I was just reading the thread on DAZ, it's at 55 bloody pages now though, so I'm not reading through that lot :-D

Anyway, as good as it sounds, I'm only interested in this if it works in the built-in viewport, or at least the window has the ability to dock in the DAZ interface.  Can someone tell me the situation there cause I hate having to switch between program and renderer program, it infuriates me so much I don't even use Octane (or Reality) because of it even though I love both products.

I just want something like this, but I wan't it built-into the program properly.  I read early on in the thread that it's "built-in", but right now I find that a bit too hard to believe.  What exactly do they mean by "Built-in", do they mean just because it's internally connected to it, or do they mean it's actually built-in to the DS interface?

It's built into the DS & the viewport. All you have to do is switch to the Iray render engine in order to use it. Here you can see it starts rendering the preview if Iray is selected. You still have to actually click render, but this shows a progression view in the viewport the longer you leave it. You can also switch to aux view where it will preview the scene in Iray if that is the render engine selected.

I was just reading the thread on DAZ, it's at 55 bloody pages now though, so I'm not reading through that lot :-D

Anyway, as good as it sounds, I'm only interested in this if it works in the built-in viewport, or at least the window has the ability to dock in the DAZ interface.  Can someone tell me the situation there cause I hate having to switch between program and renderer program, it infuriates me so much I don't even use Octane (or Reality) because of it even though I love both products.

I just want something like this, but I wan't it built-into the program properly.  I read early on in the thread that it's "built-in", but right now I find that a bit too hard to believe.  What exactly do they mean by "Built-in", do they mean just because it's internally connected to it, or do they mean it's actually built-in to the DS interface?

It's built in to the interface. Results can be viewed interactively from IPR or the viewport.

Yeah it's pretty nifty, they seem seriously motivated in making it a full alternative to 3delight.

I can understand someone who already uses both Poser and DS might want to try it but what are the other options open to Poser users that only use Poser and don't want to go down the Daz route?

Good news is that there is more choice in renderers these days then ever before. There's VRay, Arnold, Redshift, Octane, Thea, Indigo, moskito, Maxwell, Cycles off the top of my head as well as various old workhorses like mentalray, finalRender, PRMan, 3delight, Vue...

The bad news is that only a few of them offer any kind of serious support for Poser or are affordable. There's lux of course which is free and has good support via Reality but is painfully slow. There's Octane which is faster but isn't exactly cheap. Also good old C4D + interposer but that's even more expensive... Compared to those, iRay does seem like a 'best of all worlds' renderer IMO.

Here is a quick vid showing the viewport when set to Iray with DOF as well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nh7gLmjtBHM

Off course its interesting news,but as with every PBR renderer everything will depends on yours HW,shame is only for nVidia GPU,yes you can use CPU mode,with which will you will get slower renders 

With Poser you still can use many other external renderers,just you will need to export them to external app like is 3DS MAX etc.I personally prefer 3DS MAX and render there in V-RAY,both are student version and both will do job for my needs or you can use there Metalray or iRay etc. 

Agree Reality is slow,but most of the PBR renderers are slow,everything all depends on the HW used and settings used,if I will crank V-RAY settings in some scenes then my renders will takes too 12-14 hour to render on my PC

Good on the iRAY in DS is everything you have there and you don't need to export to external app,which is easier for people who prefer to render in one app.I've done few test renders and they look OK,still I would do few more renders to test and then decide if its for me,for me I hate DS GUI and I don't see I would be using DS for rendering although iRay is very nice proposition and nice renderer and this can me take back to DS,but for now I'm firmly with Poser and use as my external renderer 3DS MAX with V-RAY or I will go route other renderer

Thanks,Jura

@Zev0 and Male_M3dia
Wow, I can hardly believe my eyes, at last we have a GPU renderer actually running inside the viewport of a Figure Tool.  I've waited for this ever since I first set eyes on Octane Render!

Glad I didn't bother to upgrade Octane now, cause like I said, the workflow of having seperate programs just destroys the enjoyment for me.  But wow, have to say I'm extra happy about this because it means that finally, there is a program that does everything I want it to (well almost).  Just two things stopping DS from being the perfect solution.  I wish it had the same implementation of Bullet Pyhsics for Cloth as Poser has (that live-mode for animated weightmap positioning is superb) and I wish it had that Physics plugin like that Poser plugin developer made.

