I have a question....I've seen all the stuff here from PWFW, but if you join, are the past offerings archived?...or do I miss them and just get the future ones? Beav

Poserworld is the best deal out there and yes everything is included. Join , you wont be disappointed. Rena and Steve are some of the best people you will meet in the community, hope this helps -Kevin

You get all the past stuff too. The first couple of weeks you can just have a great time downloading your mind out. That's what I did, at least.

It's GOOD deal, GOOD models too, and GOOD People.

You get all the subscription site files... and all the PoserWorld CD files... just be ready to spend a lot of time downloading and archiving. Doug

Well...that answered that...:) I'm there I guess...:) Beav

Best place in the world. Quick replies to questions, great models, and yes, you get everything and then some! (even what's on the cd's!) I'm not just a happy Poser addict, I'm also a member LOL extends hand Hi, my name is Kymm and I'm a Poser addict

Yeah, it's a great place. Just re-upped my subscription. Probably the first pay site for anything I have been totally satisfied with. The return on investment is definitly great. Plus they are nice, what more could you want? JDexter

Well it isn't perfect, but there is lots of good stuff for an inexpensive price. Sometimes you get an attitude with your service.. It's kind of like going to a "mom and pop" diner where the crusty waitress likes to taunt you as she delivers your food.

Niteraven wrote: "Rena and Steve are some of the best people you will meet in the community." Yes, thats true. You don't have to wait long for an answer if you have troubble with an object or texture of theirs. I have never seen any attitude problems if you treat them the way you would like them to treat you, but if you have a bad attitude yourself you have to expect the answer you deserve.

A few freebies don't get added because they use free items from other creators who don't want their stuff put up on a pay-for-access site, usually character packages.

"I have never seen any attitude problems if you treat them the way you would like them to treat you, but if you have a bad attitude yourself you have to expect the answer you deserve." Actually that is quite untrue. I do believe the key here is that PWFW views us as friends who've come over for dinner rather than customers.

**Sometimes you get an attitude with your service.. It's kind of like going to a "mom and pop" diner where the crusty waitress likes to taunt you as she delivers your food. *** Crisjon1950 - excuse me, Ronknights... crusty waitress? I do hope Rena doesn't see you describing her as a crusty waitress. She's been around a lot longer than you Ron, and she's earned the right to be a little testy sometimes when some newbie comes along lecturing her on how they think she should run her life and hobby. One thing that a lot of people forget is that PWFW went subscription because Allen gave them a choice - subscription to pay for the bandwidth, or bye bye. So it's not a business, in that you're right. It IS like going to a mom and pop diner, one where you get highly personalised treatment, a friendly smile and damn good food. On that note, didn't you have enough the last time you started sniping at them? Yes Poserworld considers it's customers friends. If you would rather be treated as a nameless number in a queue waiting at the checkout of a supermarket there are plenty of other sites who can cater to it. But how many "friends" would allow you to demean their work and their manner of speech and expect them to tolerate one's own bad attitude? The thing is though, that some people get very upset when someone who is relatively new lectures them on what they have been doing for years already. Poserworld is the best value you can get. I defy anyone here to find another site - pay or free - that consistently gives away so much for so little and supports it, and makes things to request, and chats with the members and keeps it all below the cost of a night's bed and breakfast.

Well, if I pay my money, I'm a customer, and I deserve to get customer service. If I ask a question, I expect a civil and helpful answer. I don't need to pass a test, or some "time or endurance marker" to have the right to speak my piece, or to ask for what I want for my money. And frankly my friends never talk to me that way. If I get a product and need some help, that is what I need. If I don't get the help, that product loses its value. We've already been through one incident of outrageousness directed at a customer. It had some severe side-effects, when I removed all my public endorsements of PWFW. Now I see some good stuff, and am excited. I'm complimenting the artist, and asking a few questions. And I'm getting a bad attitude. Some people never seem to learn.

