Scotttucker you have said exactly what I feel for this program. Before I joined this forum I was really just pottering about with Bryce but here I've been pushed, cajoled, and manipulated into seeing the possibilities of Bryce and I love it. I rejoice in this community and the excitement of discovery experienced by all of us when we learn to do something new. Bryce is a major part of my working life now and I can't see that changing no matter what happens at Coral, I just find it sad that the core programming of Bryce may never advance to the higher level I think could be achieved with it. I guess if Bryce is to advance it would have to be taken on by someone who sees it as a labour of love and saddly I don't think there is anyone with the resourses and ability to take Bryce on who has that kind of feeling for it. Catlin

Kind of figured this might be coming. Sad. Remember all the discussions about who would buy Bryce when MC self destructed? here we go again. . . Maybe Bryce is a bit creaky under the hood code wise, it is quite old and maybe it would have cost too much to bring properly up to date. (that never stopped Microsoft though did it?) i still love it for its possibilities and its interface. Not to mention the great community round this app. i have so many email friends and aquaintances worldwide simply because of Bryce. I think the community would still exist without a new Bryce but without new purchasers it would get a bit insular perhaps? Eric Wenger would make it mac only if he got it in all probablity, not that he's that interested. Mo Musgrave has got quite enough to do right now as it is with MJW. Dunno, Eovia ? They bought Carrara. I think Corel blew it with B5 not offering quite enough in the way of new features, at least ones that those with slow computers could use, and then the market went into freefall and bryce didn't fit in to any corperate plan any more. Sad sad sad. . . . I'm still making mats though as long as anyone wants them. . . ;-) Jonathan

I for one am anxious to see what Corel has to say,And yes we could get the 2 million and if it came from Microsoft I wouldnt complain....IF....The right folks were put in charge,like Doc and Eric or even if every user of Bryce gave 5$ we would have more then enough to buy the Proggy rights...BUT then you would have all of us who would want a say and that wont work,we would need certain folks in Charge...OH heck here you go...If all of the past buyers(Several Hundred Thousand according to Corel) put up 5$ they would get a confirmation code in the Mail that would give them 50$ off the price of either the upgrade or the full product for Bryce6,And this would let us work on the code to implement Poser Animations and also let us work on Exporting whole scenes from other programs into Bryce...IE Poser Animations.....Also recodeing Bryce might be an option if we get the rights,this way we would be able to implement most everything Bryce users want...I for one will send the Money....I will start hitting all of the heavy hitters in town and see what can happen...

This is an idea that lots of folk would like to see but as ever it depends on so many factors coming together and working. 1.we need the financing be it corporate or a hat collection among Brycers, (maybe some Posers too). 2.we need someone who will look after the funds and coordinating the purchase of the Bryce code, someone trustworthy. 3.we need to find the programmers who have the skills and are willing to modify the code for love and not for money. 4.we need to know what folk would like to see in a new Bryce and decide what is possible. and there are many more posibilities to take into consideration before we get off the starting line. Who knows for sure what is possible but there is a lot of talent here and people who work in many areas of business who could perhaps be encouraged to get together and make this a reality. Catlin

Lets get a bit more realistic...I seriously doubt Renderosity, 3DWorld and Computer Arts have anywhere near 100k per month in printings, heck, probably far less. (versus millions). I also doubt that there is even 50k users still using Bryce. Most people probably bought 4, used it, and a small percentage bought 5. I bet you would be lucky to even FIND ten thousand Bryce users let alone get them to donate $100+. Maybe some of the users here should get together and work with Doc, Eric & Corel to make a few plugins or stand alone programs to export terrains and models. Sell that on Renderosity and see if you have any buyers. If only a couple hundred buy it then sadly, Bryce will die. I would love to see a Bryce 6 too, but I'm a developer (ColdFusion & Flash) and I can tell you that development costs are far higher than most anticipate, take far longer, and tend to fail far more often than all would like. For all of you saying how much farther you have pushed Bryce than was ever anticipated...maybe Bryce should die a sweet death...consider spending your hard earned $ on a product with a larger user based and more refined code. Imagine what the true artists in all of you could do with a Lightwave, 3D Max, Maya, etc!!! If you think you are making Bryce sing, imagine using something far more powerful. Sure, it costs a lot, but it might be worth it.

I already tried Lightwave and half a dozen other "hi-end" 3D programs and they basically suck. The most basic features are implemented in an unnecessarily complex fashion. Put another way, they are poorly thought out and hard to use. It's like getting a new 900 hp super car with every luxury imaginable, but you need a week to find the steering wheel and a year to figure out how to drive it to the grocery store. Power and features do not justify a poor interface.

