Ok I've seen packs like the Boris Pack that has alot of very different faces for Michael, however I have not seen anything simmilar for Vicky. Every face I've seen for Vicky only looks slightly different from every other face I've seen. There are differences but they are so small that they all start to blend togeather after a while. Am I missing something? Is there a pack out there with alot of varied faces? I mean really varied. Anyone who has seen packs like the Boris Pack knows that those faces are so drastically different that you can really tell one from another. Thanks in advance. Mainly I'm looking to make some peopel that don't look so much like Vicky. I like all the body morphs just fine, I just need new heads.

I have a few at the marketplace, they are morph targets, not modelled in Poser. If you have any special requests, please let me know. :-) http://www.renderosity.com/softgood.ez?Who=Zrincx Zrincx.

If you really want to make some, try out the magnets from within Poser. They are a sadly underused feature that with experimentation will give you highly individual features and can be used in combination with morphs and posing dials. The result you can save as morphs of your own. They are savable as props and can be saved in prop "groups" like any other prop so you can apply a base set over and over and to any figure. Happy morphing B)

I've tried doing some things with them and always end up with something that looks really wierd. I'm not very good with the magnets. I could try to work with them a bit more.

But that is exactly the thing about the magnets, made by scientists, must be handled by scientists..No wonder there arent any people (well not many) who use them. Its simply a clumsey made tool.

I am going to assume that most peopel that make facial morphs use it though?

I know what you mean, my first magnet experiments were like "okay it stretches the nose, wow". But now I can make any clothes I buy fit my "Barbara" character, who is curvaceous compared to Victoria, with minimum tweaking. I am attempting now to create expressions for an anime-style head Ive just started. They are tricky to use but infinitely variable and there is no practical limit to how many you can use. I loveem. I guess I have a magnetic personality :) (Sorry)

Yeah that was bad. Anyhow back to my question. Does anyone have some other samples to look at? I'm trying to see a large amout of faces so I can decide what I want to do. Thanks Zrincx for you link. Those were pretty cute.

Zrincx, how do you like your computer? ;)

Im glad you like them Routledge, hats off. :-) There are many other options (programs) which is IMO IS easier and quicker to make morph targets in. 3D MAX, Ray Drem, ZBrush, just to name a few.

RE: Zrincx, how do you like your computer? ;) Qe ???

Zrincx I like the pictures in your gallery. Those were made with the Face morphs you have for sale? Talking about this picture http://www.renderosity.com/viewed.ez?galleryid=113083

Zrincx "Made by scientists... clumsily made tool" Cool faces by the way, on my next purchase list! Fracture try these too: SWO faces and Destiny at DAZ 3D, Plain Jane at Renderosity Going offline now see ya and good luck B)

No not "My Gawd", its a Millenium face (pre teen). And please note: My morphs are not tools for tweaking individual parts of the head, f.x. nose, lips..BUT heads modelled in one procedure. Its full face morphs so to say. (Just so you know :-)

Im off too for now, Routledge: It was overdriven, and with a smile on my lips that I wrote this :-) Take care all.

Thanks. Ill look at these links and see what I can see.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/softgood.ez?ViewSoftgood=5235

Maybe you find some , following the link, and i think there are more to come soon:-)) and i think at 3d-arena there are some, too.

Ok those looked good btu they suffer from what I call Vicky syndrome where they all look slightly different but still too much like Vicky. I'll check 3d-arena.

Hi! As thgeisel says, there are more coming. Here's one of the demo renders.

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/photos/SoftgoodImage5316a.jpg

Again looks nice. I like them but what I'm getting at is that all of them still look like vicky. I'll keep pointing to Boris. I picked that up about a month ago and the faces are so far from looking like Mike that you can get some true variation in the heads you make by combining the morphs with each other. The point of this thread was that while all the effort that has been put into vicky wasn't bad, it was prett damn good. it just seems like everyone is only slightly altering the face and no matter what I've seen, there are very few that look anywhere near different from the base. Here's what I mean. The link below shows a bunch of Boris Faces side by side. Would it be possible to do something simmilar for Vicky? Not every womans face looks the same.

I see what you mean... Many head morphs to create some extremely varied faces. Traveler's had morphs like that, and i suppose the DAZ monsters, witches, and so forth would count. i haven't heard much call for such with Vicky, aside from Halloween usage. Can't say for sure why: perhaps folks prefer their female characters to hit close to the metrics for beauty? What i have heard was a call for more ethnicities in Vicky, which i've tried to accomodate. And not all these grrls are beauties or even button nosed cuties! There are many more of them than i could ever do, so i've tried for "interesting."

