One of my favourite characters for Posette is Yamato's Linlin (and Ranran) for the JP settings. Granted most clothing with thighs and shins don't work but I've been able to do slight alterations to get them to fit. However, for nudes, the figures can't be beat since they bend without breakage and the hip area is one of the smoothest I've seen on a Poser model. Now, comes my problem. I recently got AprilYSH's P4VSkin (Posette remapped to take Victoria skins) and wanted to use my modified Linlin. Editing the cr2 to point to April's new .obj didn't work as materials assigned were not named the same and even after I had used the grouping tool to assign the Head Skin mat the head still wouldn't map correctly. So, I tried editing April's cr2 in cr2 editor and copied what I thought were Linlin's joint rotations over. I ended up with something vaguely resembling a human figure, though. My next attempt was to bring both figures into Poser and painstakingly copy each joint but although this worked for the arms and elbows, something's wrong with the hip. If you've read this far, here's my question: How can I make a custom pose file to include only the JP information from Yamato's character so I can apply it to any Posette and one that will return her to default (coz now I can't get rid of what I did and already loaded the figure with morphs and made body morphs aaack!)?

Even if you could, the resulting PZ2 file would be huge. But transfering JP's is very easy: http://www.zenwareonline.com/cr2edit/help/CR2EditWelcome.htm 4th icon first row If the geometry of the figure has been radically changed, the results may still be weird. Dan http://www.zenwareonline.com/cr2edit/cr2edit.html Sorry Win only for software http://www.zenwareonline.com for ZenPaint, ZenTile, ZenGrid and VueMaster

Thanks Dan but I seem to recall a thread where Jaager had talked of such a thing, I can't see why the PZ2 file would be huge, all it would have would be alterations on the JP's, no morphs hence no geometry right?

I did it with my version of Vic. I rotate the hand and foot from there. In order to do this, the end point for "twist" must be pulled back to the elbow and knee. This is just one line, in one channel for each of the four groups. I could have made a pose file that just changed these four lines, but I included them in the pose file that also changed to the new limits for each on the channels and hides the unneeded finger rotation dials. What you do: open a regular pose file and look at the data that is required. (Usually the channel title - the internal { and } pairs and the line of interest in its proper location relative to the { - } . Sometimes you will want a line that comes after key - key has a { } in it - I usually include the empty { } - each on its own line - It might not be necessary, but these are markers, Poser may count them as it goes. It is OK to skip a few if you are jumping to the next channel . Anyway, it does not cost much and it CYA. As for your problem. You need to know which channels are involved. You need to locate the lines with the new data. Rule one: if IT is not changed, or addressed = leave it out. IT being any line. The pose file would have the channel title - the { pairs and the JP lines - nothing else. Make another pose file with the standard JP data that you have changed with the first pose file. This will be the reset pose. (undo) You can fold this into any other sort of pose file, including a MAT, but it can also be stand alone.

I will re-enforce: Any JP lines that are indentical between the two? Leave these out out of the pose file, ignore them If it ain't broke, don't change it. This comes from my experience with MAT pose. I wanted to use a bump on lips. I wanted to change the lip textures at will. My MAT texture pose had a line = Bump NO MAP My MAT bump pose had a line = texture NO MAP Depending on which was used last,I either had no texture, or no bump. I removed the Bump lines from the texture MAT I removed the Text lines from the bump MAT The point being - leaving in lines that have default data can have unwanted effects, so cut any lines that are not strictly necessary. Any kind of pose file.

Oh, thank you so much! Gotta get down to some work now but it's getting clearer. These PZ2 files can do just about anything. You've been a very big help, thanks again :)

Anything but change the geometry itself, add a new morph as a new targetGeom, or add a prop or hair. But as for the figure itself, if Poser can change it in a CR2, a pose file will do it. Any variable is open the change by using a pose file. And - say you had a character face and you would like to keep it in Face instead of Pose, but you want to add trans data for the eyes with it? The only difference between a pose file and a face file - as far as what they can do when you click it? Is that one ends in .pz2 and must be in Pose and the other ends in .fc2 and must be in Face. You can put a full blown pose file in Face and it will work the same - as long as you change the extension.

