Quote - (click image for larger view)

odf,

I would like to draw your attention to some inconsistencies between the channels in the left and right instep of the 123 figure. See image above.

Thanks Les! Well spotted! I wonder how many more of these glitches are still hidden in the CR2.

I tried Pyramid_3A.cr2.TXT with DAZ Studio 3.0.1.144.  The result is the same as what sazzyazzca discovered.  The dials are not working at all.

lesbentley, what is the purpose of these tests?  Are you going to utilize the "valueOpTimes" in something new?

lesbentley,

I tried the Pyramid_3A.cr2 in DAZ Studio 2.3.3.146, 3.0.1.144, and 3.1.0.126.  None of the sliders do anything.  I also tried in Poser 8, and PoserPro2010. Cube 1 will change from a pyramid to a cube proportionate to the slider position.  Cube A and B "snap" between Pyramid, and cube.  Cube C dos nothing.

   Good question! I only spotted it because I was replacing the rotate channels for an experiment.

Nice job on the thumb JCM, a big improvement.

Quote - One thing I'm wondering about is whether I should retrofit the existing JCMs to be controlled not directly by their rotation channels, but indirectly through a channel in the body as I am doing here. This would make it very easy to reduce the strength of selected JCMs or turn them off completely in situations where they are not needed/wanted (as when they are covered by loose clothing and such). It would also make for shorter lists of dependencies when using P8's dependent parameter tools. Any thoughts from the experts?

I'm not sure that I'm very keen on that idea. I was going to sugest an alternative way, using valueOpTimes. So that's at least part of the answer to Amy's question.

Quote - lesbentley, what is the purpose of these tests?  Are you going to utilize the "valueOpTimes" in something new?

I wanted to make sure valueOpTimes worked in D|S before suggesting you use it. It seems that valueOpTimes does work in D|S... sometimes. 

Unfortunately I can't really recommend something I can't get to work reliably. Though it's probably just some stupid mistake I am making. I think I know what was causing the the problems with valueOpTimes in P7+ and have the answer to that one, but I am still uncertain about the problems in D|S. My "Pyramid_2.cr2" seemed to work for for P7, P8, and D|S 1.7.1.9, no one reported whether that version worked in D|S 3. A later version "Pyramid_3A.cr2" meant to track down the bug, did disclose the cause of the problem in P7+, but did not work in any version of D|S.

For anyone interested in my valueOpTimes method of turning JCM off and on, you can try the file attached above. This is the same file that is in my "APUtilityPoses" and available from the Antonia's Free Stuff site.

The thing is, if I turn the JCMs into normal PBMs with a master channel in the body, I have all the 'interesting' slaving code at one point. That includes the rotation channel it is slaved to, the deltaAddDelta factor and any fancy extra stuff such as using valueOpTimes to turn the morph on and off (I'd still want to use that so that I can turn whole groups of JCMs off at the same time). All that would simply go into the master channel.

That way, it would be much easier to see what's actually happening, either by looking at the CR2 directly or by using dependent parameter interfaces in Poser or D|S, and it would also be easier to make changes. Say I re-create the JCM at a different rotation angle. Then I'd only have to re-inject the new deltas and change the deltaAddDelta at one place. In addition, I don't need to do much special hocus-pocus when creating the CR2 content. I just treat it as a normal PBM and then add some slaving to its master channel.

One of the big problems with Poser files is all the redundancy. Certain changes have to be made at several places at once, and if there is a discrepancy, things can break, and the cause can be extremely hard to find. Just take injection poses that change JPs. Work like a charm, but only if one includes the modified settings for both actors involved.

So I'd like to try and avoid introducing additional redundancy wherever I can. Obviously, I'll have to test this for the various Posers and Studios. I was just wondering if anyone saw any good a priori reasons for not doing it.

Ok lesbentley,

I tested the Pyramid.cr2, and Pyramid_2.cr2 in DAZ Studio 2.3.3.146, 3.0.1.144, and 3.1.0.126 (D|S 4 beta).  The results are the same for all 3 versions:

Pyramid loads as a cube, and the slider has no effect.

Pyramid 2 loads as a Pyramid with the slider defaulted to 1.  It morphs to a cube at 0.

A big thanks for testing in all those versions wcbncal. Your info is very useful.

I'm a long way from something that can be used as a walk cycle in the Walk Designer. Because I am using ERC as part of the mix, I need a Python script to convert the ERC stuff into standard poses for use in the Walk Designer and for distribution, but that can wait for a while. I still have plenty of work to do before I need that.

What would help at the moment are some good video references of people, especially
woman, walking, but they would need to be free because money is tight at the moment.

