hey .. just dropped in to mention that I'm new to the site, and a profesional art critic. I'm currently using Poser for storyboarding at my agency and figured I'd come here to check out the community. I have to say that what I've seen today in the gallery seriously needs some help for the most part. Many technically sound pieces, but most lack a fundamental understanding of light, color and composition. So, if anybody wants a serious critique of their work, send the URL to me and I'll have a look. And to those I commented already today? let me know if you reowrk the piece and I'll have another look. Nice to meet you all, TigerShark PS remaining anaonymous 'cause I'm gonna seriously annoy somebody someday. Its just the nature of being a critic

but not, alas, a professional typist. Please ignore my spelling

First off what you see in the Poser Gallery is a mix between advance and beginner, professional and hobbyist. Before asking to critique others work, it might help to upload some of your own work so people can see you know what youre talking about.

i'm sure many people will be happy of ur assistance, but i hope you understand that many people are learning or/and just make renders for there personal enjoyment... I myself am a digital artist... I have sold my digital art to, and do commissions for shops & clubs... I have developed my own style.. my style of art isn't going for photorealism, its more fetishy/pinup... so i don't know what you'd make of it. I have 4 years of actual art training with real mediums, then discovered the digital and haven't put 'pen to paper' since! So for the galleries here, go gentle on them. Remember to bare in mind many people do it for a hobbie and fun, they are not trying to be professional about it. -SimderZ- xXx

we have plenty of rude critics for us hobbyists, we don't need another....

I don't want to sound offensive, but i neither desire or need your critiques. I don't if your statment came across wrong, but I am sure many here will find it slightly presumtuous on your part.. Sorry if i caused offense, just stating what i feel

I'm attempting to be helpful and offering professional level citiques. If you don't wish them .. don't email me. Very simple. For those who wish to improve their work, no matter what level they are at, feel free to contact me. As I'm not an artist myself, posting my work would be less than pointless. To prove what I can do? alas, I am in a bind .. the best I can offer is to critique someones image publicly, here where all can see. But I think that would be contrary to the purpose of this forum, no? Simderella, I fail to see why you felt the need to tell me you didn't need my opinion, but I shall bear that in mind. Thank you for your charm and courtesy. TigerShark

I'm still a beginner, and I'll never be a pro. But always looking for guidance in lighting and composition. Be glad of any critiques you care to make on my stuff, which you can see by clicking on my name above -- and yes I have a thick skin ;-)

Well, if you can't help yourself, then how are you going to help others? ;) We get people in here all the time claiming to be professional critics. And all they want is a badge to go and rip others work to sheds. Kind of like what your screen name implies.

"As I'm not an artist myself, posting my work would be less than pointless. To prove what I can do?" Sounds like another troll to me.

Which gallery? Poser? Maya? Cinema 4D? All of them? Look, man, sorry, but here (at Renderosity) it is about helping others out, giving each other positive feedback and honest critique, not just some lofty write-off. Giving advice which will truly lead to better renders.

Furthermore, a lot of the people giving feedback and advice at Renderosity are professional still and motion picture artists, as well as hobbyists. A place where professional and hobbyist alike can come together and learn. And showing up and saying "I'm a pro art critic..." just seems a little pretentious and off-putting. And before you claim that "the gallery" is all bad, I suggest you have a look around all the galleries of Renderosity. Furthermore, this is an art site, and as a pro art critic, you should know that art separates from reality and does whatever the artist wants, not adhere to some arbitrary set of rules.

No anger intended. Just throwing down the truth.

if you provide some reference to what your critiques are like, would be helpful for people to see if your opinion is valuable. personally, I prefer the critique of professional art directors and artists myself, someone with a resume. Actually, that person is my uncle, who worked as an art director for a major publication for 20+ years. you have to understand, that not everyone is going to like critique, and its good to couch critique in a way that you are giving pointers to improve the work, not tear it down. The objective is to produce a better piece of artwork, so think of yourself as a teacher, not a critic. Also it helps to understand the media you're critiquing, because if you don't understand it, you may not know what its limitations are, and not be able to give appropriate pointers in how to improve as a result.