You know I had suspected as much, seeing as a poseable prop that has become a figure can be renamed as pp2 instead of cr2 and I also do this with hair if I want to combine hairstyles, pp2 files stay put, hr2 files replace one another. But this will solve a lot of problems since my pose folder is quite full, thanks for the idea Jaager, I'll be moving all my mat and other custom poses to the face directory.

Attached Link: http://www.nerd.com

I've been performing in depth expiriments along this line. The only glich I can't seem to workout is this (Let me see if I can explain this in less than 10,000 words)

I've created a re-jointed Posette (Pretty good I think) trouble is, as usual all the clothing won't fit. I think, "I'll hack a cr2 into a pz2!" This works fine, except for the last joint on a limb. If the clothing has chest, collar, shldr, foreArm. The applied Joint setup Pose kills all the bend channels in the forearm, UNLESS you re-hack the pz2 to not contain any hands. (It is actually the hand related channels in the forearm that are messing things up.)

I've examined the CR2 with the broken bend channels till my eyes bugged out. I can't figure out what is broken, but the jointx, jointy, and jointZ channels are messed up some way so that the JE shows no channels and the figure no longer bends at that joint.

This is all fine for expert consumption, Just start with a all parts included CR2 and hack off the parts you don't need. I was hoping to release this as a freebie, but I'll be supporting it till !!@4 freezes over.

How do you convey to the poser newbie that the P4 leotard has Collars, but no shldrs? Use the wrong joint file and the leotard will be wigged out. I've also noticed that applying a joint file with too many parts makes Poser very cranky. Apply that full figure joint file to the bikini and you'll be re-booting in a few minutes. I can't leave out the otherpart_jointZ lines because I've changed fall off zones, angle, every thing. Really weird stuff happens then.

If any body knows a way around this let me know. I'd like to share CaMie and her joint files with everybody.
(This simple trick is turning into a real project)

In the picture notice that CaMie's collar movements effect the chest as they should. Hey, she can even put her hand on top of her head without breaking her collar bone!

Hope this doesn't show up twice, Ren. is slow and flakey for me today, There has been a lot said lately about changing extensions to make files easier to organize, and this is a handy idea -- but with caveats. Files with the "wrong" information in them for their extensions will break CR2Edit and utilities that don't use hundreds of lines of code in extra error checking. If such files are distributed, the problem is compounded. Further, we are all hoping for and even expecting that Poser5 will include a new library system, and since this would involve a major rewrite, it wouldn't be surprising to me to see a lot of error checking dropped in favor of stricter file format rules. Go ahead and change the extensions, it certainly does make things easier, but I would highly recommend keeping the original extension in the new name, as in NewHair_pp2.cr2 or something similar. Then you can always rename if you want to distribute the file, or if it turns out Poser5 spits out a file that claims to be a cr2/whatever when it is actually a pp2/whatever. The latest build of CR2Edit helps to keep things organized by inserting comment lines into the PZ2 files it makes, listing the file it is intended to be used on, the body parts effected, number of materials effected, etc. There is a reader for these lines built into CR2Edit, and they are easily read in any text editor. While on the subject of formatting text files: it matters. Five spaces is not the same as a tab character. Putting a "{" for a line when it should be a tab plus the "{" matters. For many tools these things matter to CR2Edit, they may matter a lot to Poser5, and they matter to Poser4 in certain circumstances. I have had files sent to me that looked perfect, but wouldn't run in Poser. With a lot of find/replace of spaces and tabs, it would run. I don't know which lines matter or why, but somewhere, at least one of them does. So if you are hand-hacking Poser files, preserve the formatting, for your own sanity, because sooner or later you will wind up scratching your head over why a file doesn't work. Changing geometry with a PZ2 file: in a sense, this can be done with subdividing MAT file which references an alternate geometry. The ability to automatically create both standard and external obj types is included in the latest build of CR2Edit, as is scaling PZ2 files. Last night I added the JP switching type that started this thread, with your choice of body parts and X, Y and/or Z channels included. Nerd, that is the first time I have ever seen Posette toss a salute without getting a greenstick fracture of the collarbone, wonderful work! I agree that this sort of PZ2 file can be very dangerous in the hands of someone who doesn't understand what it does. Readmes are, of course, never read (I don't know how many times I've answered a support letter for CR2Edit with "As stated in line 2 of the ReadMeFirst...") Putting the needed info as to what it is to be used on and under what circumstances in the name of the file could quickly get cumbersome, to say the least, and unreadable in the Poser library list. This info is in CR2Edit-created PZ2 files, but that is even less accessible than a readme. If you decide to distribute your CaMie, I guess the best you could do would be put up an explanation in the download area, and put something in the ReadMe to the effect that you are using these files at your own risk; there is no support beyond the info on the website. But you'd still get email, I'm sure, "Hey, I put yer CaMie joint thingy on the Poser Rattlesnake and he killed my Poser!" Regards, Dan http://www.zenwareonline.com/cr2edit/cr2edit.html Sorry Win only for software http://www.zenwareonline.com for ZenPaint, ZenTile, ZenGrid and VueMaster