In the above image, on left is AP with the P4 Walk pose applied, on right, same thing, but with ERC and some tweaking. Just a start, a lot of things to iron out, and a long way to go yet.

Attached Link: http://hdl.library.upenn.edu/1017/d/archives/20051109002

Maybe go back to the 'classics' for references? (see link)

The left hand one would be good for a zombie. The right hand one looks brilliant, she moves so naturally. Well done everyone!

CHEERS!

Quote - I'm a long way from something that can be used as a walk cycle in the Walk Designer. Because I am using ERC as part of the mix, I need a Python script to convert the ERC stuff into standard poses for use in the Walk Designer and for distribution, but that can wait for a while. I still have plenty of work to do before I need that.

Hmm.  Back in 2006, I cobbled together a script which could take poses from Poser and apply them in Blender, with compensation for the various rotation order mismatches.  There was, IIRC, a specific combination of matrices which could be applied to effectively take a pose and apply it to another "skeleton" (a process derived from the BVH import for Blender developed by Cambell Barton).  I wonder a bit if the process might help within Poser, perhaps removing the need to do all of those conversions by hand. 

Your results are looking very good!  :thumbupboth:

Does anyone have a EULA  template that I could use to create a license for my products?

I will be selling my non-Rendo products at CP and have to create my own license.
This is something I am stumped on as I don't know if I can use the ones from any other site as examples.

Some of my Antonia products will go there but most will be sold here.

Sorry lesbently but it does not get any better than that no matter what version of walk designer you use. I tried. Got the same as you have and even more work with PP2010.

No way to get around having to adjust every frame. But once you have you main walk it may be easier to create all the other types. Sexy, stroll and what not.

Quote - Does anyone have a EULA  template that I could use to create a license for my products?

I will be selling my non-Rendo products at CP and have to create my own license.
This is something I am stumped on as I don't know if I can use the ones from any other site as examples.

Some of my Antonia products will go there but most will be sold here.

This is such a complex issue that you might want to consult a lawyer with intellectual property expertise.

Wow... you have to write your own EULA? Does this mean that when I buy products by five different merchants at CP I get five different EULA's - and there is no preview for them???
Maybe you can ask a fellow merchant who sells there what he/she recommends.

Actually I've been checking them out and it looks to me like almost everyone uses the same EULA.

Each one reads the same as here, Daz and CP's own EULA.

So I've contacted CP and will find out tomorrow  about the license.

Now on to some Antonia news. :)
It's been a busy two days working on her promo images but they are finished.
Now I just have to decide between one of  two first page promo images.

I need to upload them somewhere for viewing and let folks vote on which looks best. Lol.

My retail set will be ready when odf releases the official version of Antonia.

LOL, that's one hot pussy! 

Diamond's progress ,or ya could say my lack of 2D skills progress report.

Having a lot of fun anyways :)

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=2057113&np

I have a toolbar from SweetIM that has these emoticons.
They are a riot. :)

RorrKonn,

This thread is already ridiculously long and full of distractions. You shouldn't post info about another figure here. it's already hard to find anything in this thread.

I almost unsubscribed from this thread several times. It has outlived its usefulness. There are some conversations I'm interested in tracking, but most I'm not. But I have to stay subscribed in order not to lose valuable information. This is a problem that is getting worse.

I think it would be good to start using separate threads. My giant VSS thread also sucks for the same reason.

For example - the EULA discussion is a good discussion, but I don't sell anything and it isn't valuable to me. Yet I've gotten many ebots and had to come in to to see if something important was posted about Antonia, only to find it's about legal stuff.

New threads, please.

Quote - RorrKonn,

This thread is already ridiculously long and full of distractions. You shouldn't post info about another figure here. it's already hard to find anything in this thread.

I almost unsubscribed from this thread several times. It has outlived its usefulness. There are some conversations I'm interested in tracking, but most I'm not. But I have to stay subscribed in order not to lose valuable information. This is a problem that is getting worse.

I think it would be good to start using separate threads. My giant VSS thread also sucks for the same reason.

For example - the EULA discussion is a good discussion, but I don't sell anything and it isn't valuable to me. Yet I've gotten many ebots and had to come in to to see if something important was posted about Antonia, only to find it's about legal stuff.

New threads, please.

**bagginsbill

**Over the years ODF ,Phantom3D and I have worked on are charaters.
Even thou we all use deffrent app's and are goals are not the same.
We have encourage and suported the others charaters.
ODF had Antonia threads before this thread

This is ODF's thread.
I'm showing a brother charater modeler my character that ODF was arond sence her creation.
If ODF wishes to no longer suport Diamond then that is for ODF to say.