You are not getting a bad attitude you silly little boy. As you mention yourself there's an involved html file explaining how the dress works. You don't understand that, fine, ask questions, stop bloody well sniping at people because they don't come round to your house and spend a few days explaining in detail. If you want Peter and Jane style explanations no problem, you can get them. But your belligerence and continual snide remarks get very wearing.

My belligerence comes after people snipe at me and seemingly refuse to answer questions.

Common thread on the Poser Forum... Different name, same wine... pass the cheese. Ron, it is unfortunate, because I really believe that you have some potential and you HAVE already provided some excellent resources to the Poser community with your tutorials, but it seems that you continuously need to chimne into almost every thread and whine over some issue that is important ONLY TO YOU. Perhaps if you confined your "questions" and "complaints' to on topic threads, instead of "shot gunning" them into every thread like a selfish child, you would get more respect and less attitute. Flame me if you will, I truely intend this as constructive critisism! Oh, very sorry to continue to drag this thread off topic! I'll be quiet now. mike

Excuse me, but someone was asking for recommendations concening PWFW. The issues I raised are valid issues, and someone should know all sides of the issue in order to make an informed decsion. You might want to research the term constructive criticism. Phrases such as "like a selfish child" are not considered constructive. They are instead demeaning and insulting.

RonKnights wrote: "Phrases such as "like a selfish child" are not considered constructive. They are instead demeaning and insulting. " and "crusty waitress" isn't? what goes around comes around as far as I can see ...

Nope, you are confusing things. I was making a comparison that is a good technique to illustrate a point. In fact it was a compliment. That comparison is used a lot to describe some eating establishments in the US. People love to eat at those places. They even love the crusty waitress. They keep coming back for the entertainment and the food.

whatever ...

Ron, I meant the "selfish child" analog in the same vein as your "crusty waitress" reference. What I intended to illustrate to you was that you tend to continue to try and make your "point" by introducing it into every available conversation, like a "selfish child", ie one who is only concerned with his or her own point of view to the exclusion and interruption of any other. I honestly didn't and don't expect you to understand this, because in you point of view, I am "attacking" you with my words. Meanwhile, also in your point of view, anything you say should be perfectly acceptable, becaus YOU said it, again illustrating my comparrison. Enough! As in all of these types of discussion, you see critisim as an attack and totally fail to heed it's actual intent. I have better uses for my time. mike

Well it was an attack. I had already proven that the crusty waitress comment was indeed a compliment. I even provided the proper reference in US culture for those of you who might not be familiar with such a scenario. In fact I was prepared to provide some TV references to that type of character. The name Flo comes to mind. She worked in Mel's Diner, along with Alice, the perennial good mom type figure. There are other cultural or media references. Now the comment concerning my alleged childish behavior is not the same as the crusty waitress comment. It is not meant as a compliment. I don't even go to every thread, and I don't comment on PWFW in every thread I visit. However, this is a thread asking for recommendations concerning PWFW. My initial response was a very positive comment. The responses to that compliment continue to be quite negative. That's pretty strange.

Well, to perhaps bring this thread back on track, "you can't please all the people all the time."

Personally, I think I got my money's worth from my subscription in the first few downloads... everything else seems gratis to me.

When I've had trouble, I've had nothing but excellent service; so to answer beav1's question, "Yes, the subscription is worthwhile."

crusty: having a crisp crust, irritable, curt, hard, crustlike, a person of unkempt appearance often with matted hair or dreadlocks esp. New Age Traveller Oxford English Dictionary. Taunt: thing said to anger or wound, assail with taunts, reproach contemptuously. Oxford English Dictionary So, where's the compliment in that? Huh? So don't play innocent you knew precisely what you were saying and why you said it. It's a shame that I've had to post the definitions of your words to prove the point that you in fact had NO intention that "crusty waitress" was meant as "nice". You really are quite sickening sometimes, the way you wriggle around and turn everything to your own agenda. Why don't you do Poserworld a favour, accept the generous offer made to you in another thread to purchase your remaining subscription and not "help" with your "positive" advertising that really only thinly covers your snide remarks. Lord only knows why you've decided to make it a personal crusade to haunt her and frighten her from posting anywhere because she "knows" you'll snipe at her. Trav is absolutely correct in what he says. The analogy he uses is more than adequate. Of course, you won't agree with me either, but so be it, I'm kinda used to that. :)

ROTFLOL. Pot - kettle - black...