Dan, re: tab v.s. spaces - way back when it was DOS only and I was using WordPerfect, I could do - reveal codes - and see spaces and tabs. The text editors that I use now? I don't know how to get this level of information - Soooo - in Poser - is it tabs, ot is it spaces? if tabs, how many spaces per tab? Paul, I'm not sure I understand. My guess if you are using a pz2, you must be using it to batch convert P4 clothing to have the same JP settings as your new figure. Looking for a simple way to do all clothing - for full utility of your new figure. Most Zygote clothing seems to have an additional group at the end of every IK chain - that is there, but not a part of the clothing - it drags the inner parts on poses. If you apply a JNT pose file with the altered JP settings, and the JP it alters is also those in these target groups, things go - boom. ??? If you leave the JP in the target groups alone, is it then OK? If this is so, you would need a series of JNT pose files - each one more group out the IK chain and a user would need to know which JNT pose was appropriate for which clothing prop? So that the target group is left intact? Education problems??!!! Things in Poser must be getting really interesting for beginners and duffers.

There are only tabs before the first word on any line in a Poser file except one -- it slips my mind which one, but it drove me nuts for a while, there are three tabs, then a single space, then the word/number. I suspect it was a slip of the programmer's finger that wasn't discovered until too late, because it is locked into all CR2/PZ3 files. On the other hand, it could be there as a marker for finding the info on that line in a hurry, Poser would scan lines and only have to parse each one until it came to a letter, then move to the next, until it found a space before a letter (or number). If it IS a marker, this illustrates the danger of not following formatting. I just remembered, its in the parent lines of the welds and par/child sections. CR2Edit doesn't use the trick of looking for a space because there are too many hacked files out there that may not follow the formatting. I've never tried leaving out the space, but if it IS a marker, leaving it out would either crash Poser or slow it down, since if there was an error handler it would have to re-parse the file to find the info the long way. CR2Edit does use a lot of tricks like this to speed things up, if it is working in the channels, say, and finds three tabs and a "}" it knows it's reached the end of the section and can immediately jump to the next part of the task. I have handling code to take care of most improperly formatted files, but these files are slower to work with -- which probably means they are slower in Poser, as well, since any programmer concerned with speed will use tricks like this, and remember that the Poser code for processing a file was written many years ago, long before anyone dreamed people would be making their own files. It really makes me wonder how many of the problems people have with Poser going slow and crashing have to do with "little" things like this. To tell if it is a tab or a space, just set your cursor at the start of a line and hit the right arrow key, it will move either one space if the hidden character is a space, or 5 if it is a tab. If you have to make a file by hand, or edit one for experimenting, just start with a Poser or CR2Edit-made one and follow that formatting, copy/cut/paste will preserve the tabs. This whole JNT file thing sure does look like a can of worms, for sure! Dan http://www.zenwareonline.com/cr2edit/cr2edit.html Sorry Win only for software http://www.zenwareonline.com for ZenPaint, ZenTile, ZenGrid and VueMaster

