Doh, I thought you were already participating Lemur01!  I just accepted your comments like I would have before this was really going on.  Welcome aboard :)

I was also surprised, I could swear I read a post from you, lemur01, saying you wanted in. So I went back and in page 15 I found that post. Lemur01, you got me confused now! :-)

I think karen has had a lot on her plate lately... must have missed me.

i reckon yer just being greedy lemur...ya wanna be in twice!! :D

I'm sorry but real life issues have been keeping me very busy and I'm overdue on crits on many pictures (I think I have about 25 unread ebots in my mail folder!).

Sorry! :-(

You and me both lol, they sure do keep coming!

Yikes, sorry Jack! Adding you now :-)

Is a happy bunny 

bouncy... bouncy... bouncy...

Could everyone please remove me from their favorites. Sorry for the trouble, but I'm afraid I'm done with the club. I've enjoyed the Critique Club so far, and appreciate the thoughtful comments on my images, but the numbers are getting a bit overwhelming and I can't keep up with the critiques. With up to 25/30 new images a day, I can't give each one the time for the thoughtful critique it deserves. Thanks.

fivecat - ok, i'll remove you.  but i don't think the point is to comment on each and every one.  any more than being a member of the poser community means you post in each and every thread.  if you just write one critique a day, then you're still contributing a whole lot.  so i completely understand if you don't like getting all the ebots.  the forum is a great alternative for that.  but please don't stop because you think the demand on your time is too much.  anything you can give in terms of time is appreciated and welcome.  you shouldn't feel obligated to do more than you can comfortably give.

Does that matter? You don't have to comment every picture. Nearly impossible, by the amount of pictures coming in. I cannot comment everything either (ok, I commented nearly nothing in the last two weeks, but I had a broken computer so...).

We have the club to get our images commented and to know who wants critique instead of praise. As long as you manage to do some pictures, I would wish you would stay. I would not even concider it a problem if you commented no pictures, but stay to get your pictures commented, as long as enough others still comment.

So, please comment some pictures and stay. Pretty please?

ONE comment can make or break some people.  If you feel like you HAVE to leave, that's fine. Fivecat, I don't comment on every pic the ebots tell me of.  I make point of LOOKING at each one.  If something grabs my eyeballs (I scream like a little girl, but you know the ol' figure of speach) I comment. 

NO ONE has an obligation to comment on ANY pictures.  If you'd like your pics to be commented one, someone will!  That someone might even be me! :lol:  You do some intereresting things, so I'm gonna watch you anyway!  So there! NYAH!

If you want to keep watching some people, watch'em.  Everyone has different styles. Watch the styles you know about and forget the rest if you want! 

The whole idea is generate SOME critical comment, somehow on some pictures more than NONE!  We've done that.

If you want to do a little, just stick around and do a little.  THAT is still light years MORE than MOST people who browse the galleries!  You just have to keep it in perspective. ^__^ V,,

Ok, cobaltdream, bantha, and Joelglaine, you've all made good points. I've seen good images become great images as the result of feedback from group members -- I see the value it has to those who are receptive. That there are a lot of images daily is a good thing, as many people are choosing to participate. I'll continue to critique what images I can. I just didn't want people to feel obligated to critique me when sometimes I can't critique that many (although truthfully I don't upload that often).

Don't sweat it if you don't want to or can't comment on every image, I certainly don't expect everyone to comment all of mine - some of the content may be something you don't want to see or don't care about, or simply don't have time to give attention to.  I think there are plenty of people moving with this now, enough that everyone is gettting a fair amount of comments, and some good information is being passed around in all directions.

Keep in mind there's another approach to using the gallery for this:  you don't have to take ebot notifications for this business, you can control whether or not you're notified by artist.
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/member.php?favorite_artists

You can also view each person's gallery from that link, and make your decision ... uh, based on the thumbnails.  Fucking thumbnails.  Aggravating rule.  :cursing:

I am also one who does not comment on every image. I look at them all, but I only comment when I have something to say that I think is helpful. 

If someone does something that affects me, I'll praise it, even if I can't think of something else to say.  Oftimes artists need a little praise to know they're on the right track.  Praise need not be empty.  Looking with a critical eye is NOT just a possibly negative thing, IMO.