ROFLMAO - I think considering the reviews I've seen you give all across the Poser Gallery I'd prefer to know your credentials. I've always been amused by the "I'm not an artist myself but..." mentality. Art is a state of mind and heart (Picasso is a good example - can't stand his surreal images, but it spoke what was in his mind), what you don't like doesn't make your point valid. An example of that would be your "critique" of the image "Persephone" it was created as an "artistic vision" something a "critic" should be aware of. As for your comments - you don't care if you are emailed a request or not, you just hit the galleries and shredded. Personally I could care less about your commentary on my image, I do sell my artwork so I prefer to listen to the voices of those who enjoy my work enough to pay for it. I will say however that your comment seemed to show a lack of knowledge or understanding. On occasion an artist intentionally centers and creates in a specific direction that is where the "balance" is aimed. I'll be interested to see the types of comments you leave for those members here who are either Art teachers/professors or hold an art degree. But hey - you sure know how to make an impression as a newbie.

Looks like i did offend but it wasn't my intension.. Its just i have read the comments you have left on peoples work... and some of it agree with.. but art is up the artist, and many people here do this purely for fun.. Also u've got to see that its not all about going for total realism.. I don't go for realism, to me its all about expressing my style & feeling through my art... I would hate to know that if i left an overly critical comment on someones work, it made them feel so crappy that they gave up posting here.. thats all i was trying to point out.. I do understand that the comments box is there for um comments and negative or positive if you allow comments to be given you have to be prepared for what you get, i believe in a little sensitivity and maybe pointing out some good things too.. I didn't want you to take my thoughts the wrong way, I was just trying to pint out how some may feel here, as i have been a part of this community for sometime. anyhoo... now i am very interest to know what you would think of my work, so perhaps i spoke in haste. Honestly I really do have charm and i would hope a modicum of courtesy.... ;) Enough of my rambling, i need a cup of tea!! hehe -SimderZ- xXx

.... i must say this ... I value the opinions of my fellow artists here at ReRo..... BIG HUGS ALL.... you all rock & shine in your own unique ways!!!! YAY US!!

I'm currently using Poser for storyboarding at my agency & of course As I'm not an artist myself, posting my work would be less than pointless Interesting - you state "agency" to imply validity (advertising?) and yet you are not an artist.

yeah I just read the critic on Lady Silvermage, and have to say, I do agree with it... but... remember Poser 4 and Poser 4 ProPack both do NOT do refraction, or reflection well at all. (poser 5 does in a fashion, but its not the most spectacular) All that has to be painted, or use a photoshop plugin like Aurora if you use Poser 4. So she's at a bit of a disadvantage there. I'd like to know what the camera settings were on the image.

My uncle isn't an artist either. He bought artwork and photography for a magazine. Big difference. Still is very active in the antiques scene. have to say, I do not post every bit of artwork as a masterpiece. Some stuff I post here is for fun, some of it is stuff I really want a solid crit on. It just depends.

The value (and credibility) of someone's critique depends on the quality of the art posted in their gallery.

That just isn't true. Critics often aren't artists, musicians, actors, etc.....you can have a keen sense of art without trotting around your degree to shove in everyone's face just as you can have perfect pitch and never have studied music. A critical eye is a speciality in itself...and artists often don't own it themselves. Having said that, I also would say that no one is necessarily who they say they are on the Internet (yes, it's been said before...because it's true) so don't take anyone's criticism at face value (unless you want to).

not always, MM. There are a LOT of people that post here that do not have a gallery on Renderosity, but have a body of work 'somewhere' ... just because its not here doesn't mean it doesn't exist. most magazine editors and art directors are also ... NOT artists. But they know what they want, and have a trained eye. Not fair to say they aren't qualified either. But the diff is, the latter group usually has a lot less TIME to give their opinions here. I know I have to send the stuff to my uncle myself, he sees the internet as some kind of beast that he wants nothing to do with.

I have to jump in here and say that most people you will be trying to sell your art to are not likely to be artists themselves - they may have an educational background in art. However, they're the people who have to want to buy your work. However, Tigershark, here you probably should wait to be contacted by people who want your critiques - many people who post here aren't even interested in being professionals and therefore probably also aren't interested in a serious critique, may even find it offensive. There's a few forums over at cgtalk.com that are set up specifically for people interested in having professional critiques of their work. There's nothing like that here, although it might be a good idea.