...OR, it might not! I can only speak for myself, but as a hobbyist, $2000-5000 is a shitload of money to spend on a single app. Some nice plugins, another ?K! I think that people that in the end chooses Bryce, does this because its cheap, its fun and easy to use but also because it CAN produce high quality renders once youve learned it well enough! It might take longer to do some stuff in Bryce, but that doesnt mean its impossible. You can model most stuff with primitives and metaballs, lighting can be faked etc. For me personally, one of the most important factors is to have fun, and out of all the trials and apps, ive tested, Bryce is the only one that really puts a smile on my face! No offence meant Hartwichr, this is just my personal thoughts. :)

Do I smell a Cross Program Challenge?Lets Rock and Roll....Time to play again....

3D Studio is a great application with many bells and whistles with a fairly large learning curve attached to it. I've used it for many years with a fair amount of success. Yes, very expensive and the better plug-ins go for an arm and a leg. The problem I have with 3D Studio is that to create a landscape scene, for instance, you have to walk around the corner over the hill and through the pond instead of just having to go across the street which is what Bryce offers the user right out of the box. And if you just want to create landscapes or seascapes, some still life and indoor scenes why should you be forced to shell out thousands of dollars when Bryce can offer you that with the ease of a finger touch away and at a fraction of the price? Bryce is the software package that broke ground and inspired others to mimic its essence and launched other copycat packages into existence.

I can't say that this is was a surprise to me - from metacreations, an off the wall, out there, and ingenious company to...well...Corel! - didn't think it would work, and Bryce 5 kinda proved it. Here's the good news - You still have Bryce 4 & 5, they'll never get faster at rendering (other than with better processors), but they'll still work as they ever did - so no actual loss there! Sure, somebody paying attention, ironing out bugs, and actually trying to make it better would be ideal, but that requires a company with vision, creativity OR previous experience with this market. I for one wont stop using Bryce, it's still my favourite app for 3D image creation, but equally, once you have learned enough to realise it's real limitations, and see how much better it CAN be elsewhere, Bryce may start to become a warm fuzzy memory! :)

Righttttt.I still have yet to find a program that actually does it all like Bryce,The only real things Bryce needed to stay in the main stream was OBJ export and Animation import...The Partical system I have done works fairly well and I am always trying to find ways to make it work better...AS for Bryce becoming a FUZZY memory...Wont happen because I will always use Bryce at leaste for its Material and DTE not to mention the ability to export Landscapes into other 3D programs....Like Lightwave,Max,Imagine,and of course MAYA....

Brian - I wasn't playing down the merits of Bryce - I am one of the first to shout at those that pull it down - and I have always agreed that 'it's not the tools - it's the craftsman' - as I said - I will always use Bryce for both illustration and landscape creation, because I am so comfortable with it, and can get results fast. I also know what I have to consider or compensate for with it, but what I meant was, a lot of the things people want from Bryce develpment will most likely never see fruition, and are done much better elsewhere anyway! I always wished I could export models out of it after the hours I spent making grouped booleans etc, but at the end of the day - Bryce is not a modeller as such, and once you use another package, be it LW, Max, Cinema, Rhino etc, you obviously realise how much more powerful and easier it is to create meshes outside, and import them in to Bryce scenes. Render times will always be my only 'real' issue with Bryce, especially if you want the benefit of global light or soft shadows - something that can take only minutes in other renderers like Cinema etc. I hope, as mentioned elsewhere, Pandromeda or someone with equal ingenuity take it under their wings and give it the respect and development it deserves, but even if they dont, it will still exist and work the way it always does! - I still have my 14 year old Airbrush and compressor - they are the same reliable tools they ever were! :)

I believe I will always use Bryce, but I said the same thing about VistaPro4, and now I can't even remember where I placed those 2 CDs. Shame on Corel! Fernando

CHRIST ON A BIKE! I have only been using Bryce about a year so I am a relative newcomer to digital art, and now those bastards at corel crap are yanking the rug from under me and thousands of others. I guess they are distincly unfamiliar with terms like "user base, support community and loyal users" Back stabbing shitkickers! I feel gutted by this news. I hope they all rot in linux hell. Bryce has always offered maximum pleasure and satisfaction for beginners and experts alike, that has always been a part of its attration and its strengths unlike others apps. I've tried fiddly 3D max, Mucked about with maya and had the Vue from the bridge of eons nice app, but bryce always brings home the bacon. The price was right, the interface was great, the varid quality of the software shone through and not to mention the communities out there that love it. What can you say.... Corel, if you murder bryce we'll hate you forever. Think about it.

