My bad...I forgot to announce the new Renderosity "Art Charts". Check'em out, & voice yer opinion!  ;o)

LINK

40 out of 50 pix POSER CRAP. Top 50 Artist POSER LOSERS. Top 50 merchants people selling crap to POSER LOSERS. I can see how things have improved. NOT.

Okay...

Cyba_Storm: Be honest mate, don't let anyone stop you from letting your true feelings be known!

OY...I feel my Drac blood count rising, but I won't go there. Bottom line: whatever keeps this site alive is OK.

(cherishing my "yin-yang")grin

ICM

well i used to get an occasional placing in the Bryce only chart but i guess i'll fade away when its a whole site gig or did i miss something, never mind maybe i should do more T&A.or even better a Fractal T&A.

"per" gallery art charts would be good, otherwise like it or not, Poser will dominate over everything.

Cyba_Storm does make a point. Most Poser art is unbelievably pathetic. Mostly it's the overabundance of zombie stares that tend to zone out my brain, but when you add in all the glowing and light filled nostrols, greatly exaggerated breasts and excrusiatingly bad poses....well then....you do have the sum total of crap produced by losers. This is not to say that all Poser images are crap, cause I have seen some truly creative and very well done images produced in Poser. Images that are just as good as anything seen in the galleries of cgtalk that were produced in programs that are alot more highend than lowly Poser. But the majority of images done in Poser, at least on this site, are nothing more than people playing with dolls, or little adolesent boys getting their kicks by overexaggerating the size of Vicks breasts. rj001...you and I are in the same boat. The Art Charts is nothing more than the Hot 20 morphing into the Hot 50 with now everyone playing in the same backyard.

Hmmm, how do I put this:

I agree: there is a lot of poser produced rubbish, I would like to see the charts available filtered for application.

I disagree: Some poser artists are genuinely that artist producing good stuff, and there is actually some good stuff in the chart.....

So I'm holding the middle line......

Lists that are based on the number of fav artists and fav images that people get in a week (like the new art charts) seem like most of the best art of the week will be left out.

IS there a fair way of doing this? I doubt it.

If it's based on votes, views, ratings, comments, whatever, someone will find a way to skew the results.

I'll just depend on getting ebots for MY favs, and do some occasional gallery surfing.

And we thought the old Hot20 was bad.

To do with the list of top images in the chart...

The current setup as I understand it simply favours the big galleries... which means byrce images would have a much better chance than say Lightwave of making the chart, but poser images would have the bext chance to make the chart (more images get posted to the poser gallery which means more people are viewing the images in that gallery, which means that more people will comment/fav the images than they would for a similar quality image in a smaller less viewed gallery).

I'd be curious to know what the list would look like if you normalized the numbers of favourites for an image against the number of images posted to that gallery, thus elliminating to some degree the inherent bias towards the more heavily posted to galleries.

But then... what would I know lol

        I do think it will end up being skewed. I can see rainbow pictures with rings of people who favorite them. There is no consideration for just plain number of views.People can come up with 10 freinds who will add images to their favorites and then they get in the top 50 easy as pie to rig it and it will be.

       There are more metrics to view pics on so that is kind of cool so there is a small improvement in some areas. I share Cyba Storms view of poser  but I also realize that is where Rosity's bread is buttered so it is a moot point.

   Maybe once ther ecan be art charts for different packages and even different Genres then that might get interesting.

Speak of the devil ... it is rumoured that there are those who don't need Poser to create characters. In the slumbering  proliferation of Poser characters these mighty magicians have been forgotten in the top twenty and lo scorned by those of lesser talents who deem Poser as the Be all and end all of characer creation. But buried deep in the bowels of a Bryce terrain work those who know the mysteries that soon will be revealed to and honered by all with unwashed minds. Until that day ....

sholan-tru,
-TJ(Mouse who rides a motorcycle - not mouse from BiKor provence) 

We need a change of culture in Rosity. We need people to rate any image they have a feeling about.  If you like it give it a top rating, but if you hate it nail it to the wall.  If POOR Poser images annoy you then rate them as crap. If Bryce images of WATER AND REFLECTIVE SPHERES get your back up, same deal.

We need it set up so you don't need to comment, just rate.

Don't use number of views, but peoples rating of the image. Change the rating system from 1-5 to 1-10. The top 50 images bases on average (After a minimum number of ratings.20??. ) then make the list.

Same with ARTISTS. An artist must have posted a minimum number of images. The artists with the top 50 averages make the list.

For the 3rd colomn remove Merchant, and highlight a different each month. STYLE. Sci-fi, Glamour, Military, etc.  This will encourage people to try that style, and possibly make the top 50.

Poser may tend to still dominate, but  ANY image with a high average has a chance of making the cut. A great photo, an interesting abstract, or a fantastic fractal with enough support can make the grade.

