Okay, money is not an object in this discussion.  I already bought Poser 7 and am happy with it. Additionally, I don't find Poser's cost prohibitive, so future upgrade fees are not an issue. 

Now, I've spent years investing in learning the Poser interface and like the results I get. I particularly use the sketch renderers to produce b&w artwork, but I do enjoy making color images and animations every now and then.

So, that being said, I'd like to hear more about the reasons I should consider switching to Daz Studio or at least giving it another try.  To be honest, I tried ver. 1 and wasn't interested -- it just wasn't ready for prime time, yet. 

So, (and please don't mention price), what does it do better/faster than Poser 7?

By the way, I will make a rare "cross post" of this question over at the Poser forums to hear what they have to say from that point of view.

Thanks in advance for the help!

I think when you start an issue like this, you may nt find to cost prohibitove. That depends on who you are, where you are finacially and what you can afford to do. Your question is unfair, pointless and really just a shake of the Poser v DAZ debate. Poser does do much more than Daz, without a single doubt. I won't either doubt or correct you on that. But until I find a use for Poser 7, which currently I have none thankfully as my budget is as tight as a drum right now, I'll be sticking to Daz.

****  My opinion only  ****

The poser layout Is how can I say Awkward.
I f the lay out was better and more user friendly
I would probably use it as is it is a pain to use.
I like Daz because of how straight forward it is
and the program is improving constantly. I
Would assume that in the near future it will
surpass Poser.
I do have poser 5,6 and 7. I do not use them.
I like the tree system that Daz has to locate my objects
To locate objects in poser takes way to many steps.
I started with Bryce 4 and have been using them
ever since. I guess If I had started with poser I
would look at it a little different. Other than that
I do get pissed that items are not always compatible.
But the workarounds are getting better. And so is Daz.

If I could get everything to work in poser as easy as Daz
I might switch.     
Maybe

**AsheRaven2000: **I must say that your reply has taken me be surprise. I certainly didn't know that this was, in any way, a hot topic. Please accept my apologies if I came off as trying to stir something up, and I certainly wasn't trying to be "unfair" or "pointless."  I'm really not.  I'm being 100% open and sincere here. 

I currently use Poser and like it, but have heard a few people say that Daz Studio can produce better renders and, I must admit, I don't know whether that's true or not. Also, I'm particularly interested in the sketch capabilities of ANY renderer, as I need to produce some illustrations soon and have been finding that my results with Poser are not all I hope for (I can get the effects I'm after, but it really takes me a long time in Photoshop to do so).

I only posted the bit about the price because, honestly, because I didn't want to see this thread flooded with lots of comments that said only, "It's Free!"  I mean, free is nice and all (I'm a big fan of free), but the truth is I have a day job that lets me pay for my toys, so $150-$250 for Poser 7 isn't going to break my bank (I think I paid around $250, but it also came with a bunch of extra content, or training, or something -- can't remember right now).  So, I just didn't want Free to be the driving force behind this discussion.  I really want to hear about features and capabilities.

So, I poked through your gallery and see that you also do some nice sketch work.  Is that done native in Daz Studio, or is it post work in an image editor like Photoshop, Paintshop, or Gimp?  I'd love to hear more about your take on the software from someone who is obviously as passionate as you are.

pwSketch is great. You'll love it.

I, too, own P7, but I haven't opened it in a while. I have purchased every version of Poser since version 1, but I doubt I'll buy version 8.

D|S is easier and more intuitive for me to use, as I was able to configure the interface to match the way I work, and I really like the output I get with Studio.

And my favorite reason...

The Finder plugin makes content management a breeze!

**Sherlock: ** Thanks for replying to both threads. I went by your gallery and saw some very interesting comic-style art.  Do you have any samples of the pwSketch?  And I'm going to look at those shaders you used for your City of Angels piece.

 Lighthorse: I glanced at pwSketch a while back and wasn't sure it would really do what I want it to do. 

Thanks very much, everyone.

Quote - **AsheRaven2000: **I must say that your reply has taken me be surprise. I certainly didn't know that this was, in any way, a hot topic. Please accept my apologies if I came off as trying to stir something up, and I certainly wasn't trying to be "unfair" or "pointless."  I'm really not.  I'm being 100% open and sincere here. 