If something needs fixing, it should be pointed out.  If something in a piece makes you smile, or tugs at your heart--well, for me--I feel obligated to tell the artist!  Most artists lack faith in their own creations, and sometimes just a little positive afirmation goes a long way.

It doesn't haven't to be 'cool' or 'awesome' or such. :lol:  A "Good composition", or "Dynamic color use" or even "Evoked sadness and pity--Great job" would go far from most empty praises.

Sometimes we don't know we're flying until sometimes someone points out that that our feet have left the ground. ^__^ V,,

i feel the same way , well said JOELGLAINE!

For those viewing Kenrnest63's work who would like some background on what's going on:

http://bulfinch.englishatheist.org/dante/hell/hellindex.htm  Full text English translation in verse form, a bit difficult to read because it's very formal old-style English along the lines of King James Version biblical text

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dante's_Inferno a very minimal summary, but helpful for locating which canto is being dealt with

Both together are a great help in appreciating and understanding Ken's magnificent paintings.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dante  Life and times of the man

How known is Dante outside of Italy? I sometimes wonder, because here we study him in school, read his works and almost everyone has, or had, a copy of the Commedia in his home. For us, knowing about Dante is a perfectly normal thing...

Giorgio

Dante is famous across the world, but many people in the English-speaking parts of the world read his Divine Comedy at a pretty young age, and a lot of its meaning is something we just don't get.  I'm nearly 40 now, and I'm looking at Inferno for the first time in 25 years, and so much of it makes sense now, all the politics went completely over my head when I was a kid.  The religious and moral themes got through, but it never occurred to me to wonder who all the people really were, that Dante was talking directly to very powerful people who were his enemies and his friends.

Many Americans probably do not know that Dante basically standardized the modern Italian language (e.g. I never knew, I don't think that was taught at any school I attended).

I'd like to join as well - opinions and constructive criticism always appreciated.  I've posted a few things in the Gallery, but would like to become much better using Poser and achieving "life-like" poses.

Ok, I have my gmail address all set up for POP3 and have just gone and readded everyone again. At least those who are listed in the first post in the thread.  Hope I got everyone.

Welcome back :)

Yaaaaaaaaaay!!  Let's ROCK AND ROLL, now!  Peeps are a posting, and let the critical times go a rolling!  Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!

It's up to US to make the art-world a better place.  A little enthusiasm and excitement , and an attitude of wanting to help people fix stuff will make the world a better place, one render at a time!

"Per adua ad astra"-- 'To the Stars by hard works'    <Some ancient Latin said that.  It's still true, ya know.  ^__^ V,,

Hi
Can I join the club please? I just posted today my first render -comments very welcome. I was hesitating if to join for two nearly contradicting  reasons: I am not sure I can critique all or even most posted pictures,but I saw above that it is acceptable to comment  as much as I can, so that's fine.
On the other hand, because Imay not have many renders to post, it may not fair to those I commented on,not beeing able toget back at me...
Bare with me while I add the very substantial list, I'll have to do it a bit at a time.
See you (or  at least your renders) in the club

There's no permission required, just join up :)

ArtPearl in your case, you probably want to make it very clear what you're looking for feedback on, since you explained that Poser is just an intermediate step for you - many people will be making suggestions on color, postwork techniques, and lighting that may not apply to your finished work at all.

Quote - Hi
Can I join the club please? I just posted today my first render -comments very welcome. I was hesitating if to join for two nearly contradicting  reasons: I am not sure I can critique all or even most posted pictures,but I saw above that it is acceptable to comment  as much as I can, so that's fine.
On the other hand, because Imay not have many renders to post, it may not fair to those I commented on,not beeing able toget back at me...
Bare with me while I add the very substantial list, I'll have to do it a bit at a time.
See you (or  at least your renders) in the club

There is no minium requirement for uploads :)  Just do what you can when you can.  All we are seeking to do is get a list of people together in one place who are open to honest comments instead of all of the standard "ooing and ahhing" out of fear of getting yelled at for their honesty.

I haven't posted anything in the gallery since signing up. I just haven't been really inspired to create anything. 

Also, it's not necessary to post a comment on every image that is uploaded. Just comment when you can and when you feel you have something of value to contribute. 

