I'm not sure what the best forum for this would be, like Marketplace Wishlist or General Discussion, so I'll put it here since this is a popular forum.

I'd like to make a plea to the merchants that sell here, to also sell elsewhere. The vast majority of vendors in the Poser world go with exclusive deals, whether it's here, DAZ3D, RDNA etc. Obviously it's because the merchant site offers a better % if you go with an exclusive deal, but it is a disservice to your customers, and I'm not even sure it's the best choice financially.

There's a lot of discontent on this site, like I assume there are in many communities. Unfortunately, we're kept chained to these sites if we want to buy the things that our favorite vendors create. It's not, as I heard a Forum Admin say in a recent locked thread, our option to just "leave" if we don't like the TOS. Sites like this make money when we buy from the marketplace, and we buy here because the items we want aren't anywhere else, so even though we dislike the site we still end up supporting them financially.

So I'm suggesting vendors start making their creations available elsewhere as well. Starting a personal web shop, like on Yahoo! or Squarespace, costs almost nothing and isn't that technically challenging. But you end up with 100% of the profits from there instead of 50%-75% here, and it gives us an option, and would I have the option I would never buy from this site again.

Your point is very well made. And to a large extent I agree with it.

But this site (at this time) has one big advantage. Our products are rather specialized in the wider world. Also much if not most of our sales are impulse sales.

We must have foot traffic.

Over the years I've seen every attempt at individual stores fail simply because of a lack of traffic.

It's much like selling at cafepress. You have to bring in customers, the site dosen't. And most ppl only know so many other poser artist.

Yes, but as more and more people leave this site, where will they go? Some will come back just to buy stuff, but if vendors all had their own sites to sell from as well, people who like their products could always go directly there regardless which communities they hang out in.

I am a vendor here and there are other factors besides foot traffic to your product that you get at a large community website like this. It is cost effective. I do not have to purchase web software to try to create my own web store. I do not have to pay for a personal commercial website (money is real tight, I only have a MySpace Page and Deviant Art page now). I do not have to make contracts with credit card companies and Paypal on my own. Also Rendo handles year end reporting of earnings to the government and sends me a W2 to fill out and fax back to them at the end of the year.  Not every vendor or potential vendor has the money, time, and web know-how to create personal stores nor the energy to advertise their butts off to get traffic to their own web store.

Quote - So I'm suggesting vendors start making their creations available elsewhere as well. Starting a personal web shop, like on Yahoo! or Squarespace, costs almost nothing and isn't that technically challenging. But you end up with 100% of the profits from there instead of 50%-75% here, and it gives us an option, and would I have the option I would never buy from this site again.

Is there a tutorial for setting up shop at these sites? Inquiring minds wanna know!

I've been a vendor here in the past and the experience was only positive.   As a buyer I have also not run into any problems.  

Am I correct to assume that it's not the marketplace but something else that has you bothered about shopping here?  In that case, please just stop and consider if you go around trying to befriend and 'feel good' about every establishment where you shop.  And think about all the corrupt board of directors or shareholders who don't share your view of life or the world etc, that benefit from you shopping at a particular store. 

Now, if it's the community here that bothers you, well that's easy.   I survived it for over 10 years without any drama and I'm sure  you can too :)

I do support vendors and buy from their own sites but most of the time it's because a particular product I need is not sold here (e.g. PhilC's python scripts, content from certain Japanese creators, etc)  but if it's the same product and same price I would buy from here as I prefer not to give my CC info to hundreds of other sites.

As I said before, the marketplace is run well and that would be my only concern.   Hey, no one likes the soup Nazi but people still line up for more :)
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38330701/ns/business-consumer_news/

 Well.. been there, done that.

One of my best friends runs PoserAddicts, a pretty large store site, and of course I sell some stuff there, too. But to be honest, my sales there are laughable compared to what I can make here. This is just a hobby for me, but still, I'd like it to rake in as much money as possible - otherwise I might as well just make it all free.

There are things I make that for obvious reasons can't be sold here, so I AM selling elsewhere, and doing it happily. But the fact remains that even if the vocal minority leaves, there's still lots of potential customers here. REMEMBER that the people who uses the forums are a very very small number of the people who goes here only to shop. Don't judge numbers by us here in the Poser forum. Most of the names of my buyers are some I've never seen :)

Great idea.... but do you have any idea how much effort and time it requires to manage your own store? I've tried in the past and it's not that easy. OK, if you have 1 or 2 products it's easy, but if you have a lot, building a store website has a lot of catches.