I currently use Poser and like it, but have heard a few people say that Daz Studio can produce better renders and, I must admit, I don't know whether that's true or not. Also, I'm particularly interested in the sketch capabilities of ANY renderer, as I need to produce some illustrations soon and have been finding that my results with Poser are not all I hope for (I can get the effects I'm after, but it really takes me a long time in Photoshop to do so).

I only posted the bit about the price because, honestly, because I didn't want to see this thread flooded with lots of comments that said only, "It's Free!"  I mean, free is nice and all (I'm a big fan of free), but the truth is I have a day job that lets me pay for my toys, so $150-$250 for Poser 7 isn't going to break my bank (I think I paid around $250, but it also came with a bunch of extra content, or training, or something -- can't remember right now).  So, I just didn't want Free to be the driving force behind this discussion.  I really want to hear about features and capabilities.

So, I poked through your gallery and see that you also do some nice sketch work.  Is that done native in Daz Studio, or is it post work in an image editor like Photoshop, Paintshop, or Gimp?  I'd love to hear more about your take on the software from someone who is obviously as passionate as you are.

Heh, I didn't mean to come across as harsh as I did, for that I apologise. I have a habit of eing more blunt than I need to be. My belief has always been if you don't have the budget, push the limits of the tools you have. I never used 3D studio max or lightwave, or Maya, the money wasnt there. At the time I used cover disk programmes, freewar and low cost applications and still got a lot of the desired results both my clents and I desired. I guess for me it's a matter of showing that affordable doesn't mean cheap and I hope I pull that off pretty well :)

As for my work it is all primarly doen in DAZ with the special effects added by Anime Studio or Real Draw Pro :)

My gallery here is very old Poser work. I've considered taking them down, because my Daz Studio work is much better.

I've done some work with Poser 7 at a friends computer, still own Poser 4, but browsing through the content is a PITA, as stated before, you can arange DAZ|Studio to your likings, which largely enhances the workflow.
Just placing the lights is easy, you look through your light and place it on the spotand if you use DreamLight's SpotlightPointer you even see the fall-off aera, makes lightning a fun part of creating. Now we are waiting for the pointlight pointer, uses the same tools for the pointlight.
You said "Don't talk money", but me and others  used their money to buy plug-ins for DS to make it even more effektif, I think I spend as much money for plug-ins as you did for Poser, but I have a tighter control over DS then you over Poser.
Posing is as well easier, using PowerPose or Puppeteer!
Need IBL, we got it and easier to use than in Poser. AO? pwSurface (you pay for it) or Pendragon, a free plug-in.
Want to use a tattoo on a skin without changing the original skin? Layered Image Editor.
Want to compare two different renders without quiting the program? Render Album.

Only things missing (for the moment!) are the Material Room (but you have a free plug-in to have a even greater control over your materials) and the Cloth Room(?), but this will arrive later.

You are talking about some sketch-style renders, as mentioned before, there is pwSketch.

And, one important thing, in DS I can create scenes with a higher poly-count than in Poser!

Ever tried to integrate a 3D-character into a photo? With shadows and reflections? Have a look at pwCatch!

Just my point of view!

Akhbour
GO Man Go
I could not have said it any better !!!!    WOW  !

mmitchell_houston
Here is a sample of pwSketch , I did have to reduce it a little for viewing.

WheetField-Sketch.jpg

Akbour has done a good job pointing out the extended capabilities of Studio. Nice job my friend!

There is a simple truth that anyone comparing applications needs to realize - Using a high end application in no way gaurantees high quality artwork. No program has that elusive "Perfection Button".

In short - The effort of the artist is more powerful than the abilities of the application.

Lighthorse: thanks for the picture.  I'm really going after more of a pen & ink look than straight sketching, but I still may have to look into this for another project I'm working on.

AsheRaven2000: Thanks for the reply.  I just said what I did about the money aspect because I didn't want to get 30 posts that all said: "It's Free!"  I like free stuff, but when it comes to my work I have a budget that I can work with and would rather pay a bit more to get the results I want.  That's why I keep shelling out the cash for Photoshop when it upgrades (not every time, and not immediately, mind you, but I do eventually upgrade).  When I started out (and my day jobs paid less than they do now), I lived off those freebie programs on the cover of 3D World and Computer Arts.  Nowadays I don't have as much time to work with all the apps that are available.

