etc. I tried maya learning edition and in my eyes, it's overly complicated, and doesn't let the user bring his or her vision to life as bryce does. You can do anything with bryce, from cartoonlike renders to complex photorealistic renders. It's all up to the user.

Hey everyone... Ok, Im gonna get flamed here for sure but it needs to be said. Bryce is a great piece of software. Excellent way to learn the basics and get yourself started. BUT... it really doesn't compare to Lightwave or Maya or any other industry standard. Sure, you can make nice images in Bryce the same as you can in anything else but, and I speak with considerable experience, Bryce can only be used for very limited things. Bryce is extreamly limited and for that I can understand why people give it the slag that they do. But Bryce is for most people a way to enjoy something without paying alot of money.. and thats the bottom line. -dash101

I agree only partially with you, Dash my friend. It's true that Bryce has obvious limitations, and now that I'm tweaking with Cinema4D I sure agree that the render engine is fantastic and the modelling is easy as honey, but... ... but I still have to see in other galleries the quality of the renders that you find every day in the Bryce gallery here. I'm talking average, mind me. And I'm talking about stills, I know that the animation capabilities of Maya, 3dsmax and the likes are not comparable to Bryce. Personally, I don't care much about animation, but it's me. But the fact remains. A couple of msg above, Ornlu said: "I tried maya learning edition and in my eyes, it's overly complicated, and doesn't let the user bring his or her vision to life as bryce does" and, having tried almost any high-end demo out there, I couldn't agree more with him. I'll be glad to hear your opinion. Ah, sorry, forgot to flame you... maybe next time :-) S.

Heh, not long ago I was browsing the Maya forum. Someone wanted to make terrains, and everyone told them to use Bryce or Terragen...odd that a peice of software costing thousands can't produce a better terrain than bryce. One good upgrade would put bryce right up there with the big dogs. Pity Corel didn't see that.

This has been an old line jordan... i had my fill with this see the "we brycers are...." thread started it and saw what it really means to be a brycer... to be honest... i use 3ds and cinema 4d now... and i love those programs especially when it comes to modelling... i can model complicated obljects with the least polygn count... BUT.... Bryce brings out the artistic side on me... yeah i have ambitions on hitting the animation industry, but thats yet so far i can barely see it... BRYCE is like a little brush i known thats called a MOPPET (chinese brush) true its just a cheap brush BUt it can compare to much more expensive brushes since its so versatile, you could do anything with it... it has both a sharp and a blunt tip do you follow me? If your a brycer, it doesn't mean your not as good as they are... they may be only good at fast renders but if we had a contest on creating atmospheric images at lighting speeds, well we would come out thriumphant... whatever they say, id still stick with Bryce till the time its going to get really old... but ven at that time im still going to be back to get great terain renders for the background.... and atmospheric scenes.... nuff said and hope your happy now... dash----i cant flame you, we share the same sentiments... hope nobody flames me... E

Im probably gonna get flamed for this too, but don't really care. Let me start off by saying I love Bryce, my fav program....BUT it will never be compared seriously with the high end (industry standard programs) for so many reasons Im not going to list them all (particle systems, nurbs, splines to name just a few). And the point is brought up that Alvin, Hobbit and rochr do incredible renders and this is absolutely true (a lot of my fav artists are Brycers...honestly)...BUT they are just that, renders...try to animate them or export those amazing characters they create for use in video games or other media and Bryce's limitations will quickly become realized. I'll point out an example of one of my favorite Bryce renders of all time, Flak's "The Siege". The image can be found here: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=322332 This is a prime example of an unbelievable render that would be nearly impossible to animate (I would be first in line to congratulate flak if he could do it though). ...alright thats enough of a rant

everyone made great points, i think we are all thinking the same thing here... obviously bryce cant compare to the animation aspect of maya, 3ds, or lightwave. but Im like stefano, when i think of bryce, i think of making a still image. i didt get bryce to do animation, although it does have some nice animation features. Ornlu took the words right out of my mouth, sure you can create some awesome stuff in those high-end progs, but it comes to a point where its so complicated and technical, that its hard to bring a vision or idea to life, and when you do. oh well---im glad everyone shared their opinions! have a great day all.

Innovator wrote -> "I would be first in line to congratulate flak if he could do it though" * Flak breaks out a water cannon and disperses the line of one real fast *

Aye, Innovator. The true and initiating reason for 3D graphics is animation. That's where the money's at. I've used all of the high-end programs except C4D (gotta give it a shot soon!). And I agree, many of my favorite images are NOT animateable! The most powerful and devastating iteration of 3D-graphics is, and has been for years, the Unreal Engine. Anyone who has seen Unreal Tournament 2003 or Unreal II will understand what I mean. It does things in realtime that rival any pathetic pre-rendered CGI movie (Final Fantasy Movie, AniMatrix, both of which of course I DO love to death)! Still, it has limits, like shadowmaps instead of Ray-tracing, no true self-shadows... But oftentimes, even Unreal isn't very artistic. I mean, it never inspired any emotion in me besides awe. No real anger, no real sorrow, no real love. On the other hand, to complete my comparison, lies Morrowind. Which is not only the greatest RPG ever made, but is also breathtaking and inspiring! Vast mountains, vistas, beautiful foliage, RIDICULOUS architecture that rivals almost ANY art I've seen from Bryce, 3DS Max, or Maya! BUT the graphics in Morrowind are not nearly as complex as the Unreal Engine's, and yet the game is much more evocative and pleasing, and fulfilling. So, technical work doesn't really mean much to my heart. The image is everything. I dont' care what program someone uses, as long as their image is REALLY theirs, and the artist put work into it, and their emotion and technique is true. Most technical work doesn't spark any emotion at ALL in me. Look at the Maya or Lightwave gallery, there's very little real emotion there. But lots of hard work, nonetheless... And my guess, Woodhurst, is that whoever said that to you has a much less impressive gallery than you do! Just ego talking...

hm, Innovator, I don't thing you'll get flamed. Not by me, at last :) ___ that's because I think you're right. Spot-on right about animation, IMO, even if probably Clay could prove the contrary :) In my posting above, I said that I don't care about animation. But of course many people do, specially if they want to make a try in the gaming/movie industry. My point was of a different nature: I just noticed that, if you look for "artistic" images, it's easier to find them in the Bryce gallery rather that in the others (of course with the exceptions of the case). S.