If you do it yourself, you need to learn some kind of content management system. You can buy one, but they are quite expensive, so you need to go with a free one. I've done that and it took me over 3 months to even learn how to use such a store system, only to find out in the end that didn't do everything required. In the end, I gave up. Building a simple website is easy, getting a store up is far more complicated.

The next option is to go to some place were they have ready made stores or hire someone. Most of the ready made stores aren't geared towards poser content at all and hiring someone to build a website is going cost.

Next thing is bandwith....... huge problem when you are selling content. Before you know, you start paying for extra bandwith and loose the little profit made.

Then there's time..... having a store is taking up a lot of time to maintain, time that will be taking away from creating new content.

I do agree with you and it would be wonderful, but for most of us it's not an option, we either lack the knowledge, time and money. Our revenue isn't good enough to pay for a store also.

Setting up a shop isn't as easy as you state, simply because we're dealing with downloadable content. Most ready made shop system are made for physical products and services and can not handle downloadable products. Other can handle it, but charge extra for it. Yes, a shop is easy, as long as you don't sell products that can only be downloaded.

If it was so easy and cost little money only, we wouldn't see so many (personal) poser stores closing or struggling.

Having said that, the main issue is exclusivity..... Because some stores insist on being exclusive, we need to make choices. RDNA & DAZ only give the option of being exclusive. If a vendor doesn't want to be exclusive, then there aren't many choices left anymore. Even if you don't go exclusive, you still are, since there are very few places that you can sell at, that really work well.

But even if non of the stores wouldn't be exclusive, it still not that easy to sell everywere. Each store uses a different system and has different rules to abide to. It actually take a bit of effort to get products released. It's not like uploading some images and zip files and you're done. Far from that. The only store that really has that option is Content Paradise. CP is very easy to use for vendors, but it seems like a lot of customers refuse to go there. If I release a product at 3 stores (which I do), I need to do the work 3 times. Each requires different things in the zip file, different promotional material and different testing. Because each store uses it's own system, you need to do the same work each time again. Just go figure the time it takes to render and edit a set of promos for each time.

In the end, all of the work to please customers just doesn't pay of at all. Sales aren't reflecting all the work done at all when one sells at all kinds of different stores.

It's all easily said, getting everything in different stores, but in reality it's not like that all. The more stores a vendor releases at, the less he/she can focus on creating content. That is why we make choices...... or more or less are forced to make choices. I don't like it either, but we all seem to be stuck in the same place......

Also Renderosity buys ad space in major 3D mags so that brings in more folks as well.

I agree with Latexluv, we also had a site for many years before we started our store here, and got alot of traffic mostly from here.  Most people do start here and then create their own site, but again marketing yourself on a constent basis, watching your stuff get stolen on a regular basis (not that, that does not happen here), but better regulated, it can be exhausting.

Sharen

I realise you have an issue with this site, I think a lot of people have at one time or another.  I don't expect you to come out n say what it is but I think that your best bet is to try and address that issue.

Not all vendors here do this kind of thing full time, and it would be a large undertaking to start up a site for anyone.  A whole new skillset would be needed, to build the site, market it, get traffic in etc.  Frankly for one person that would be a full time job in itself, leaving less time to actually make content to sell on it :)

While something about the this site gets your goat, it does all that background stuff for us, leaving vendors to make the content.  It may be quircky and annoying, but without this kid of site a great many vendors would probably not make the stuff they do.

Think of it as supporting your favourite vendors, rather than supporting a site you aren't keen on :)

John.

I don't think setting up an online store is as hard as some of you may believe. I happen to know, I have one: http://elfguy.net/store

I made it myself in a day for free. Now it's pretty basic, since I made it from scratch, but there are so many sites online that allow you to do it easily from a web interface for as little as $5 a month. And even if you don't want to get into that, it's often possible to sell at multiple sites, like RDNA, DAZ, etc.