Akhbour: The plug-ins may very well be the reason I haven't gotten bit by the DS bug.  When I tried it (ages ago, I admit), it felt like such a Work In Progress that I didn't spend any time on it.  Now that I might be interested in it, when I open it there's just a feeling that there's so much missing... 

I think, from what I've heard, that I will install it (I hear 2.1 came out today) and see what it can do.

Thanks again!

Your welcome Mitchell, just have a try, look around and if you have a question, you see the button below?! ^_-

There you will find folks to give you a hand and answer your questions about D|S.

And looking at your avatar, have a look here, what you can do without any plug-in  and sketch renderer: www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php

Lighthorse: Great work with pwSketch, very well done!

Akhbour: Thanks for the words and the link.  That's a pretty nice effect on the shading.  I'll have to look more into that approach.

Always a pleasure. By the way, the recent toon shaders I have been using in my most recent pictures are all Daz too. I was never able to pull that kind of toon work with Poser. I'm not dissing Poser, I just currently can't find an effective use for it anymore, even with dynamics.

Is toon rendering native in DS, or is it a plug-in that needs to be purchased?

I stopped upgrading Poser at Version5, which I haven't used much since switching to Daz Studio. One of the main reasons I switched was seeing what Dreamlight's lighting sets could do. They only work in Daz Studio and I haven't seen the same capabilities in Poser renders. Light Dome Pro is incredible for realistic outdoor scenes. Studio Light Pro is the equivalent for indoor, but can be applied anywhere. Also Mood Master give the artist more options. Since D/S is free, spending a few bucks on these products and some of the other plugins is well worth the investment.

Quote - Is toon rendering native in DS, or is it a plug-in that needs to be purchased?

There is a built-in Toon renderer, but ...  it's just plain dull, only good for test rendering.

You get the best results with surface-tweaking, and there are the default-shaders with a couple of toon-shaders which work very well.

There are some Toon Shadersyou can download from the DAZ sit, but they are wolfully limited. The Shaders I use are of much better quality and can be found here:
 
http://forum.daz3d.com/viewtopic.php?t=70707

Best of all they are free also and very profesional when used correctly. I combine both the default and these with some very interesting and professional results

As for me I have both and use them intermittently. Can't really say which I prefer yet. Both have their pros and cons. 

ok..this only rough render , i`ve done in DAZ Studio1.8 with multiply in render album.
This pictures is apollo with toon maps and standart DAZ toon render ( without any shader than standart  ) . you can do this in poser im sure ... but not easy like in DAZ studio

DAZ studio have clever design and purpose than poser i think . You know from version 4 , user start have problem with  huge content , solutions in 5th , 6th , and 7th not help too much .
But in DAZ Studio its easy to manage . yes i agree someday this software would be surpass poser

Just to chime in, I've recently decided to concentrate more on Daz|Studio and may consider abandoning Poser altogether. Most of the reasons mentioned in previous posts echo my thoughts on Poser and why I would consider using D|S instead.

But one thing not mentioned is the constant changing of ownership of the Poser program. When I purchased my first license, Poser 4, it had just been purchased from MetaCreations by Curious Labs; then Curious Labs sold it to e-Frontier. Now the program is owned by Smith-Micro and it's anyone's guess what will become of it. 

On the other side of the fence, Daz|Studio was created by it's parent company, continues to be developed and offered (I'm sorry) for free by its parent company, and it appears to be gaining 3rd-party support with regards to plug-ins and other goodies. Another thing I like about D|S is that they release both Mac and PC version upgrades at the same time. As a Mac user, I was forced to wait nearly a year before the newest version of Poser was available for my OS. That gets old very quickly. 

For my workflow, I like a program that is easy to navigate and easy to use. I don't expect perfect renders because post-working is where I have most of my fun. Daz|Studio delivers what I need and, quite honestly, I think it's more fun to work with.