PS. I DON"T hate Poser. My FAVORITES contains Poser images. There are people who can make that program sing.  My gripe is with the lack of imagination, and skill level of the average user. I know it is hard to create props, and clothing. But you cannot take other peoples props, clothing and poses and expect the same rating as someone creating ALL of there own image. A lot of Poser users do.

Well the H50 is even more than the H20 a showcase of a popularity poll. Wich is good in my opinion, you people should go out to the galleries and admire the true talent and hard work that can be found there. As usual 90% of everything is crap, its that other 10% that makes it all worth it.

How about a rating ranging from -5 to 5?

"Top 50 Artist POSER LOSERS."

To observational and/or numerical incompetence you add logical incoherence.

"We need a change of culture in Rosity."

Not enough, apparently, for you to campaign for it in the location AgentSmith linked to. For the fastest change to your Renderosity cultural experience I recommend you duplicate your first post there.

       Thanks Bikermouse. Yeah I have been working my character modeling quite a bit latley. (much to the chagrin of those who like my airplane pics)

       Well took a quick look at the top 10. 2 photos 1 terragen piece 6 pieces of softcore poser porn and 1poser beaver shot. Hmmmm. I tend to agree with cyba storm.

      There generally is no appreaciation for the creative process and this is one of the reasons the people who actually are good are leaving. You certainly don't see the top people at CG talk posting here. Many did at one time but the cult of mediocrity drove them away. No respect for the creative process. The attitude of hitting your instant poser make people button is the same as building them up polygon by polygon.

   Personally I think there has been a change in culture here. It has gone from a general 3D site to a softcore porn station. (don't beleive me look at that top 50) Generally porn does not bother me but when I come to a 3D site I don't expect to get a barrage of it so I can't peruse the galleries without nudie thumbs and the like I have a family here I just want to look at airplanes and spaceships and cartoons. I think it is too much to ask.

@PJF: Getting the words POSER and CRAP in the same sentence on any link that links to the front page does not happen. I know. I've tried.

Like his name sake Agent Smith is a little less zealous than his masters where the Poser god is concerned. A fair hearing is possible here.

What, you mean to say you can't describe artists' work as "crap" and call them "losers" on the front page? How desperately unfair.
Thank God we're so much more tolerant in here.

"Well took a quick look at the top 10. 2 photos 1 terragen piece 6 pieces of softcore poser porn and 1poser beaver shot."

Softcore pornography:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1248072

Softcore pornography:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1248441

Softcore pornography:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1250498

Softcore pornography:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1251723

Here's a thought for you, Dann-O:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=188071

PJF From someone who has no gallery and no favorites you certainly like to stir the pot. I look at those things to determine how much I should value your opinion. Well you can guess how much I value yours.

You are probably a person who can't see a difference between making a poser pic and buiding up a character polygon by polygon. Sad thing is it a bit more difficult to pose people with clothes on then making nudie pics.

I probably should not have said softcore porn but nudie pics. I think there is so much more that can be done than what is done.  Remember this is supposed to be the best of the best.  You go to other 3D sites and look what is their best. What we have seems cheap and tawdry in comparison.

Rather than having one art chart, why not have (as well as or instead of ) seperate charts  for each gallery. The links to the gallery charts could be on one page headed 'Art Charts' (and perhaps just have  thumbnail or link of the current top image from each gallery on this page). That way there would be some appreciation of the great images that are produced by the less popular (ie less well known) apps. That's the one thing I did like about the Hot 20 - I could choose which gallery category to look at and quite often it introduced me to artist's work that I had never come across before.

There will always be someone that is not happy with whatever set up there is, but maybe this would be one way to go.

What about a new monthly feature on the front page looking at  the other various applications 2d/3d that make up the gallery headings or the people that use them (perhaps professional artists), and the things you can do with them to give an insight in to what else is out there apart from Poser?

There is nothing that can be done. It will always have to be based on something. And that something is always going to be effected by the artists amount of friends on the site. I just see this as another pointless addition for the artists on the site, and a grand addition to promote sales of products on R. Can't blame em. But I dont have to like it. haahaa.

Quote - "Well took a quick look at the top 10. 2 photos 1 terragen piece 6 pieces of softcore poser porn and 1poser beaver shot."

Softcore pornography:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1248072

Softcore pornography:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1248441

Softcore pornography:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1250498

Softcore pornography:
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1251723

Here's a thought for you, Dann-O:
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=188071

 

LOL.. you have a couple Portraits in there marked as Softcore Porn! WTF? I wouldn't go that far.

"I probably should not have said softcore porn but nudie pics."

