Attached Link: http://mysticfantasies.com/

well, a few years back, before i came to r'osity, i did the "themes" for a couple of aol graphics lists. we made little "tags", basically by cutting up, "tubing" other people's work. we also freely shared photoshop filters. don't hate me....i did not even know what warez back then. i had bryce, and poser 1, but did not share my pics with my lists. then, i got poser 4, found this place, started a business that was not home based, and, my lists were history. i mean, be real...upon becoming aware that there were real cg artists out and about....the ones we list folks tubed to make our tags...dangitall...i aspired for more than swapping mary englebreit tubes and oohing and aahing over all of the gadzillion tags posted by homemakers with nothing better to do than to play in psp all day. i aspired. and, i did learn. even modelling, though i have miles to go on that. i also aspired to make the hot 20 and, did a time or two. the 20 still interests me. well, tonight, i went through and viewed the 20. i noticed that one artist, in particular, had no less than SEVEN PICTURES there. and, it was a name that was new to me. i followed her links to her site...and, YES....she is a list leader of a psp group. i think, since she has only been posting here since september, she just has her list buddies vote her in....really not fair to the rest of us, who have to impress THIS community in order to get hits and comments. it gets worse...i followed a couple of links at her site. i am sure that i recognize some of the artwork by other poser artists in some of the thumbs. it's worth a heads up, to see if your copywritten work is being used, anyway. so here's the link. some of you may not agree with me on this issue of "list buddies" voting on the 20. and, i am reasonably certain that the ptb on this site will move this to the darkest regions of the ot forum. but, that first picture on the site, the sloe-eyed girl, i recognized. and, a couple of others on the next link i clicked on.

Well, that explains a lot.

It's a real shame that some people cheat to get noticed. Considering the artist and the quality of the images, I'm not surprised at all.

i don't know why this made me so angry. it just did. partly, because once i discovered this place i lectured the folks on my lists to respect the works of others...heck, back then i bet many of the artists would have said fine...just give me credit. well, this all was too much effort for the ladies of the lists...so i resigned. i hope a staffer or two reads this before they send me to o.t. purgatory. because, this is warez, too....only on the small folks.

Unfortunately, Poppi, the link has been disabled due to excess bandwidth. That means there is no proof.

Tried looking at the site and got the "too much data transfer" geoshitties loves posting on their members website

oh, mann!!! this was so blatant, too. so, is that bandwidth thing just for today? maybe, too many checking all at once? or for the month? 'cause this makes a joke of us twice...once by getting the list folks to vote 7 times into the hot 20, twice, by using our members HARD work to build a site, with no credit given.

Poppi, I was on those lists too. Got booted once I found out they were warezers and I spoke out against it. I was hounded and harrassed endlessly in email to the point of having to change email addresses. I got many many lectures that it was okay to get pirate copies if you couldn't afford it "by a high school teacher" on the list. Her rational? They were improving their lives by using those programs. When I pointed out it was a crime, she got real nasty to me. I have no respect for people like that, and if indeed the artist on the hot 20 is one of those, well then, I have no respect for her either. Hopefully the other legitimate artists on this site will read this and adjust their perceptions accordingly. But don't hold your breath.

Well, her website just opened. And yes, I see Toxic Angel's image there and a few others. However, they are lonks back to the artists sites. That kind of a gray area.

nowhere does it say that toxic angel is the author of the work in question. ir you use what someone else has worked hard to create, at least give them credit. having to follow a link for credit is alot more time consuming than what most surfers do. also...7 in the 20? all commented on by names i have never heard...except for sophiadeer? that is not fair to us, here..who don't happen to have the time or inclination to belong to lists. this is so bogus. i wish the ptb at renderosity, would free up those seven spaces in the 20 for those of us who are honest, and work for what ever little acclaim we may get...and, NO...i'm not in contention, there. i gave up posting to the poser gallery months back, when i realized i could work for 3 weeks on a picture, only to have it "buried" in a half hour.