Just my 2¢

I have been using Poser since version 5 (actually Poser 4 demo) and I have used Daz Studio also since it's first release. I found that both products have their quirks and interfaces are different I still use Poser as my primary program due to I create content. D|S still does not have the tools I need to edit my content. D|S has a superior render engine over Poser 7 firefly but I use Carrara or Vue to render in.

If you want an example of how I am utilizing DAZ Studio with anime Studio Pro, look here

http://arielhsdgproject.blogspot.com/
http://sihderoject.blogspot.com/

Quote - ...I still use Poser as my primary program due to I create content. D|S still does not have the tools I need to edit my content....

That is for sure, sadly, when you want to create content you DO have to use Poser, but let's hope that'll change some day!

The first Poser I used was Poser3D - due to the clunkiness of the controls and the frustration that caused I soon abandoned it.

I since tried both Poser 5 and 6 (on a friend's PC) and downloaded the free Poser 5 when it was briefly available at Content Paradise.  It is no longer free.

Poser 5 is easier to control than Poser3D was - you overshoot the position you wanted much much less often when posing.  Poser6 seemed to have more content - especially a greater range of figures.

But!  I also downloaded DAZ Studio, and frankly the positioning controls etc (parameter dials) are for me much easier to use.  Obviously there's only a minuscule amount of content that you get with DS initially making it hard for the dead broke to uncover all that it can do as a complete program - indeed I don't think I've yet managed a complete scenic render with DS - i.e. no ground or sky.

I do prefer the method of finding content in DS, so much so that I have pretty much abandoned Poser altogether - no doubt Poser 7 is better at most things than 6 was but I hardly remember 6 and as I'm at University and struggling with a lack of funds (especially as I just got C4D 10 with an unexpected bursary) there's nothing I can do to find out.

I am intrigued to hear that there are a lot of plug-ins for DS - apart from Power Pose (which now comes incorporated into the prog) I didn't know about those.

Basically I only use either DS or Poser as an importer of an occasional figure as scale for showing off my modeling capabilities - in Bryce.  I would like to be able to do a whole scene in DS but doubt if that is possible.

The only reason I like D|S over Poser is because of my hair. (my actual hair on my head)
I like my hair, or what's left of it.  But from using Poser since version 1, my hair has either turned gray or has been pulled out due to frustration.  D|S isn't totally "frustration free" but there is a lot less hair pulling and graying these days since I switched. :biggrin:

That's the best reason I've heard, pzrite, and I couldn't agree more!

 Well, I started with D/S and later purchased Poser 7.  I still like D/S.  I found the learning curve much steeper with Poser and not as quickly rewarding, but I'll still keep plugging away at it and maybe eventually post an all Poser image.  The other application that I use is Vue which I have found easy to use and pretty powerful,   
   I never have used D/S or Poser to turn anything into a sketch... the one time that I did I tossed the image into Corel Paint to get the effect that I was after.  The image was originally set up in DAZ...

http://www.renderosity.com/mod/gallery/index.php?image_id=1431635

   I guess, I'd prefer this method of creating a sketch; however, I have seen and heard very good things about the PwSketch plug in and it is fairly inexpensive to add on.

  To FranOnTheEdge:  (great handle there)  You can use the free poser content here on this site in D/S just avoid dynamic clothing (IMO - there may be a work around I'm just not aware of) and other Poser content on other free 3D content sites like 3Dworld.  Another place to check out and get some of that much needed terrain and ideas for skies is the DAZ Artists Guild (we're a fairly helpful bunch).   

                                 Anyway, that is my buck and a quarter (inflation you know)
                                                                                             evoluzione

i started with daz at 1.0. i recently upgraded to 2.1 i also have p5 installed as well. both have their pros and cons . i'm pretty happy with the results i've gotten from them both. what i do like about daz is it's simplicity.i think daz eventually will be equal to poser when the rumored material room and the ability to apply dynamics.there is a material style plugin in the daz forums though as well as new shaders to do sketch work and other effects like those mentioned above as well. in fact they are being posted at a rapid rate of late here,daz and  sharecg. 
 all in all daz continues to suprise me each time i open it to do an image.render times vary for me. i'd say anywhere from 15 mins to a couple hours in both daz and poser. i've learned to expect that each time i begin a project. 
 as a plus for daz. there are tons of content  available for daz and it's characters that poser plain and simple hasn't produced. this i think will be a major  draw for daz in the long haul  
    

evoluzione33,
*"*you can use the free poser content here on this site in D/S just avoid dynamic clothing   ... *Another place to check out and get some of that much needed terrain and ideas for skies is the DAZ Artists Guild (we're a fairly helpful bunch)."

