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Poser - OFFICIAL F.A.Q (Last Updated: 2024 Nov 29 7:57 am)
Subject: Hi! DAZ 3D wants to chat.
Quote - Additionally I would like to add that an open discussion does not always lead to the result the majority wants to see.
I would also point out that the "Vocal Majority" isn't neccesarily the same as the "True Majority". The Silent Majority around these forums far outstripes the Vocal Majority.
Quote - I would also point out that the "Vocal Majority" isn't neccesarily the same as the "True Majority". The Silent Majority around these forums far outstripes the Vocal Majority.
Very true, which is why it's also important that the True Majority occasionally make their voices heard as well. For every person who doesn't like how something is done, there could be two who think things are fine - but if they don't speak up, only the one who doesn't like it gets heard.
SnowS
my DeviantArt page: http://snowsultan.deviantart.com/
I do not speak as a representative of DAZ, I speak only as a long-time member here. Be nice (and quit lying about DAZ) and I'll be nice too.
...and sometimes the opposite is true as well as those who don't like the way things are going, are reluctant to speak up for fear of being shouted down or being branded troubelmakers and whiners.
...the door swings both ways.
...forsaken daughter is watching you.
[Intel Xeon 5660 Hyperthreading 6 core CPU, 24GB GSkill Ripjaws 1333 DDR3 Tri Channel RAM, Nvidia Titan-X GPU with 12GB GDDR5 & 3072 cores, 1 x AData 240 GB SSD (boot) + 1 x 2TB HDD, EGVA 850 G5 PSU Antec P-193 with more fans than Justin Bieber.]
WHew... this forum has stolen away most of my personal time this weekend. Its very very time consuming, trying to thoughtfully read and respond to such an energetically inquisitive crowd. I hope you all wont mind too much if I cut back just a little. Ill be back but it might be on Tuesday or so.
It seems like we have covered a lot of ground anyway so maybe a lot of the big stuff is answered.
Later!
R
Attached Link: http://www.kwiksurveys.com?s=OMEKIO_f872e781
Hey everyone,After going though this and a few other forums regarding this and similar topics I've created a survey to see where people stand on the content issue at Daz3D.
I've posted links to the servey site here and on the Daz3D general form. It's called:
The Daz3D Content Survey (Unofficial and Unsupported)
Quote - Hey everyone,
After going though this and a few other forums regarding this and similar topics I've created a survey to see where people stand on the content issue at Daz3D.
I've posted links to the servey site here and on the Daz3D general form. It's called:
The Daz3D Content Survey (Unofficial and Unsupported)
great, thanks :)
Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/mod/forumpro/showthread.php?thread_id=2840780
Results will be shown on the above link. It's called:"The Daz3D Content Survey (Unofficial and Unsupported)"
And since I created the survey I'll have to refrain as well. Thanks for your interest though.
If you could please pass it on - the more who participate the better.
Quote - > Quote - One of my gripes was the fact that I would see an outfit and ask if there will be a male version made and be told "Male clothing doesn't sell so I won't be able to do it." Also asking about scaling characters similar to Steph4 got a similar answer. If nothing else, people that do art using male characters got a bigger boost because I can grab certain items from genesis female and use it on the males, and now i can scale and morph the bodies and still have all the clothing fit without asking others to make fits or learn how to use magnets.
Sure but getting garments to fit either is still a lot more work than it used to be - this is a step backward, not forward.
Not at all. The reason it wasn't worthwhile to do a male version of an outfit was because it involved nearly as much work as making the original female version. For instance, in converting a V4 outfit to M4, you first had to re-sculpt the mesh to fit M4. Then you had to re-rig the thing. Then you had to create a whole new set of JCMs. Then you had to create a whole new set of whatever other morphs you wanted or needed to include-- FBMs, PBMs, adjustment morphs, etc.
IF the female outfit sold very, very well, such that the male outfit could be expected to sell fairly well (bearing in mind that, as a general rule, male stuff sells only about half as many copies as female stuff), it might be worth doing. But if the female outfit sold fewer than maybe 300 copies, then making a male version (whch would be likely to sell only 150 copies or fewer) just wasn't worth all that extra time and work.