Yes, that would have been better, for it would have confirmed that you either hadn't even looked at the top ten image favourites or you were clinically blind. The same possible problems appear to have inflicted your examination of my repost, for despite direct links to the full images you failed to see that three of top ten favourites you labelled "softcore porn" are not nude - two are head portraits that don't even go below the shoulder! Try the link I provided to the illustrious CGI Talk gallery image and have a careful look at what they show there.

** **

"PJF From someone who has no gallery and no favorites..."

Boring. The observation that I have no Renderosity gallery or favourites (I'm also wearing odd socks at the moment) has no bearing on the fact that what you said was demonstrably untrue. That's not a question of opinion, that's simply observable fact.

Also a demonstrable fact is that this website used to be called "Poser Forum Online". It did not start off as a general 3D site; it went from being a Poser user's website to a being a general online art community. Despite expanding to having forums for thirty-three CG programs as well as traditional arts, photography and writing (plus galleries for all those), it still retains its Poser momentum (especially in the store).

Also a demonstrable fact is that Renderosity has become less tolerant of sexually based images over time, along with being more restrictive of member expression in the forums (disneyfication is what the process is nicknamed). As for people leaving, PoserPros started in part because of the restrictions not for the lack of them.

It's quite amusing that you should accuse me of stirring the pot when you are openly bemoaning the progress of Renderosity with arguments based on untruths. Even more amusing is that your untruths are so easily exposed by anyone who can be bothered to look.

**
"You go to other 3D sites and look what is their best. What we have seems cheap and tawdry in comparison."**

Oh well, if it's so bad there's always the Bryce forum at CG Talk.

Oh, wait...

"LOL.. you have a couple Portraits in there marked as Softcore Porn! WTF?"

Not I, stiving. But yeah, WTF?

i said it once and i'll say it again....this site has gone to the dogs

Arf.

Oh the fun to be had at this site is overwhelming at times. rolf 8D

PJF you are still one of my favourite Brycers even if you don't have a pic in your gallery. 8)

The hot one doesn't bother me 'cos I've only ever had 1 image sent there and that just happened to be a nude rendered in Bryce, maybe I should do another one, maybe I'll get int the hot one again. lol 8)

Cyba_Storm has said exactly what I used to feel about this site when I first started, that was until I got my hands on Poser and discovered I rather like it. But what was said is still mainly true, you've got about 90% total crap and another 10% good to excellent in Poser land but if you take a good look at all the galleries then you will see that it's about the same rating for every kind of software out there.

Nuff said, I think I'll go render somethng, now which program should I use..............

Catlin

Personally i don´t care about the new Art Charts, but this is not exactly an improvement from the Hot20, it´s actually worse.
Apart from Czarnyrobert, Beton and very few others, it´s pretty much naked flesh all the way. And somehow i doubt that will change...

OK, this is my very first post. I spent a lot of time viewing the charts. I DID see a typically very uncreative tendency (in the nudie-soft-porn or whatever images) that was repeated a lot.

It's that tired old, same-O same-O look on the women's faces. I think somebody called it a "zombie" look, which was very apt. This is something you see on real porn pics, and it makes me laugh! The women lack facial expressions, unless you wanna count the look that makes them resemble somebody who is either about to vomit, or already has.

You know that look -- mouth gaping open and slack-jawed, eyelids half-closed, glazed look to the eyes. All that's missing is the chunks and drool! I often wonder how that look ever came to be considered as "sexy." It's ridiculous and it's way past time for a change. Who is up for leading the way?

If people are gonna render what they hope to be sexy images, I certainly hope they will seriously consider giving the women's faces some LIFE, some CHARACTER. And why not have the women actually doing something other than standing or sitting there doing nothiing? And I am not talking about  X-rated activities.

There is only one thing that I dislike intensly about poser (or at least the P4 I have) - the camera systems, each figure has it own camera. Whenever you try to create a multifigure group with interaction, switching from one to the next pops you around view-wise in a truly aggravating manner! Other than that, I find it a useful tool.
I don't think these art sheets are something I am really interested in.
Rendo is a general community now. That means rank amatures to seasoned pro's (and we do have a bunch (at least in the C4D forum)). Yes there are more over at CGTalk but that site is targetted at the professional user.

If artwork here should be judged, then why not use a +/- 5 rating system and use that to keep score. Then not only could there be a top 20, but a bottom 20 as well. It seems wrong, but curiousity would definitely get people (I know I would) to look at just how bad something must be to get the most -5 votes. Negative scoring could also balance out anything positive and vice versa, so the rating would probably be more fair.