Yeah, I'm finding out about what can be used in DS, I did join the Artists Guild, but I haven't been able to find any grounds or skies there - even though there's a section called "Free Items and Content" - except one ground with grass...

try rdna .there're some really good props and skies there.

An interesting and informative discussion.  Came in here looking for exactly this...

I'm on Poser 5.  Frustrated.  Thinking about upgrading to P7 and then started wondering why I wasn't considering DS.  And of course had a ton of questions about what it can and can't do.

So it sounds like it has a reasonably advanced texturing system.  You can do some kind of sub-surface skin type shading.

It poses and animates...  I assume you can render out animations?  Not that rendering animations even falls within what I'm interested in.

It exports so I can continue to use other apps in my workflow.

I might have to give this a try.

Try it. You will not regret it!

 I'm currently using it for character creation... something I used to do exclusively in Poser 7. I currently have a V4 character in progress and am testing my texture maps. I love working with D|S's Surfaces settings over the Material Room in Poser. I can load new test textures in seconds and the render times seem a lot punchier than when working with Poser — even with the UberEnvironment lighting.

Also, when it comes to setting morph dials to create the character, I like the fact that the morph responds in real time with the slider. With Poser, I had to type in a numerical value because my system would hang each time I tried to turn a dial. I wasn't getting any realtime changes as I adjusted the morphs in Poser. The process was (and still is) rather tedious. Adjusting the sliders in D|S makes the process more like "sculpting".

Of course, once I have everything finished and ready to package up, I'll have to take the time to convert or create Poser-optimized files in order to market it. A small price to pay for the efficiency I've gained.

i use poser and daz and have found daz to be better for lighting effects etc. poser can be frustrating and you have to render an image a few times before you get the result you are looking for. often the finished render does not look like your pose you are creating.

i use poser and daz and have found daz to be better for lighting effects etc. poser can be frustrating and you have to render an image a few times before you get the result you are looking for. often the finished render does not look like your pose you are creating.

i use poser and daz and have found daz to be better for lighting effects etc. poser can be frustrating and you have to render an image a few times before you get the result you are looking for. often the finished render does not look like your pose you are creating.

I m just starting and have tried DAz already, can t compare Poser 7 because it s simply not working fast under windows vista. It needs like a minute or two to open and initialize the first windows.
I guess it s not posers fault but untill i downgraded to xp i guerss i ll stick with DAZ.

 I haven't tried DAZStudio yet, but to me the renders look lighter and brighter in DAZ even compared with the new poser pro and it's gamma correction.
Love esther

I use D|S just for rendering, unless it the file I am working with is for studio only. I just download the latest version and have not played much with it yet.

By the way, there is now a great toon shader plug-in available for D|S, pwtoon, for those who disliked the standard D|S Toon rendrs.

Also a rigging plug-in is now being tested and a couple of merchants have said they're already using it for their products.

Hi,
I like this thread.
I am now about 11 months old in Poser world.
I have started with DS 1.7 I think and i started to download freebies but soon bought Poser 7 and later Poser 6 (For $2.74 at CP as a special with a $5.00 discount voucher). The reason was that all the utilities asked for Poser.

I have also asked this question some time ago and got some answers but not this , better ones.

Currently I prefer Poser 7 because of the Library ability of "Collections". In this there are no limitations of organising contents what so ever. The only limitation is duplicating of the thumbnails and their relative files if you are not prepared to wipe the original ones (My choice of work method). I also prefer Poser 7 because of the many utilities that work with it. I hve bought some and also downloaded freeware ones.

Lately I became aware that DS is getting better and better and I am convinced that DS will overturn Poser in the near future. I like DAZ. They sell only quality stuff and I also bought Carrara 6 Pro and Bryce 6.1. I am also aware that DS is getting better and that you can now organise your files as well.

I have seen pictures that convince me that DS is currently in the upperhand position with regards to render quality. and is also lighter on resources.