Jaager, if you build a "JNT" file with the same number of parts as the target figure it works perfectly. I saved some CR2's with the "JNT" poses and then examined the CR2 VERY carefully. It looked exactly as if it had been done the right (hard) way. So technically, no it wont go boom if the figure has the extra hidden body part. The boom happens when the JNT file has extra parts. Then it fries the loaded figure, and makes Poser weird until it is restarted. I don't think I'm going to find a way around this so If CaMie (Maybe I should call her ERiCa since we've renamed this technology) ever gets released it will be with one of the longest readme files in history. I'll probably password the zip and make people actually read the readme to get the password. There will need to be a pose file for every common combination of hip/ ab/ chest/ collar/ shldr/ foreArm/ hand/ neck/ head... Yikes I'm not sure it's worth it. Then there are weird figures like my Taarna shoulder pad, I only has one side. I was really hoping there was one line in the otherpart_jount(xyz) cahnnels that was causing the trouble, but I think it is the presence of the channel in general. So are we calling them "Joint" files? An asside, I've found that the order that certain things appear in a Poser file can effect how things work. Example... I wanted to add an extra part to an existing conforming figure. The trouble was Poser kept trying to make the flaps I added conform when it shouldn't. I discovered that the extra part needed to go last in the weld and add child lines, then Poser would leave it alone. To address this problem, I tried moving the other_joint(xyz) lines later in the channels, fried the file. The order the channels appear seems to matter.

Paul, Sounds like I got what you were saying in general. Quick and dirty would be nice, but I think most of this will need to be one off, as far as pose files go. If this were a union shop, this would be great = job security. No mass production. I don't know about "we" calling them "Joint" poses, but I do. As it now stands: MAT = materials POS = pose or position MOR = morphs I have two more: MOR donor = substitutes actual morph deltas in a existing morph JNT = joint - for everything else - joint limits, JP, scaling, trans, alter rate or rate signs in JCM - the housekeeping stuff. I called the tmech scaling and fix the fingers and reverse gravity effects in JCM = JNT pose files. It just makes explaining it easier if there is some basic understanding about nomenclature. But we are not close on this yet. One danger in this - it suugests that the functions are separate - and they are not. One pose file can include all of these functions. MAP = what? A typo that was supposed to be MAT?

One possible way ... ( won't require custom pose files ) 1 . A collapse gimbals function - to remove the scaling and rotation joint info on a cr2 file - this needs to be propagated down the hierarchy tree ... taking into consideration 'Actor' orientations, axis rotations and transformations . 2. A map gimbals function beteween two cr2 files - where joint data from a figure's cr2 file can be mapped to its conforming clothes cr2 file . nb Unfortunately the joint info is all over the shop in a cr2 file so it 'll take some under the hood hacking . Would such a utility be worth purchasing in the marketplace ?

Why do I suddenly get the feeling that this conversation has gone way over my head?! Maybe I'd better just try to remap the Linlin character to accept Vicky maps as I'm more confident in uvmapper :) On a serious note though, I've learned more about the inner workings of Poser files hanging out here for a few days than I did in the two years I spent in Poser forum!

