guess he's been weightmapped.

Quote - Pretty likely it's him.  The 'con is listed as a Dan Farr Production, with him as President on its site and there is no mention of DAZ...

Everyone that has Dan friended on fb got an event invite for salt lake comicon. It has to be him.

Native to poser and native to DS may still make it hard for vendors to support both, especially with clothing. I hope they found a way to overcome that.

I think we may have to just adjust this split in the marketplace.  It's probably for the best in the long run. 

I'm gobsmacked by the names popping up in the Dawn thread.  If anyone can make this work, they can.

Quote - > Quote - Pretty likely it's him.  The 'con is listed as a Dan Farr Production, with him as President on its site and there is no mention of DAZ...

Everyone that has Dan friended on fb got an event invite for salt lake comicon. It has to be him.

 

Native to poser and native to DS may still make it hard for vendors to support both, especially with clothing. I hope they found a way to overcome that.

If it's the same mesh (and I have no idea if it is really) might make it much easier. Of course, I would think you'd still need to know the particulars of each program in order to set up things like materials, morphs and what not ;).

To be honest, I don't have the first clue about DS (only DS3), so I intend to create for Poser...DS too if I can figure it out and I'm not above trying to do that ;). I haven't really taken to it in the past tho (and I've tried), so that's a "we'll see" sorta thing.

Laurie

Has anyone here ever had a thread removed from Daz? I started a thread like this one over in the Poser forum at Daz and it was gone within a few hours. I looked in my private messages and  saw this.

"Your thread “Interesting News for Poser users in Rendo Freebie thread” has been removed for review"

This has never happened to me before. All I said in my post was that Poser users might want to check out the thread.  I did not use profanity or anything, so I am pretty sure that what I said was not a red flag. Are we not supposed to post about the new figure over there? I have seen other posts that discuss figures like My Michelle and Antonia and Anastasia/Alyson2.

Has anything like this ever happened to anyone else?

It's very common, and has happened to several people who tried to post about Dawn there.

As I understand it...you are allowed to post links to other stores there, if it's in answer to a question. Just posting a link or starting a thread pointing people to a for-sale product or a site with things for sale is grounds for removal.

It's kind of like that here, too, isn't it?

Oh, I have indeed had threads removed. LOL I think they see my name and go "Darn, that woman is posting again, better pull it" LOLOL.

Might be they pulled it because it's sort of a competing figure. Not sure why they wouldn't want their users to know tho since it will work in DS and there's technically nothing for sale yet.

shrug

Laurie

Quote - It's very common, and has happened to several people who tried to post about Dawn there.

As I understand it...you are allowed to post links to other stores there, if it's in answer to a question. Just posting a link or starting a thread pointing people to a for-sale product or a site with things for sale is grounds for removal.

It's kind of like that here, too, isn't it?

Individual post with links, yes....but they will at least let you discuss all you want here. LOL

Laurie

Well, "removed for review" suggests they are considering letting it stay (perhaps moved to the freebie forum, if it wasn't posted there?).

My guess is they haven't yet decided how to deal with this (looks like several prominant DAZ PA's have thrown in with HiveWire3D, so you can't blame them for seeing it as a bit of a threat). 

Well, if they're gonna let hard feelings get in the way, well....then ya really got no business being in business. LOL It's the name of the game really.  People come, people go...might work for one cable company and then go and work for Comcast. It's the way of the world ;).

Laurie

Quote - > Quote - It's very common, and has happened to several people who tried to post about Dawn there.

As I understand it...you are allowed to post links to other stores there, if it's in answer to a question. Just posting a link or starting a thread pointing people to a for-sale product or a site with things for sale is grounds for removal.

It's kind of like that here, too, isn't it?

Individual post with links, yes....but they will at least let you discuss all you want here. LOL

Laurie

Actually I did not include a link. My post just said. Check out the tread titled "Dawn of a new day" I did not mention HiveWire3D or that there was another figure.  I just wanted to let others know about this exciting news. It can only help juice up the Poser/Daz world.

A certain company police there forums with a iron fist.

Certain users can get away it, others stand no chance.

They are probably a bit worried about what is going on.

All the best.

