@Tomyee: I would say in my own word I'm not a technical guy, and to add what Biscuit said

there is no systematical relation as : still render/static simulation and animation render/animation simulation or conforming/static simulation,... It wouldn't be fun!

• sometimes you need animation even for still render. Classic example: a seated Victoria, you need the animation to put correctly a floating dress between the chair and V4.

• I do only still render but I use both static and animation simulation depending of what clothe, the result of the conforming, the pose, the final scene,... and sometimes I use even both for the same clothe.

• For sure most of Poser dynamic clothe props (dress,...) must go through an animation but there can be exceptions : you want a render with the default T-Pose :-) or you have basic dynamic props (poncho for example) where a static simulation COULD work with the pose you have

• VWD works with conforming clothe (cr2), dynamic clothe made for Poser (pp2), imported object in Poser (obj), hair (hr2) so whatever the "poser scene origin".

tomyee posted at 10:33AM Fri, 18 March 2016 - #4261592

@Biscuits: another GREAT tutorial! So nice to hear a voice to narrate the lesson as well... combined with the text it makes it much faster to understand what is being taught.

If I understand correctly, if I am using a prop clothing item, then I have to do a dynamic simulation? Only conforming clothing works for static sim? I was going to model most of my figures' clothing for use in the cloth room, so I am concerned that means I'd have to buy the full VWD with animation support if I want to simulate with my custom-made props... I only have the funds to buy the limited version for just doing static renders.

With a (dynamic) cloth prop you need to go from T-pose to the real pose to get the cloth to follow. That is why you need a dynamic simulation. If I remember correctly the limited version does have dynamic simulation for a limited set of frames. This will be enough to get the dynamic clothing to follow the pose of the figure

wimvdb posted at 11:51AM Fri, 18 March 2016 - #4261610

tomyee posted at 10:33AM Fri, 18 March 2016 - #4261592

@Biscuits: another GREAT tutorial! So nice to hear a voice to narrate the lesson as well... combined with the text it makes it much faster to understand what is being taught.

If I understand correctly, if I am using a prop clothing item, then I have to do a dynamic simulation? Only conforming clothing works for static sim? I was going to model most of my figures' clothing for use in the cloth room, so I am concerned that means I'd have to buy the full VWD with animation support if I want to simulate with my custom-made props... I only have the funds to buy the limited version for just doing static renders.

With a (dynamic) cloth prop you need to go from T-pose to the real pose to get the cloth to follow. That is why you need a dynamic simulation. If I remember correctly the limited version does have dynamic simulation for a limited set of frames. This will be enough to get the dynamic clothing to follow the pose of the figure

I have to add - i am not sure if there still is a limited edition. It could be that that idea was dropped. The version I have works fine with dynamic simulation

I didn't know there was a limited version and full version of VWD: what are the difference between the two? Or are you talking about the demo and the full version?

For me basically:

• Animation simulation in VWD use the number of frame from Poser
• Static simulation in VWD have an unlimited number of frame

Relation between the number of frames and simulation also depend of the range of the movement. We need sometimes plenty of frames to let the clothe follow "quietly" and sometimes one frame is enough

Smaker1 posted at 12:47PM Fri, 18 March 2016 - #4261617

I didn't know there was a limited version and full version of VWD: what are the difference between the two? Or are you talking about the demo and the full version?

For me basically:

• Animation simulation in VWD use the number of frame from Poser
• Static simulation in VWD have an unlimited number of frame

Relation between the number of frames and simulation also depend of the range of the movement. We need sometimes plenty of frames to let the clothe follow "quietly" and sometimes one frame is enough

At some point there was talk about a limited - or lite - version with a cheaper price (see page 15 in this thread). But it seems that the current version which is sold through paypal is the full version. So no limited version. Tomyee mentioned the limited version, so I assumed it was still there.

@Smaker1: the limited version is the same as the full version (about half the price) and could not do animation, otherwise was supposed to be the same.

I hope the limited version isn't cancelled, I never heard VWD mention that this would no longer be offered but I could be wrong. I think the limited version (for people like me who only want to do comic book static renders and not animations) was supposed to be offered once Renderosity put it up for sale in the store. It was never offered for direct sale by VWD from what I can tell.