I know at times thay go way OT.
It does not bother me but I reframe from posting way OT.

If ODF ,Phantom3D and I share tech with are charaters May be a bit OT but also helpful to the charaters.

Quote -
I almost unsubscribed from this thread several times. It has outlived its usefulness. There are some conversations I'm interested in tracking, but most I'm not. But I have to stay subscribed in order not to lose valuable information. This is a problem that is getting worse.

I've thought about splitting the thread, but frankly, in a forum with such high traffic and variety of subjects, I find it easier to follow one long thread than several smaller ones. There's no guarantee that people will stay on topic any more when the thread is split, and we would get effectively more notification mails per post. Also, I'm a bit worried that the PTB might not react so well to me flooding the forums with threads about 'my' figure. Okay, I'm not alone in this, but I guess Antonia is still mostly associated with my name, so basically I could/would be perceived as spamming the forum.

At some point I hope Antonia will have a 'real' web site with forums, wikis, download areas and such, but right now, I simply don't have the time to set it up. In general, I don't think that forum threads are a good way for storing retrievable information, anyway. There's now a Wiki for that, and you're all welcome to add new pages as long as Renderosity doesn't object.

That said, it would be good if we tried and staid on topic in here. I'm guilty of getting into chatty mode and/or wandering off topic myself, but I guess there are limits.

Finally, if anyone wants to start spin-off threads about special topics, they are obviously free to do so. We'll see how it goes.

odf, you seem to have misunderstood.

I'm not asking for multiple Antonia threads. I'm asking for multiple off-topic for any topic that is not Antonia.

I'm not asking for spin-off threads about special Antonia topics.

I'm talking about "Good" Friday, and EULA, and a dozen other things.

I don't know how to put this; when I see an email notice of a new posting in the Antonia thread, I prepare for disappointment. Seeing that ebot used to make me excited. Now it makes me sad. Does that make sense?

Quote - odf, you seem to have misunderstood.
I'm not asking for multiple Antonia threads. I'm asking for multiple off-topic for any topic that is not Antonia.

Oh, I see. Fair enough! Let's try to stay on focus a bit more from now on.
 

odf, a thought about the neck....
At present Antonia only has a bend, twist, tilt morph for the upper part of her neck.

I've found that when I'm doing a pose that involves tilting, twisting and bending the head and neck it still has an odd look.

It would be a help if the lower section of her neck had the same parameter setting or morphs that the upper neck has.
That would eliminate the odd look on twisting the neck or head .

Quote - odf, a thought about the neck....
At present Antonia only has a bend, twist, tilt morph for the upper part of her neck.

I've found that when I'm doing a pose that involves tilting, twisting and bending the head and neck it still has an odd look.

It would be a help if the lower section of her neck had the same parameter setting or morphs that the upper neck has.
That would eliminate the odd look on twisting the neck or head .

Thanks for the suggestion! I realize the neck does not bend as well as it should, and I'd definitely like to do something about that.

The lower neck is actually part of the chest actor. I could add a second neck actor, but my feeling is that that would only complicate the figure unnecessarily, lead to all kinds of new problems, and not really help much. The odd look, I think, is mostly due to the fact that twists in Poser do not work as they do in reality. None of our limbs twist (or bend for that matter) like a hose, but that's want Poser tries to do. I was considering adding a JCM for the neck twist.

One must also keep in mind that the neck cannot twist very far in reality, and that, say, an over-the-shoulder look is really a complicated movement that involves the whole upper body.

I have upload the latest WIP, it can be downloaded from http://sites.google.com/site/amyaimei/antonia/AntoniaBeachVolleyballBottom3.zip?attredirects=0&d=1

The zip contains Antonia Beach Volleyball bottom version 3. CR2 and OBJ only. New mesh.

I learned a lot this week.  It seems that improving the mesh rather than making more JCMs solved the problems I encountered previously.

This one contains 4 JCMs only!
 

This really looks great. This is a challenging position.

Looking very good Amy!

Cage came to the rescue by providing a py script that was essential to further development of the walk poses.

My progress with the animated walk poses is slow but steady. The walk I am using is adapted from the "P4 Walk". I think what I have now has some minor improvements on some aspects of the original P4 version, other aspects are still not up to scratch. There is some jitter in the feet. I haven't paid much attention to anything but the legs, feet and toes, so far. I will keep trying to improve it.

In the image above, left is Posette using the original P4 Walk, right is Antonia using a modified version of the walk.

Quote - In the image above, left is Posette using the original P4 Walk, right is Antonia using a modified version of the walk.

It looks a bit like some foot-jitter may be present in the P4 original.