With Genesis, the process is a lot simpler and involves far less work. There are no JCMs or other "shaping" morphs that have to be put into the clothing itself-- the morph follower takes care of all that. So, to fit an outfit to M5, all you have to do is load in the outfit, fit it to Genesis, dial up the M5 shape on Genesis, and presto!-- it's done. Now, there may be places where the clothing is distorted or looks odd because of the difference in body shape, and you may need to put a morph in the clothing to adjust that (similar to putting a morph in clothing for V5 to eliminate the "shrink-wrap" effect on the breasts). But that's all you have to do. All that extra work that used to be necessary-- resculpting the mesh, re-rigging it, adding a whole new set of JCMs, adding a whole new set of FBMs and other morphs-- is no longer necessary.
I experimented with a fairly simple little item-- a sort of short tank top-- and I was quite blown away at how well it worked. It even fit the Troll. Granted, it looked a little weird on the Troll, but the point is that it FIT-- with no need to need to put any morphs in it at all.
Depending on the type of clothing involved, a content creator might have to add some fitting morphs, but that's still far less work than having to resculpt the mesh, re-rig it, etc., etc., etc., etc.
All this means is that it will be FAR easier for clothing makers to make both male and female versions of outfits than it was before. Far from being "a step backward," the Genesis system is a vast leap forward-- of about five light-years.
I completely agree with blondie9999 on this. Having made some clothing for Gen4 figures in the past I have recently tried making some clothing for Genesis figures, and converting things from Gen4. Not just to the base Genesis figure, but to fit some of the shapes. It is a LOT easier to make things for Genesis.
One of the things that make it easier is the DS4 collision detection which works on clothing, and will automatically fix pokethrough.
Quote - Its WAAAAAAAAY to early for me to be telling you this but I am trying to bring on the next generation of Equines. It will happen....probably in the second quarter of 2012... but that isnt a promise and you didnt hear it from me B)
I'm deaf on that eye. :) Did you say something?
All I can say is, if it relies on Genesis... I'll be well and truly "nissed". And so will a lot of other Poser users. Tread lightly. :)
And if you need good photographs or video of a Paso Fino for a nice morph... cough I can sent you half a ton of them. ;)
(Oz has pretty nice legs...if you need some reference images for that equine we're not talking about lol)
Oh, and it would be nice if you could hide the tail in one go, for those of us who paint manes and tails. (Watch that backend. Some of the breed morphs kind of break the top of the tail) Also, another nice touch would be a "skullcap" type thing for dynamic hair. I realize DS doesn't have it, but Carrara does. I'm sure the Carrara users would love that.
And I'm sure there are quite a few horsey people around who know their stuff (probably better than I do) who'd be happy to give feedback on initial models, breed morphs etc.
Thanks for err...not...telling me, Rand. :)
Silke
Okay, I know this has been brought up before, but...
Rand, one thing that really bugged me in DS3A was not only the lack of documentation, but also the fact that it was a WIKI.
That's no way to do documentation, sorry.
I want help files. Searchable, well written, help files I can access from within the application. Or at the very least a PDF manual.
Without them your users are simply stuffed if their connection drops, or they are on dialup, or need to work offline for other reasons.
Many here have (3D work) machines that are not connected to the net. Others work for companies who will block access to many sites they don't deem work related. (FWIW -- mine blocks Daz3D, Rendo, RDNA and a few others.)
Online documentation is not a good thing, and a wiki is too easily messed up if you're not careful.
So... no to a documentation wiki.
Another that was brought up, more generally, is the ever-present dissatisfaction with promo shots.
Something needs to be done about this.
A hair figure needs shots from the front, both sides, and the back. It needs to have enough space at the top not to cut off the crown of the head so you can see the whole figure. Hair promos are my biggest source of frustration on the Daz site.
I don't care about "Artistic renders" showing every morph the hair can do -- if it lacks the basics, I won't buy it. I got burned too many times.
Many, many hair product shots are severely lacking in actual informational detail. You have 29 shimmering colors? Cool. I don't need to have an individual render for every single one -- all from the same angle. If you don't show me what the un-posed, default hair looks like from the front, back and both sides, then I'm not going there.
The crown-cut-off is just as bad. I've seen hairs where it was so "artistically" rendered/cut, it hid the wisp of hair sticking out on top. To me, that is on par with misleading the customer. No sale -- or often a return.
Clothing often falls foul of the same "artistic" hide-and-seek tactics. And then there is that M4 hipshot pose. Can we get rid of that horrible pose, please? Every other product that shows up uses that godawful pose to show off clothing "in it's best light". Newsflash -- I'd say 90% of your customer base loathe that pose and are turned off by it.
Maybe create a set of "PA/Promo Shot" poses that are mandatory to use as default "Front/Back/Sides" shots, and make them as natural as you can? If the creator wants to be "artistic", fine. But the default "Show off" images could be a bit more streamlined.
