I'm currently thinking about getting a new male figure. However, I'm not sure if this is the right moment, so I'd appreciate some recommendations. I've been using M4 and I'm annoyed how often the figure doesn't bend correctly. I was thinking whether the new figures available would ease that problem. Currently, I do correct the bending errors in postwork, but it's sometimes really annoying. I've browsed through various forums to get information about M5, however it seems, Genesis in Poser isn't 100% working and somehow I'm unwilling to swap Poser with DS. It would not be a major problem, however, since I plan to get rid of my old Poser version, but if I could continue working with Poser, I'd appreciate it, since I'm used to its interface. I know the DSON importer is around, but in nearly all forums I've been reading about other users complaining about errors and it scares me off a bit, to be honest. And also, I'd appreciate if someone could give some information how much M5 is an improvement compared to M4. I've read much about V5 compared to V4, less so about M5 compared to M4. And also, there is Tyler, and he looks really good, and I can use him with a new Poser version. However, I guess that would mean the old M4 textures I bought and created would be useless then, and I have to recreate them. What I don't really care about is additional content. This is truly not an important factor to me, since I don't buy additional content except maybe textures, so it's not important for me how much content is available for one or the other figure.

I really enjoy working with Tyler.  If you'd like some renders to see bends, etc. just let me know.

You might look at this product:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/i13-overhaul-m4-edition/94600

I own it, and it fixes about 90% of my issues with M4.

Additionally, if you go to Poser 9 or Pro 2012, scaling is fixed. EVERYTHING now works and is scalable without heroic morphs or tons of postwork. Between these two upgrades, I think you will find a lot of milage left in your old figures.

P.S. I love Tyler, too. If you are going to make a change, that is where I would send you.

I invested in M5, and also the Gen3 and Gen4 shapes, to play with in Poser using the DSON Importer.

You need Poser 9/Pro 2012 of course for that.

The downside there is a) it's still pretty slow, for starters, even on a fairly beefy system and b) if, like me you just want the basic character and not the bundle with content you don't necessarily want or need, the thing's not got a penis.

I like Tyler personally too... and he's free, still, I believe, to Poser 9/2012 owners... and /or if you have Blackhearted's GNDA for Alyson 2.

That Ironman13 morph fix pack for M4 looks pretty good too... not got it myself, but I'd definitely take basicwiz's word for it...

Quote - Just because I can.....Tyler render I did this morning. 

I LOVE that lepard rug! Where did you get that?

Quote - > Quote - Just because I can.....Tyler render I did this morning. 

I LOVE that lepard rug! Where did you get that?

It came with an "Egyptian" set I bought at DAZ a very long time ago.  I'll go look, but I bet it's been vaulted.

That is a very nice rug ;)

Yeah, the other thing with Tyler, that ticks boxes for me, is that I can GoZ him into ZBrush.

Although, he bends very nicely anyway... so doing that to resculpt his face a bit, more than trying to fix body deforms...

...being a native Poser figure, using the morph brush on him within Poser has significantly less lag too. To make a bit of an understatement...

Aha!  Found it, not vaulted.

http://www.daz3d.com/treasures-of-egypt-2

Anton's Treasures of Egypt

Many thanks

DSON performance aside, The biggest thing about M5 is the amount of customization available. You're not locked into specific body shapes and sizes.   If there is something you don't like, you can always change it. Widen the torso, shape the hips, lift the chest, tweak the feet, you can do that with it M5. You also don't lose your M4 textures, and there's a freebie that allows you to use the M4 textures on the M5 gens, so you don't lose that investment either... it works pretty well. There's also a freebie that allows you to use the M5 textures on the M4 gens, so you can parent that to M5 and use that as well... you'll may have to do a little post work though on both of those freebies.