Attached Link: http://www.renderosity.com/messages.ez?Form.ShowMessage=675621

Questor, you said you were done with this thread. You totally neglected to read anything I said about the whole concept of the crusty waitress in the restraunt, and the people who just love to patronize that eating establishment. Again, since you refuse to see the compliment, you will see the insult. There was no attempt to compliment me with the reference to childishness. It's an utter shame you don't see the truth or the difference here. But then maybe our cultural references are really very different on other sides of the Atlantic?! Questor, you may be a talented artist, and fancy yourself to be great in a debate. However you have two failings: 1.) You don't know what I think, and you never will since you refuse to accept anything I say to explain myself, my motives. All your guesses and proclamations are colored by your own warped perception in this case. 2.) You can make a hasty, and wrong, statement based on your faulty perception of a situation. And then you refuse to admit you're wrong even when presented with evidence to the contrary. **** Now this is the most absolutely absurd statement I've ever read: "Lord only knows why you've decided to make it a personal crusade to haunt her and frighten her from posting anywhere because she "knows" you'll snipe at her." Rena has a reputation for being one of the most volatile, outspoken people in this community. Rena also has many people behind her that provide support in these actions. Check the link provided in this message for one example. This thread was eventually locked. Oh, I'm not the only person to be a part of a locked thread. And I don't think I ever got involved in this one. **** Questor, you should be ashamed of yourself for insinuating that I't go on a crusade to harass someone to that extent. You and I have talked, privately, on an extensive basis, a few times. You know me better than many people here. You know me far better than that. I've given a lot of myself in this community. Hell, in the past week or so I've offered to host the files of two people who've crossed swords with me, because I recognize good talent when I see it, and you deserve to have this stuff hosted. Yes, and you are one of those people Questor. Or did you forget that? Did I extend this generosity as part of a nefarious plot to attack someone? Do I waste all my time working on tutorials and freebies just so I can attack someone? Bull shit.

Thanks for the re-edit of your post Ron, it's nice to watch you wriggle around changing your words, deleting you posts, much like you've deleted other previous posts to cover your mistakes. I am truly done with you now. I refuse to talk or argue somantics with a coward.

Oh, geesh. Did you ever make a typo? Mis-spell something? Whatever. Again, you chose to find something that is not there, and you lack the ability to see otherwise. Oh, you so nicely ignored all the appeals to your powers of reasoning, and the fact that you know better than to make such accusations. Me, a coward? Hell if I were a coward you and I wouldn't be arguing. I'd slink off and you could feel superior. It's rather hard when someone doesn't make it easy for you isn't it?

Again, you fail to hear anything that goes against your own narrow-minded negative view on this subject. That's pretty sad since you continue to see the world through mud covered glasses.

Unfortunately I can't seem to get the html to work. Oh well.... OK, third try at this. Previously at the Farm I find it necessary to revoke my "done with" comment. Typo. No, not exactly, but I wouldn't expect you to understand that. Please remove my file from your website. I will not be blackmailed or held to account for things you offer for your own reasons. Thank you 'tis not I who sees the world through mud coloured glasses. I see the world as it is. Unlike you, who seems to see the world in Ronky coloured glasses and cannot possibly entertain that you yourself are mistaken. It must be very satisfying knowing you are soooooo perfect.

A gift for someone who can get the site code and html to work. It is not behaving for me unfortunately.