If DAZ listen to peoples' suggestions and better DS that PhilC's Clothing converter, CrosDresse and the other one will work in DS and some other suggestions like third party programs / utilities as well as the abilities of POser, but light on system resources as I have heard Poser Pro can do and even better render quality, I will pay for DS. What about a freeware one and a payware one with more abilities. If I look at the quality of V4, A3, A4 and M3 and some animals, I can not beliece other that DS will kick the butt of Poser in future. DS can be designed to excell over Poser at a cheaper price.

I am worried that Poser may be getting more expensive and suffering from the same problem as Microsoft Flight Simulator in the way that it is getting better, but so way out extremely heavy on system resources that the majority of users buy the program, but dump it because even after an expensive new computer it is still not string enough to run it properly.

DS is also tiny in comparison to the huge Poser.

And Hello,
this is my opinion. I am allowed to my own idiotic, or insane opinion!

I think the antivirus companies will also include Poser and DS in their databases in future. In the past year I have very seldom played any game or did anything else than 3D rendering. I just can't get enough. Not even a virus can not cause so much havoc on one's computer. You constantly have to buy additional hard drives, better display cards, etc.

 I don' think your opinion is insane at all. I agree with most of what you posted.

And don't forget: Insanity is the father of creativity! ^_^

and just have a look here: forum.daz3d.com/viewtopic.php ! (dear mods, no offence ment, I will ask Dreamlight to post here as well! ^_-)

 It's merchants like Dreamlight who make Daz Studio a joy to use! :-)

Quote - .. there are tons of content  available for daz and it's characters that poser plain and simple hasn't produced. this i think will be a major  draw for daz in the long haul  
    

Huh? Most of DAZ's original content is targeted at Poser. Always has been.

Take a closer look at V4 for instance. "Readscript" ,contained within the figure INJ/REM files (which, incidentally, is built upon the Poser hierarchy), is a Poser exclusive construct. It is merely usable in D|S. If DAZ was designing figures soley targeted to it's own application, the construct would be much different since DAZ script (which files save as from D|S) is closely related to Javascript not Poser script. However, the figure files still follow the Poser hierarchy.

The only thing in the V4 package which is exclusive to D|S are the material presets and shaders which are separate files from the figure files that the charcter is built upon.

D|S has a much better rendering engine and loads more quickly, but it is lacking greatly in the content creation category. That should be "GREATLY" with all caps.. ;o) . So, naturally most content that you are buying for DAZ Studio was built in Poser and upon Poser standards, so I don't understand how there is "tons of content  available for daz " versus Poser. I am a content creator and have been since 2001 and that just makes little sense. Content has been around for Poser for ages and continues to multiply (99.9% of DAZ's content is targeted at Poser and has been since Zygote's inception and eventually DAZ's split from Zygote).

It doesn't matter to me which tool an artist uses to create their digital art, it has no bearing on the final production. I don't harbor any misgivings about D|S and have had many of my own complaints over Poser. However, they are just tools of the trade. But misinformation is never a good idea just because you like one tool over another; there is little basis for fact when it is simply a personal preference and opinion. I once knew a guy who could carve intricate totem poles with a chainsaw.. later on I discovered a guy who could do even better with an axe.

One can't exclude the fact that D|S is an entry level program still under development. It has only been on the scene a few years. I don't use it to design my content because it doesn't have the tools necessary and also has a convoluted scripting (which files save under). I do test my content in D|S however, to ensure compatibility. Where Poser and DAZ part company is DAZ is a tool for producing digital imagery whereas Poser is a design tool. I don't produce digital imagery (renders and such... except for product images) so I really don't have much use for D|S at the moment (except for testing). I don't even use Poser for that purpose. But I guarantee you that if you take a poll of content creators (even the DAZ team themselves), you'll find most of them inside Poser creating the much of the content that you are using in D|S. 

As I stated earlier, if you create content, you have to use Poser (for the moment!).

If you create art (generic term for any kind of image) you may use Poser or D|S,  just as you may use an airbrush or a pencil to create an image. That is up to your personal preferences. It's the image that makes the artist, not the tool.

For me personally, Poser does not fit into my way of working, it is not fast enough and in no way "intuitive" (completely personal and biased statement, you may feel it just the other way round, it is ok for me ^_^).