Poppi, come on over to DeviantArt. You can find my gallery here http://darkswan.deviantart.com

it is psp...paint shop pro. i think with our "zero tolerance", if you see someone's work displayed without credit, or consent, on another site...you should bring it up. lists are whole different animals...r'osity has not dealt with them, yet. nor, is it likely that they will be dealt with...after all....with the new rendorosity/cl...content paradise deal...why turn hundreds of people off by enforcing copywrite laws? heyas...all the tubers must aspire to make their own...i did....din't some of you? so, when they cross that barrier..they might buy, here, right? so, let's just put our warez guard down a bit. in fact, let's reward them further by allowing their "list" votes, as opposed to votes from those of us who have been long in good standing, put them in the hot 20...with just using the same model, in same position, 7 times. wrong, wrong, wrong.

hmmm this is what I see when I get to the site.. (Second page) Everything is credited. Links back either to their homesite or rosity gallery.

Yes, that is what I saw, however,(and this is a big one) Both Vallejo and Bell do NOT want their images used even in links. I know, I've asked. They are pretty darn ugly about it too. I'm sure once they get the mail she will be getting a nasty gram pronto.

yep she will .. Boris and Bell are very strict with their stuff though I have found that if you ask they at least respond civilly with a thank you for asking but no.

I had wondered about so many of these images by this same person in the Hot 20 as well ... never have I seen her comment on anyone else's work in the galleries, and, not meaning to put anyone down, but all the images seem to be a bit out-of-place among the others there. I have in the past voted for images I just "knew" had to wind up in the Hot 20, only to go there and find image after image of the same Poser character by the same person. Strange. Rhi

Stormrage is right about Boris and Bell. I got the same response from them. I am sorry to say that links and credit on these sites are not good enough. They HAVE to have written (can be email as long as artist email address is provided as well) permission from the artist/s. Anything is not acceptible. I have been using PSP since version 4 (now onto v7) and I have always created my own graphics. There is no excuse not to. There are thousands of tutorials tell PSPers how to create various things if they took just a little bit of effort to find them. It's not hard. Having been a sub-leader of an online website based group, I know they are there. Apart from the fan sites, there are at least 5 big sites devoted to the PSP community with hundreds of tutorials each.

Ok ........ enough of the bashing! I did write to Boris and Bell and did get their written permission to link back to their website only. As for my graphics list, I closed it! So try again! Sorry to sound like a witch, but just because a newcomer comes along doesnt mean you have to get nasty. Now, Who is cheating? Me? I dont think so. This was a hateful forum with only one purpose, to shame and humilate someone you dont even know. I hope you can sleep at night karen

I'm quite sure you have permission to link back, but to use one of their images? I doubt it. They haven't given permission to anyone for that, ever. I can't imagine them changing their policy for one person. Could you post that permission please? That would end all the arguments.

Poppi, I'm behind you on this complaint. Sorry if this is going to make me unpopular but... I too had a difficult time understanding so many images by someone who, a month ago, was asking how to "make clothes stick".
http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=895519

I'm not saying the work is not ok. It's just not Hot 20 material. That in itself means nothing. But 5 images, all very simple and all very similar, don't belong in the Hot 20. Had it been one image it wouldn't have been noticed.

To manipulate the Hot 20 this way isn't fair to others.

From BorisJulie.com FAQ section Is there any way I can get permission to display some of the images in my website? Sometimes under specific conditions we allow some people to display a limited number of our paintings in their web sites. This only applies to non-commercial, gallery type web sites. Because of legal contracts with our clients and agents we can never grant permission to use any of our copyrighted images for downloading, wallpapers or screensavers. Keep in mind also that we cannot allow you to use any of our art to illustrate game characters, home pages, or to represent any organization, group, ideology or body of work. If your site is indeed a gallery site we could direct you to the conditions under which a limited number of our images can be displayed. Once again, never use any images from any artist without their permission

I did ask how to make clothes stick, and I recieved very good advice from well known poser artists. I thank them!