Yes I know what you mean Kromekat I use Truespace for all of my Modeling now and I will move on to MAYA as soon as I can get the money saved up...I love the way I can set up a scene in another program and then Import into Bryce to use the Lighting and the Texture Editor not too mention the Lanscapeing abilities...So on and upward while still useing Bryce...

This is turning into one hell of a debate. For me, if it was not for Bryce I would never have bought Rhino. I never thought I could model anything but then Bryce showed me otherwise. This warm, fuzzy memory thing is true, if Corel drops Bryce we will always have the tools as they stand now and look at the joy that gives us all. But one day we will have computers that will turn round and say "what is that" and won't be able to run it. Well I guess for real world work other apps will do a bettr job in some areas but I still come back to Bryce for lots of things I can't do effectively elsewhere. Cat

Well I'm a former Bryce owner, now Vue owner, but...this news saddens me. I'm sorry to hear this, but never liked Corel anyway; the first time I had a software problem it took 6 months of constant emails to get a proper reply, and then their suggestion did not work :o( Before I forget...I keep seeing people mention that people will always use Bryce 4 or 5 while they have their installation CD's. I think you'll find that newer Operating Systems (especially Windows) will be moving to 64bit, and I'm not sure how compatability will effect older programs. I do hope someone does come in to save Bryce, then I may start using it again :o) Cheers

Maybe one day someone will make an emulater for it..........8) Cat

Compability is one future problem, you are correct! However, theres nothing that prevents you to have 2 separate operatives in one machine. One new, and one older one!

Old machines become renderfarm slaves and bridges to old technology. I still have on old souped-up Powermac 9600 (g4 upgrade card) that runs the old OS and a UMAX SCSI scanner. That thing will run old versions of Bryce for awhile, and it is still a useful machine ; ) Scott

That makes me feel a whole lot better. I have a whole load of parts to make all sorts of basic machines and it's good to know that as computer technology advances into the unknown my old, old, ancient (said with a shakey old voice), Bryce will still be around to amuse/bemuse the grandchildren. :) Cat

Here is a little bedtime horror story I intend to email to Corel. One day poor little Bryce was out in the cold looking for a place to stay, when along came the corporate monster, Corel who took Bryce in. Bryce was a little unsure of its new host as it had heard horrid tales, but it was a port in a storm so had to risk it. All seemed peachy and well. Bryce was allowed a small growth spurt by the monster and the future seemed okay if not a little ambiguous. Then one dark day the monster, Corel, was checking over its ledger of blood and was amazed by how much red blood there was on the books, The monster had been a little too divergent in its eating practices so decided something drastic must be done to get the books out of the red. The monster had a long conference with itself which involved plotting poor Bryces murder and plenty of self-congratulation. After the meeting the monster, Corel, called Bryce over to it. The monster made small gestures of concern and affection for Bryce and waited for the right moment. Then suddenly and with neither provocation nor warning, the monster plunged a knife into Bryces back and twisted. Shock! Poor Bryce was defenceless against such a large, ugly monster, and promptly fell to the ground mortally injured. The monster was quite smug and self-satisfied with its work. It shoved Bryce in a small, dark corner and said nothing of the incident to anyone. A few weeks went by and the monster finally began to indicate to the outside world that poor Bryce was very sick and may soon pass from sight from its beloved users and fans. After that, people were shocked to their very cores by poor Bryces demise. They wept, got angry and even looked longingly at other 3D apps until they came to their senses. They needed to know how this had happened. Surely the monster had promised to look after poor Bryce when it had invited it in? Slowly but surely, the real story of what had befallen Bryce began to leak out. The monster, Corel, had enemies from within and they did not like what had happened to their friend, Bryce, and made sure the world knew about it. Once the multitudes of Bryce lovers, enthusiasts and fans the world over realised the true story of Bryces horrible death, they rose up like a dark army of discontented crows and dumped on Corel the only way they knew how. They never went to the monster again for any of its other crap products nor would they recommend them to anyone. They began to spread the word far and wide that the monster, Corel, was not to be trusted, especially with financial affairs or other software. Who knew who the monster would bump off next? Eventually the monster became thinner and thinner as it tried to clear all that red blood from the books. The lean times set in as former friends and customers stayed away, and eventually the ugly monster, Corel, ceased to exist, disappearing into a puff of smoke up its own backside. Much rejoicing ensued, especially by lovers of Bryce, whom had not forgotten the monsters old treachery THE END.