Great Uncle LROG

It's not necessarily hard feelings.  They may just not want to use their servers to advertise a competitor's products.

They've already been through this with the commercial forum.  Originally it was meant for merchants selling in places other than DAZ - to keep them out of the Commons.

But the DAZ merchants wanted to post there, too, and eventually they pushed out the non-DAZ merchants.  Because they didn't want to host ads for a competitor, pointing out that other stores like Rendo don't allow it, either.  Even if your products are for things that only work in DS, you can't advertise them there.

Of course, Dawn is free, and there's nothing for sale at HiveWire yet, so perhaps that's why they are reviewing it, instead of telling people to knock it off.

Quote -  

A certain company police there forums with a iron fist.

Certain users can get away it, others stand no chance.

They are probably a bit worried about what is going on.

All the best.

Great Uncle LROG

'Scared shitless' is probably closer to the mark than 'worried'. Which I find an excellent state of affairs. The corpronazi's running the D-thing made the eternal mistake of believing their own hype. Inertia is not forever, and the damage done to the D-thing's former rep is pretty much self-inflicted. As was mentioned elsewhere, this is sounding more and more like the Newtek/Luxology situation (also fomented by suits telling geeks how to do things...or not do things based on marketing assumptions).

The Gray Golem(tm) was at best a partial success, as all us poserites -didn't- toss our preferred software away and grasp at the shiny new bling. And from the timeline of certain names leaving the Draper-place, it sounds like there was a solid core of dissent there. I always wondered what DAZ could have done if they hadn't kept cutting it off to stay with P4 level tech. Looks like we'll get to see.....and maybe this time there will be a respecting for the creativity in the Poser-verse, not a trampling on.....  

Competition is what drives economy.

Glad to see a new company.

TBH, I think that DS users will always love DS. And since the new girl will work in DS, I don't see the problem. Can only benefit them. It's not like you need new software for her. So I think this will be a great thing for the whole community of users - DS and Poser alike and might help to heal the rift of the last couple years.

Good things...not bad ;). I don't think DS users will be flooding to Poser anymore than I think Poser users will be running to DS ;).

Laurie

Yep, she will work on both systems, so great news for both sides.

Just interesting to see those names appearing, and then their products dissapearing at a certain site.

That's the bit that will worry them, not little names bit BIG ones.

All the best.

Great Uncle LROG

Quote - Well, if they're gonna let hard feelings get in the way, well....then ya really got no business being in business. LOL It's the name of the game really.  People come, people go...might work for one cable company and then go and work for Comcast. It's the way of the world ;).

This is quite a bit different; this is more like Bill Gates saying he's coming out of retirement to sell a new operating system and office suite...

I hope it is just that and not some legal dispute over intellectual property or some such.

Quote - > Quote - Well, if they're gonna let hard feelings get in the way, well....then ya really got no business being in business. LOL It's the name of the game really.  People come, people go...might work for one cable company and then go and work for Comcast. It's the way of the world ;).

 

This is quite a bit different; this is more like Bill Gates saying he's coming out of retirement to sell a new operating system and office suite...

I don't see how tho, since it will work natively in their software. LOL. It's basically like Rawnrr selling a new creature and selling it at Rendo instead of at Daz ;). Just another store selling content. I can see how they would be worried about losing their better vendors tho, but not the figure itself.

Laurie

I can imagine daz will not be happy about it and if they can find a way to stop it or slow it they will.

Gee, all the cloak and dagger stuff between these sites really makes my pants baggy. LOL

Laurie

I agree with you though, i don't see how they can stop it.  still they will be considering their options right now.

Quote - I don't see how tho, since it will work natively in their software. LOL. It's basically like Rawnrr selling a new creature and selling it at Rendo instead of at Daz ;). Just another store selling content. I can see how they would be worried about losing their better vendors tho, but not the figure itself. Laurie

Bur Rawnrr isnt a founder of DAZ...

Quote - > Quote - I don't see how tho, since it will work natively in their software. LOL. It's basically like Rawnrr selling a new creature and selling it at Rendo instead of at Daz ;). Just another store selling content. I can see how they would be worried about losing their better vendors tho, but not the figure itself. Laurie

Bur Rawnrr isnt a founder of DAZ...

That's true enough ;).