Quote - OK folks, I'm back!

I've added the new signups over Easter.

I have a new article published today on the art of receiving critiques and how to get the best out of it:
http://www.renderosity.com/news.php?viewStory=13552

I have now updated the opening post to reflect the different methods for getting crits.

Don't work so hard Karen. Shouldn't you search for easter eggs instat working on your puter :)
Damn was away for a couple of days and the group is growing like grass :)
Going back to my work in progress now.
I'll post it maybe to try to find a name for it since I'm having problems finding names :)

I haven't posted on this thread in a while, but I have been dilligently posting comments on every piece that rolls in and is uploaded, with few execptions.  Though I try to be helpful, I realize at times my honesty might be a bit too much, but so far no complaints.  I did want to make anyone aware, I do try to help if I think i can with a suggestion.  I have seen a lot of good work thrown off by something "amiss" ....... thats just "odd.".   Usually that minor change can make the difference.

I do have a concern, however.    I have been very hesitant to post my feelings, as it might be taken wrong, but it is so engrained in me now, I really feel I should say something.   In several images I have looked at and gotten ebot messages of a new image, there is a lot of description of "Just threw this up"......."Just wanted to get something up today".  Its no specific entity, but names showing up with ebot alerts, over and over, then to see "Just playing with my new item".

Now, I'm not saying people can't do that, its fun of course, and thats fine.  However, it is sort of wasteful to walk on over to critique something that was "thrown together".  Do you see what I mean?  Maybe something else in the description to note it doesnt require an artistic critique would be helpful.

To set up a scene quickly by literally throwing things together is some kind of skill.
Some can do a decent pic within 20 Minutes (with little to no postwork) and other maybe can not do it for various reasons.
If somebody throws stuff together you could still tell him/her that item X would fit better than what he used or that the color Yab doesn't match with whatever else color.
After some practise the quick pictures should look better then.

That is if the person wants to combine fun with practise.

It takes a different kind of critique, is all.  It's more like commenting on a quick sketch, than a painting.  Form, balance, and execution still apply.  If it's a piece of crap, then whoever posted it needs to be chided as wasting our time.

If it has potential to be turned into a good render, tell 'em what might help 'em do that.

I use 'thrown together' to show-case something new I'm trying, or using and NOT sure what I'm doing.  Comments positive and negative help guide the useage and execution, IMVHO.

just as a side note, one thing I've noticed over the past 10 years in regard to poser renders is that the image creator will sometimes preface his/her image with a self-congratulatory statement: "I'm particularly pleased with this image" "I really like how this image turned out" et al. These usually imply that the image poster doesn't want anyone to contradict those statements, meaning there are deficiencies in the image that the poster is hoping the viewing audience will not mention. and it's definitely the case that the image creator will be more acutely aware of any problems than will the general audience.

Quote - just as a side note, one thing I've noticed over the past 10 years in regard to poser renders is that the image creator will sometimes preface his/her image with a self-congratulatory statement: "I'm particularly pleased with this image" "I really like how this image turned out" et al. These usually imply that the image poster doesn't want anyone to contradict those statements, meaning there are deficiencies in the image that the poster is hoping the viewing audience will not mention. and it's definitely the case that the image creator will be more acutely aware of any problems than will the general audience.

you are so right :)

Tiari:

Quote - Now, I'm not saying people can't do that, its fun of course, and thats fine.  However, it is sort of wasteful to walk on over to critique something that was "thrown together".  Do you see what I mean?  Maybe something else in the description to note it doesnt require an artistic critique would be helpful.

While you shouldn't feel obligated to critique any piece, those in particular I think you can safely skip with no hard feelings (I often do).

Mr Nancy:

Quote - "I'm particularly pleased with this image" ..."I really like how this image turned out"... et al. These usually imply that the image poster doesn't want anyone to contradict those
statements, meaning there are deficiencies in the image that the poster is hoping the viewing
audience will not mention. and it's definitely the case that the image creator will be more
acutely aware of any problems than will the general audience.

I don't really see anything wrong with that - if something is intended to be a certain way, the poster probably isn't too interested in being told it needs to be changed.  I glaze over when people point out to me "the hair is unrealistic" for example.