I think its a good idea too, it would be good to have a wip forum expressly for critiques on renders and modeling... you post there, you know what's coming! g

No disadvantage at all bijouchat - I could have put the reflections in via postwork and in fact did at one point, but I disliked the effect and chose to remove them. As I chose to remove the plants I had added as well. I found them to be distracting from my point of the image. As for the comments regarding the need for horizontal lines - why? I could have draped ivy but that would have defeated that I had specifically removed the top of the image to imply a heavenly infinity . Woman is centered as a power point between the vertical columns which imply a grounding as there is intentionally no ground or background other than the heavens. But you see all of that is my poespective of what I was intending for the image. I'd have to check but the camera angle was at 150mm and angled out and down a bit (just slightly I didn't want to actually be looking "in" the pool). My uncle was a professional artist for many years and worked for years as the Arizona Highways magazine cover artist. My father was a dabbler as was/is my mother. Doesn't mean much, only that I grew up around it. I have my own critic anyhow, a grumpity (is that truly a word lol) older woman who was an artist for a NY advertising agency back before women were accepted in that line of work. Man, she can be brutal! but I know her and respect her opinion. To be honest - anyone who views an image is a critic. As for this image the version on my site (which is slightly different) has actually already been sold today as a print within a few hours of my posting it - so someone must like it (although they are a regular buyer...). And all who view images are critics anyhow. I simply have an issue with anyone who suddenly appears and takes apart every image with comments enabled (it explains why so many gallery images today had the comment option turned off) and claims he's a professional. Many images I viewed earlier that he commented on have now had their comments turned off - but not once did he leave a comment that an image was good. Then he comes here and says he'll critique upon request...

Well it is nice to meet you too. Be kind. Sharen

I don't give a damn who says what - or why - about my images. Anyone who looks is welcome to leave a comment, no matter what. I regard this place as a wall in the city; every so often I go and post up a picture, so that passers by can view and leave their reactions. FWIW, I do believe TigerShark is a troll, but so what? Even trolls have opinions. I'm not so scared of an adverse reaction that I'd disable comments from my work. Believe it or not, I know what's good and what's bad about my stuff (most of the time), so I ain't fishing for praise.

I would like to see an image that TigerShark DOES find artistically 'sound', created by someone that he feels has an understanding of light, color, and composition. Although I personally feel that anyone who acts like a critic should have pictures in their gallery, I would be much more willing to take his suggestions more seriously if I could see what he deems to be a quality image. This isn't intended to be an insult directed to him, I would just like to see his idea of good art before he passes judgement on anyone else's. Thanks, take care. SnowS

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=467406

Troll.

Sweet shooting, bijouchat.

I no longer think Tigershark is really a professional, if he had a background in art history he'd have known that Egypt was and IS a multiracial society, and was even more of one back in the Bronze age. There are white people in Africa and ALWAYS HAVE BEEN... and if you would take a look at the depictions of Syrians in Egyptian art, you'll see they are all white. Berbers are fairer in skin colour, its a known fact. thanks for the camera settings Lady Silvermage... I was curious, as Poser drives me nuts to get a decent perspective that I'm happy with, and leads to the perception of renders looking flat. I pretty much stick with a 50 mm lens for wide angle views, that's pretty close to the human eye, but it looks weird in Poser a bit for some reason. Not your fault. I hear you on not wanting critiques unless they are invited, I generally don't leave one unless I have something good to say as well.

bijouchat - I believe 65mm is pretty damn close to the human eye's focal length. I have to disagree with you on the "something good to say" remark. All comments - and that includes the comments of a complete and utter f*ckwit - are welcome and valid, else we run the risk of preaching to the converted and/or becoming a back slapping society. That's not to say I'd just rip into someone's work for the hell of it, but if I think a piece is shoddy, I will say so. For sure, I'll try to say why. Maybe that's the difference between insult and reasoned criticism. But for myself, I really don't care.