Laurie

Quote - > Quote - > Quote - It's very common, and has happened to several people who tried to post about Dawn there.

As I understand it...you are allowed to post links to other stores there, if it's in answer to a question. Just posting a link or starting a thread pointing people to a for-sale product or a site with things for sale is grounds for removal.

It's kind of like that here, too, isn't it?

Individual post with links, yes....but they will at least let you discuss all you want here. LOL

Laurie

Actually I did not include a link. My post just said. Check out the tread titled "Dawn of a new day" I did not mention HiveWire3D or that there was another figure.  I just wanted to let others know about this exciting news. It can only help juice up the Poser/Daz world.

I just got a note that the mods removed the phrase "It's good to see Chris Creek back in The Game" from a post of mine where I responded to another post (also edited)  because it violated rules against off-site advertising, so tread carefully...

Tread carefully? It's why I won't even bother. LOL

Laurie

Purest speculation, but maybe it's not beyond reasonable to see HiveWire3d and SM working together.  Nobody is going to say that SM excels in character creation, although their latest are really good, and nobody is going to say that DAZ are programmers of software.  To have the creators of the V and M things working with SM, at least enough to be able to round out problems, could be something good all the way around.

But DAZ editing phrases now?  Hmm.  Lessons of history seem to escape them.

Doric.

Attached Link: More of the HiveWire 3D story

But anyway there is question time at rdna if you want to ask them anything. I posted and got a response within 10 minutes there.

They've also posted a bunch in the Freestuff thread here today, and promise to answer any questions as quickly as they can.

When you decide that you are going to tell your customers what is best for them, how clever you are and how you are going to launch a game changer and deliver a grey blob you surely can't be surprised when some make it clear it is not what they want. 

When a group of talented individuals with a long history in the business set up a company and attempt to give Poser users what they want and not side line users of other software there is a very big chance that the game is changing.  You can try and delete all reference to the new development but history tends to suggest it just makes people more curious.

Just my view but I think Daz may well have produced a real game changer just not in the way they first thought. 

When Genesis came out there were those that foretold of the impending doom of Poser with Poser 10/2014 now out and a possible prime candidate for the fitting room the same people seem quiet.  I guess they are too busy playing with V6.

By working together, I don't mean going into kahoots, but more of checking with each other to see what they have up their sleeves before going off on a tangent one or the other can't follow.  As in, and purest speculation here, if one comes up with a soft body dynamics, making sure there's not a figure without a program that can handle it, or a program feature and no figure to use it.  Software designers are somewhat dependent on figure designers, and vice versa.

Doric.

so many possibilities for the future.  our future has certainly got a lot brighter hasn't it.  I'm happy happy happy.

Quote - Purest speculation, but maybe it's not beyond reasonable to see HiveWire3d and SM working together.  Nobody is going to say that SM excels in character creation, although their latest are really good, and nobody is going to say that DAZ are programmers of software.  To have the creators of the V and M things working with SM, at least enough to be able to round out problems, could be something good all the way around.

But DAZ editing phrases now?  Hmm.  Lessons of history seem to escape them.

Doric.

You mean that Steve Kondris and his DAZ fellows were sent out on a covert mission to collaborate with SM on their next figure project? Not unreasonable, given the history of the Hivewire guys, actually i think that is a good idea and might actually work. If SM do not want to adapt Genesis from outside, may be they can be convinced from the inside. Perhaps a bit conspiration-theoretical, but let's hope it works out.

I mean more like going to the other companies, including daz as well as SM, and asking "Whatcha got up your sleeve that we'll have to look at" before they release something new.  That way nobody gets left behind wondering "Wha' happen?"  It would also weed out those things that "would be nice, but" before anyone gets hung up in a loop dividing by zero. 

THey said they were going to release separate figures for Poser and daz, which makes sense as the two are no longer really compatible.  There will no doubt be some vendors that will support one and not the other, big deal.  We already have that to an extent. 

But the list of names that HiveWire 3d is getting on board, impressive to say the least.

Doric.

Quote - I just got a note that the mods removed the phrase "It's good to see Chris Creek back in The Game" from a post of mine where I responded to another post (also edited)  because it violated rules against off-site advertising, so tread carefully...