Three cheers all around for the great story from firewall. So now what?? Back to the land of reality. I recently discovered, over the weekend actually, that one of my friends knows some folk on the developement side of Corel he would be willing to put folk over the coals and get information for us, so if anyone has any specific questions I'll tell him to start the interogation. So what does the forum have for me to ask?, mind you we got to be civilized here.........ok, let the questions roll. :) Cat

I would ask that they simply do the right thing, and hand Bryce over to a youger, creative company whose employees were not just Harvard computer nerds, but artistic nerds that had experimented a little with chemicals, and sat on the top of mountains now and again just saying "wow!....wow!" that might help! :)

We would just like some answers...And as many as Possible...

Had all development of Bryce been stopped? How much was developed for Bryce 6 (i.e. near release)? Has Brian Wagner(B2-B5), Todd Bogdan (B3) and Josh Bates (b4) been let go as "consultants" (the guys that know the most about the Bryce code)? Not a question but a comment - the 3 guys above with John Feld (B3-B4) as Product Manger and Meredith Keiser (B2-B4) in QA would be my Bryce "dream team". As Doc Musgrave once commented about Bryce " the engineers are more valuable than the code itself" Thanks for trying to get this info Cat!

I've had contact with beta-tester for Bryce 6, looks like it was in some level of testing for about 6 months, then Sept 11th happened. AgentSmith

To be honest, I do not think some of these corporate nerds know what they are dealing with. They spend so much time locked up in their ivory towers surrounded by accountants and yes men. They are so far removed from real Bryce lovers and the huge fan base, it would never ever occur to them what they are undertaking in this action. I would like to know if Corel is prepared to move the product on, or merely engage in endless rhetoric about the matter. They are not saying much at the moment, allowing others to draw many meanings from the silence. Are their intentions honest or just driven by a sudden need to placate the voices of discontent? That would be a start at least. If Bryce can be allowed to find a new home and Corel are prepared to signal such, then plans regarding a new buyer will take on more rational solidity.

I can remember only one time that we have ever heard anything from Corel, other than press releases. That was when Renderosity had the "Spotlight with Conan Hunter". And, he himself is a Bryce user/lover, and had great/logical plans for Bryce. He just doesn't hold the reins, is all. I'm not sure even if/when Corel gets back up financially they will want to keep Bryce. The best bet right now, is for another interested party to buy Bryce off of Corel now, as they are financially in the red, to get Bryce for much less. Corel has looked to sell Bryce in such a manner, and there has been interested parties, it just hasn't worked out. Keep your fingers crossed and wait....;o)

I think the people my friend has contact with want to come forward and say what is happenning but cannot openly identify themselves for fear of corporate reaction. This is why they're coming here through me. As is the case in many corporations not all the staff agree with company policy, the same could be said of countries and governments. So if you have legitimate questions I'll ask them on behalf of us Brycers. The more truths we know as a comunity the better position we are in, I think, for doing something positive about it. Wouldn't you agree? Cat

I think the question in general is; has there been any change with the status of Bryce, meaning, Is Corel going to sell? Hold onto? Undecided? Does Corel have ANY thoughts on Bryce at this time? Or, can those questions even be answered at this time? AS

My 2 cents worth: It is almost certain that Bryce is for sale, but my guess is that it will have to be for a considerable sum. While it seems that corel is not spending any time or effort supporting the product, and as we have heard the development and management of the product have gone, then it is languishing. But Corel does need money, but a hundred thousand will not make a huge difference to them. They wil probably need considerably more, (and in US dollars too!). For them to get attorneys and all the legal stuff in gear will cost them a lot, and my guess the only people who can get this together would be Doc Mojo with the help of some deep pockets. It needs real entusiatic management and engineering, with a real marketing savvy. No one will make any money making a version 6 if it does not get a huge audience of first time buyers. Upgrades to us guys will never make enough to make it profitable, unless they cahrge us $200 dollars or something more. So there has to be a way to reach a whole new audience. This will probably mean reworking the application from scratch, with new code and a new interface and somehow making it either dumb enough for a lot of people new to graphics or put some real Web utility into it. Problem is, this is not the Bryce we want for the most part. I do have ideas on how to make it a worthwhile application, as probably do most of you. But it all starts with the money. Consider a years development with about six people: 4 coders, 1 interface person and 1 prod mgr. that is all extra cash needed before any marketing and sales, then the cash will arrive. Maybe what can be done with bryce to make it more mainstream and continue the tradition is worth a new thread? Regards