Shoes. If there are shoes with a clothing item, they need to be shown, not the feet cut off to show how nice the shirt is. You have no idea how annoying that is. I don't want to have to go into the forum to ask for someone to post a render of something. When I have to do that, it means you just lost an impulse buy.
The popup promo window...often loses the scrollbar once you click on the first image in the list. Annoying as hell. I have a big screen, but I was recently wrestling with a Stonemason preview that extended way down the bottom and I could not get to the bottom image without relaunching the promo preview popup. (Happens on IE and Firefox, as well as Chrome.)
Those are my promo pet peeves. The other is that I have to guess which items are used in a promo shot, if it isn't a Daz product. It wouldn't hurt to list what it is, even if you don't have a link there because it is not one of your items. At least we would stand a chance of finding it by searching. Let's face it, we only go in the forum and ask either people there, or the PA direct, and they'll tell us. It's not like it's a state secret. (Just look at the amount of "Which hair is this?" threads.)
It could be made a lot clearer what has been used, and I'm sure many people would really appreciate the effort.
But yeah...promos are an eternal bugbear with me. :) (And many others.)
Silke
Quote - Very true, which is why it's also important that the True Majority occasionally make their voices heard as well. For every person who doesn't like how something is done, there could be two who think things are fine - but if they don't speak up, only the one who doesn't like it gets heard.
Actually, thanks to our wee capitalistic system, the majority's voices are heard. They vote with their wallets, and as reputation rises or falls, so does both profit and the positive/negative voice of the majority.
This is doubly true in the CG hobbyist market, where the commodity is purely a luxury item.
Nobody is forced to buy CG goods in order to remain alive - we're not talking food, water, medical care, or heat. Hell, it's not even a secondary commodity - like, say, gasoline/petrol, cigarettes, and coffee would be. This means that when the majority speaks about a company or product in this little realm, that company or product will live or die by the voices of the majority.
Here's the trick, though: The majority doesn't speak with words - they speak with dollars, euros, yen, pounds sterling, etc etc... and those voices carry a lot more weight than the electron-scented vapor that we see in these here forums.
Quote - I experimented with a fairly simple little item-- a sort of short tank top-- and I was quite blown away at how well it worked. It even fit the Troll. Granted, it looked a little weird on the Troll, but the point is that it FIT-- with no need to need to put any morphs in it at all.
Simple crap like tank tops and bike shorts are not the issue, it's the highly detailed models (i.e., the things people BUY). However in nearly all the promo pics on the DAZ store for V5-ish conformers, even on simple models, I see some fairly significant fitting problems.
Kerwin, I have made DAZ Studio scripts to convert glossiness imported from Poser content to the correct value, as long as it uses the Simple tab in the material room (or just plugs the specularity node without extra stuff in the advanced tab). It's sold at YURdigital.com, see my sig. There is also a companion script that does the reverse, convert from gossiness to highlight size.
@Kevin Sanderson: you don't need to purchase a DAZ Studio for each one of your computers, actually. Check the license, it specifically states that you can install one copy of DS on all the computers at one address, be it your home or office. So if you work at home you just need one license for all computers!
Match Highlight Size and Glossiness between Poser and DAZ Studio
Quote - > Quote - I experimented with a fairly simple little item-- a sort of short tank top-- and I was quite blown away at how well it worked. It even fit the Troll. Granted, it looked a little weird on the Troll, but the point is that it FIT-- with no need to need to put any morphs in it at all.
Simple crap like tank tops and bike shorts are not the issue, it's the highly detailed models (i.e., the things people BUY). However in nearly all the promo pics on the DAZ store for V5-ish conformers, even on simple models, I see some fairly significant fitting problems.
I've seen a lot of fairly significant fitting problems on conforming clothes made using Poser-style rigging as well-- things that were just plain badly modeled and/or badly rigged, with collars that "float" an inch or more out from the neck, straps that "float" an inch or two above the shoulders, belts and straps that "float" a couple of inches out from whatever body part they should fit snugly, and so on-- not to mention poke-through ranging from small bits the size of a quarter to huge things the size of a dinner-plate. And a goodly number of those were on "simple crap" like halter tops and arm-bands and garters and simple trousers and such. I'm sure you've seen the same. Does all that "prove" anything about Poser itself? No.