Oh poor boy. You find insults, conspiracies and threats where they don't exist, and when challenged, you run off and resort to childish pranks.

Ooh boy, here we go again. Here's a thought to the people who want an "Ignore person" button; how about just ignoring them. We go through this every couple of weeks. Someone gets in a mood, and other walk right into their trap and just feed it. It's the same pattern every single time; isn't it time to break it? Just walk away. We can all see what's going on.

I've moved my questions concerning some newly downloaded stuff to the PWFW forum. Let's see if we can get this stuff figured out. I'm truly sorry that people don't see a compliment when it is intended. I won't debate it any more.

Crisjon1950/Ronknights. I asked you yesterday to remove my file from your site. You have not yet done this. You now have 24 hours in which to do as I request before I take further action to have it removed. Thank you

Sighing Guys why cant there be a civil conversation anymore? Why the hell does it have to turn into a fighting match? Honestly i am just curious about this.

Civil conversation? Not possible in this day and age. Far too many steroids in the meat, testosterone in the drinking water and carbon monoxide in the air.

*Choaking on my coffeee.. * Umm thanks Questor LMAO

You're welcome Stormrage, sorry about the coffee. :)

Oh, gee, what further action are you going to take? Gosh, do a guy a favor, and where does it get him? I just figured you'd realize I never intended to use the file as blackmail and then get over it. But if you wish to persist in making a nasty end to this, then so be it. Threats are not appropriate. You know better than that. *** The more I think about this the more absurd it seems. You needed someone to host this file. I offered my assistance, as a gesture of generosity and even respect for a fine artist. You choose to threaten me now?! Get real. The file is gone. I've learned a lesson here: "No good deed goes unpunished."

Not threatening Ron, just making a request for the second time and stating the consequence of not meeting that request. You may view it however you wish. I am tired of your paranoia, childishness and your continual self martyrdom and I have no wish to be associated with that in any shape nor form. Have fun in your delusional little world. I am done with you.

Oh, yes, the Semantics Game. Yes, I can warn you of the consequences, but that is not a threat. I can say something in anger that I might later retract, but you must take me seriously. I can insult you, but use the words in a way that can't be interpreted as an insult. But I reserve the right to twist any of your words until I see them as an insult. And nothing you say, no proof you provide will ever convince me of a different truth. Because I am always right. Now that pretty much sums up your attitude, I'd say. Give it a rest. I'm not one to be intimidated by your lack of debating skills. While you're at it, talk to your friend about playing Martyr. If that is supposed to be my role, why is she playing it?! Paranoia?! Teehee. You and others choose to see attacks where they do not exist?! Paranoia?! Teehee, talk about calling the kettle black. Now go and play somewhere else my little friend. You lost this one.

Yes, I can warn you of the consequences, but that is not a threat. No it was not a threat, it was a statement of fact, Ronknights: And nothing you say, no proof you provide will ever convince me of a different truth. Because I am always right. Yes, that is precisely how you come across every single time you start having a hissy fit. I'm actually very surprised you would admit this behaviour trait in public. Perhaps there is hope for you after all. Keep it up Ron, you're doing a far grander job of showing what a complete fool you can be than I ever could. Your spoiled brat behaviour and tantrums are doing an amazing job of destroying all the credibility you've tried so hard to establish. For some reason you seem bent on self destruction. That is something I do not understand. Have fun playing the wounded hero, I'm having amazing fun watching you.

If this wasn't so pathetic it would almost be funny.