I think that CG magazines would be interested in this little flurry of the loyal Bryce users up in arms at the possible demise of their fav program. A few interviews with those involved and those interested in purchase and of course the loyal fans would perk the interest in this humble little program or "Bryce the Giantslayer" as we fans call it, introducing a new generation to the Bryce experience. But maybe that kind of move would have to wait until Doc was in a better financial position and Corel more desperate for it to work effectively. Gosh, I think maybe I should go into marketing. 8) Cat

Could go either way. If this was highly publicized, maybe some big company would see that, come along, outdo Doc Mojo, and buy Bryce. Then proceed to screw it up, lol. Maybe Corel would finally see the support for Bryce and decide to not to sell it at all. Ah, Who knows? Either way, I think everyone should know how much of a following Bryce still has. To be honest, I would rather see Doc or even Curious Labs own and further develop Bryce, than anyone else. AgentSmith

Whoa! Johnfeld - nice to see you - haven't seen you since Brycecamp Ojai. For those who don't know John was product manager of Bryce for Metacreations during Bryce4 - and we all know a lot of cool things came out of 4. Nice to hear your take on all this, John. - Scott

AgentSmith, last night I had a look in the Maya forum and as usual with every forum there was a newbe there asking questions. Nothing unusual there I here you say, but the guys in the know all said they had started out with 3D in, go on guess which app, that's right little old Bryce. So there you go, from little acorns sprout mega oaks. 8) TA,DA...........what a great program to start out with too. Cat

Oh, sure, lol. I tell my friends, "start with Bryce, here, sit down, click this click that, now hit the render button" "Wow, COOL!!" (as they render their first chrome sphere, lol.) Bryce gives enough immediate visual results, that people don't get frustrated as quickly, IMO. Instead of their first step in 3D being a 4 hour modeling session ending with a flat 2 color rendering of a hex nut...they get a first step in Bryce in a couple minutes with the old plane of water, chrome sphere, and their choice of sky, voila! A happy face, usually a "COOL!!", and then very quickly on to the second step with the relief of no frusration, just learning with quick visual results. It makes a difference. Bryce, Poser, and similar; lot of 3D for your buck, best way to start, IMO!! AgentSmith

Well I never though I could model to save myself but Bryce made me realise the impossible, sometimes is possible. Now TT and I have been working towards getting Maya and we're close, that's why I popped into their forum. Got to say though that in comparison Maya is like a ghost town with a cold wind running through it, there doesn't seen to be too many people involved there. Which makes me think that it wouldn't matter which other program I get involved with "This Forum" is still the best. Beats the rest of them hands down and that's thanks in a big way to you and Clay so thank you very much for your effort and untempered patience. Cheers and a big hug. Cat 8)

Awww. Thanks so much...and you're welcome. AS

{I would rather see ... Curious Labs own and further develop Bryce,} Eeek - now you are getting desperate!!! {Bryce gives enough immediate visual results, that people don't get frustrated as quickly} Yep - that's exactly what enticed me in, and made the whole thing accessable. {Which makes me think that it wouldn't matter which other program I get involved with "This Forum" is still the best.} Try Cinema 4D and their forum! - I love Bryce for the same reasons everybody else does, and I also feared the higher end apps, until C4D! - plus their forum is full and quite active! :)

Curious Labs : Name any other former MetaCreations product that has done as well as Poser has in CL's hands*. Painter? Also owned by Corel...(at least they're coming out with an update for that...) (*That's the one thought that makes me think of Curious Labs owning Bryce) C4D, seriously considering making this my leap into the higher-end world. AS

Ok fair point there AS! - but equally, what DID CL do with Poser? - poser 4.03 was the last Metacreations version - then we had the ProPack plugin from CL, but then...5 - and that looks to have been a disaster really, so it's not like they took it a great deal further!? yes - C4D (IMO) has the most approachable interface to go with it's amazing toolset. Couple that with the fact that it's the fastest (and one of the nicest in it's league IMO) renderers, and you'll be away with the fairies! :)

Just a thought: What about the folks at World Builder combining their product with Bryce? I know that we (Bryce team at Meta) always had respect for what thos guys were doing, and World Builder 3.5 has some dynamite features I would live to see in Bryce.