Quote - I don't really see anything wrong with that - if something is intended to be a certain way, the poster probably isn't too interested in being told it needs to be changed.  I glaze over when people point out to me "the hair is unrealistic" for example.

I can agree with that.

For me to be able to create anything artistic, be it writing or a picture, I have to "see" the finished product in my head. Once I get that vision, it's just a matter of copying what I "see" in my mind's eye onto paper or into an image.  Where images are concerned, my challenge is finding the right techniques and tricks to get what I'm seeing onto paper or into a graphic program and have it look like the image I see in my head.   

The only time I think I really fail is when I have no vision and then I struggle for direction, as in the case of the Drow in my gallery. I had no vision other than "Drow wearing this type of outfit" and tried to create something from an idea and IMHO failed to do that.  The image is "ok", but too busy and distracting to the eye, and I knew that when I posted it, but I was simply tired of working with it by then.

I see people saying that they have a hard time tuning their brain to give honest critique because they have been programmed to tell little white lies and only give praise or say nothing at all.

You aren't the only one having to change your way of thinking. When  it comes to art I have always created it to please my eyes because I know what I like, and have always felt that if  other people like it that is just a bonus.   And TBH I still feel this way because it's impossible to please everyone and there is no such thing as "flawless" because someone will always be able to look at something with a new perspective eye and point out something wrong or which doesn't work....according to them.  Heck I find myself  mentally correcting the works of some of our greatest masters when I go to an art gallery!

Because I create to please me I have a hard time accepting criticism on my images. That's not to say I don't want it, because it's nice to know what other people really think and feel. And don't get me wrong, I don't get upset over the comments either.  What I'm trying to say is that for the most part because I create art to please me that the negative comments kind of bounce off of me and I have a hard time taking them to heart and TBH I have found myself rolling my eyes at some of them. 

However, please don't give up on me!!!  Don't think that I don't appreciate you having taken the time to look at and comment on my images. Because I do. I really do   However, it's a learning process for all of us. 

I am pleased to say that I have found myself reading some comments and then scruitinizing my image and going "Oh yeah, I see what you mean!"   Also, please don't be offended if I don't go and correct the pieces that are already in my gallery  because I deleted all of the working files once the image was done and uploaded to my gallery.  I will however keep suggestions and ideas  given, on tap for future projects.

Appreciate any help in this matter :)

GothicAngel, how about "Forward!" or somesuch :)

Going somewhat back to what Tiari was talking about, I hate to be a bit of a wet blanket, but really if something is a pretty ordinary WIP image, it doesn't need to be lavished with tons of love and flattering - I notice at least one example with a large number of ratings (somewhere around 20 ratings) between 4 and 5.  Support is all well and good, but that's a bit overkill ;)

**GothicAngel:
** how about  "Facing the Storm".   Looks scary - glad I'm not there!

Thanks for the help and I'll consider it :)  Like "Facing the Storm" so far :)

I think there are a few artist out there they really deserve great comments. I think alot artist just uploading almost every day a new image. Where is the real work. I just need almost a month to finish one image because I do a lot postwork and painting in PS. I take my time overlook the image many times and if I find something I don't like I'll rework till I'm pleased :)

You never will do anything right with qrits. Go and try to put your opinion on some images what get at least tons of aaaaaah and oooooh other member will hunt you down. :)

I like "Facing the Storm" too.  Here are some others, not as good, but fitting.

War!    (The  horses kind of remind me of Revelations)
Victory!
Going Home
Desolation

That is an excellent looking image! Very impressive.

Quote -

You never will do anything right with qrits. Go and try to put your opinion on some images what get at least tons of aaaaaah and oooooh other member will hunt you down. :)

I've been taking my chances and working at being more honest in the galleries, and so far I haven't had any death threats,  lol And if I do happen to get one I'll just say "OH!!!! You aren't part of the critique group?! I thought you were"  and then give them this link,  hehe

Quote -

I've been taking my chances and working at being more honest in the galleries, and so far I haven't had any death threats,  lol And if I do happen to get one I'll just say "OH!!!! You aren't part of the critique group?! I thought you were"  and then give them this link,  hehe

ROFL:....I never thought about this way. Could be a funny thing I guess :)
Thanks for your opinion. Image isn't ready yet....Alot postwork is still to do. Like I said it takes me almost a month to finish one image. Don't like to rush. Better be good or I'll get to much qrits about my sloppy work..........LOL

@ Gothic Angel

Add dramatic wind.  Stir that cloak and mane and give that man a HAT!  His bald head just looks wrong! LOL  Those horse look calm to the point of drugged.  No emotion can be showed on the guys--they're masked.  HOWEVER show somw eye-whites ond flaring nostrils on the horses and throwing heads and you can convey a lot.  Life is motion.