The censorship on their forums pretty much reduced my interest in doing business with them... and it was very lopsided in how they approached their "rules".    When I raised the issue in a private conversation when their higher ups, it was made clear they view their forums as vehical for advertising, not a community site.  Even discussing some things they have said (e.g. quoting previous posts of months before) became forbidden in some cases.

I don't think they get that the more they censor, the less valuable their forums become and lower traffic from those who might dain to spend money with them.

-K

Quote - > Quote - I just got a note that the mods removed the phrase "It's good to see Chris Creek back in The Game" from a post of mine where I responded to another post (also edited)  because it violated rules against off-site advertising, so tread carefully...

The censorship on their forums pretty much reduced my interest in doing business with them... and it was very lopsided in how they approached their "rules".    When I raised the issue in a private conversation when their higher ups, it was made clear they view their forums as vehical for advertising, not a community site.  Even discussing some things they have said (e.g. quoting previous posts of months before) became forbidden in some cases.

I don't think they get that the more they censor, the less valuable their forums become and lower traffic from those who might dain to spend money with them.

-K

This is why I put the over/under on DAZ surviving as a company at 24 months.

I personally don't see a reason to remove posts, even if they are critical, as long as they are reasonably civil.  The appearance of Dawn or existance of HiveWire 3D has to do with the "3d / digital world", so what's the issue?  What, you can't post about Max because they offer Hex?  To me, it's the same kind of thing but it's their forum so they can do as they please.

You need to have a sense of community in this rather small community we have.  All this isolationist nonsense gets on my nerves.  There needs to be a some wiggle room between commercialization and talking about what your neighbor is up to.  Obviously its wording and context.

The only way that Dawn is a threat is if they want absolute control as figure provider and software provider.  That seems a bit insane to me if it is true.  Any figure that gets developed and can be used in their software promotes its use.

I hope it's not something like... well you are running Windows so you have to use IE.  In which my reply would be: No, I'm going to run whatever I choose to.  It's your job to give me a compelling reason to change my choice.  Or not. shrugfest

AetherDream wrote;

Quote -  Are we not supposed to post about the new figure over there? I have seen other posts that discuss figures like My Michelle and Antonia and Anastasia/Alyson2.

My Michelle, Antonia, Anastasia/Alyson2, Rex, Roxy et al were never going to be competition for DAZ figures. Dawn most likely will.

Coldrake

I slowed down using the daz forums quite a while ago, now I don't even look at them.  Too much "you can praise the gray golum all you want, but don't say anything good about the poser figures, that we won't tolerate."  Think maybe I pushed them a little too hard, don't know for sure, killfiled every addy they send things from, and there are a lot of them.  Don't want to go back to my old system of killfile, "If you ain't in my address book, bit bucket, charlie.  Don't bug me with spam."

Doric.

Censorship, be it on a forum or just anywhere, is just proof that he or she that censors is a complete and utter loser.

If you are a winner you can smite down dissent with reasoned argument.

On a more serious note, all of our governments - I mean all of them - are clearly losers.

Quote - Purest speculation, but maybe it's not beyond reasonable to see HiveWire3d and SM working together.  Nobody is going to say that SM excels in character creation, although their latest are really good, and nobody is going to say that DAZ are programmers of software.  To have the creators of the V and M things working with SM, at least enough to be able to round out problems, could be something good all the way around.

I believe very much that they worked with SM. I see in one of their posts thanking couple of the Smith Micro poser rigging gurus (Nerd3D among a few) for help. (I think I saw this on facebook - I read so many post by HiveWire in several places I forget now what I read where.)
Nerd3D is one of the guys whose name you see on Poser credits splash screen and he writes tons of tutorials for Poser, if you don't already know who he is.
Working with him on a figure, you know the figure will be big deal!

I just hope that the Daz stores that are disappearing are from a glitch or by choice and not for...other reasons :/ I would really hate to see that....

Laurie

Connie, I think that was probably in the freestuff forum here.  I saw that, which was what got me to thinking maybe they'll be talking to each other and exchanging ideas.  One way for what they can accomplish in a model, the other way what they can do to implement any developments.