As for the issue, I think anyone who browses the galleries and forums a bit can easily see it. Just this week several members left and threads were locked once again, and it's usually always the same reason, fed up with this site's policies and how admins apply those policies. But I don't really want to go into the reasons behind the miscontent, this is more to urge vendors to offer their customers with more buying locations. I personally used to spend hundreds of $ monthly here, now it's down to a fraction of that, with the rest being spent at other stores, even though there are things I would want to get from here sometimes. And I know for a fact I'm not alone. I do think it's doing yourselves a disservice not offering your products at more stores.

Quote - I don't think setting up an online store is as hard as some of you may believe. I happen to know, I have one: http://elfguy.net/store

Curious..... what did you use to build it? Do you have a link?

Quote - I And even if you don't want to get into that, it's often possible to sell at multiple sites, like RDNA, DAZ, etc.

No, it isn't.... an item sold at either RDNA or DAZ cannot be sold anywhere else, both of them deal with exclusive content only. You can be a vendor at different sites, yes, but not with the same items. An item is either sold at DAZ or RDNA or Rendo Exclusive or Rendo non exclusive & the rest of the stores. Never at all of them.

I made it from scratch using my basic HTML skills. You don't even need to use a shopping card, or deal with credit cards or anything like that, Paypal can do all that for you. But as I said there are tons of resources online to help with that.

I didn't know DAZ and RNDA did exclusives only, but again that is purely a business decision for them, a way to force people to come to their store, and is anti consumers. Vendors should fight that just like us, as in the long run it only hurts everyone.

HTML..... I don't have basic html skills, I've got the feeling that it will take those of use without basic html skill will need far more then a day :-(

Biggest question is..... was it worth it? Do people even buy stuff on a regular basis? Do people even find a personal website? How much time do you spent in promoting it?

No, but people didn't buy when I had a store here either. Again I'm not suggesting replacing one with the other, but the 5 people who buy from the personal site will be grateful.

building the store = one day
putting products in the store = one day
marketing and promoting the store = 24/7, 365 days a year
creating new content and staying up to date with 3d and poser products = zero time

trust me, I have forgotten a lot of what I used to know about poser because I was focusing on running an online store. While making a store IS easy, getting customers will become your job, you won't actually MAKE anything anymore. If what you want is for your favorite creators to STOP making things, then by all means, keep insisting that they run their own store.

your own webstore = small boutique crammed down an alley downtown
renderosity marketplace = mall

Quote -
your own webstore = small boutique crammed down an alley downtown
renderosity marketplace = mall

What a perfect way to put it!

Let me tell you.. I've been doing FREE Poser content now for over 8 years - and on a GOOD day (when I've touted my site ehre and made a new freebie ect) I have like 50% extra hits.

As I said, the owner of PoserAddicts is a close friend of mine. I KNOW how much time he spends on that site, it's like 26 hours a day (well so it seems at least!) and it leaves him *NO time for persona "fun" renders. 

And when your hobby becomes your full time work, it's no longer a HOBBY, it's tedious WORK.

I don't want my hobby to turn into something tedious.

Besides.. I do think you're coming off rather ... blinkered. You don't like Rosity, yet you post your "plea" here so that we should all ideally abandon ship. You don't even know how DAZ or RDNA works. You have your own website... wow. So do I. But still, with all your html knowledge you can't even post a clickable link to tit? (ok I HATE to have to cut-and-paste links when making them clickable is so easy here!)

And your stuff didn't sell.. Well a quick glance revealed 95% Vue stuff. I dunno how Vue stuff sells.. I don't buy it as I use POSER (hence, this is the POSER forum) so perhaps the reason why your stuff didn't sell here isn't because Rosity sucks but because VUE stuff has few customers? Again, I do not know.. only guessing, and trying to figure out the reason for your anti-Rosity crusade.

Yes, this place has issues. Show me a major site/company who doesn't. It's STILL - short of DAZ the most effective place to sell your stuff.
I also have banners for my For Sale products there. I haven't been able to see ANY increase in sales on a day with more hits than a day with the normal odd 50 hits.

Thanks for reminding me to update my sig trekkie. (slaps forehead)

it has been too long that I have been away, obviously

Quote - No, but people didn't buy when I had a store here either. Again I'm not suggesting replacing one with the other, but the 5 people who buy from the personal site will be grateful.

That's way too much work for 5 people..... I'm sure those 5 will buy stuff where ever you sell it. I know an own store will generate (some) sales, can't say for sure how much it will be, but going by the tendencies we see, it's not a valid option at all. It's quite obvious it will not really boost sales at all, it may actually hurt sales, due to the time lost.