Tyler is nice, however its biggest fault is the lack of body shapes and facial emotion dials specifically for him; thus most of the renders I've seen have the same wide-eye vacant stare. And depending what morphs you mix in, you may need to take the morph brush to it to clean up some issues when posing. Your results will vary if you decide to create a thin, non muscular shape or a fat one... I did a few body morphs for him, however I had to unsculpt the detail in both his face and body in order to make a morph that doesn't look like Tyler with just a few tweaks. With that detail built in, you're really going to have a hard time making characters that don't look like Tyler without going to zbrush or another tool and taking the detail out first.

Quote - And also, there is Tyler, and he looks really good, and I can use him with a new Poser version. However, I guess that would mean the old M4 textures I bought and created would be useless then, and I have to recreate them. What I don't really care about is additional content. This is truly not an important factor to me, since I don't buy additional content except maybe textures, so it's not important for me how much content is available for one or the other figure.

I don't really render males but I really like Tyler and enjoy working with him. The old M4 textures won't work on him though. There are a small number of clothing items for him in the marketplace here. Otherwise M4 with the joint fixes may be another way to go.

Quote - DSON performance aside, The biggest thing about M5 is the amount of customization available. You're not locked into specific body shapes and sizes.   If there is something you don't like, you can always change it. Widen the torso, shape the hips, lift the chest, tweak the feet, you can do that with it M5. You also don't lose your M4 textures, and there's a freebie that allows you to use the M4 textures on the M5 gens, so you don't lose that investment either... it works pretty well. There's also a freebie that allows you to use the M5 textures on the M4 gens, so you can parent that to M5 and use that as well... you'll may have to do a little post work though on both of those freebies.

Yes, that is certainly a big upside to M5... a lot more dial-able bodyshapes. If that is something you're after (certainly why I thought it worth getting it) then that is the biggest plus. That and the ability to still use M4 textures (and morphs if you get the M4/V4 shapes plus Generation X from D3D)...

...and any chance of a link or two to those M4-to-M5-to-M4 gens freebies you mentioned Male_M3dia? :)

I guess really, on that "front", what would be more useful for clothed male figures... which I don't think exists already(?), is trouser bulge morphs (left, right or center... with sizing... and maybe shaping) that can follow into the conformed clothing...?

Also, I'd say, on the other hand... now that scaling is working so much better in Poser 9/2012 SR3.1... and there are the joint fix morphs for M4... there is a lot more versatility possible using M4 too... i.e. with the Morphs ++ pack and maybe some other character morphs mixed in too.

The bottom line, I'd say, is there is currently a fair few choices to weight up.

I've currently opted for all of them... personally ;-)

Quote - ...and any chance of a link or two to those M4-to-M5-to-M4 gens freebies you mentioned Male_M3dia? :)

Check the first few pages in commons in the Daz forums... there's a thread about the m4 remap and the link with take you to both.

Quote - I guess really, on that "front", what would be more useful for clothed male figures... which I don't think exists already(?), is trouser bulge morphs (left, right or center... with sizing... and maybe shaping) that can follow into the conformed clothing...?

All my products have a basic bulge in it; M5 has two bulge morphs. Both are found in the hip section. If Trekkiegrrrl's site is still available, she has bulge morphs for M4 that does exactly that and you should be able to move them over if you have GenX.

Quote -All my products have a basic bulge in it; M5 has two bulge morphs. Both are found in the hip section. If Trekkiegrrrl's site is still available, she has bulge morphs for M4 that does exactly that and you should be able to move them over if you have GenX.

Thanks Male_M3dia... I'll take a look.

Quote - Just because I can.....Tyler render I did this morning. 

If you're showing off the bends, I'm not exactly sold on that right inner thigh.

Quote - > Quote - Just because I can.....Tyler render I did this morning. 

If you're showing off the bends, I'm not exactly sold on that right inner thigh.

I didn't think postwork would be be appropriate, so I left it as it posed.  Those are "Ryan" poses, because as far as I know no poses have been released for Tyler - just expressions.

However, again, I felt that postwork (in this instance) would have been deceptive since the question was about "bending."