Laurie, there are already some well known names that have aligned with HiveWire 3d, this could explain where at least some of them went.  It's not unreasonable to think the two gentlemen have some personal loyalty from the vendors, but let's see what happens.  If it goes big, it's going to be good all the way around.

And maybe they'll make a newborn, that's something that's missing and AFAIK, always has been.  Closest is the old P4 infant.  Not close enough.

Doric.

Genesis a Golem? Don't mind if I do.

Bash it and Daz all you want, but I haven't seen anyone push any of the other figures into the kind of interesting and diverse shapes I've seen out of Genesis.   I know the creature possibilities are meaningless to some, but they're what give me a tremendous amount of joy working with the figure, whether the stuff I'm making is just for fun, as some kind of freebie, or as something commercial.

Enjoy all you can, Joe.  And you're quite right, what you put up for a sample leaves me with one reaction, Why? 

I'm not into fantasy, I want accurate representations of humans, not some wild imaginary creature.  IF Steve and Chris can deliver what they promise, I won't regret removing all daz content and figures from my computers, which is also past tense.  I have no doubt of their ability, but I hope they pay a little more attention to the way humans are proportioned than they did with the V and M characters.  With what it sounds like they're assembling for a team pays off, it can only be good for the 3d graphic world.  And two versions so you can still plunk along with DS in whichever ever changing variant they release.    Few outside the daz devotees will care.  They'll have the same figure,one designed for ds and the Poser users will have their version.  Nothing there to knock.  I have no doubt there will be some clothing I'll be tempted enough to pass out money for them, and I have little doubt that will soon swing to the other side, things I wouldn't let my family wear behind closed doors. 

I've also had a vendor of the g thing's products tell me I don't need other figures, that I should sit for hours twiddling dials to get a figure I could load with a double click of the mouse.  Logic, please?  I don't know what's going to happen, that's in the future and for some logical reason, we're not allowed to see it yet.  All I know is I'm waiting on what's been the best news for the Poser community in years. 

And if enough Studio users don't want the new figure for studio, tell them, they may not do it.  (Tongue firmly in cheek here.)

Doric.

Quote - > Quote - "you can praise the gray golum all you want"

Genesis a Golem? Don't mind if I do.

Bash it and Daz all you want, but I haven't seen anyone push any of the other figures into the kind of interesting and diverse shapes I've seen out of Genesis.   I know the creature possibilities are meaningless to some, but they're what give me a tremendous amount of joy working with the figure, whether the stuff I'm making is just for fun, as some kind of freebie, or as something commercial.

Thats great, but here's something akin to what you'll get from the Poser user: "I don't use DS and this is not enough of a draw to make me want to learn a new software, new material setups and inferior slower renderer (ultimately people want to see snazzy renders or slick animations). I can always buy a critter for Poser for about $5-$15 when I really need one. Also, I'm not happy that you wonlt make a figure for my favorite program, but want me to jump through a bunch of hoops and pay more money to come to you... after you've been catering to me for years."  It's a little like a bakery or a decadent ice cream shop suddenly switching to health food, and then making customers walk extra three blocks to come and get it. Sure, health food may be good for them, but it's not what they want, so you lose them as a customer.

Here is a list of vendors and people involved in the Dawn project for those who have not had a chance to go through the now 24 pages of posts at the free stuff forum.

I know many times people are afraid to invest in a new character for fear it will not be supported, but the list of supporters and developers is quite impressive. If you have not read about the project over in the free stuff thread (it is now a sticky at the top of the thread), the first few posts from the new company HiveWire3D will introduce you to the new character with versions for both Daz and Poser.

I think when you see this list of people involved, it will be clear that this is  not just another 3rd party character that will fade into the twilight, it is definitely "the Dawn of a new day," as they put it.

Chris Creek( 3D Artist/Modeler)—Founder of HiveWire3D: Formerly co-founder of both Zygote and Daz3D—executive vice-president of for almost a decade—created/worked with artistic teams on several popular figures for Poser/Daz including Posette/Dork and Victoria and Michael in all of their incarnations.

Eric Merrit(Graphic Artist)—Co-Founder of HiveWire3D: Formerly co-founder of Zygote—Worked for several years as a core team member at DAZ 3D—helped design/manage user interface for DAZ Studio. Co-founder of  AniMate and AniBlock system, designed and sold by GoFigure.