Keihan, I am not sure about D|S being entry level, does that exist in 3D? But evidently it is (luckily) still under development, as most software I know (Photoshop CS3 next step CS 4?, Vue6 next step Vue 7, Poser 7 now Poser Pro).

But anyway as an artist, it is the final image that counts, no need bashing at others because they do not use your tool, pencil, brush, canvas, paper, axe, chainsaw .....

Quote - Keihan, I am not sure about D|S being entry level, does that exist in 3D? But evidently it is (luckily) still under development, as most software I know (Photoshop CS3 next step CS 4?, Vue6 next step Vue 7, Poser 7 now Poser Pro).

But anyway as an artist, it is the final image that counts, no need bashing at others because they do not use your tool, pencil, brush, canvas, paper, axe, chainsaw .....

An  entry level program is a program that offers individuals a starting point into a various field. This particular field being 3D. Yes, some people do use D|S professionally. For example PSP is an entry level raster based program (tho it has some vector capabilities), it doesn't have nearly the power of Photoshop, but like you and D|S, I prefer it's intuitive interface better. I can work faster and it does what I need it to do. I don't need anything more than that as I am sure most DAZ users feel the same about D|S. PSP isn't as full-featured, nor does it have all the bells and whistles of  Photoshop or other top painting apps, but it can do the job if the artist is insightful enough. But none of this is what i am talking about. I am simply pointing out some facts over misinformation and I don't see how that is "bashing" anyone.

As for more info, Poser is not "my" tool. I am a content creator. Poser (and, incidentally, D|S) is my targeted application for the content that I create. I could just as easily target Maya, 3DS Max, Cinema 4D, Lightwave, Softimage, etc etc..

My real tools are Rhinocerous 3D, Hexagon (from DAZ incidentally), Okino Polytrans, UVmapper Pro, CR2builder, Paint Shop Pro, My Fuji 7.0MP Digital Camera (for photorealistic textures) and the list goes on and on. The only time spent inside Poser is putting it all together for the end user and doing promo images (if I do them myself).

I have been in this industry long enough to know a little history about the applications being discussed and I just find it difficult to remain quiet when it seems that there are a lot of biased opinions being strewn about rather than real facts about the subject matter. I saw Bryce, itself, change hands a few times. How many know Bryce's history? It was also owned by Metacreations along with Poser 4. Eventually Corel ended up aquiring Bryce, then DAZ thereafter. I have never even used Bryce, myself. Personally, I don't like the whole arguement of this vs this because it is subjective. I am not a render artist, but I have seen some awesome Renders come out of D|S and I have seen some equally awesome renders come out of Poser. I have seen awesome renders out of Bryce and Vue as well that also blow me away.

With all that said and , once again, I am not bashing any users nor am I bashing any applications, their developers, etc.. etc.. What I am challenging, however, is misinformation. Misinformation such as the statement included in my prior post from a member who I'll not name (as it is irrelevant) .."there are tons of content  available for daz and it's characters that poser plain and simple hasn't produced"... that statement is simply, NOT true.  I see many opinionated statements as such being slung around as if they are fact, not only in this forum but others as well. If the reverse were true, I'd certainly say so, but in this incident it is not.

I am sorry keihan, if I made it sound as if I am after you for "bashing"!

I wasn't aiming this at you, it was meant for all those people out there who judge an image by the tool used to create it. So I hope you eccept my excuses if I hurt you by accident.

The point I was trying to make is, the moment you find a tool that fits in your hand and that does what you want to do why should anybody bother?

Here and at other places there is always this kind of "I use X and you use Y, so you are not an artist!"-attitude (liberately exxagerated!) which tends to drive me crazy. When I see a picture that makes me go "Wow! Beautiful!" I don't care much about the tool(s) used.

Personally I would love to see the gallery with only a 2D, 3D, traditional art and photography section to avoid that kind of  feelings.

As a matter of fact, you did well to correct the false statement in an earlier post.

With all this said, as I do love to use D|S, I actively try to promote this app and if it's for the only reason that it is the free entry card for the voyage into the adventure of story telling!

Again keihan, my excuses if I did hurt you!