There is nothing wrong with asking for help. However, there is something VERY wrong about manipulating the galleries to get an image into the hot 20. There are people who have been on this site for years polishing their art. To have so many of your images in the hot 20 that are at the most basic level of poser is a shame. Sone very good advice from a known poser artist. Polish your craft. Learn how to make expressions. Use new models. Explore different lighting environments. Leant to do post work. Stop getting your buddies to kangaroo your images into the hot 20. Until then those of us that DO work hard at making our art better feel nothing but disgust and shame at someone who cheats.

are you saying I dont do hard work? I work very hard. I have wonderful mentors who have helped me. Disgust and shame is what I feel for those who would deny a newcomer a fair chance to explore what I can and cant do. i never said I was experienced in poser, far from it, but i have been able to make some beautiful images. It is true that they are beginners work. BUT I DID NOT MANIPULATE VOTES! I feel strongly about this and as I am an RN,JD, I am taking this to the highest authority Thank you for your helpful comments karen

<> No one here is limiting what you can and can't do. Perhaps you protest overmuch? Highest authority of what? No one on this site has EVER had 5 images in the hot 20 at once, Not Toxic Angel, nor Skooldaze or even Blackhearted. That in itself should say something, eh? I'm sure you can't argue with those statistics. If you are not cheating, how is it that you have managed to get 5 images in the poser hot 20 when even the BEST of the poser artists have not? I'm sure you cannot deny that it is quite a mystery to the other artists here who strive to make the hot 20 that you make it with every single image you post. That is unheard of success for a beginner and for the level of expertise you have at this point in time. Food for thought.

It must be very very good. Why are you not in the hot 20? I have seen your work, it isnt bad. actually, it is quite nice. You see, I will not stoop so low as to make nasty comments about anothers work, as I know how hard it is just to render

RNKarenER.. while you do work hard you should feel "Disgust and shame" for the fact that 6 of your images are in the top 20 Sure you have good images. Most artists only get 1 image in the top 20 YOU have 6. That right there gives the idea that you have "salted" the votes. If you are not manipulating votes then you should ask your buddies to please not vote for your image but let the poser community truly vote for you.

Funny you should say that ....HisMinky..... Toxic Angel wrote to me and said he should be asking me for pointers! LOL Now, are you folks done bashing me? I know Erotica is seething with some sort of jealous rage, sorry honey, it doesnt suit you. as for the rest of you. say goodnight and I will keep practicing and you all will

Constructive critism.. Your characters are great. Your poses very well done. Postwork is fine.. The main flaw with each scene is the character is staring in the same direction for the most part. Your character rarely changes, and even then the new character stares in the same direction as the others. Try moving the eyes, changing the expression. Try varying the lighting a bit more.. Adding a twinkle in the eye or a reflection. Have them looking down, right, left up even backwards. Try tilting their head. Or maybe even try bending it a bit forward to throw off the staring off into neverland look., All in all good images but honestly not an excellent

Oh honey, you must get over yourself. Please.

I didn't make nasty comments, and if you BOTHERED to read the comments posted in mine, you will see I get critisism in my gallery as well. I don't get all bent out of shape, rather I USE those comments to better my work instead of whining like a child about being harrassed. I'm not in the hot 20 precisely because I don't cheat. I don't have an army of buddies poised to jump onto a posted image and vote willy nilly until my image hits the hot 20. Oh, I suppose I could, but what exactly would that say about my art? The REAL votes from the ESTABLISHED artists are what mean something to me. What if they don't vote? Well I guess then I should work harder and USE those constructive comments to fix my images. Its all about "credibility". With 5 uninspired basic poser images in the gallery, it speaks VOLUMES for your credibility. Don't believe me? Ask around. I'm not out for "popular". I want to be the BEST I can be. If that means my art isn't good enough to vote into the hot 20, well so be it.

Jealous of you?? "Oh honey, you must get over yourself. Please." I think i have more talent in my little toe than...

I believe that Legume had more than 6 images in the "Hot 20", but I don't think that he managed to get a full house. Does anybody know his highest count? And yes, he is an artist, even when he is trying hard to be a cartoonist.