Thank you everyone for the helpful clarification!

OK thanks, I missed this one!! On my experience, even if you are doing still render like me, animation can be the answer in some cases but perhaps it's not mandatory for you.

@Smaker1: I would like to buy the full version, but my father died unexpectedly at Christmas and unfortunately the funeral bill was almost $10,000. It is not definitely not because I would not mind also having animation support (the demo videos showing the animation look really amazing), I must pay off the huge bill first... these are very tough times right now. Even the lite version will be a stretch unless I know I can use it right away to make income.

I'm sorry for your lost and I understand perfectly. I was only talking about my experience with dynamic simulation.

tomyee posted at 12:06PM Fri, 18 March 2016 - #4261655

It is not definitely not because I would not mind

..ugh, I wish I had read this more closely before I posted. That was really bad grammar. Sorry, I'm having a very very bad day today. I still hope to buy VWD eventually when I have the money, but until then I am so grateful for Biscuits in making these great tutorials. At least I can learn how to use the program for now and get a quicker start when I eventually do own it.

@Biscuits : Thank you. You make tutorials that are very nice to look at and are very educational. I will not make videos as perfect as yours. They will be dedicated to a particular simulation. They will be subtitled because of my horrible accent.

@tomyee : I'll send you a sitemail.

This weekend, I'll send a new version to all people owning VWD. I also will send a new demo version. This version will allow to test the dynamic deformation.

Trying out some hairsettings.

@Biscuits: I downloaded your new tutorial on dynamic dress simulation... I have questions:

1. how does the spline break act as a safeguard? I don't know much about animation in Poser so this step was confusing to me
2. there are 3 videos inside, but at the end of part3, it says the next step is a simulation in Poser... however there is no fourth video that shows the simulation. Is that coming in a separate tutorial, or was it accidentally left out of this one?

Thank you as always!

The 4th and 5th video is ready and waits for rendo's approval

Spline breaks. When you set a bend or morph, poser will try to make it a nice smooth motion - in graphics terms a nice curved line. But in our simulation we start at a zero pose, then add morphs and then the pose. We do not want a smooth curve for those. They have to be fixed (you do not want the voluptuous morph to change beyond its setting and you do not want to take the movement from zero pose to fixed pose to influence the pose.) So what you do is set essentially a breakpoint at those frames for the figure. This is the spline break. You cut off the curve at those frames to fix them at that position. If you do not do this, there is a change that a morph or bend will "overshoot" its goal in order to make a nice curve. The spline break prevents that If the figure is selected in the left column and you click on the little square on the right frame it will put the spline break in for the entire figure

I hope this helps

Ah thank you winvdb... I didn't even know about the spline break button until today, makes sense to have it.

I just put the new demo version in the FreeStuff.

Waiting for Approval.

Rendo has a limit of 1 freebie every 24 hours. Part two is available now.

Thank you Wim :)

Hello

@Biscuit: great render. I'm fond of "inside" picture with "outside" over exposed part. What's the hair? I currently have trouble with my internet connection and hope to download your tutorial as soon as possible. I also don't know about spline break (basic animator I am !). It may be my answer on some troubles I had. Thanks for your job

@tomyee: don't worry, no offense taken !

Here is my last render (orientalist mood) but not entirely satisfied . I increased the complexity to challenge VWD: Victoria 7, a two layered skirt (Calla gown), a more complex pose (at least for me!) and long sleeves. It took some times to find the right roadmap . As usual, VWD did a perfect job and some details are hidden in the shadows

@VWD: a display of the direction of the wind (vector) could be interesting :-)

I agree with Smaker1, being able to see the direction of the wind as a 3d vector in the scene would be most helpful. Maybe even edit the wind as an object in the 3d scene e.g. rotate the vector, adjust the wind strength by scaling the vector object using a gizmo, or set the wind as global or just a narrow beam of wind (like a spotlight).

@Biscuits : I have not had time to upload your tutorials. I'll do it tomorrow. Thanks to you and WinVDB for all the work you've done. I also thank you for your rendering, it is beautiful and I look forward to see animations done with your hair.