Those are both things that can be done with plugins, and with those two, DS would be my dream setup!

"Sadly, it's nVidia only."

Only if you want to use GPU rendering. It is faster with a nVidia card yes but it is not required. CPU can be done with any card.

Interesting.  How is the speed compared to LuxRender?

Oh, and when I see 'PBR Renderers', this is what I envision... :lol:

THIS THREAD IS MAKING ME THIRSTY!! 

"Sadly, it's nVidia only."

Only if you want to use GPU rendering. It is faster with a nVidia card yes but it is not required. CPU can be done with any card.

Interesting.  How is the speed compared to LuxRender?
No idea. You would have to open the exact same scene and do a timestamp render in both engines.

i would luv a vray plugin.  if anyone is counting wishes :)

maybe win the lotto so i could buy the hardware 

I just downloaded it but I can't find that button, and even in the render preferences where you get to choose the renderer, I can't see IRay listed as an option.
Any idea what I'm doing wrong here?

It's the latest version of DS downloaded through the Install Manager.

I just downloaded it but I can't find that button, and even in the render preferences where you get to choose the renderer, I can't see IRay listed as an option.
Any idea what I'm doing wrong here?

It's the latest version of DS downloaded through the Install Manager.

did you d/l the new beta version?
is only in the beta.

You will need

http://www.daz3d.com/daz-studio-beta

and also the new genesis2 essentials.

To correct the misinformation. Nvidia's Iray does do SSS and it is available from within DAZ Studio. And the 'misinformation' is why so many DAZzies show up in these areas.

OK perhaps I can get a clear answer(without having to read pages of a seeming temper tantrum going on)
Sotto on DA said I do not need the NVIDIA card to use the new DS...is this true?

Yes, you can still use your "cpu only" with Iray, the same why 3dlight does. However renders will take a bit longer. But there are those who are using cpu only and getting decent times and results. All depends on your scene. The end result in terms of quality will be the same, only time is affected without an nvidia gpu.

Hmm..this looks very interesting but frankly

after looking at the  "Iray render" thread,

over at the Daz forums,

I see nothing that cant be done with the free

Daz script I have been using to send my

LEGACY POSER CONTENT to Blender cycles

Via Daz Studio.

Not knocking Daz in fact Kudos to them, it just seems to my aging eyes that All of the modern Physically based renders

(IRay Maxwell, Octane,Thea,Cycles,LUX etc etc.)

look basicaly the same.

Yes, you can still use your "cpu only" with Iray, the same why 3dlight does. However renders will take a bit longer. But there are those who are using cpu only and getting decent times and results. All depends on your scene. The end result in terms of quality will be the same, only time is affected without an nvidia gpu.

Decent times? are we talking hours ....or days? Its slow render times that have been dragging me. I have Reality and ...guh...I tend to work in 8000x6000 and anywhere from 72dpi to 300dpi....

Well for me the difference is an extra hour or so. But Like I said, it all depends on the scene you are rendering.

I see nothing that cant be done with the free Daz script I have been using to send my

LEGACY POSER CONTENT to Blender cycles

Via Daz Studio.

It is all about convenience. You have no idea how much that plays into people actually wanting to try out something. There are lot's of user who do not want to go into another app just to render, the same mindset that they won't use another app to use Genesis for example. They want things working where they are most comfortable.

They look the same because they are basically the same in terms of the kind of rendering they do. Some focus on performance, some on more features but the root unbiased rendering approach is the same in all of them. And of course the bottleneck in all this is steadily shifting from the rendering itself to the quality of content being rendered...

@Misty
Thanks, that fixed it, I had stupidly downloaded 4.7 :-P

@Zev0
Where in the render settings do I set it to use my GPU's?

I have two nVidia GTX460's, bit crappy by todays standards but two of them were lightning fast with Octane (though sadly it will only access the RAM of one card as Octane doesn't add together the RAM of both cards).  I've got a viewport render from IRay, but it's a bit sluggish, I think it must be using the CPU and not the GPU's.

Trouble is, I can't find CPU/GPU settings anywhere, help! :-D

Yes, actually I am saying it's more OT than any of those.

Oh, you would be wrong, then.  Thanks for trying to be the forum police though, good show.

"It is all about convenience. You have no idea how much that plays into people actually wanting to try out something. There are lot's of user who do not want to go into another app just to render, the same mindset that they won't use another app to use Genesis for example. They want things working where they are most comfortable."