When I get home from work today I'll make a enw thread with some pictures of actual people and show you what I mean. You can have variations and not have them look ugly. On the contrary. But I'll have to do that later as I can't do much photo-work from the office.

RE: Not every womans face looks the same. Yourso da** right..Hows this?? :-)

Thanks, Fracture! Maybe Zrincx and i can have a Face-Off! All in good fun, of course. :^) Everyone's invited.

Zrincx--she's so cute! So... gamine. Well done!

Yes that's a step in the right direction. Doesn't look like Vicky at all to me.

Hang on! What means gamine??

gamine (g-mn, gmn) n. An often homeless girl who roams about the streets; an urchin. A girl or woman of impish appeal. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- [French, feminine of gamin, gamin.] -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- gamine adj.

I think the latter definition was meant.

Fracture; I think what you need is a Victoria face where the face mesh is pretty much "streched" in wierd directions! More than Felecia here.. You can then, yourself adjust it to suit your taste using the many dials on the V2 model... If her nose is too wide, adjust it etc. But in the end it still has a totally different look cuz the mesh has been moved, and getting it back to Victoria default is impossible.

Ok well where could I find such a head? Also would something like that be a prop or whole new head I would have to attach?

Yes, Fracture... impish, waifish (in the sense of cute and young). It was meant as a compliment. And what Zrincx said--you can use the morph dials on Victoria 2 to stretch her in a lot of ways--there are cat, monkey, hag, and alien (among other) morphs that can be used a little or a lot to get some of the weirder effects. That's why they are there! And any of these characters or faces that i or anyone else presents may still be considered stepping-off points for your own experiments.

i am working on SEVERAL face paks...i have some previews in my gallery...my ETHNIQUE pak will be first to be released...i should have more previews of that pak later this evening. also, i made 10 faces in the Melody pak 5 fae, 5 human you may be interested in....Melody is in the marketplace now - $10, includes spectre3's EXCELLENT textures! tam ;o)

Hey funny you should chime in mizzthangg as I just bought Melody over the weekend. I collect alot of textures with tatoos and makeup combinations. Good job. Also your ETHNIQUE pack is another step in the direction I like to see things going. Not because she's got a big mouth but mainly because she's just different. Like I siad I'm gonna post some human pictures to show off what I mean by varied facial structures. It's something peopel see but don't often notice the difference between.

lol @ her big mouth!!! ;o)

Wasn't meant as any kind of a derogatory comment. But I'm thinking you got that

Zrincx and I have started combining some of our faces together to get a different look. It's amazing what a li'l ol' morph target can do. I build most of my faces now by combining my previous full face morphs, and then only use the "feature" morphs, such as "Mouth Narrow", in very small increments to put the final touches on the look I am going for. BTW, I absolutely LOVE the magnets too, they are the best new addition to Poser since they added transparencies. There is a secret to making faces that I shall now reveal, though I'm sure it is no "secret" really... Of all the billions of people in the world, there are still only a very small number of facial "archetypes". Some of them are similar and you get the generic looking people whom you've seen one you've seen them all. The number of face archetypes is surprisingly small. To be able to identify faces as belonging to one or another archetype does require some bit of skill and it is a skill that can be developed and gotten better at, just like any learned skill. I have been studying faces for over 20 years. I mean really studying them- I started out drawing pencil portraits in 1979- noticing how the eyes curve and the lips are placed in proportion... one thing that I've noticed is when you get down to the scale of millimeters and notice how faces are put together, there are NO ugly faces. All faces are interesting, and all faces have some beauty in them, which naturally implies that there is an "ideal" face for every single archetype that exists. These "ideal archetypes" then, are the faces that I strive to create with my models. I think this is why many people tell me that my girls look like someone they know- their sister, girlfriend, ex-wife... it is because I have purposely made the face to fit close to the ideal for a specific facial archetype. Another trick is in "SEEING" what is there, rather than just "looking". But that is another entire essay in itself. ;) This girl is a combination of morphs created by myself and my faerie helper Zrincx. I think she came out rather cute. Hey! I know that girl! =};-}>

Yep another deviation from the vicky model. Good work.