Quote -
I've seen a lot of fairly significant fitting problems on conforming clothes made using Poser-style rigging as well-- things that were just plain badly modeled and/or badly rigged, with collars that "float" an inch or more out from the neck, straps that "float" an inch or two above the shoulders, belts and straps that "float" a couple of inches out from whatever body part they should fit snugly, and so on-- not to mention poke-through ranging from small bits the size of a quarter to huge things the size of a dinner-plate. And a goodly number of those were on "simple crap" like halter tops and arm-bands and garters and simple trousers and such. I'm sure you've seen the same. Does all that "prove" anything about Poser itself? No.
I'll see that and raise stockings/shoes/pants that suddenly don't fit at all anymore if you shorten the legs in Poser (be it by scaling or morph), the perennial elbow poke-through (though to be fair, the better merchants put in fixes for that), and a whole host of fitting problems for anything that isn't a standard model (or sometimes even if you do use the default body shape).
I think at some point it becomes less of a limitation of the app (except the scaling bit), and more a limitation of the merchant's skiills.
I guess what I'm getting at is that these are not new problems, and they aren't limited to any one vendor, or even group of vendors.
Err, you two really are not understanding the problem, but again it doesn't really matter since DAZ is committed to the neuter base anyhow.
Quote - Err, you two really are not understanding the problem, but again it doesn't really matter since DAZ is committed to the neuter base anyhow.
I (partially) understand what you're getting at, but I wasn't completely clear myself... thing is, there's plenty of screw-ups and bugs to work around as it is - though IMHO (and only based on experience), D|S does try and does rather well to get around the worst of it.
What you're talking about is trying to anticipate which way a mesh will morph to, then model for approximately that destination. For instance, making, say, a prom dress means predicting where the neuter base parts will morph out in a feminine direction and designing for that (well, unless you have a RuPaul morph or somesuch), which makes modeling it a bit tough to do.
OTOH, I was just thinking... why not take, say, the "female" dial, crank that out, model for that morph, then adjust the clothing mesh for a neuter figure? It's somewhat similar to the design challenges that a clothing maker faces in real life... adjusting the pattern to fit women with smaller cup sizes, larger hips, taller/shorter legs or torsos, etc.
It would mean a slightly (okay, radical) change in how mesh is made... instead of making the mesh in one piece, you build it in one piece then break it down into a pattern. Then you take the pattern 'seams', and literally fold them under each other as part of the morph, or tweak the mesh changes to accommodate along the 'seams', instead of trying to make the morph changes consistent along the whole.
Not a fully-formed idea, but something I think can be looked into.
I would think it would go better neutral to female than female to neutral. Or maybe I'm thinking about it wrong. I would rather have what what polys are there stretch to a breast than have a fully modeled breast try and flatten to a male morph for instance. I could be wrong tho ;). Neither is ideal. I think that might be what pjz99 is trying to get at. It's better that the model is made for the shape it's gonna be on. Going either way to far normally doesn't look that great.
Laurie
Quote - I'll see that and raise stockings/shoes/pants that suddenly don't fit at all anymore if you shorten the legs in Poser (be it by scaling or morph)
Just in case folks don't know.... If you're using PP 2012 (or Poser 9 presumably) there's an option to fix scaling issues now. You just select the item of clothing by its body actor, after you've scaled the target figure, and on the parameter dials (on the tab, under properties) you check off "include scales when conforming" and voila. Fits awesomely. Not sure how it will manage with partial scaling (ie: just legs) but it works great for overall scaling for sure (like with Stephanie Petite 4 and her proportional morphs)
Quote - > Quote - I'll see that and raise stockings/shoes/pants that suddenly don't fit at all anymore if you shorten the legs in Poser (be it by scaling or morph)
Just in case folks don't know.... If you're using PP 2012 (or Poser 9 presumably) there's an option to fix scaling issues now. You just select the item of clothing by its body actor, after you've scaled the target figure, and on the parameter dials (on the tab, under properties) you check off "include scales when conforming" and voila. Fits awesomely. Not sure how it will manage with partial scaling (ie: just legs) but it works great for overall scaling for sure (like with Stephanie Petite 4 and her proportional morphs)
This has been a feature of Poser for a while now. It was certainly a feature of Poser 2010 and Poser 8. I can't remember if it was in Poser 7 or not now.
Quote - This has been a feature of Poser for a while now. It was certainly a feature of Poser 2010 and Poser 8. I can't remember if it was in Poser 7 or not now.
Yeah, probably.... I didn't open PP2010 to check it for certain. I only found out about it recently, actually. As I understood, it was a recent upgrade. But I could be mistaken.