@Smaker1 : As usual, you did a wonderful rendering. I am happy and proud that VWD have participated in its creation. This is a very good idea to put a wind vector in the scene. I'll look at how to do this.

@tomyee : It is possible to create a beam of wind, but for more flexibility, would it be interesting to define the vertices that react to the wind and those that do not react to it?

@VWD: yes! That would be great too if the user can select which vertices react to the wind e.g. cape, but maybe not the skirt. Or maybe have separate winds for different groups of vertices? Sometimes the wind will produce a nice result for one item of clothing but not so good for a second item. It would be more flexible to let user define separate wind effects in those cases to help get the best look for each cloth items.

@vwd, would love to have better control of wind. I don't want it separate for different material zones or dynamic parts like tomyee is asking, but a visual of the wind generator. I love having the option but find it difficult to control. I usually end up with nothing or a hurricane.

I'm having fewer issues with large meshes, and that to me is a wonder, to watch some layered dress or huge mess of hair become dynamic. I think we will see some amazing things in the future, using this wonderful tool.

@VWD: Thanks!

"That would be great too if the user can select which vertices react to the wind e.g. cape, but maybe not the skirt. Or maybe have separate winds for different groups of vertices? " I agree with both Tomyee and Fivecat :-) For me: by default, the wind apply to all the clothe and we can select vertices we don't want the wind to interfere. I would perhaps be lost with separate wind groups, but why not. I had this need in my last picture: I wanted the wind to apply only on the underskirt. My solution was to fix the vertices of the over skirt but there were no more simulation for them. So yes: both are interesting. We also need to reinitialize (like fixed vertices and release fixed vertices)

Writing this, it could be interesting to have the possibility to reinitialize all the parameter of all vertices (fixed, nail,....) to define new one. Sometimes I get lost with what I have done, I don't want to loose my current state of simulation but want to change parameters. The only option today is to send the result to Poser and start a new simulation with the saved object. Of course I talk about the static simulation.

And a question: what is the right parameter to have a maximum of folds?

Smaker1 posted at 1:38PM Tue, 22 March 2016 - #4261900

And a question: what is the right parameter to have a maximum of folds?

It's an interaction between stretch, friction, mesh density and rigidify.

A lot of stretch, pulls folds out.

A high gravity, pulls folds out.

Few friction, makes it slippery, thus less folds.

Clothes that already have build in folds, can be kept with rigidify,

Clothes without folds on default, keep no folds with rigidify.

Rigidify basically is stiffness.

Also it depends on the density of the mesh, if the mesh is very low poly, it won't fold a lot.

Can the properties of the cloth be changed dynamically? That is, from the second tutorial I can see that you can tug on the cloth to adjust it while the simulation is running, is it possible to alter the rigidity, stretchiness, etc. values so that you can see in real-time how this affects the cloth's behavior?

Yes some parameters can be changed during sim as long as you can open up the vertices tools/groups you can change elastic% & rigidify.

The dynamic, collision and hair parameters are locked during sim.

Gravity can be changed during sim and wind as well.

Thanks Biscuit, like there are plenty of dependant parameter do you have a typical workflow to set them ? Like first: rigidity to keep the clothe folds, then gravity, then ...

@Biscuits: Yes, agree with SMaker1, it'd be nice to see your thoughts (or a tutorial) about setting up the cloth properties. I find it more confusing compared to the cloth room, not sure what to do first and if there are any "rules of thumb" for getting the kind of cloth behavior I'd want e.g. rubbery, cotton, etc. (I know that it varies because of the mesh, but hopefully there are some tips for at least what to try first before spending a lot of time doing trial-and-error).

The order after collision setup is basically like this:

1. Change the settings as a whole for the clothing/hair, so the Dynamic parameters.
2. The Hair Parameters let you glue and the nail to collision setting is for the clothing glue.
3. Vertices group are for partial settings, very selective control. (stiffen roots, bun or button for example)
4. Simulation parameters, settings for gravity and wind.

Support for animated Poser wind forces would be great.