The results are looking quite excellent.  :thumbupboth:

They really are, Antonia animates so well.

Quote - Here is a side view. Posette on left (behind), Antonia on right.

I think Antonia's feet look better than Posette's, from the side.  Antonia may be slouching a bit.  :unsure:

Here is the actual animated walk pose as used in my previous two posts. Please realise that this is still very much a WIP, I hope to be able to make considerable improvements on it.

[edit]

Whoops, sorry folks, looks like the file is too big to attach. 

At the present stage of development it is just meant for use as an animated pose. If used as a walk blend in the walk designer results may be poor.

Quote - I think Antonia's feet look better than Posette's, from the side.

I'm glad you think so.

Quote - Antonia may be slouching a bit.

She does seem to be bent forwards too much, that should be easy to fix. So far I have concentrated on the bottom half, now that the bottom is looking reasonable, I will try to improve some other parts.

From what I can see in the animated gif, Posette's legs look like they twist a bit or distort sideways as she walks.
Antonia's does not do that.
Antonia looks more natural as she walks.

The feet also look more natural as Antonia walks than they do on Posette.

The ascent of Antonia, brilliant!

CHEERS!

Guys!?

It's Tuesday, are you all busy!?

CHEERS!

They're being chatty elsewhere so I don't have to waste my time coming here to find a chatty type message instead of something about Antonia.

Ooooops!

I've been busy working on my promo stuff for Antonia and other products.

Also checking my other texture set for Toni to see how much more I need to do on it.

And in a day or two I have to use my system restore disk on my desktop.
Somehow it has a nasty problem and I've not been using it for anything recently, didn't even have it connected to the internet.

I had all my Antonia work backed up there and now it will be lost.
I'll have to put it all on DVD this time so i' don't lose it if my laptop gets a bug too.
Crappy trojans and virus bugs!!!

speaking of Antonia, I've noticed a strange crease when where the shoulder and collar meet when I do a certain pose.
I'll post an image showing it later if I get a chance.

BluEcho,

You can boot your desktop from a Linux disk and burn the files to DVD or copy to external disk.  You can get Knoppix here-it works very well for my data recovery needs:

http://knopper.net/knoppix/index-en.html

You download the cd image and burn it to a CD, and then use it to boot from.  It gives you a graphical desktop and you can browse for the files you want to save.  Just remember that you single-click  instead of double-clicking.

Good Luck!!

[EDIT} Don't download the Adrianne version, as it is set up for blind people.

Here's a download link to the English version:

ftp://ftp.kernel.org/pub/dist/knoppix/KNOPPIX_V6.2.1CD-2010-01-31-EN.iso

Wandw, thank you for that link. :)
I did do a few other Antonia sets I don't want to lose and they are on my HD, not my external...sigh.

There is a fantasy set I'm working on with a snake-like skin and it is there.
I can start over if I have to but I'd rather not.

I hope this works but I will  definitely scan all files I put on a DVD before I re-install to my external.

I hope it works for you.  I'm not sure what Windows CD recording software you have to create the Knoppix boot CD-if yours doesn't support writing an ISO image, here's a tutorial using isorecord freeware:

http://www.petri.co.il/how_to_write_iso_files_to_cd.htm

It's not all that bad but it just looked odd to me, but then I don't know if our arms actually look like that if we bend them the same way...lol.

I know there will be creases and folds of skin, that's only to be expected.
But thought I'd better just ask in case it is something that needs smoothing out. :)

That's definitely not looking right. Can you send me the pose so I can have a look at it?

It is a tricky position for the arm, though, so I might not be able to fix it just now.

Okay, I'll save the pose tonight and send it to you.

Quote - This is an image showing what I mean on the arm-bend.
Is that natural or a problem with the mesh?

It's not all that bad but it just looked odd to me, but then I don't know if our arms actually look like that if we bend them the same way...lol.

I know there will be creases and folds of skin, that's only to be expected.
But thought I'd better just ask in case it is something that needs smoothing out. :)

I tried to reproduce the pose you showed.  I have similar result but the problem can be reduced by adjusting the combination of lCollar and lShldr bones.

Quote -
I tried to reproduce the pose you showed.  I have similar result but the problem can be reduced by adjusting the combination of lCollar and lShldr bones.

That is usually my suggestion. The JCMs are not perfect, but it often helps to consider how much a real limb could bend in such a pose and avoid going past its natural limits. That is true for any figure.

That said, with the arms one really has to fiddle a bit to find settings that work well.

What pose settings will produce that distortion?  I couldn't even create a little mess, much less the result shown in the image.  I think I must be mis-reading the pose as pictured.