Actually I don't mind critiques at all I have received some that I felt were well deserved and that have helped me to improve. And I'm aware of the no-no that placing a figure in the center often is. There are simply times that I believe that breaking "the rules" works for the intent of an image. An image should be taken as the whole of what it is - not a concept of what art "should" be. That said had his critique been simply the centering or the water that would have been either ignored or considered (although I'd already done the reflections and discarded them). It was the comments implying that a purely vertically (or horizontally) aimed image is wrong somehow. I shrugged it off as his opinion - until I began to read the gallery and saw that all the images uploaded in the same time frame that still had comments showing had a negative comment on them - some of them were just "historical" but not truly valid "critiques". That's when I became annoyed. Couldn't care less about his opinion on my work (and only one image at that) but when I see that he is apparantly just looking to stir the post with all the artists it makes his "critiques" far less valid.

Good call Bijou. I don't want criticism from someone who does not have a working knowledge of the program I'm using. Especially criticism of lighting, which is not our friend in Poser.LOL. Someone who understands the workarounds necessary for the limited render machines Poser 4 and Poser 5 have is invaluable. Something tells me Tigershark is not it. I try to give useful critiques occassionally in the galleries when my hands can stand the typing. If I've ever been helpful, I'm grateful, and if I'm ever too heavy handed, please let me know. Emily

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/gallery.ez?ByArtist=Yes&Artist=Rhiannon

lol at rhiannon - hon your work is fabulous although you center your characters in several, that'll get points off ya know wink

quote "Good call Bijou. I don't want criticism from someone who does not have a working knowledge of the program I'm using." That's how I think most of the time too. Its hard to appreciate the work I put into modeling and shaders if you haven't got any idea of the work that's involved in it. When I want an art directors critique, a person that's in the industry, I'll go to someone I know that's in the industry whose opinion I can respect, not someone that hides behind anonymity. When I want a fellow artists critique, I want to know what programs they have experience with. I want them to be able to provide me feedback and most importantly... TIPS on how to fix my image, technical tips that come from someone that knows the tools I am working with. Poser is definitely not anyone's friend with a lot of this stuff. Realism is best tried in other programs, and that's why I use Carrara to render and not Poser. That being said... I think its a feat when someone is able to get something really photoreal out of Poser, its really hard to do. Its something to brag about, even.

Welcome to the forum and I hope you have a warm and wonderful time in the community. That being said, I don't hold a high opinion of critics of any sort. So often I highly disagree with what one has said of some movie, book, food, art, dog, ect. that I tend to take his/her opinions with a pinch of salt, just like I take everyone else's.

NUff...said! tigershark.next be nice and take out the "pro" and be a little more subtle with the hand out. advice and comments are welcome...just drop a line if you see something but please...this place is haven of great artist whose tool is just being born. We definitely have grown and evolved far from the caveman art critique whose piss is a vote of "yuck".

Hmm i think what everyone is trying to say is... Post your resume so we all can see it and decide if we should value your opinion or tell you to STFU Just my take on this.

Those who can't do, teach. Those who can't teach become critics. Don't remember who said that, but I tend to agree with it. :) Kate (who is not an artist, never claimed to be an artist, doesn't WANT to be an artist, will punch out anyone who ACCUSES her of being an artist, and thinks critics are one step below lawyers) P.S. That means that I only want warm fuzzy comments on my "work" if you feel you must comment at all. :P ** goes off to remove her tongue from her cheek **

You're welcome to critique anything in my gallery, Tigershark. Not a whole lot in there I'd call artistic, but if you have a shortage of offers, then pick out 3-5 of what you consider the closest thing of mine you believe to be artistic and tell me their shortcomings. Thanks for your time.

"That means that I only want warm fuzzy comments on my "work" if you feel you must comment at all. :P" Hehe, evil old me just has to take a look now. :D Be right back.