Quite True Sir 

I am thankful that My mind is not hindered by such limitations and is able to allow me to access a variety of tools to achieve my creative objectives.

Where in the render settings do I set it to use my GPU's?

On the render settings tab.. then look at advanced settings:

Decent times? are we talking hours ....or days? Its slow render times that have been dragging me. I have Reality and ...guh...I tend to work in 8000x6000 and anywhere from 72dpi to 300dpi....

DarkElegance,  for CPU rendering in Lux, jack every computer you have in the house into a switch or router, and network render.        If budget allows, consider buying used server blades equipped with dual HyperThreaded hex-core Xeon processors, and using them as network render drones.

Yes, you can still use your "cpu only" with Iray, the same why 3dlight does. However renders will take a bit longer. But there are those who are using cpu only and getting decent times and results. All depends on your scene. The end result in terms of quality will be the same, only time is affected without an nvidia gpu.

In our testing, we have found that, as long as you properly light your scene (Not comparing Headlamp only or no shadow renders in 3Delight.) the average time for Iray renders in CPU mode is about the same as 3Delight., Yes, some things go nuts, but generally it is within +/- 10%.

Note that if your Video card has less than 4GB dedicated Video RAM, it is turned off by default. You can turn it on, but be advised that if you run out of Video Ram in the viewport it can crash. Also note that the viewport mode only uses one card or the CPU, which ever the scene fits on. 

Further note It is not recommended that you turn off the CPU. That gives your computer nothing to fall back on if you exceed your video card RAM. 

@Male_M3dia
Cheers, I was clicking on the Draw Settings by mistake, and there was no options under Advanced for that part.

Got it, so now I'll have to have a look at all those interactivity settings so that I can get it to behave like Octane (I hope).  In Octane, when you rotate the scene, it breaks-up into larger pixels to make it nice and fluid to rotate even while it renders, so I'm hoping some of these settings will do that as well.  It's not as fluid as Octane at the moment cause there's a pause and then it shows the full render, whereas Octane was rendering all the time, even while I rotated the scene.  Like I said though, it's probably down to the settings, and wow, it looks a lot more sophisticated than Octane so far, I'm not sure I've seen half these settings before.

First impressions are very promising indeed!

Hi everyone, I'm glad to see this thread calming down. Unfortunately the mods have agreed that it should be locked due to the potential of it flaring up again. 

I am bring this thread back as I think it is newsworthy to some of our members.  We have to remember that some members use both DS and Poser.

All we ask that the thread stays on track going forward.

"Sadly, it's nVidia only."

Only if you want to use GPU rendering. It is faster with a nVidia card yes but it is not required. CPU can be done with any card.

Interesting.  How is the speed compared to LuxRender?

Hi WW  Comparison speeds between the CPU and GPU mode of iRAY in DAZ3D:

GPU(560TI 2GB ) with CPU(X5670 6core overclock'd 4.2GHz) mode scene bellow took 39mins 

CPU mode only(X5670 6 core overclock'd 4.2GHz) 1hour and 30mins

Lighting i've used only one spotlight and dome light(studio HDR from sIBL)

As you can see there is no difference between the CPU or GPU mode,only speed is there difference,as with every renderer,everything deepends on HW used.

Hope this helps 

Thanks,Jura

Thanx, Jura!  :)

And Thanx to Tina for reviving this thread!  :)

I'm thinking I'll hold out for Paolo's Reality for Renderman. :)

the records stuck ,somebody kick it.

P.S.

pumeco before ya dive to deep daz forums are a lot stricter then here. 

It looks an interesting development however, given some further thought it really is not a solution for me.  First of all I would have to learn another interface and I really don't want to go down the route for the sake of a render engine.  The other problem I have is that Vue has now become part of my workflow and using Poser for internal scenes and Vue for external, with Poser materials inside Vue, it gives me some consistency.  Not sure I want to have to use three render engines but then that is just the way I work, for others this does look a step in the right direction.

"I'm thinking I'll hold out for Paolo's Reality for Renderman. :)"

I'm not sure that I blame you due to the extra level of fiddling for surfaces. But, since I am cheap and the price is 0$ I doubt if I would. That and I want to be able to figure out how to work "oh I use the same render engine as the guys who do the renault commercials" into a conversation. I know they still won't understand what I do or what I am talking about but at least they would recognize that one word.