Hmm, titles for the picture ....... possibilities?  "Dark riders"  "Chasing the storm", or "Oncoming dark".

As far as critique goes, I'm honest, and I'll be honest here.  If an image disturbs me (this has happened for various reasons), Its a genre I really don't care for,  I will actually leave a comment like this:

"This image may very well be good, however, since it is not my taste, I cannot give an unbiased critique".   I do want posters to know I "am" looking, but also let them know in whatever the endeavor, i probably will not leave comments on future updates of the same image.  I think thats fair, at least in my opinion.  I would rather leave that, than no comment at all, and have some think I either don't care, or are "ignoring" their work.

There are certain things though, I will, with no hesitation go for the jugular LOL.  This may or may not be liked, but I hope its helpful.  IN particular, haha, I am a "breast snob".   For those that insist on doing nudes (i like nudes, a lot actually), I'll go there! LOL  I do hope that doesnt offend anyone, but i often find the gravitational pull, encasement, size shape.......so on can totally break an otherwise good image.

@ **JOELGLAINE

like i said....I'm not finished yet....alot postwork has to be done but anyway Spanx for the useful tip I'll consider it :)
The bold guy get some hair.....haven't started to paint it yet....just the mane and the tail for the horses and the cloakes :)
Puting some windy leaves in it should be an good idea and the flaring nostrils I considered too :)

I used the poses from the movie 300...dunno if anybody recalled them....it was a scene i really liked and I memorized it like it was.....there where only buildings and some ppl araound ... doesn't want to paint all of them in this scene. :)

Dunno if I change the background to something else...amybe a lighter one :)

Any tips would be appreciated :)
**

GothicAngel: Actually, I like the dark and menacing atmosphere. Fits very well with the rather gruesome trophies the first rider is holding.
I agree with the comments on the horse faces. You might want to pull back the lips on the rearing horse, flaring nostrils, and maybe, since the atmosphere looks cold, some "steam" from the nostrils.
The ground looks too smooth and flat to my eyes. It could use some pebbles and grit (noise node into displacement?).
The second horse and rider somehow look a little stiff to me. Even a rather sedate walking pose on the horse would make it more dynamic. Some asymmetry in the pose of the rider - I'm thinking about holding the reins with one hand, and the free hand doing something else - would also make the image more dynamic.
The stark outline of the dead trees works very well for me. This can become a fantastic image.

I would suggest posting the image in the gallery or the Art Theory Forum for input otherwise this thread will be taken over by critiquing instead of a place for people to sign up.

@ Acadia

you are right and dunno what happening. I just want a name for the image thats all but some suggestions popped up too :) ROFL

We really should take it over to the Art Theory Forum or maybe I delete the post if I still can do this :)

I really like "Facing The Storm" and I guess I go with this name :)

Hey there, late to the show as always, story of my life.....

I would like to be included in the list and I will start adding to my favourites just now.

I was getting a bit dispondent with the galleries here to be honest, I'm learning photography at the same time as poser and vue, and the photgraphy forums I use are full with great people and great advice, so much so I have learned a lot and actually sold several shots, where as the poser galleries here, as has been mentioned before by others are (trying to be polite here) not very constructive apart from the very rare comment that makes you feel that atleast one person has taken the time to view your post properly and offer a comment/opinion.

I regcognize a lot of people in this thread from various posts and also recognize that there is also a lot of knowledge and talent here and hope to tap into the knowledge.

cheers

Scott

Knowledge is only useful, if it's applied.  We just know we overly opinionated, and love shooting our mouths off! :lol:

If you don't mind us appling our eyes to your work, we'll apply our mouths to it, as well.  My metaphor is making me hungry.  I'll go eat breakfast now! ^__^ V,, 

Welcome on board!