Poser files are nothing but text files, of course, and parsing and manipulating data is what computers excel at, you could even say that that is ALL they do. Anything you can do to a highly-structured file like a CR2 can be automated, and nearly everything Dean mentions has already been automated, to the point where a PZ2 file can be created in seconds, half a dozen can be made before you can scroll to the lines needed to make one in a text editor -- especially with something like a 20MB Vicki file (which will be considered small in a year or so). I remember the discussion of MOR donor files a while back, but since I have never heard of anyone actually using one in a released form, I haven't bothered to automate it. I feel the whole JNT thing will be the same; interesting, but not used in the real world. I added it to CR2Edit the other night because I found the idea intriguing, not because I thought anyone would actually use much of it in the near future. Changing ERC ratios, on the other hand, is something done a lot while testing new ERC, and so it has its own window in order to be able to do it without other tools cluttering things up. Yes, you can fold PZ2 files together, but if they are to be realistically useful you need to have what they do in the title, and would quickly exceed the 256 character limit. MAP = swapping out maps, combined with MAT file creation in CR2Edit because the two go hand in hand. Transferring joint parameters between files has been possible in CR2Edit for over two years, and has been used by hundreds of users to create clothing, it is so commonly used that it has its own icon on the main screen, rather than buried in the menus. However, it is easier to do most of the work with the newer Make Master CR2 tool, which can create a stripped file from any CR2 (not just the catsuit). Then, in many cases, all you need to do is repoint the OBJ (click on it in the main window and browse to its location) Dan http://members.fortunecity.com/dwilmes/bump/texbump.html for WW tex and bump maps http://www.neca.com/~dwilmes/gallery/pics.html

Dan, I know its frustrating. I am just used to doing this in EditPad. A CR2 is familiar territory now. I had to climb a curve, but having done so, it is the way that I know.

Actually, a combined pose file need only have a character's name. It is not necessary to list the traits in the title.
The real use I see is to define a character.

The JCM rate change poses are because I have about seven collar morphs that each need to be fine tuned to either positive or negative depending on the location of the figure in space. And it can be only one, or two that need to be reversed. With a pair of pose files for each JCM I can easily fine tune a pose.

I am having a difficult time generating much interest in MOR donor pose files. Sometimes, I think my vision of this is actually an hallucination.

There are a couple or three others who are starting to use them. The way they are using them is transparent to a user. It is with V2 characters - head morphs so far. The characters involve both V2 and non-v2 morphs. The latter are combined into a single morph. You get a face pose (.fc2) just as you would from DAZ, except, for one of the V2 morphs (Fox, Hag or Monkey -usually), instead of k 0 0.255 being transfered, the entire combined morph is. No one has to apply an outside morph in Poser, or from a carrier in MM4 or supply the character as a CR2, which is 3-4 times larger at least and usually fouls up Materials. The outside morph comes in as easily as the new dial settings. It is just a Big complex dial setting. It can be more than one outside morph (but I don't see why it would be.) If the character needs the eyes moved, this can be in there.

I tried to get this introduced through Blackhearted's Angelyna submission, but no go. This one has a combined morph for every body part, except hands. It would have been nice to set it up in a transparent way. But, it is V1. V1 has no morphs for forearms, feet or toes. I have morphs for every body part that can be used to accept the transfered morphs. In themselves, my morphs are just a name and text - no deltas. Their only function is to act as a host (receptacle) for morph deltas transfered from a pose file. If a cr2 has these morphs, then a pose file could transfer a full morph defined character - with a single click. (individual scaling, eye location, whatever can go at the same time.)

Lets say you have collected some face morphs: Veth, Sugar, Angel, Buffy .. You either have them on a CR2 making it huge, not knowing what a face looks like. Or as loose morphs waiting for you to apply in Poser when you get around to it, and again, you don't know what it looks like.
Now, suppose, you have each of these morphs set up as Veth.fc2, Sugar.fc2 .. and each with an rsr that shows what it looks like. The c2 you use it on is small. Instead of a 20 meg V2, it is a 5 meg Vic, with only expression morphs, and joint fixes (and JCM if you are of a mind) - plus each group has one more morph. It is empty, its only function is to recieve transfered morphs. ( With me, it is Body on every group but Head, on the head it is Faces.)
Every fc2 file, if you looked inside - would have the name: targetGeom Faces ... Veth.fc2 - is individual, except it is called targetGeom Faces. Sugar.fc2 is individual, except it is called targetGeom Faces.