OMG!!!!!!what can I say???!!! LOL

Critic... Sigh... A good critic comments on the merits of the work, and gives advice on how to improve. They are polite, and make encouraging comments and positive comments as well as pointing out the needs in the piece. A good critic doesn't hide because "'cause I'm gonna seriously annoy somebody someday". Annoying people with a critic doesn't help anyone. We need honest evaluation and helpful comments. We need encouragement. This isn't a professional artist site. We're mostly ungifted amatures sharing our limited vision. The one comment I've read by our new member wasn't actually too bad (I happened to agree with it, is what I mean). It was well worded, but not too negative. If I'd have gotten it, I'd have appreciated the advice. TigerShark, we've had problems with "critics" here. People who never post their own work, and only give negative, non productive comments. Most of us are VERY wary of someone who calls themselves "critic". We tend to hear "troll". A good critic would be welcome to the community. Especially if they can contribute to our growth. Another troll can take his "criticism" and shove it where the sun don't shine (somewhere on teh eastside of Portland). We're very defensive, both of our own work and those of our friends. And most of us here are friends. We'd love to critque some of your work too. Storyboards sound like lots of fun. Why not post a few and wait for the advice we give? And welcome to our community.

Feel free to critique my stuff. A lot of it is promo shots for clothing I put up in freestuff. It's my way of giving back to our little community. Hope you like homoerotic art (grin).

No offence, but I tend to paraphrase Barbara Cartland's immortal words whenever I see a critic that want to tell other people what to do with their work. She said, something like, "People that can't write a coherent postcard tell me how to write a novel...". How can you give effective critiques when you do not know the characteristics of the material, the limits and possibilities of a certain technique, the limits or possibilities of each color and how they fit with each other to achieve certain effects, the limit and possibilities of the apertures and focal lengths of the simulated cameras employed in this program? As I said, I mean no offence, but your critiques would for these reasons be near useless -- and all they would do is pamper to some sort of ideal of how art should be rather than how are is.

My point of veiw on comments, critics, etc... first off, I do this for fun - it's a hobby - it gives me a chance to get the pictures in my head on "paper" and to share them from time to time. second - I have to admit it makes me feel good to haev someone say "nice job - this really moved me/made me smile/made me think." Even though I don't do this for a living, I put a lot of work into making something good. Third - I really don't mind someone saying "this could be better, what if you tried doing this with it?". Constructive criticism is always welcome. fourth - It's even more welcome when they add "what you did with (insert pose, lighting effect, camera angle, etc) is really stellar. fifth - art is an opinion. There are many things I don't care for or "get" that I can appreciate for being well done, just as I apprecitate that what I think is incredible won't do anything for someone else. sixth - Just because you don't do art/music/write/etc, you can still set forth a valid opinion on what works and what doesn't. seventh - I've no opinion one way or another on tigersharks critics - only wanted to say that if s/he is doing it out of a desire to help out others, then cool - but I won't count tiger's opinion more or less then any of my fellow artists who submit here. If s/he is doing it as meanspirited then not cool - world's got enough negativity as it is. It doesn't need more. : ) just some thoughts. Rob

http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=467406 Came back as "Sorry, someone has deleted that item" Bummer, now I can't see what it was :-(

Good points, Rob.

You wrote: > ... I'm new to the site, and a profesional art critic.... I see you've been given the grand reception. Something that you should be aware of is that this site regularily has people show up claiming to be good critics, and then proceed to increasingly savage artworks in the name of "honesty," focusing on those they find to be most sensitive, and enjoying the furore and controversy they create until they're finally banned as trolls. > I'm currently using Poser for storyboarding at my agency and figured I'd come here to check out the community.... Then it's my hope that you explore the software well enough to get a good understanding just how much can go into making a lot of the work here. A lot of folks are, after all, starting out with the same tools you have. And, what the hell, why not post a few as works in progress, or element studies? A credible critic will also take the effort to learn and respect the craft involved, and won't be afraid to admit to or show his/her own limitations. > ... most lack a fundamental understanding of light... Light is a particularily bad Achilles' heel in Poser4. I don't know that P5 is all that much better (I've heard it is). To really get good lighting, one needs to render in a prog that uses sophisticated ray tracing, or else to paint it in post work. So this one isn't entirely users' fault. A lot of folks here like myself are limited to poor-man's software (Poser4 and Photoshop6), and can't get the kind of renders you see out of Vue d'Esprit and Cinema4d. > PS remaining anaonymous 'cause I'm gonna seriously annoy somebody someday. Its just the nature of being a critic If you're on the level, feel free to have a look through my gallery. If you're just looking for fun, I don't participate in games and a trolling isn't going to faze me one bit. Take care; Chas