From my experience Worldbuilder is very pewerful and advanced, but using its interface is a genuine nightmare from hell. Now if we had the power of Worldbuilder and C4D added to Bryce... that would be something dreams are made of.

The thing about bryce as mentioned here, are those quintessential attributes that have always made it so readily accessible. I started using it about a 14 months ago and looked at the opening window with a mixture of wonder and fear, yet soon the fear was dispelled and the wonder has never left me. Its ease of use and acceptable learning curve along with its strength in depth have always been a mainstay of the program. Add to that the fanbase and loyal user support that Bryce has imbued throughout the web and you have something that is just too darned good to kill off. Bryce is a definition of creativity and artistic endevour. Sure, there are other apps, but they leave me cold and without inspiration. I have always viewed the more expensive modelling programs with a degree of apathy. Yet having said that I have just ordered Vue d'esprit and 3D max. If Bryce is to eventually go, then diversification in creation as a user may be the only way to stay ahead of the corporate hacks who see little more than the next fiscal quarter in front of them.

{I have just ordered Vue d'esprit} I bought it a few months ago, as I have long admired much of the painterly landscapes produced with it, but I havent had the time to explore it properly. It is no where near as inviting as Bryce though, despite its faster renderer and nicer skies. Bryce will always remain so much more than a landscape app, and if a look in the 2 galleries shows how much more diverse artists are with Bryce than Vue.

I agree. In one Brycecamp alone we had people creating fish with terrains, cartoon characters with primitives, and even a working kaleidoscope. Bryce just totally invites all this experimentation from its friendliness and real feedback. I have Vue too and I agree the skies are amazing but the UI is very funky and the terrain editor just makes soft looking terrains regardless of the resolution. The texture editor is pretty good but doesn't have nearly the range of possibilites we have in the DTE. Vue will probably great a few versions from now. Vue has the advantage of being written when there was already modern architecture and this is the problem that john feld and others mentioned about Bryce. Underlying architecture is yet another reason why Bryce is so far behind of other apps using modern features - like MP threads and faster rendering schemes. The last total rewrite of Bryce was Bryce3 and that beta was a nightmare!!! - Scott

CuriousLabs; yeah, they did bring out a bug-ridden Poser 5, and that rubs on customer satisfaction big time. But, CL seems to be fairly aggresive in making things right, and I'm sure it eventually will be. (eventually) Right now, I'm tempting myself with buying Poser 5, since Amazon has it for $150. And, like I said, I'm sure eventually CL will iron everything out. But, then there is DAZ studio to wonder about... AS

I believe Bryce will always be used, period. It's like the developers of Bryce stumbled upon some secret 3D power, that even (something like) 6 years after Bryce 3 came out, people are still using it, and Bryce's user base, resources, and even the gallery is as big as it is. Oh, if I could onlyhave my Bryce knowledge I have now, back when I had actually bought Bryce back in 2000...I mean if I could have uploaded Bryce pics with hdri workarounds 3 years ago...oh, the mind boggles. I keep wondering what more I can do with Byrce, but just haven't figured out yet. AgentSmith

From what I've gleaned from my friend it would appear that since times are tough for Corel there is a good chance they would sell Bryce to put something back in the coffers, and I think this would be more likely since at present they don't appear to have any future plans for Bryce. The patch for Bryce 5 was the last work to be done on the program and since many of the developers were laid off last summer I don't think any more work was completed for a Bryce 6. Also there didn't appear to be any developers brought in from outside the company to continue work on Bryce, this would have cost a fortune to do anyway and I don't think Corel have the finances for that at the moment. From everything my mate has told me it would appear that the developers of Bryce were/are as dedicated to the program as we are, but because times are very hard economically for Corel they had to let the developers go and as Bryce is not included in Corel's future plans, no more work is being done on it. Folk who have an interest in aquiring Bryce basically have a similar problem as Corel itself, the venture capital isn't there, and there's another point, many people would like to own Bryce the name but not Bryce the program and we should all be careful about who we choose to trust with the use of our money to develop Bryce. One thing I was warned about was that putting money into buying Bryce would have to be done as an investment program with all the contracts etc. that accompany such an action, then we would have the assured knowledge of what we would be getting in return otherwise we could end up throwing good money after bad and not get the program we want in return. This brings me back to a point I made earlier and that is that we would need someone trustworthy to organise this and it would be asking a lot of someone to do this. I hope this has answered some of peoples questions and if there is anything else anyone would like to know either write here or IM me. I'll also put this in a new thread to keep everyone informed. Cheers Cat