If you do this, click Veth.fc2 - bang - the figure has Veth's face, click Sugar.fc2 and it has Sugar's face. I have over a hundred character faces set up like this. I have over thirty full body characters set up like this. You what Sugar's face on Veth's body? One click.

None of the faces or bodies are mine, so I cannot share them. A lot are V2, so each user would need to make a combined morph for each body group involved, transfer the morphs to a stripped cr2 and convert it to an fc2 or pz2. The targetGeom changed to Body, or Faces. It is not hard to do.
I will let anyone host, share the morph carrier with the Blank (host) morphs Body and Faces.
These same Blank morphs can be converted to P4, Mike, Dork.
The line = numbVerts - must have the value that corresponds to its group on any particular figure.

Generating interest in this has been like trying to push a 50 ton boulder. I'll be quiet now.

Sorry Kalypso, You just happened to hit on something I and obviously a group of other Poser heads have been fooling with lately. What you want to do is very possible, just a little complex right now. As Dan Wilmes said, he has a commercial tool to do this right now. I suspect he will be writing an addition to this tool (Probably furiously coding right now) that will move the joints whole sale. Presently it just moves them one joint at a time. Which is still a heluva lot easier than setting all the centers, orientations and zones manually. As we Poserly types toss this around, a better solution may come out of our technical ranting. A year ago a protracted technical tirade like this produced the technique known as ERC now. That was Robert Whisenant and I, and Dan produced his CR2Edit to embrace the tricks we figured out. EMC, REC, JCM, whatever you call it is pretty main stream now. Maybe we can figure out a way to stream line JNT, MAT, MOR files for public consumption. Until a new version of poser comes along these files will require an expert to hack them. FYI, I'm gunna release CaMie, probably with a better name. She will include JNT files to apply to the bulk of clothing that is out there. I think she is the best jointed Poser figure ever, yes better than Vicki. She can kneel, salute, scratch her butt, sit, do the splits and look more or less like a human with no dislocated joints or broken bones when she does it. There will be clothing items that don't work. The P4 Leotard is a piece of junk as a conforming figure goes. Ever notice it is bent in a weird pose before it is conformed? That's because it's not built right. I has to few body parts to conform really well. Same with the Formal Dress. They need head and shlder parts to work right. I may include new CR2's for these figures. If I do this will be a store item, but it will be cheap. A poor Posers Vicki. Maybe 5 or 10 bucks for a Posette that poses as good or better than Vicki, and a whole bunch of clothes for her. Plus she can be fitted with nearly all the existing P4 clothes and morphs. See, I did it again. Off in la-la land.

One thing about JNT poses: there are POS poses - rotation settings that are extreme. The stock JP do not fit right. It is possible to adjust the JP settings to clean it up? If so, rather than doing this by hand, these altered JP settings can be a part of the actual pose. The problem? turning it off and getting back to default JP for another pose. I see two ways, JP settings in every pose - madness A separate JNT pose file that resets the JP to default. Just a thought.

... Or just reload the figure from the library. I like the idea of throwing a few JP's into an extreme pose. I can see that happening easily.