Of course, I note the M5 examples didn't even bend any part of the body, yet no one bothered to comment on that.  I could have stood him like a pretty little girl, but I chose, instead to answer the original poster's question.

But, then, as a user and not a vendor, I'm not trying to sell anything.  Just answer questions honestly.

I do too and I can also answer a question of an OP without accusing people of nonsense. And did I say I was showing bends? What I was showing is the fact that you're not limited to dials and can use custom morphs... like a thinner and shorter, stocky shape... I can also make him younger and shorter and change the shape more.... don't think you can do this with Tyler, but I'd invite you to if you think I'm just blowing smoke. This is what I can do easily with M5 and that's why it's a big improvement of M4.

Yep, we are in plastic doll land again.
?

Quote - Yep, we are in plastic doll land again.
?

Not yet, luckily we're talking about males this time ;)

You can do it with any character if scaling is set up. If scaling is not set up it wont work so well.

Nothing but scales messed with in this.

Unfortunately, those shapes look a bit weird. It doesn't still solve the custom body issue.

Anyway, an old test render... inner thigh looks better than ryan's and has with a custom shape.

No postwork.

Definitely would recommend Tyler, especially if you're not too bothered about having a lot of kit for him.

Anyway, now to do some poser mats that I've been procrastinating on...

Quote - > Quote - .... don't think you can do this with Tyler...

You can do it with any character if scaling is set up. If scaling is not set up it wont work so well.

Nothing but scales messed with in this.

Male_M3dia's figures could be the bodies of real people. Your two outside figures  are way out of proportion, and sorry, but the one on the left doesn't even look human.

Coldrake

Loving that Clark Kent Joequick! ;)

Quote - > Quote - Just because I can.....Tyler render I did this morning. 

If you're showing off the bends, I'm not exactly sold on that right inner thigh.

I have to agree.. I think  Ryan2 and Alyson2 are both pretty good figures... but that inner thigh has given me nightmares.  I spent tons of time trying to figure why my clothing looked bad in the inner thigh before I finally picked up on the way the figures bend in that area

Lol, I wasnt trying real hard to make them look "Perfect" or "Human"  I was just giving an example of the fact that scaling works on the character for the most part. Guessing that was missed.

I have to agree with the weight mapping issue on Tyler. But that is easy to fix.

I appreciate those non-postworked renders here ... and I'd like to thank everyone for very good info. I've been thinking about getting Poser 9, wouldn't there be the M5/Genesis issue. The body shape/customization issue Male_M3dia mentioned for instance is something I didn't know before and never researched about. The M4 morph options so far have been sufficient to me, but surely, that would be a big advantage for M5 ... and the fact I could use my old M4 textures. However, after reading through some DSON issues, I'm not sure if I want to join the fun :( Tyler looks very interesting, I love the renders I've seen of him (and also that one Glitterati3D posted here), however if it's difficult to morph the head shape without ZBrush so he looks distinctively less Tyler it would restrict my opportunities extremely, since I don't own ZBrush and in near future don't plan investing in it. The smoothing system looks interesting too ... I'll certainly have a look at it.

The Poser morph brush will actually do you pretty well, in place of ZBrush, I would think, for playing around with Tyler's facial features.

The morph brush is definitely pretty good in the latest version of Poser 9 /2012. So don't overlook that with all the talk of ZBrush... I'd say.

But... the biggie with Tyler, is that he is Face Room compatible... an aspect that is important to remember I think for Tyler (Ryan2), Anastasia (Alyson2) and Miki4.

You can always take Tyler into the Face Room and see what you can do with him there ;-)

Quote - I appreciate those non-postworked renders here ... and I'd like to thank everyone for very good info. I've been thinking about getting Poser 9, wouldn't there be the M5/Genesis issue. The body shape/customization issue Male_M3dia mentioned for instance is something I didn't know before and never researched about. The M4 morph options so far have been sufficient to me, but surely, that would be a big advantage for M5 ... and the fact I could use my old M4 textures. However, after reading through some DSON issues, I'm not sure if I want to join the fun :( Tyler looks very interesting, I love the renders I've seen of him (and also that one Glitterati3D posted here), however if it's difficult to morph the head shape without ZBrush so he looks distinctively less Tyler it would restrict my opportunities extremely, since I don't own ZBrush and in near future don't plan investing in it. The smoothing system looks interesting too ... I'll certainly have a look at it.