Quote - > Quote - This has been a feature of Poser for a while now. It was certainly a feature of Poser 2010 and Poser 8. I can't remember if it was in Poser 7 or not now.
Yeah, probably.... I didn't open PP2010 to check it for certain. I only found out about it recently, actually
Maybe we could do with a similar thread in the Daz forums to clear up misinformation about Poser. 
Ok..lol. Let me rephrase that so it seems less....sarcastic.
I have tried every version of DS since it came out. Before DS3, I couldn't even keep it open long enough to do anything. DS3A did a lot better on my equipment, but I spent more time searching for stuff than I did making stuff...lol. Now that DS4 is out, I'm just tired...lol.
I will admit the IDL bug in Poser 8 is a doosie. It frustrates me daily. As far as I'm concerned, unchecking "Visible in Raytracing" is NOT a workaround. Try doing that for a tree full of transmapped leaves...that now casts no shadow. Having said that, I've found Poser to be rock solid otherwise ;).
Laurie
Well, no matter what u use, they all have their fair share of issues.... and things that never get fixed. There's a bug in Poser right now that irks that crap out of me lol and don't even get me started on PP2010 (so glad to have upgraded to 2012)
Taking it out of the fold, theres other software thats buggy.... in a word, Silo :sighs: If anyone thinks Poser or DS is bad, they should have a go in Silo. And Photoshop CS3 has a really bad bug (which only got fixed if u upgrade to CS5)
Its just the name of the game.
Quote - OTOH, I was just thinking... why not take, say, the "female" dial, crank that out, model for that morph, then adjust the clothing mesh for a neuter figure?
This is possible, the Transfer Utility (that projects figure weights to conformers) has a Reverse Deformation function that allows you to take clothes modelled to fit a morphed shape (only one morph, though, not a multitude of settings to make a character unless you spawn them out), or even a supported legacy figure (M4/V4/K4 plus sundry morphed versions, or D3 at the moment) and adjust them to fit the neuter base. But as it's an auto-conversion it will need tidying up. This is what was being discussed earlier.
Yes it's possible, but the problem is that when you reverse the morph to fit the neuter base, a) that's a large chunk of difficult work ("tidying up" is an understatement) and b) the new fit is going to be pretty far from ideal unless you're working with a very simple model; and c) when you mix in OTHER morphs, because you're working with a messy base, the other morphs come out even worse.
Maybe if the autofit tools were able to treat any individual morph as the "base" from which to calculate further fits from, this wouldn't be a big deal, but they have to start from the actual base geometry. Anything with fine detail, e.g. laces or buckles or modeled-in seams for example, gets smushed.
Quote - > Quote - ...(I bought P8 - I refuse to be a beta-tester for anybody :) ).
And you use D|S?????!
Laurie
Ha ha... I usually stay one version back from the bleeding edge as well, and have done so ever since I stopped doing dev work on it. So nyah.
Incidentally, I did test it (SR3) out a bit over lunch hour... works pretty well (though having a bloody time working out the body morph dials after conforming). It also made things a touch unstable, but not by too much.
Quote - Incidentally, I did test it (SR3) out a bit over lunch hour... works pretty well (though having a bloody time working out the body morph dials after conforming). It also made things a touch unstable, but not by too much.
Good :).
If you don't use IDL all that much you won't see a difference. And I think the clothes go better if you scale the figure first then conform (checking that checkbox when you chose the item to conform)? Don't quote me on that tho...lol.
Laurie
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...The stats of my rig are in my sig below. I have basically maxed out the RAM, am running the latest updates of OpenGL DirectX and system drivers. The MB only supports DDR2 so there are no further RAM upgrades available. As it is a notebook there really isn't much more I can do to improve the situation outside of buying an entirely new machine (which is way out of my budget).
I've been using 3A (32 bit) but due to memory managment issues that were never fixed (more critical in 32 bit as there is a finite amount of RAM that can be allocated to any application) before the relase of ver.4, it has been an exercise in frustration to say the very least. I also have all my older installers (back to ver.1.5) however much of the content created after 3.0 was released will not work in them.
...forsaken daughter is watching you.
[Intel Xeon 5660 Hyperthreading 6 core CPU, 24GB GSkill Ripjaws 1333 DDR3 Tri Channel RAM, Nvidia Titan-X GPU with 12GB GDDR5 & 3072 cores, 1 x AData 240 GB SSD (boot) + 1 x 2TB HDD, EGVA 850 G5 PSU Antec P-193 with more fans than Justin Bieber.]