"I'm thinking I'll hold out for Paolo's Reality for Renderman. :)"

I'm not sure that I blame you due to the extra level of fiddling for surfaces. But, since I am cheap and the price is 0$ I doubt if I would. That and I want to be able to figure out how to work "oh I use the same render engine as the guys who do the renault commercials" into a conversation. I know they still won't understand what I do or what I am talking about but at least they would recognize that one word.

I recognise the word 'commercials' :-)

"I'm thinking I'll hold out for Paolo's Reality for Renderman. :)"

I'm not sure that I blame you due to the extra level of fiddling for surfaces. But, since I am cheap and the price is 0$ I doubt if I would. That and I want to be able to figure out how to work "oh I use the same render engine as the guys who do the renault commercials" into a conversation. I know they still won't understand what I do or what I am talking about but at least they would recognize that one word.

I just don't think Reality will be available with Renderman as Renderman Free if you mean is and will be available for free use(although Renderman has been announced few month ago and they said,should be available in 2014,hopefully will be available in 2015) and Reality is commercial product,not sure if Renderman can allow this  Out are few other PBR renderers like Mitsuba which are GPL free or many others and if SM or Paolo@Reality will accompany this to their apps then great thing,this we can say,if SM will struck the deal with nVidia or even AutoDesk or Chaos(V-Ray) then we are all the winners

Thanks,Jura

Poser has a fairly good track record for folding in useful things that were externally created. If I were them I would have started talks with Paolo to try get him on board for just that. The tricky bit there would be requiring people to make that extra lux download (f that had to still be downloaded separately) and you know how people get about.. stuff.

there was a reduced price vray version for truespace.
it wasn't same as maxes it was a water down version ,vray lite. 

------------------------------------------------ 

Realty is a killer deal for a wicked render engine.
http://www.renderosity.com/mod/bcs/reality-4---poser-edition/107744/ 
but if all ya can afford is $0.00 free.
how ya going to afford to buy stuff to render ?
there might be free stuff in 3D but 3D is light years a way from free.
ya pay to play.

and while I'm rambling.why don't we ever hear about the best post app MS5 ?
They spend all that time and money on a killer render but they don't take it over top in post.
I just always wonder about that part.

I know it won't be free, not a problem.

Paolo posted something recently (I don't recall where, probably RDNA) about extreme interest in building a Reality for Renderman when it's released for free. I'm pretty sure about that because that's when I googled it and got signed up on the renderman email list for when it's released, supposedly in early 2015.

So I'm thinking it will be released (and this isn't an intentional dig to you daz guys) soon. :)

I am in the middle of a complex animated film project so I have ZERO time to fiddle with the public beta.

However I will likely grab the Official release when it appears in my Daz Account Page at some point.

The renders posted in the various threads so far have left me underwhelmed

but I admit to being a bit jaded as a person

who has C4D with Vray, Maxwell and recently

started using blender cycles for stills,

At any rate this is a smart move on the part of Daz  Inc. as it keeps their software cutting edge and relevant.

Agree with Reality is great renderer,but its slow and if Luxrender in next installment will support GPU rendering then maybe this will help us with faster render times,GPU renderers are still faster than CPU renderers,for fast CPU render you will need render farm which for most users this is not simply option

If Paolo will release Reality for RenderMan version then this can bridge the gap to other renderers

IRAY is not bad renderer,but if you AMD/ATI owner then you will need to run in CPU mode which is slower than GPU mode.probably best will be if SM/Poser pro support some sort of the GPU/CPU renderer based on OpenCL,where you are not tied to GPU maker(with IRAY you need to have nVidia GPU like with Octane)

Out are few good renderers  which are GPL free or paid programs too which would love to see be implemented in Poser Pro

Thanks,Jura

Remember that, unless their plans change, Renderman free will be non-commercial only - unlike Iray in DS, or LuxRender.

Reality for RM just makes no sense.

What is a hobbiest going to do with it that your not already doing with DAZ Studio?

3Delight IS a Renderman compliant render engine.

Im sorry, i dont mean to take this off topic at all.

I wish I had Iray renders to contribute but i dont. 

"3Delight IS a Renderman compliant render engine."

Doesn't that only mean that it uses Renderman's shading format?

"3Delight IS a Renderman compliant render engine."