Let me see if I get this right: 1.) According to your vision of life, if I say "I will shoot you," that is not a threat, but a statement of fact?! Or just when is a threat not really a threat even if it sounds like one? And is a threat only a threat if the person it's directed to feels it a threat, or only if the person who speaks the "threat" says it's a threat?! Or does it depend on who speaks the words, and who hears them? 2.) Now tell me exactly what can be defined as calling someone names? "Your spoiled brat behaviour": is that calling someone a name? Or do you need to say "You're a spoiled brat," before it is name calling? Is this an insult, or name-calling?! "It's kind of like going to a "mom and pop" diner where the crusty waitress likes to taunt you as she delivers your food." Or is this an insult or name calling: "You're a crusty old waitress." Is an analogy or comparison actually calling someone a name? Not where I come from. Is a compliment an insult if a person meant it as a compliment? Or is it an insult or compliment only if the person it's directed to wants it to be either one? If someone refuses to see the truth, does that make the truth any less valid? Is it wrong for everyone to insult? Or is it only wrong for those you don't like? In otherwords, is it ok for Questor to insult or threaten, but no one else who doesn't agree with you? Methinks it depends on who is saying the words, and who is hearing them. You have a huge double standard going on there Questor.

Play nice or both of you will be sent to your rooms. Please don't do the "But he started it" routine. Calm down, take it to IM if need be, but keep your public posts in this forum restricted to Poser related topics. Let's not force an official warning, or worse. Thank you.

Not as big a double standard as you maintain Ron. I don't change my tune to suit my purposes, nor do I pretend to insult someone by claiming it was a compliment. Nor do I delete previous posts to hide what I've done in the past or re-edit posts to make myself look innocent. All of which you have done and regularly do. Your spoiled brat behaviour Is a description of you abherrant behaviour. You may take that as an insult, however I consider it a simple statement of fact. I don't give a damn whether you consider it an insult. I've watched you calling Rena and other people all sorts of names and claiming that they're victimising you. Always a pretense of innocence. It's pathetic, it really is. One day you might just realise what a complete fool you appear to so very many people. Then again in the months you've been around the forums you seem to have learned nothing. If I say "Ron, you're a complete fucking wanker with the mentality of a rabid dog on heat and the personality of a filthy lavatory." That would be an insult Apparently if I stick a smiley on the end, it makes it a joke. So here's your smiley.. :) You lecture continually on being polite (remember your ridiculous introduction to C&D when you instructed everyone that they speak politely and without rude words?) yet when anything does not agree 100% with the Ronknights view of Existence you get antsy, belligerent, combative and paranoid. Hell you've accused people of victimising you and insulting you when they weren't even talking to you. Of course, you'll totally ignore your previous history up to current, as well as denying it, you'll completely ignore the fact that a lot of people have got totally cheesed off with you and your behaviour, and you'll no doubt completely ignore the possibility that things just don't exist outside of your own mind. There is a world out here Ron, and amazingly it doesn't operate to the Ronknights principle. I have no doubt that you'll continue to completely fail to realise that there are more cultures than American soap box programs and that the entire planet does not revolve, rotate nor pause and breathe on you command. No matter. Please keep up the nonsense, you really are revealing yourself quite well, and you're amusing the hell out of me at the moment. Thank you for fullfilling all my expectations of you. Oh, before you make some ridiculous claim about debate, I am not debating with you. I'm simply responding to you the way a person responds to an annoying barking dog. Perhaps later I'll throw a slipper at you or something.

OK, Crescent, I hear and obey. Besides I'd rather spend my time making naked pictures of Frazella and the Gorilla. After I'm done with that I plan to play with Poser Trash.

ROTFLMFAO... Oh you really are priceless. Well Ron, I can't resist responding to you. I know how much you just love to have the last word and play the innocent party, so I shall continue to respond to you so that you can indulge your fantasies and continue to play the martyr. Far be it for me to prevent you from having your delusional day at the soapbox. I'm done with you. Yes. I have lost all hope of you ever becoming a rational member of the human race. It won't matter to you but you have nothing but my contempt. Not because you snipe at Rena continually, but because you just cannot see beyond your nose to anything that doesn't fit into your narrow view. Have fun with your response Ron, I'm sure you'll just die if you can't have the last word.

Awww, fancy deleting the post Ron. Oh well, I have a copy in case anyone is curious what you had to say in your parting shot. Have a nice life Ron.