Fracture: The difference between a face pose file - and - morph taget for the face is this: face pose files changes the mesh of the head only as much as the morph dials on the individual character allows! (V1 or V2) A face morph goes beyond this! Using an 3d editor with obj imp/export, opens up endless ways to model.. a head, or and arm, whatever mesh WHEN you apply this new modified part back to your character (add morph target:-) regardless of shape, this new part takes the desired shape.. So, no matter how people put it..or claim, you can not create something VERY different with the default dials on Victoria! Its simply impossible, V2 is better, but it is still V2 !!!!

I suppose I look like Vicky too?

Yep that looks like Vicky. On the point brough up by Zrincx. What would be a good program to look into that would be relativly easy to import and export a head object to be used on Vicky?

I agree with Z on that- magnets are good also but you can only do so much with them. Quite a few of my faces have been modeled by "hand"- that is I exported an OBJ of Vickie's head, took it into my modeler, and moved the points around individually to smooth out the nose, or to make a head be more symmetrical that had been slightly overmorphed, for instance. Victoria's HEAD object consists of 10,041 vertice points, no more and no less. That is considered HIGH resolution. Posette's head has only around 3,000 vertice points, so you can see the difference, even though in my opinion the default Posette is much prettier thant the default Vickie head, which must have caught fire during development and they put it out with a sledghammer. ;o) Still it is the VERTICE count that is everything- and any conceivable item that can be constructed from 10,041 vertice points (and that could be just about anything!) can be a "morph target" for Victoria's head. you could even make her head into a boxcar for that matter, with sliding doors! Beware of any company requiring exclusive use of their morphs only... we may be seeing that come to pass and it is a disturbing trend. Free Vickie from the tyranny of proprietary morph targets!!! Use Vickie One!

The best way I've found to try and make Vicky look less "Vickyish" is to try to make her look as much like a real person I know as possible. About are two of my attempts at unique Vicky characters.

The brunette is based on a firend and uses mainly Handspan's Chere and Kendra face morphs. The blonde is based on myself and uses mostly the standard V2face morphs plus few from William the BLoddy's free MMV2 character.

Hopefully neither of them looks a lot like the standard Vicky.

Anim8tor is kind of tricky to use, its free though, and cool once you get it to know. I use mainly ZBrush which is great for moving around the mesh of any obj. Relatively easy to use (the obj editing, that is) everything else in this strange program can be a pain to find out how to use, it has to be said, that is beacause of its complexity, I doubt any other prgram can as much as ZB. Happy modelling. Try looking at www.anim8or.com or www.zbrush.com And to Ron, thats a cool joke... She looks like just about every other V2 :-)

Wow Daio! I recognize Kendra in there, very nice! The blonde is just drop dead gorgeous! OoOH! Just awesome! Your work is always high caliber, and you are right- neither looks like Vickie at all! note to Fracture- I use the RDS 5.5 Mesh From Modeler to edit OBJs.

Daio: Indeed cool looking characters.. Ingrid makes some small incredible power textures too, her choice of colours is outstanding.

First, the "sunshine."
I have found this thread fascinating! Keep goin'.

Thorne,

Your pic in #37 (this thread) is just possibly the cutest I've seen thus far - including all Poser females to date. [how does he do that!?]***

Ok, now the "salt."
How in the *$%$#@@$%^^$ do you use the mesh modeler in RDS for morph targets without screwing up the "origin?"
I know if you tweak the origen 0.000001 and try to tweek it back, RDS evidentally does not save as many decimal places in the .obj file as Poser wants. When you load the MT - el zingo ...... touch that param dial for the MT and you've got garbage! Body parts flying everywhere! [that ya don't want 'em]

What's the secret, huh, huh, huh?

Specifically, when the mesh is in the modeler, you can't change the positioning of the mesh [at all] or the MT gets screwed up. Moving individual verticies is ok, but it's a b***h to position the mesh so that you can see it from any angle. How do ya do it?

cheers,
dr geep
;=]

I use Ray Dream for morphs all the time ... I never mess witht he origin though and it works fine. And I think Boris is cool but he is way too charicaturish for me. Think that is one reason he is more different though .. He is more pushed past actual human standards than most Vickie's are.

... rotate the mesh to get to the backside. Detailed explain ... if you don't mind.

I just use the different preset views. This is Ray Dream Studio 5.5 but I just look in the different views and when I think I am done I click done and then rotate the camera around out in the land of the red figure (main window) but the figure is still in the same exact position.

Is this what you are after Fracture? This is a set (called Morphess) I sold from my site. However, I pulled them with intentions of refining them. Though they are not ready, they are on my list of to do. As such, the faces may look totally different when I am done.

Beth