Doesn't that only mean that it uses Renderman's shading format?

3delight does indeed use RSL (Renderman Shading Language), though 3Delight does have some extensions to it. Note there are, that I am aware of, two GUI based interfaces in software that can create RSL code. One of them is in DAZ Studio, the other is from Pixar and costs $1000.  However that is not all Renderman compliant means. It is a set of standards, math and equations to make a render engine. :) 

I mentioned this in another thread, but didn't really go into any detail.  I personally think Renderman being free for non-commercial use is only really any use to the company that produces it.  The idea behind it is no doubt so that you learn it, and then maybe in the futre, you'd need to pay them for a commercial licence if you want to use it commercially.  Nothing wrong with that, it's a good idea, something they all should do, but I think there's an evolutionary bad side to all of this.

It's bad because it's not realtime, yet a free to use "cinematic quality" realtime renderer already exists.  DAZ have their shiny new GPU renderer built right-in, and congrats to them for such an excellent implementation.  However, this means SM are up against a free DS with a free GPU renderer built-in, so how can they possibly pull any potentially lost customers back from DAZ, and gain a whole bunch of new ones besides?

I think the answer is obvious, and it's called "Unreal Engine" which is a 'Cinematic Quality Realtime Renderer'.

The four clips below shows Unreal Engine (which is free) in action.  This is what Poser needs running in "realtime" in the Poser viewport, this is a much better proposition than bridges to renderers that are not realtime.  Poser already has a raytracer, a damn good one, but neither DAZ or SM have a "Realtime Renderer" in their products, so if SM were to licence this product for use directly in the Poser viewport, I think people would come flocking back to Poser at an alarming rate.  See, Poser already beats DS in the usability and interface design, and if Unreal Engine was running in the viewport, Poser would beat anything DAZ have added to their system.

Nothing is more enjoyable to use than something that runs in realtime.  Movintg an object or figure around in Unreal Engine means it's already rendered.  Developing for a game engine would be a dream, because your Poser viewport would be the same as that used in games, so when you develop in Poser, you're effectively developing in the same engine, you know exactly what it will look like.  No compatibility problems, instant renders, realtime rendering, this is the future ... now!

Unreal Engine needs licencing for the Poser viewport before 'someone else' beats them to it.  Unreal are open to enquiries, so assuming SM use their noodle here, here's how this system could be implemented perfectly into the current Poser system.

• Put an option in the Poser Preferences where the user can select between "Firefly" or "Unreal Engine".
• Choosing "Firefly" will put the Poser viewport into standard mode, and the Material Room would show the usual Firefly material nodes.
• Choosing "Unreal Engine" will put the Poser viewport into Realtime mode, and the Material Room would show the Unreal Engine material nodes instead.

Simple, selective, productive ... mindblowing productivity would await you with such a setup.

So you see, Poser would still have it's raytracer for if/when it's needed, it would still have it's Luxrender and Renderman plugins, but it would also be capable of working in realtime, and realtime is what the future is all about.  Unreal Engine is the best out there, it's cinematic quality, physically based rendering, and all in realtime!  There's no renderer out there as attractive as Unreal Engine, simply because it does what it does, all in realtime, and that's important for maximum productivity and enjoyability.

The following videos are just a selection of many available, and remember when you're watching them, that everything you see was rendered in realtime.  I say that because it's so good it's often hard to believe, but these are all realtime, no more waiting for renders:

Unreal Engine is truly beautiful, isn't it?
And free!
And Unreal Engine are open to licencing!
Waiting for renders is a thing of the past!
It would be the most amazing Poser release ever, to have that renderer running live in the Poser viewport!
So what on earth is SM waiting for? :-D

BTW, just noticed Copy/Paste is fixed and that YouTube embedding is back - thanks :-)

Actually, the Unreal render isn't running in real time as you build scenes. It needs to be compiled first, then you move around the result:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7CTPS-5JsE

This makes sense, otherwise you would need a powerful computer and several video cards to run it.

I suspect however, a lot of work would be need to be done in poser to support the subset of rendering, just like DS basically ripped out their view port functionality for the IPR, the environment tab, the render settings tab, and the surfaces tab to allow multiple renderers and their different settings. Choosing a renderer gave you different sets of render settings, applying the iray shader gave you a different set of materials settings, shader mixer added in iray blocks, etc.