Actually, if you look in the Renderosity free stuff, there are a number of face morphs for Tyler.  The Fabiana and basicwiz ones do show some real promise using dial spins only.  Here's a link to the freebies, searching on Tyler:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/freestuff/search.php?section_id=-1&query=Tyler

I just didn't use any of them because, once again, felt you were asking about Tyler and it would be inappropriate to use morphs to answer the basic question.

Fabiana's Tyler face morphs look great, but are non-commercial use :(

Quote - Fabiana's Tyler face morphs look great, but are non-commercial use :(

 

Thanks for pointing that out.  I hadn't noticed.

All the best.

LROG

Ah, so he is... $19.99 now, along with Miki4, I see...

Tyler is still "free" (or at least included at no extra cost) with your purchase of Blackhearted's GND Anastasia though... as far as I know ;)

Pitklad did a brilliant free morph for Ryan/Tyler's eyes:

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/freestuff/details.php?item_id=69912

This helps get rid of that typical "Ryan look" and makes it possible to make characters look more original.

Anyone know if it's the latest update for Tyler that comes with Ana? I can't remember if I ever downloaded the update from CP or not... but I think probably not.

Quote - Anyone know if it's the latest update for Tyler that comes with Ana? I can't remember if I ever downloaded the update from CP or not... but I think probably not. 

I may be wrong... but I believe it is the latest version. Pretty sure BH said he'd be releasing updates through this channel too...

Thank you for the links to the freebies for Tyler. There were several items I hadn't seen before. Thanks too to the people who provided them. :)

Quote - Anyone know if it's the latest update for Tyler that comes with Ana? I can't remember if I ever downloaded the update from CP or not... but I think probably not.

 

 

 

IIRC, Tyler was included with Anastasia when Tyler was updated at CP so I assumed at the time they were both the same. I could be wrong but that is what I assumed for some reason.

Quote - Render of Tyler, but he is a now a a pay for character.

All the best.

LROG

VERY nice! You've captured what I like about Tyler - not a smooth pretty boy but a real rugged man. Yummy!! :laugh:

That's good! I can see the download for Tyler has appeared on my original Anastasia order so hopefully that's the latest version. The download's expired on my CP account and I'm fairly sure I didn't download the update from there as I was waiting to find out what was included in the update and then never got round to it.

Much better if any updates are available from Blackhearted's store here, can't stand the CP store.

Quote - I was just giving an example of the fact that scaling works on the character for the most part.

From what I see in your image, I guess we'll just have to disagree.

Coldrake

Despite my best efforts in the face room, I have been unable to do very much that is satisfactory with morphing Tyler's face. I've had to rely on what others have done. But as yet the range of possibilities does not look very large.

I have the same issue with Anastasia. I lack the skill to do much with her face. As a result, she doesn't get used quite as much.

I don't blame the creators. It is what it is.

Both M4 and M5 are easier to customize.

Despite my best efforts in the face room, I have been unable to do very much that is satisfactory with morphing Tyler's face. I've had to rely on what others have done. But as yet the range of possibilities does not look very large.

I have the same issue with Anastasia. I lack the skill to do much with her face. As a result, she doesn't get used quite as much.

I don't blame the creators. It is what it is.

Both M4 and M5 are easier to customize.

tyler looks like he spends too many days in the gym and too many nights cruisin' with an eight ball.

here is the morph applied to Tyler

**
**

Thanks for that morph Pitklad.

Quote - tyler looks like he spends too many days in the gym and too many nights cruisin' with an eight ball.

LOL ;)