 I like the exclusivity because then I can't accidentally buy the same thing twice.
You can still buy here and just not partake of forums and galleries and that way you aren't really chained to the site.  Unless your issue is somehow related to the buying process or return policy or something.
Love esther

Besides.. I do think you're coming off rather ... blinkered. You don't like Rosity, yet you post your "plea" here so that we should all ideally abandon ship.

Where did I ever say that? Look, all I'm saying is this site has pissed off several people. Just look for the latest thread locked where several people said in no uncertain terms how they are leaving Rendo because of their stupid policies. I left this site for the same reason, gallery images being removed for ridiculous reasons, without any chance for appeal, and I have some friends who also left for similar reasons.

But again, this is irrelevant. All I'm saying is to offer your customers choices. Right now the vast majority of the Poser market is an exclusive market, meaning vendors stick to one store only. There are so many reasons why this is bad. A store closes, and suddenly a lot of cool products aren't available anymore. Some customers don't like or trust a certain site, and the products on that site aren't available for them. My plea is for vendors to change this process. If several high profile vendors started to sell at more than 1 store this could change.

Again, it's simple. You make a product I want, and sell it here, that's a $15 you won't get from me, if you sell it at DAZ or RDNA or your personal web site, it's money you'll get. Same for anyone else who has the same dislike for this site. Same for anyone who is exclusive at DAZ and I also know DAZ has pissed off several people who stopped shopping there. This isn't a Rendo only problem, it's a plea to end ALL exclusivity.

Quote - I didn't know DAZ and RNDA did exclusives only, but again that is purely a business decision for them, a way to force people to come to their store, and is anti consumers. Vendors should fight that just like us, as in the long run it only hurts everyone.

I think the main reason RDNA and Daz demand exlusivity is to have control of the quality of content - something I have absolutely no problem with. RO gets to look a lot like a flea market. Some will hate me for that, but I'm only telling the truth as I see it ;o).

Laurie

Believe it or not, I think there is much diversity here.  More then I have ever seen anywhere else. Don't you agree. 

Yes, there is. DAZ is limited diversity, so is RDNA, CP has a lot more variety, but Rendo so is most diverse of them all.

I don't use paypal, I don't like their contract. I understand it was easier to use them in the past, but I'm not giving them my banking account information, I think that's just too crazy for me.

Then there is a trust issue, I wouldn't buy from a bunch of small vendor sites I didn't know. I only buy from one small vendor, and it took a long time before I'd do that.

[b]LaurieA[/b]:

Quote -
I think the main reason RDNA and Daz demand exlusivity is to have control of the quality of content - something I have absolutely no problem with.

Quality of content has nothing to do with whether it's available from one shop or million shops.

Quote - [b]LaurieA[/b]:

Quote -
I think the main reason RDNA and Daz demand exlusivity is to have control of the quality of content - something I have absolutely no problem with.

Quality of content has nothing to do with whether it's available from one shop or million shops.

You're right about that.... it's a pure power, control & dominion issue ;-)

Well, all I can say,until you try it, have your own store etc., and do all that work yourself, see how much a vendor can profit on it's own.  Sharen

Quote - Where did I ever say that? Look, all I'm saying is this site has pissed off several people. Just look for the latest thread locked where several people said in no uncertain terms how they are leaving Rendo because of their stupid policies. I left this site for the same reason, gallery images being removed for ridiculous reasons, without any chance for appeal, and I have some friends who also left for similar reasons.

Why does (or should) the events in the forums or galleries have much influence on whether or not you purchase from the store?

I wouldn't be surprised if the majority of content purchasers at any Poser-related site actually don't visit the forums therein, unless they've got a problem with a purchase, and likely either don't post anything they create with the program on the Internet or do so elsewhere.

Heck, I don't like several of the policies over at DeviantArt, yet I still visit the site to look at the works of artists I like. I'll never post an image of my own there though, or purchase any products from there. Doesn't mean all that needs to (or does) have any impact on my viewing.

Just as Renderosity's sometimes bass-ackwards policies and seeming attempts to drive people away necessarily need to have an impact on the Marketplace. Really the only people usually aware of the policy changes are those who frequent the forums, and the people who get upset about those are primarily that group.