@tomyee : I just want to give you an answer on the forum because it is important to give some clarification. VWD is more complicated than the Cloth room because it makes more things. If I wanted to rewrite the Cloth room, VWD would only contain a stiffening by extension and dynamic simulation (more fluid and faster, I think). So about 10% of the program. If you want to use correctly VWD, it is necessary to understand the remaining 90%. And I agree with you about the lack of video tutorials. Thank enormously to Biscuits for her wonderful tutorials. From next week, I'll make tutorials that will come in complement from those made by Biscuits.

I know that VWD misses a lot of flexibility once the simulation has started. - The modification of the rigidity, - the wind is not user friendly, - The fixing parameters, - Etc ... There is much work still to do. I can assure you that when you start a program like this, you're not sure where you're going. It is thanks to you that I begin to see more clearly where I have to go and I understand my early mistakes. But it was necessary to start somewhere. I think VWD will soon be on sale at Renderosity. I think this time is the good one because Jenn accepts clearly its distribution. I think to freeze for a while the current version, first for explaining how it works using simulation exemples.

@VirtualWorldDynamics: thanks VWD for the info, and I hope I do not sound as if I was complaining. I would like very much to fully understand all of the potential of this tool, since as I mention to you before, I think this program is more important than the recent Poser11 update and features. This functionality (along with better hair creation and fluid dynamics) is what I was hoping to see in P11.

Now that I finally got to try VWD and seeing how easy and faster it is to do simulations, I now wonder if the Poser team will even bother to update the Cloth room in the future, since your tool is probably going to be more advanced than what they make and the better choice to use.

Apart from the specialized options, the main attraction for me in VWD is the possibility of manual intervention in the simulation. Get the clothing settled by a light thug here and there. The options are a bit primitive still but sure that will be solved in due course.

New

Thanks biscuits for the new tutorial - new secrets revealed.

This tutorial shows how to get realistic flowing hair with VWD's Cloth and Hair dynamics

Another excellent tutorial, I didn't really understand the difference between the two types of stiffening before... so "by extension" is meant for unimeshes, and "by neighbourhood" is for any figure or prop that has unconnected polygon meshes (I guess not only hair but a feather duster, peacock feathers, possibly a multi-layered outfit).

Yes, but all meshes need to be connected, one doesn't load buttons separately normally.

But a button isn't usually welded to the fabric but it is part of the clothing.

The extension by neigbourhood uses more memory I think.

Is it possible to take the prop generated by the tool and use it as a morph target for the original hair? I used the wind to give my hair a small windblown look and I wanted to keep this for the regular hair prop. So I exported the hair_vwd as an OBJ, then tried to import it back as a morph, but when I turn the dial, the hair is a mess. Are the vertices no longer in the same order as the original hair or am I doing something wrong?

In your final frame with hair_VWD selected, go to menu > Object > Spawn morph target.

Save that as a prop.

The spawned dial holds the morph then.

@VirtualWorldDynamics; please check your email - I'm currently stuck on the translation of the user guide and have sent you three emails with questions that need answering before I can continue. Sorry if you're busy elsewhere; I'm just wanting to be sure you know I have some questions............ Thanks.

@Erwin0265 : excuse me Erwin, I send you an email.

VWD will certainly be in sale at Renderosity in the next centuries. I think.

Good luck, Gerald. Our thoughts and best wishes go with you..................

The beta team has been testing this software for 8 months now.

It's ready to roll Rendo!

We want VWD! Holds sign in front of Renderosity store.

WOOOOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOO it's live!

@ vwd Congrats! VWD Cloth&Hair

Congrats!! On getting VWD to Market!!! Excellent software!

Finally! Hair done with Cloth&Hair simulation.

Looks like I'm visiting the marketplace tonight

I am trying the demo and I can't get the Poser scripts window to stick. When I add the VWD script to the Scripts Palette/Window (the one visible via Window->Python Scripts). when I restart Poser, the buttons in that window revert to the defaults. It's annoying as hell. How can I make my changes stick?

Hello,

@VWD: congratulation! at last VWD hit the store. I hope it will be a success, it really deserve it!!.

@Biscuit : thanks for your input and your tutorials, I must find time to assimilate all these infos

@the hawkman: I use script servant from Netherwork: it's very easy to keep my preferred scripts near me.