As IO4 said on one of my post on this forum,  Brycers artists are often underrated,  and maybe Renderosity should do a category Merchant of the Month too, as well as an overall on, eg Bryce merchant of the month feature, or Vue merchant of the month feature etc.
The same it would have to be made on this  "new" Art Charts...
I have many Bryce stuff on sell on Renderosity and I earn some money selling in them , but also if I sell US $150 in a month (my top month sale during Christmas) I'm still around 350 in the top sellers chart (how much eran the people in the sellers top ten?).
I do my artworks ONLY because I like it and NOT because I want attention, but difficultly I will be the "Merchant Of the Month" or the "Artist Of the Month" with Bryce (and not even the others Brycers)
Perhaps the "quest for success" is only a (Poser?) "breast" matter... :(

I add to my reply above something more: a copy of an email (from another thread) that CrazyDawg Renderosity member sent to the Renderosity admin after recieving their newsletter.. He don't expect to get a reply from them... I totally agree with CrazyDawg...

Hi, i'm sorry to send you this email but something needs saying on this
subject.

First of all i have noticed that like most other sites Renderosity is
showing more interest in anything for poser. What i mean by this is you go
to the site and the first thing you see is a page full of poser items, you
get a newsletter and what is it full of poser items that are on the market
place or free.

Now i'm not sure about you lot that run the site but i know there are more
than just "poser" or "Daz studio" users on your site.
Please correct me if i am incorrect on this but i believe Renderosity is a
community of people interested in the 3d graphics, this would then point out
that they are not just poser users but use other programs for the 3d
graphics they like doing.

It would be nice seeing things for these other programs on the newsletter
and the page you see when one first go to the site.
If it is your intention to highlight the fact you have a large interest in
poser then may i suggest you change the site name from Renderosity.com to
Renderposer.com.

Thank you.

Hence the reason i don't post images on this so called 3d community site nor do i say much on the forum. i might read things others say or look at images they have done but until the Staff at Renderosity turn this site back to a 3d artist community and not one for only those that use poser i'll continue only being a visitor here..

CrazyDawg

Maybe they should change the name of the site to POSEROSITY. 

As a sometime 2d artist, I use this opportunity to remind all that this is an Art site. All are welcome here.

2d artists have the same problems her of the "NOT TOTALLY POSER" artists... perhaps more...

EBot dragged me back..must remember to untick box.

Ok, let me put something straight here and thank you to the two very kind IMs i had lastnight from two well known artist on this site.

I am not having a go at anyone that uses poser for their art work nor am i having a go at any of the many poser merchants for placing their items on the market. I don't mind looking at art done in poser/daz studio or anyother program no matter how good or bad it is, your art might just place an idea for something in my head which i can work on.

My beef is with the staff of this site which when i first joined it was a community for all forms of art done with 3d/2d programs, now all i see is art and merchants mainly to do with poser. I believe when they state the site is a community for 2d/3d artist then they should also advertise items on the newsletter and front page to do with all other 2d/3d programs...

CrazyDawg

I usually use ALSO Poser in my art and as you I am not having a go at anyone that uses poser for their art or their market.
Again I think as CrazyDawg:

Quote: I believe when they state the site is a community for 2d/3d artist then they should also advertise items on the newsletter and front page to do with all other 2d/3d programs...

"My beef is with the staff of this site which when i first joined it was a community for all forms of art done with 3d/2d programs, now all i see is art and merchants mainly to do with poser."

LOL, CrazyDawg joined about eighteen months ago. Renderosity was as Poser dominated then as it is now; if anything more so.

This is like looking at a rant by someone complaining that the sky was better when it was green instead of the blue it is now.  If this was a serious subject it would be quite disturbing.

End universal suffrage now. ;-)

Perhaps someone will invent a breast generetor for Bryce... will it be in Bryce 6?

Well, the top rated image in the gallery is a Bryce image. There are lots of 2D, photography, Vue, etc. images.

Doesn't really seem like Poser has any huge numbers of images in the top rated images.

It is a popular program though, so I'd kind of expect a lot of Poser images in general.

**"LOL, CrazyDawg joined about eighteen months ago. Renderosity was as Poser dominated then as it is now; if anything more so."**PJF, it was very clever of you to notice when i joined Renderosity, shame you weren't so clever at noticing everything in my post, i did state when i joined the site it was a 2d/3d community. Sorry but back when renderosity was mainly a poser site i wasn't around computers, born, or into 3d graphics.

I always knew you were a big baby CrazyDawg. lol 8)

Quote - I always knew you were a big baby CrazyDawg. lol 8)

Why am i a baby, because i have the backbone to put my opinion forward instead of sitting back in the shadows..

Well if thats the case i'm sorry for speaking up, maybe i'll just sit in the shadows as well and watch what happens to this site..

CrazyDawg

OK so I'm riding my giant duck one day and this guy says get down off that horse . .. .

You don't get down off a horse, you get down off a duck.

it's just a new way to ignore the hot 20, which I did on a regular basis..;)

Oh horsefeathers!  you don't get down off a duck until you get down off the duck otherwise you might get downed by the duck.