Dean, I'm with you on using the tools you are comfortable with, and EditPad is the best plaintext editor out there. But I also like speed, which is gained by using a tool tailored to a job. The manual editor in the latest version of CR2Edit has 2 panes, line numbers (that you can go instantly to), doubleclicking in a file will tell you what body part you are in (all those JP channels look SO much alike), you can click on a body part in a list and go instantly to it... The average user has no need to ever go near the editor, since just about everything that can done with a Poser file is automated, but for Posergeeks like us... Your explanation of MOR donor files is far more exciting than I remembered from the long-ago post, or I never went back to see more. I will look into adding it to the present MOR file creation window, and hope that it catches on. But don't lose heart, remember how long it took for even the simplest ERC to catch on, despite Nerd's best efforts to publicize with the EMC Haltertop and the wonderful whirling Posette, and my efforts to convince the unwashed hordes that yes, you too can do this, with just a few clicks -- well, the haltertop, anyway, LOL! Nerd, transferring multiple JP's would be simple enough to add, just some mods to the code that transfers multiple morphs, but I think I'll wait until we see what settles out with this JNT file thing, since an easily-reversible way of doing it would be better. CR2Edit will already make all the types of PZ2 files you mention plus a number of others, the problem lies in educating people about WHY you would make these files, especially these newer types. If Posergeeks are just starting to get a grip on the concepts, newbies will be lost, and wind up making JNT files that apply the horse's hoof parameters to Posette and wondering why she only whinnies in Mimic. Yes, I like the JP thing in a standard pose file (one that actually does pose the figure, imagine that, LOL!), if you know that the figure is going to break without the changes. What is nice is that it would indeed be transparent to the user. Nerd, from the description of CaMie's capabilities, it sounds like she will be VERY popular with the Renderotica crowd! Dan http://www.zenwareonline.com/cr2edit/cr2edit.html Sorry Win only for software http://www.zenwareonline.com for ZenPaint, ZenTile, ZenGrid and VueMaster

Kalypso- Over my head too, but as I read your original message you just wanted to use a new (remapped) OBJ file with your custom CR2, and the materials were messed up because of the different names? You should be able to just point your CR2 to the new obj, with all the current materials deleted (they are at the very end, as I'm sure you know), when you open it Poser will recreate all the materals that are in the new obj, just reset them and resave the set. Or am I missing some other problem?

Dan, thanks, I was getting close to giving up. Jim, How would you like to see a SMV morphs that would pop in and out of a standard Vicki with any JP settings that are altered going with her? Maybe, if you see what you start with and what this is with your own stuff (in EditPad) it will be clear just what is involved. The explanation is opaque, not the technique.

Jim for some reason it's not that easy. I do edit the cr2 to point to the new .obj but because it's AprilSYH's new Posetter mapped to take Vicki maps something is happening with the material names since Posette doesn't have separate materials for Head Skin and Body Skin. Assigning these materials in Poser via the grouping tool did not work. Anyway, now I'm trying to learn more about editing my own pose files to make life easier but it's having the opposite result :) Here's my latest fiasco. I wanted to retain scaling information (figured I'd better get the hang of that first and then move on to JP's)only on the body, hip, abdomen and head. Here's what I did { version { number 4.01 } actor BODY:1 { channels { propagatingScaleY yScale { keys { k 0 0.92 } } } } actor hip:1 { channels { scaleX xScale { keys { k 0 0.98 } } } } actor abdomen:1 { channels { scaleX xScale { keys { k 0 0.95 } { scaleY yScale { keys { k 0 0.95 } } } } actor head:1 { channels { scaleX xScale { keys { k 0 0.97 } { scaleY yScale { keys { k 0 1.05 } } } } } Problem is it only affects the body, hip and abdomen. For some reason the head remains unaffected. I checked and double checked to see if I had it locked but it wasn't. No matter how many times I looked through it I can't see anything wrong, in fact I've compared the abdomen (since that affects x and y scaling just like the head ) to it and it looks the same, can it be like one line messing it all up? Would some kind soul copy and try this out please??