Thank you Stormrage, I am learning. I only aquired poser in September. So, I am no expert, but contstantly learning. But I know that learning doesnt mean to trash another. I have never, no would I ever slander someone ( even the pink pony) for doing well. I have had success with Stormi's Bogarde! Now I would like to go on to other things. I did the Golden lady pic for Stormi and Dalinese as a favor. they asked me if I would, I did it a little to fast and yes there were mistakes. But the idea was to see if I could make an image using their new product. Do You remember when you first started and all your images looked the same? well, I made a very pretty image, and I am having a hard time letting that go! ( I like her). My thanks to you for your helpful comments Karen

I stand corrected. We must worship the pink pony!! karen, if Toxic Angel asked for pointers, I sincerely believe he was trying to be delicate in saying that you were doing something special and not about art. Main Entry: sarcasm Pronunciation: 's-"ka-z&m Function: noun Etymology: French or Late Latin; French sarcasme, from Late Latin sarcasmos, from Greek sarkasmos, from sarkazein to tear flesh, bite the lips in rage, sneer, from sark-, sarx flesh; probably akin to Avestan thwar&s- to cut Date: 1550 1 : a sharp and often satirical or ironic utterance designed to cut or give pain 2 a : a mode of satirical wit depending for its effect on bitter, caustic, and often ironic language that is usually directed against an individual b : the use or language of sarcasm

No comment on the art, but it speaks volumes on how the Hot 20 really works. There was a big thread in OT forum just a few days ago about this very thing. It(HOT20) should be reworked or scraped all together.

RNKarenER..learning is fine..being voted into the top 20 with work that obviously needs work, is not. Soft laugh And my early work never looked the same. It was varied. but do us all the favor and please be honest or ask your friends to quit voting for you. because they really aren't doing you any favors and only making you look really bad right about now.

I agree~ the HOT 20 should be re-worked. As all of you and myself have no control over this, it should be somehow, reconsidered?

LMAO!!

Well, I'll make sure to ask ToxicAngel when he logs in :)

Okay guys.. this really doesn't need to be a knock out dragout.. RNkarenER- your ego really needs to hit the floor for a bit. Please do me a favor and look at your work and the truly constructive critisims.. Judge It as you would judge others. Look at artists such as Syyd, ToxicAngel, And many others and truly tell us that your images belong in the top 20. Everyone else.. Name calling isn't helping you all either. Give her constructive CONSTRUCTIVE critisim and a TRUE rating and that will counteract the "bullshit" excellents she has recieved and Maybe she will truly learn how to create fantastic images.

No, your friends are NOT dong you any favors, Karen. It might be really keen to get your novice images into the hot 20 time and time again, but they are destroying your credibility. See, artists, especially poser artists, are a real inbred bunch. We talk amongst ourselves. Once it is percieved that you are cheating(even if you aren't) that stigma STICKS with you for a long, long time. And if you are thinking about eventually using poser as a means to earn a living, I can assure you, the perception from THIS bunch WILL come back to bite you in the butt. Take that one to the bank.

"Try moving the eyes, changing the expression" Okay Stormrage I took your advice. Somehow, somethings still missing. And I worked so damn hard too!

DAMMIT, Lapis!! That's twice now. I'm makin you clean the monitor next time.

Hey! When did you sneak a camera into my office? You sneakysneak, you!

Now this sounds like an all out threat : See, artists, especially poser artists, are a real inbred bunch. We talk amongst ourselves. Once it is percieved that you are cheating(even if you aren't) that stigma STICKS with you for a long, long time. And if you are thinking about eventually using poser as a means to earn a living, I can assure you, the perception from THIS bunch WILL come back to bite you in the butt. Take that one to the bank. Do I take this as a threat? or constructive critism?

Hey Lapis now there's one for the Hot 20 - LOL!

ummmmmmm Lapis...... I can laugh now

Its advice, Karen. If you don't believe me about the cliquishness of the Poser group, try reading some of the threads in the poser forums. Or the OT forums. Believe me, if I threatened you, you would know it. I don't mince words. Ask anyone.

I think they mean "Perception is reality".

LMAO Hey Lapis no fair now I have to clean my monitor.. Sighing RNKarenER not a threat.. it is the truth.. The stigma will stay with you and unfortunantly even if you aren't asking them to vote for you it looks like you are. and when people get angry over something it doesn't help. Look at your work DOES IT BELONG in the top 20? YOUR HONEST opinion. Not the face you keep showing everyone.