Steve Kondris(Tech Support) worked for Daz for 11+ years in various roles.

Ken Gilliand/KenG-(3D Artist/Modeler)—has created many models for several years that were formerly featured on Daz—Best known for his lifelike creations of birds and his love for Audubon style art.

Paul Lessard/etujedi(3D Artist/Rigger/content creator)—formerly of Daz where he worked on generation 4 and 5 human figures, as well as various other models--now working on Dawn.

Sarsa(Texture Artist)—has created hundreds of items that are at Daz—also has a store on Renderosity—has created many character textures and has frequently  worked with Thorne, currently working on the Dawn project.

Lisa Buckalew/LisaB(3D  Artist/Modeler)—former PC Co-Manager at DAZ--Best known for Lisa Botanicals—until recently had a large store of items at Daz, currently working with HiveWire3D.

Mab(Texture Artist)—has a large store of products on Daz—many fantasy and fairy themed items in collaboration with other artists

Bobbie25(3D Artist/Modeler)—has large store of clothing models at Daz—a mixture of fantasy and casual clothing

Virtual World(Texture Artist)—has a store on Renderosity with several items especially character and hair texures

Silver(3D Artist/Character Creator)—has a store on Renderosity—some models and several character sets and hair texures

LaurieA (3D Artist/Modeler) has created a large variety collection of freebie models—and has a store on Renderosity

BadKittehCo(3D Artist/Modeler)—store on Renderosity and RDNA—a variety of  textures and models

Afrodite-Ohki(3D Artist/Modeler) has a store on Renderosity and RDNA  a variety of textures and models

Latexluv(Texture Artist)—has indicated in this thread that she and LaurieA will work on a merchant resource for Dawn

Lululee(3D Artist/Modeler)—store on Renderosity and Content Paradise—a variety of  textures and models, mostly apparel.

Ryverthorn(3D Artist/Modeler) has large stores on Renderosity and Daz--a variety of textures and models

Glitterati 3D(3D Artist/Modeler)—store on Renderosity and a larger store on RDNA—a variety of  textures and models

Bea(3D Artist/Texture Artist)—store on Renderosity and RDNA—a variety of  textures and models—frequently works with Aliwonder

Paganeagle2001(3D Artist/Modeler)—freebie store on Renderosity—has said he will make freebies for Dawn

Netherworks(3D Artist/programmer/utility creator)—has store on Renderosity, RDNA and Daz  also has Website called Netherworks Studios

Nanette Tredoux(3D Artist/Modeler)—freebie store on Renderosity—has said she will make freebies for Dawn

Rhiannon(3D Artist/Modeler) has large store on Renderosity --a variety of textures and models

LadyRaine(3D Artist/Texture Artist)-- has large store on RDNA--a variety of textures

Skylab(Pose Artist)—has a page on Share CG—has said he will make freebie poses for Dawn

MeatSim(3D Artist/Modeler)—currently working on some models for the marketplace possible freebis/for sale items

Mada(3D Artist/Modeler) has large store on Daz and  a store on Fairy Dreams website --a variety of textures and models

Rhiannon(3D Artist/Modeler) has large stores on Renderosity --a variety of textures and models

Cariad(3D Artist/Modeler) has store on Renderosity

Tavia3D(3D Artist/Modeler) has a store on Renderosity and RDNA  a variety of textures and models

Lyrra((3D Artist/Modeler) has a store on Renderosity --a variety of textures, models, magnets—has said he will make magnets and dev-kit for Dawn

I  will also support her on my store at CP,  QuantumRiverGraphics (Texture Artist)and in freebies at Renderosity

I need to announce a correction to the above list as I made a mistake for which I apologize.

Glitterati--has a store on Renderosity with one item and offers freebies. She does not have a store on RDNA.

have you guys seen Dawn's latest pic?

Quote - > Quote - Reposting this from Chris Creek's post so it doesn't get too buried. Original is about three pages back.

I read that it is a Poser render and this is her default shape and skin texture is of the resource skin texture (I think included in the base pack)

Isn't she just ADORABLE?

 

Agree. And I love her long lashes. Very, very pretty :)