Nerd, I just reread the thread and I must not have seen yours before. A newly-jointed Posette will be heaven -sent! Please, though, include cr2's that we can use as bases to point to any clothing item and also don't forget shoes and boots (with shin and thigh parts). This whole matter is taking on Great Unified Theory porportions but I see it as feasible considering what Poser users were doing 2 years ago and how far it's come since then. And Jaager, your MOR donor poser files is probably the only way to go from here on. True Poser no longer has the morph limit but waiting for my fully-loaded-with-morphs character to load is sheer hell. I would continue educating the masses :) as I'm sure that most casual users haven't even fully grasped what that would mean. I would definitely like to be able to do the same set up in my library. Any chance of your doing a tutorial or something?

ok, sorry for all this posting , but looking up at my message with the pose file I see that all lines are starting on the left. Aren't the indentations carried over when I copy paste from Wordpad? I don't want you to think I've been making the pose files like that LOL.

i'm way over my head here, i only clicked in cos this topic kept getting added to so i was wondering what it was about... and still don't get it about these jp things! but anyway, i downloaded linlin, loaded her pz3, saved her as a figure (cr2) opened it in my text editor, put in P4Vskin.obj where there's P4NudeWom.obj, cut out the material settings at the bottom and replaced with the material settings from P4Vskin.cr2, saved it as linlin2, and loaded it... and she came out alright as above. now i don't know if saving her as a cr2 in the first place saved all that jp stuff you love about her though!!! the cr2 i saved from the pz3 is 4,002kb and the cr2 after text editing is 3,998kb ... if that helps. *wanders off wondering about "jp stuff"*

Actually, I do sort of halfway understand this, I'll have to try it for myself to fully see how it works, just like geomety switching and alternate geoometry, I didn't see how it worked until I actually used it, on the mermaids Kalypso- just have you tried opening your new CR2 in Poser and resaving it? The materials will not be correct until you do that. I use "borrowed" CR2s all the time, dozens, maybe hundreds of them - they all use different materials. I have Vickie CR2 (actually SMV), for example, with all morphs and materials stripped out, I use that as a starting point for many clothing items, I just delete th ebody parts I don't need, and modify the parenting.

Kalypso, Your scaling? first, as pointed out by Mason, the only scaling you should use on Body is 'scale'. At this level what is X, Y, Z is determined by Universe, not the figure. If you do a Yscale and rotate the figure laterally, what is Y scaled is still in the up/down direction. On individual body parts, Y scale on central body groups and X scale on arms as well as scale itself -if uniform - but be careful with scaling in directions that impact at a seam. If the guy on the other side is unaltered there can be problems. Is LinLin P4 or Eve? If it is P4 and all April has done, is remap, then using her geometry with LinLin should be as easy as changing two lines in the CR2. Even if you do not delete the Materials section, the legacy materials should go to the bottom of the stack and the valid ones go to the top. You just ignore the ones that no longer apply. (Although Poser will add any new materials it finds in a geometry (usemtl ___) - they forgot to include a function to delete existing ones that are not in the geometry. As far as Poser itself, once a material is in a CR2, it stays forever. You have to remove it, if it bugs you.

LinLin is P4 with a ton of embedded geometry. The fastest way to get rid of the spare materials (and put in the ones from the obj)is, before even opening in Poser, click Coordinate Materials in CR2Edit. Handy for instantly fixing the Nipple/Nipples ones in Posette, and the infamous Souls... Dan http://www.zenwareonline.com/cr2edit/cr2edit.html Sorry Win only for software http://www.zenwareonline.com for ZenPaint, ZenTile, ZenGrid and VueMaster

Thanks everybody, it seems my mistake was that I tried to assign the materials from withing Poser using the grouping tool. I did edit the cr2 to point to the new geometry but didn't add the new materials like you did April,though it sounds perfectly logical the way you did it and if anyone's way over their head in here it's me :) ) but, now I'm hooked on playing around with these pose files! Jaager, I see your point now and my original intent was to shorten the figure so no need to x scale since any shaping can be taken care of morphs. Of course Poser 5 may come out soon and do everything automatically (!) but I doubt it :)

just ducked in to thank you for pointing out linlin, she could be my next fave character now... she looks lovely in my free east skin :D (above is the low res version only)